markdohle Posted January 29, 2017 Group: Senior Member Followers: 11 Topic Count: 77 Topics Per Day: 0.03 Content Count: 641 Content Per Day: 0.22 Reputation: 328 Days Won: 0 Joined: 06/16/2016 Status: Offline Author Share Posted January 29, 2017 5 minutes ago, Gary Lee said: The sin of presumption (catholic belief/dogma) The sin of presumption is the name given to the belief in eternal assurance; it is presuming on God's mercy. It is not just a theologically incorrect position to hold, but is also one which is a sin because it makes one proud and think that one has no need of God's further assistance. The person thinks they are already permanently “saved” and so they do not need God, the church, or anything else. (This was posted for those catholics out there watching this poster. You can find the truth yourself, using your own unbiased searching, or, if you can get an appointment, simply ask your priest or bishop). Eternal assurance is not scriptural, as can be seen even among non-catholics here who trade many scriptural verses covering pro and cons. Salvation is a gift, we receive, we do not presume..... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
markdohle Posted January 29, 2017 Group: Senior Member Followers: 11 Topic Count: 77 Topics Per Day: 0.03 Content Count: 641 Content Per Day: 0.22 Reputation: 328 Days Won: 0 Joined: 06/16/2016 Status: Offline Author Share Posted January 29, 2017 1 hour ago, Thallasa said: Coming from a family in Ireland who have been christian since about 400 AD ,we were formed by a softer kinder christianity with less 'baggage ', than that of either the RCC, or the later protestant colonialist church from England . We probably knew very little about the OT . or Paul and so we lived in harmony with each other, and our beloved God and Saviourto a large extent . On moving to Scotland as a child, I saw the cynicism of that culture ,and if 'fruits' mean anything, then while the RCC ISM is tainted , and needs profound reformation ,the answer is not in protestantism ,nor their 'fruits' of confining the mind/spirit , and the Relationship with God, to conform to that of men who caused the earlier Reformation . All of them terrible sinners and vain too . To get back to the thread ,I believe that all of humanity is linked through God, and that we are responsible often for others sins while not admitting it ,so it is impossible for us to judge the ultimate destiny of a soul ; I believe that those who do so condemn themselves . A also agree that saying tou are saved does not make it so ,and is a deep flaw in Matin Luthers philosophy . Luke 18/9-14 ."Two men went up to the temple to pray ",,,,,,,,, Well said my friend. Peace mark Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
markdohle Posted January 29, 2017 Group: Senior Member Followers: 11 Topic Count: 77 Topics Per Day: 0.03 Content Count: 641 Content Per Day: 0.22 Reputation: 328 Days Won: 0 Joined: 06/16/2016 Status: Offline Author Share Posted January 29, 2017 1 hour ago, Thallasa said: More truth Mark ,and I hope someone will hear . I saw the ravages in Scotland of many of the false beliefs of the kind of lack of hope that taking certain passages too literally led to - a totally graceless society, which hated God, while pronoucing belief, in leading to control of business and life in general by free masonry (the Scottish rite etc.) Interestingly ,the présidents mother's sister was chased by this kind of protestantism ,which had replaced roman catholicism of the best and most honest kind, (by violence of course ) barely related to Rome, and kind in it's living . Religion can be harsh, hard, cruel and crazy......just like politics ;-).......well said, thank you. peace mark Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
warrior12 Posted January 29, 2017 Group: Diamond Member Followers: 5 Topic Count: 54 Topics Per Day: 0.02 Content Count: 2,437 Content Per Day: 0.88 Reputation: 1,525 Days Won: 0 Joined: 10/05/2016 Status: Offline Share Posted January 29, 2017 1 hour ago, Thallasa said: To get back to the thread ,I believe that all of humanity is linked through God, and that we are responsible often for others sins while not admitting it ,so it is impossible for us to judge the ultimate destiny of a soul ; I believe that those who do so condemn themselves . A also agree that saying tou are saved does not make it so ,and is a deep flaw in Matin Luthers philosophy . You seem to be somewhat standing in between the rcc and Protestantism. Your writing are obscure and not clear what you are saying really. Are you a fence sitter, you have to be absolute in the theology you put your trust in. Your belief is your belief, but scripture is very clear. Romans 8King James Version (KJV) 8 There is therefore now no condemnation to them which are in Christ Jesus, who walk not after the flesh, but after the Spirit. 2 For the law of the Spirit of life in Christ Jesus hath made me free from the law of sin and death 16 The Spirit itself beareth witness with our spirit, that we are the children of God: 17 And if children, then heirs; heirs of God, and joint-heirs with Christ; if so be that we suffer with him, that we may be also glorified together Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
