Guest Obtuse Monkey Posted June 2, 2005 Share Posted June 2, 2005 What I find about this thread so interesting -- is people don't realize WHO ESTABLISHES KINGS and SETS up KINGDOMS and DESTROYS KINGDOMS! 2 Peter 2:9-10 The Lord knoweth how to deliver the godly out of temptations, and to reserve the unjust unto the day of judgment to be punished: But chiefly them that walk after the flesh in the lust of uncleanness, and despise government. Presumptuous are they, selfwilled, they are not afraid to speak evil of dignities. Let's look at the timeframe that Peter wrote this -- the Caesars were in power killing CHRISTIANS by the thousands! Rome was a complete empire where SLAVERY was the standard by anyone who was not a ROMAN! And Peter doesn't FOCUS on the injustices of the government! He FOCUSES on the fact that GOD knows how to deliver the godly! 1 Timothy 2:1-2 I exhort therefore, that, first of all, supplications, prayers, intercessions, and giving of thanks, be made for all men; For kings, and for all that are in authority; that we may lead a quiet and peaceable life in all godliness and honesty. Notice PAUL is saying as CHRISTIANS we need to be PRAYING and INTERCEDING for all those who are in AUTHORITY! Daniel 4:17 This matter is by the decree of the watchers, and the demand by the word of the holy ones: to the intent that the living may know that the most High ruleth in the kingdom of men, and giveth it to whomsoever he will, and setteth up over it the basest of men. So by attacking the government -- the authorities in power -- do you realize that in a subtle way you are ATTACKING GOD and his ability to choose who's in power? May I suggest spending your time focusing on those things that God has called you to do! Attacking government and authorities is not godly -- instead we should be praying -- interceding -- making our prayers heard so that these injustices will be dealt with by GOD! Your brother in Christ with much agape love, George <{POST_SNAPBACK}> Hang on...why don't we just forget democracy and give a monarchy all the power? Birthright of the King and all that. Maybe I don't understand what your saying, in which case please explain it in a different way, but it sounds like your saying that if I see an injustice caused by authority I should pray to God to do what is right and nothing else. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steward George Posted June 2, 2005 Group: Steward Followers: 110 Topic Count: 10,467 Topics Per Day: 1.25 Content Count: 27,824 Content Per Day: 3.32 Reputation: 15,600 Days Won: 131 Joined: 06/30/2001 Status: Offline Birthday: 09/21/1971 Steward Share Posted June 2, 2005 Hello Obtuse Monkey, First of all -- I'm glad to see you on the boards! Welcome to Worthy Ministries! What I am advocating is simply this -- respect the governing authorities becuase by doing so you are respecting God! Think of the atrocities suffered by the believers in the last 1900 years! Yet you can't find any of the church fathers -- any of the saints of the martrys who cried "FOUL" against the evils of the government! They recognized the greater truth -- the greater mission in their lives -- was not to fight the "injustices" of the government -- but rather to go forth winning souls -- discipling souls -- and preparing themselves for the only REAL kingdom we need to prepare for -- the Kingdom of God! The amount of time spent "discussing" the evils of the government would have been more wisely spent praying against the evils of the government! For example, I've been the editor of Worthy News for the past 7 years through all the days of the Clinton scandals! And there were MANY of them! Yet I didn't speak evil of Clinton through it all -- it was because he was the "president" and so he is the person that God allowed to be my "President" despite how many things that were so "ungodly"! You can respect the office -- respect the governing authorities without liking it -- without speaking evil of it -- and stay focused on the ONLY TRUE MISSION we have as believers -- to win, disciple and train! Or you can get consumed with the injustices of this world -- and sooner or later you will be consumed with a spirit of criticism, a spirit of untrustiness, a spirit of anger, a spirit of rage, a spirit of discontment, etc., etc. -- because the reality is we live in a a fallen world despite the fact we are CITIZENS of heaven! And sooner or later the true mission at hand -- which is your only TRUE MISSION in life -- to win, disciple and train -- will be forgotten! And guess who gets the last laugh when Christians forget their TRUE MISSION in life? Your brother in Christ with much agape love, George Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Obtuse Monkey Posted June 2, 2005 Share Posted June 2, 2005 Hello Obtuse Monkey, First of all -- I'm glad to see you on the boards! Welcome to Worthy Ministries! What I am advocating is simply this -- respect the governing authorities becuase by doing so you are respecting God! Think of the atrocities suffered by the believers in the last 1900 years! Yet you can't find any of the church fathers -- any of the saints of the martrys who cried "FOUL" against the evils of the government! They recognized the greater truth -- the greater mission in their lives -- was not to fight the "injustices" of the government -- but rather to go forth winning souls -- discipling souls -- and preparing themselves for the only REAL kingdom we need to prepare for -- the Kingdom of God! The amount of time spent "discussing" the evils of the government would have been more wisely spent praying against the evils of the government! For example, I've been the editor of Worthy News for the past 7 years through all the days of the Clinton scandals! And there were MANY of them! Yet I didn't speak evil of Clinton through it all -- it was because he was the "president" and so he is the person that God allowed to be my "President" despite how many things that were so "ungodly"! You can respect the office -- respect the governing authorities without liking it -- without speaking evil of it -- and stay focused on the ONLY TRUE MISSION we have as believers -- to win, disciple and train! Or you can get consumed with the injustices of this world -- and sooner or later you will be consumed with a spirit of criticism, a spirit of untrustiness, a spirit of anger, a spirit of rage, a spirit of discontment, etc., etc. -- because the reality is we live in a a fallen world despite the fact we are CITIZENS of heaven! And sooner or later the true mission at hand -- which is your only TRUE MISSION in life -- to win, disciple and train -- will be forgotten! And guess who gets the last laugh when Christians forget their TRUE MISSION in life? Your brother in Christ with much agape love, George <{POST_SNAPBACK}> Thanks for the welcome. So would I be right in thinking that you believe we should be working and helping the people around us rather than worrying about whether what the government is doing is right or wrong? And by prayer you mean in the context of living your life as a prayer? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Eadora Posted June 10, 2005 Group: Advanced Member Followers: 1 Topic Count: 8 Topics Per Day: 0.00 Content Count: 226 Content Per Day: 0.03 Reputation: 0 Days Won: 0 Joined: 12/03/2004 Status: Offline Birthday: 04/24/1945 Share Posted June 10, 2005 Sometimes Those in authority, lie, and murder, and profit from it. Sometimes Those in authority have such names as Hitler, Bonaparte, Genghis Khan, or Caligula. Sometimes "The only thing necessary for the triumph of evil is for good men to do nothing." Edmund Burke Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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