Our mortal enemy has deceived the church with many lies!

[woundeddog]

3 hours ago, Hoddie said:

 I was so looking forward to you and I discussing our faiths.

no protracted debate

Titus 3:10King James Version (KJV)

¹⁰ A man that is an heretick after the first and second admonition reject;

[Hoddie]

On Sunday, October 02, 2016 at 4:31 PM, woundeddog said:

 Prohibition of eating meat on Friday (  oh that was repealed- wait wasn't that instituted by tradition of man-- oh no can tradition be wrong?)

Now woundeddog, if you were to do a little studing of your bible, you would see that abstinence from certain foods is biblical. In Daniel 10:2-3 it say's, "In those days I, Daniel, was mourning for three weeks. I ate no delicacies, no meat or wine entered my mouth, nor did I anoint myself at all, for the full three weeks." Catholics use a practice similar to Daniel's when, as a way of commemorating Christ's Crucifixion on a Friday, we abstain from eating meat on that day of the week during Lent. (and Ash Wed.) The only kind of flesh we eat on Friday is fish, which is a symbol of Christ.

Peace

[Hoddie]

On Sunday, October 02, 2016 at 4:31 PM, woundeddog said:

the teachings on legitimate marriages and non legitimate marriages,

The Code of Canon Law recognizes that, "a valid matrimonial contract cannot exist between the baptized without it being by that fact a sacrament" (CIC 1055 §2). So there are two requirements for a marriage to be a sacramental marriage: (1) the marriage must be valid; and (2) both parties must be baptized.

To be in a valid marriage, Catholics must meet certain requirements of canon law including the obligation to observe the Church’s form of marriage celebration or to be dispensed from that form. This applies to every Catholic, even when marrying a non-Catholic.

All valid marriages between Catholics are sacramental because you can’t be Catholic without being baptized. However, a valid marriage between a Catholic and a baptized non-Catholic is sacramental, while a valid marriage between a Catholic and a non-baptized person is not.

Non-Catholics are not generally under the authority of canon law concerning marriage, so marriages between non-Catholics are generally recognized to be valid unless proven otherwise. Some of these marriages are sacramental (when both parties are baptized) and some are not (when one or both are not baptized).

 

Peace

[Hoddie]

On Sunday, October 02, 2016 at 4:31 PM, woundeddog said:

, Call no man Father,

I am willing to bet woundeddog you are talking about Matt.23:9 where it say's..."call no one on earth father..." correct? What does this verse really say?

"And call no one on earth your father; for one is your father, who is in heaven."

The meaning of that verse is, 'no earthly father must come before your heavenly father'. This is shown in Matthew 10:37, when He said, "He who loves 'father' or mother more than Me is not worthy of Me." If you back up to Matthew 23:1, Jesus was actually addressing the 'crowds and His disciples'. It is clear He spoke to two groups. If you jump to verse 8, where he said, "As for you (indicating a select group, NAB), do not be called 'Rabbi' (Rabbi's are teachers, or the learned in Jewish law and the crowds mentioned in verse 1 certainly are not teachers, so He was addressing the disciples). You have but one teacher, and you are all brothers." (He called His disciples His "brothers" in many other Bible verses).

A parent is called father - Ephesians 6:4 and Colossians 3:21, "Fathers do not provoke your children to anger."

* Exodus 20:12, the 4th commandment, honor your "father" and your mother.

* In 1Corinthians 4:14-16, Paul said, "I am writing you this not to shame you, but to admonish you as my beloved children. Even if you should have countless guides to Christ, yet you do not have many fathers, for I became your father in Christ Jesus through the Gospel. Therefore, I urge you, be imitators of me."

*Philemon 1:10, "I appeal to you for my child, Onesimus, whose father I have become in my imprisonment."

* Philippians 2:22, "...As child serves father..."

* Acts 7:2, and Act 22:1, "Brethren and fathers hear..."

* Acts 13:17, "...people of Israel chose our fathers..."

* Romans 4:1-18, Abraham is called "Father" seven times in these verses.

* Romans 9:10, "Isaac our father..."

* Hebrews 1:1, ...spoke in times past to the fathers,

* 2Peter 3:4, "...for since the fathers fell asleep,..."

* 1John 2:13, "I am writing to you, fathers, because you know him who is from the beginning. I am writing to you, young men, because you have conquered the evil one."

* Malachi 1:6, "A son honors his father...if then I be a father, where is my honor?'

* Isaiah 22:21-22, "...and he shall be as a father to the inhabitants of Jerusalem, and to the house of Judah. And I will lay the key of the house of David upon his shoulder; and he shall open and none shall shut; and he shall shut, and none shall open." These verses are a prefigurement of the papacy.

* In John 6:49, Jesus Himself said, "Your fathers did eat manna in the wilderness and are dead."