warrior12 Posted January 29, 2017 Group: Diamond Member Followers: 5 Topic Count: 54 Topics Per Day: 0.02 Content Count: 2,437 Content Per Day: 0.88 Reputation: 1,525 Days Won: 0 Joined: 10/05/2016 Status: Offline Share Posted January 29, 2017 26 minutes ago, markdohle said: You are missing the point. Those in purgation, or healing, or saved......those who freely reject God can't be healed, would not want it if offered. Mercy and healing have to be received. Peace Mark Mark, the point is, a man salvation and destiny is all done while he has the breath of life. When that life is gone from the body, then there is no more healing or sanctification or purification or such. All that is in vain and it is not the the scripture that evangelical christians believe and study. Show us the scripture verses that refers to those things. Now, you can make your statements and write your essays, but state the source of your beliefs clearly and quote them, so the readers here would know where your references are. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Teditis Posted January 29, 2017 Share Posted January 29, 2017 I would think that "Pray without ceasing.." and "Pray for all things...", together with the fact that praying for the dead is not expressly forbidden is enough to show that God does not forbid it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
warrior12 Posted January 29, 2017 Group: Diamond Member Followers: 5 Topic Count: 54 Topics Per Day: 0.02 Content Count: 2,437 Content Per Day: 0.88 Reputation: 1,525 Days Won: 0 Joined: 10/05/2016 Status: Offline Share Posted January 29, 2017 14 hours ago, warrior12 said: On 1/27/2017 at 9:57 AM, markdohle said: Just as I lose out if I don’t grow in my ability to allow the process of purification to occur in my life with others, the same is tragically true with my relationship with the Lord. The process of sanctification is long and drawn out in this life. If not finished, then this grace-filled process continues. After we let go of the brain in death, what is unconscious in us becomes conscious, we can’t hide anymore from what needs to be healed and purified by the grace of the Lord…..it is not punishment, though like all healing, painful. Just as it is in our experience of deep relationships with others, if rejected then there is only a shallow attachment. Mark, could you explain a bit more what you mean here, or what are you talking about ?. 6 hours ago, markdohle said: 14 hours ago, warrior12 said: Mark, could you explain a bit more what you mean here, or what are you talking about ?. We are more than just conscious beings, we have a vast inner world that we are not often aware of. Many of our wounds, our personality problems, our addictions etc., have deep roots in our past. As Jesus said: All will be brought to light, what is hidden will be made known. I believe that can be applied to us as well. Luke 8:17 In the NDE, the life review seems to bring that out. Peace Mark Romans 8King James Version (KJV) 8 There is therefore now no condemnation to them which are in Christ Jesus, who walk not after the flesh, but after the Spirit. 2 Corinthians 5King James Version (KJV) 17 Therefore if any man be in Christ, he is a new creature: old things are passed away; behold, all things are become new. Mark,dosen't your bible say the above scripture too. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
warrior12 Posted January 29, 2017 Group: Diamond Member Followers: 5 Topic Count: 54 Topics Per Day: 0.02 Content Count: 2,437 Content Per Day: 0.88 Reputation: 1,525 Days Won: 0 Joined: 10/05/2016 Status: Offline Share Posted January 29, 2017 1 hour ago, Teditis said: I would think that "Pray without ceasing.." and "Pray for all things...", together with the fact that praying for the dead is not expressly forbidden is enough to show that God does not forbid it. IF as scripture says, absent from the body is to be present with the Lord, then why do we need to pray for someone who is present with the Almighty. He is in good hands and need of nothing as he is with the giver of all things. His work is done here and now is reaping his rewards. 2 Corinthians 5King James Version (KJV) 6 Therefore we are always confident, knowing that, whilst we are at home in the body, we are absent from the Lord: 7 (For we walk by faith, not by sight:) 8 We are confident, I say, and willing rather to be absent from the body, and to be present with the Lord. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
markdohle Posted January 29, 2017 Group: Senior Member Followers: 11 Topic Count: 77 Topics Per Day: 0.03 Content Count: 641 Content Per Day: 0.22 Reputation: 328 Days Won: 0 Joined: 06/16/2016 Status: Offline Author Share Posted January 29, 2017 18 minutes ago, warrior12 said: Romans 8King James Version (KJV) 8 There is therefore now no condemnation to them which are in Christ Jesus, who walk not after the flesh, but after the Spirit. 2 Corinthians 5King James Version (KJV) 17 Therefore if any man be in Christ, he is a new creature: old things are passed away; behold, all things are become new. Mark,dosen't your bible say the above scripture too. Look forget it, your miss the point, but that is OK. Of course I believe the above and it is out bible. Peace Mark Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
markdohle Posted January 29, 2017 Group: Senior Member Followers: 11 Topic Count: 77 Topics Per Day: 0.03 Content Count: 641 Content Per Day: 0.22 Reputation: 328 Days Won: 0 Joined: 06/16/2016 Status: Offline Author Share Posted January 29, 2017 1 minute ago, Davida said: Yes- "harsh, hard, cruel and crazy and political"-- that perfectly describes the Roman Catholic Church throughout the ages. It has always been Bible- believing Christians, that would not bow their knee to the Papal authority of the Dogmatic Religion of the Roman Catholic Church that have been persecuted and killed throughout history. You go girl (or guy or whatever) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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