He said call no man your father in Matthew 23:9, and here he calls their ancestors "Fathers". Is this a conflict?

* How about Luke14:26, Jesus said, "If anyone comes to me and does not hate (the word 'hate', at the time, meant to 'love less') his FATHER..." Here Jesus said the word "father" again. If you take the literal meaning of "father" the same as some take it in Matthew 23:9, then you could only conclude that Jesus said, "You have to love Me more than you love My Father in heaven." I am sure that is not the meaning of Luke 14:26. Wouldn't you agree?

* A priest is a spiritual "Father", as your blood father is your natural father...

* Judges 17:10, "Stay with me, Micha said to him. Be Father and Priest to me..."

* Judges 18:19, "Come with us and be our Father and Priest."





I would say woundeddog, Holy Scripture itself, corrects the misconceptions and mistranslations of Matthew 23:9, wouldn't you?

　

Peace

[woundeddog]

I guess my final post on this topic and in response to opposing views would be that in the OT the Scribes and Pharisees and Priests intellectualized it in an attempt to understand what they could not understand because their hearts where not right before God they took a beautiful system of worship and added so much extra tradition and law that the original meaning of it became lost and in trying to keep up with the religion that was formed any one that wished to worship God was lead away from Gods original intent and as the Bible says " became twice the child of hell"~~~~~ sadly today and for the last number of centuries the same spirit (small s) is still at work-but with a different face,  making the pure worship of God through faith in Jesus alone almost completely unattainable because of ritual and man made traditions. The hope for those who truly are lead to worship God in truth is in Jesus statement

Matthew 11:28 KJV

Come unto me, all ye that labour and are heavy laden, and I will give you rest.

 

Thank you Lord for the mercy you show me, not that I have done anything to deserve it, but because you are a God of love

Edited October 4, 2016 by woundeddog
merds wixed up

[Hoddie]

On Sunday, October 02, 2016 at 4:31 PM, woundeddog said:

 veneration of relics

A relic is an object, such as a piece of clothing or, more commonly, a piece of bone from a saint's body, which has spiritual value because it belonged to one of God's saints. The Bible records many accounts of the value of relics and even episodes of miraculous events connected with them. "People brought to [Jesus] all who were sick and begged him that they might only touch the tassel on his cloak, and as many as touched it were healed" (Mt 14:35-36; cf. Mk 6:56; Lk 8:43-44). It was not uncommon for ordinary objects, like the tassel on the Lord's cloak, to have miraculous characteristics. Look also at Acts 5:15, where even Peter's shadow could cause miraculous healings.

Regarding the relics of saints, especially martyrs (about whom the Bible says, "Precious in the eyes of the Lord is the death of his holy ones" [Ps 116:15]), look at 2 Kings 13:21:

"Elisha died and was buried. At the time, bands of Moabites used to raid the land each year. Once some people were burying a man, when suddenly they spied such a raiding band. So they cast the dead man into the grave of Elisha and everyone went off. But when the man came in contact with the bones of Elisha, he came back to life and rose to his feet."

 

Peace

[Hoddie]

On Sunday, October 02, 2016 at 4:31 PM, woundeddog said:

 The requirements of preforming the various sacraments to get to heaven when all the Lord requires is faith.

First off woundeddog, I disagree with you saying all that is needed to get to heaven is faith. I would be very interseted in you showing me where in the Bible does it teach that we are saved by "faith alone." The only place in all of Scripture where the phrase "Faith Alone" appears, is in James…James 2:24, where it says that we are not…"not"…justified (or saved) by faith alone. Also, why does 1 Cor. 13:13 say that love is greater than faith? Shouldn’t it be the other way around?

Now if I am missing a passage that say's that faith is all thats needed, please correct me. However, if you cannot, would you be inclined to agree that the doctrine of salvation by faith alone…not only doesn’t appear in the Bible, but the Bible actually says the exact opposite – that we are "not" saved by faith alone?

As far as what we Catholics beleive what is required to get to heaven is to come to God and be saved, you need to repent, have faith, and be baptized. If you commit mortal sin, you need to repent, have faith, and go to confession.

That’s it. That’s all there is to it. And we can show each of these things from the Bible.

The need to repent is shown by the fact that, right at the beginning of his ministry, Jesus began preaching the gospel, saying "repent and believe in the gospel" (Mark 1:14-15).

The need for faith is shown when the author of the letter to the Hebrews writes that "Without faith it is impossible to please him. For whoever would draw near to God must believe that he exists and that he rewards those who seek him" (Heb. 11:6).

And the need for baptism is shown when St. Peter flatly tells us: "Baptism now saves you" (1 Peter 3:21).

So for that’s what you need to do if you want to come to God and be saved: Repent, have faith, and be baptized. If you do these things, you’ll be in a state of grace, and as long as you remain in a state of grace, you’ll go to heaven.

　

As for the Sacraments, they are Christ’s own gift that provide us with His grace.

They are the divine helps which God gives us to enable us to:

1.Believe the truths of his faith.

2.Live according to his moral code.

3.Grow in his gift of divine life.

　

Peace

[woundeddog]

19 minutes ago, Hoddie said:

Peace

Peace- yes there is peace

Ephesians 2

8 For by grace are ye saved through faith; and that not of yourselves: it is the gift of God:

9 Not of works, lest any man should boast

 

see faith alone- no works- no sacraments, Bible clearly says faith alone-- anything added to that is an act of pride saying to God-- "you are not sufficient to save me, I will help you by doing these rituals to show you I am worthy to be saved "-- we are not worthy- he saves because that's who he is- and that's what he does

Edited October 4, 2016 by woundeddog

[Hoddie]

On Sunday, October 02, 2016 at 4:31 PM, woundeddog said:

oh and the BIG one Immaculate conception of Mary she was mother of Jesus

Yes I agree The Immaculate Conception is a BIG one! (you do know it has nothing to do with the conception of Jesus, don't you?)



The Blessed Virgin Mary is the "New Ark of the Covenant".

GOD was very meticulous as to how the Hebrews were to construct the wooden 'Ark of the Covenant' in Exodus 25. The Ark was destined to be the most sacred object on earth by GOD because it contained GOD'S "Word", written on the stone tablets handed down by Him to Moses. It was so sacred that Uzzah, who had good intentions, died instantly just by just touching it as it was about to tip over in 2Sam 6:2-8. Since the wooden Ark of the Old Testament was but a "type" of the "New Ark" of the New Testament, and therefore inferior to it, then how much more for merely a man not to touch the "New Ark of the Covenant"? What is reserved for GOD only, is GOD's only.

GOD and sin are mutually exclusive (Rev 21:27). Does not it stand to reason that when GOD created the "New Ark of the Covenant", the vessel that contained "His Word" (Jesus Christ, John 1:1) that He would be equally or more meticulous in creating it? Can GOD co-exist with original sin in the same vessel, the womb of Mary? That 'vessel', Mary, had to be worthy of the 'Treasure' she carried, Jesus The Christ, the Word Incarnate. What is the purpose of Baptism? It is to remove the stain of original sin. When we are baptized, sin goes out and GOD comes in. Baptism to remove sin and allow GOD to come in was not instituted until after Jesus had started His ministry (John 3:22-23, 4:2). So The Blessed Virgin had to have a stainless sin-free body and soul in order for GOD incarnate to dwell within her. GOD imputes the stain of original sin into the soul of each person He creates. However, He did not do so for His only Son. What makes you think He could not do so for His Son's mother as well?

Who was the first person to call Mary "Blessed"? It was GOD Himself through the Angel Gabriel in Luke 1:28. If GOD said "Hail, full of Grace, the Lord is with thee", in the same verse, could Mary have been 'full of grace' or 'blessed' or have the 'Lord with her', had she been stained by original sin? If you say 'yes' to that one, then please explain your answer to me?

By being "full of Grace", and being told "the Lord is with thee", is she not higher than Eve who was never told these things? If so, was Eve created with original sin? No? Then why do you think Mary, who is higher than Eve, was born with original sin? Wouldn't having original sin make Mary lower than Eve? Eve is a "type" of Mary, who is the "antitype". "Types" are always inferior to "antitypes" and always point to a much greater reality, and never to a symbol. GOD will not join Himself with anything defiled, Wis 1:4-5, Isa 59:1-4,

Rom 1:18-32, Rev 21:27. For these reasons, Mary had to be immaculately conceived: Gen 3:15, Ex 25:8-40, Psa *4:4,18:23,51:10, Psa 132:8, *Song 4:7, *Wis 1:4, Isa 59:2, Ez 44:1-3, Lk 1:28,42, *John 1:1 and 1:14 together, Eph 5:27, Tit 3:7.

Now, let's see what the first Protestant had this to say of the Blessed Virgin Mary: "It is a sweet and pious belief that the infusion of Mary's soul was effected without original sin; so that in the very infusion of her soul she was also purified from original sin and adorned with God's gifts, receiving a pure soul infused by God; thus from the first moment she began to live she was free from all sin."---Martin Luther, (Sermon: "On the Day of the Conception of the Mother of God," 1527).



I find it strange that most of Protestantism does not believe in the Immaculate Conception today? Which makes me wonder....Who was the first Protestant to discard this doctrine in which the founder of Protestantism believed?

　

Peace

[woundeddog]

23 minutes ago, Hoddie said:

you do know don't you

yes It say Mary was conceived with out sin,