Apologetics 101

[ted]

Perhaps we are hurt by men who were supposed to be the ones that helped us?

There are many that we trust in the matter of the bible, but we later find out that they have lied, or that they have taken Scripture beyond it's intent.

I think if we look close, we see that the Bible has never led us astray, but men who claim to understand it surely can lead us away from it, based on how they interpret it.

Much confusion and pain can be the result of false teaching, but the ultimate teacher paid for our sin on the Cross, and it is in His hands in which I trust my fate.

t.

[ayin jade]

"There she lusted after her lovers.....[Ezekiel 23:30]

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Where did you get that bible quote from? The translations I have are this:

30 These things will be done to you because you have whored after the nations, and because you are defiled with their idols. (MKJV)

30 have brought this upon you, because you lusted after the nations and defiled yourself with their idols. (NIV)

30I will do these things unto thee, because thou hast gone a whoring after the heathen, and because thou art polluted with their idols.(KJV)

30'These things will be done to you because you have played the harlot with the nations, because you have defiled yourself with their idols. (NASB)

[Guest shiloh357]

QUOTE(shiloh357 @ Jun 18 2005, 01:58 AM)

The reason so many do not like to hear the Bible is because it doesn't tell us what we want to hear.

Oh, is that the reason? Not my personal reason, but OK. I am assuming you are focusing on the negative points in the bible and not scripture excerpts such as John 3:16. Negative points including spending eternity in the pyrotechnic playground.

Well yes, it is pride. Pride is at the root of it all. Pride may not be the "reason" per se, but it at least in part fuels unbelief.

Actually I am referring to John 3:16. I am also referring to Romans 3:23, 28; Romans 6:23, John 3:3, Eph. 2:8,9. Romans 10:9,10. As well as Every part that tells you are a sinner as well as the parts that tell you how to saved. Man's pride balks at the idea of sin and the need for a redeemer.

It also insults my intelligence to the use the brain that "God" gave me. To believe everything in the bible (including talking burning bushes, talking serpents, and living in the stomach of a fish for 3 days) would require me to put all common sense and logic on a shelf. As for the bible not being offensive, do you really want your kid reading  Ezekiel 23:30

No, it would only require you set aside your pride on the shelf. It is pride that is the biggest threat to faith. No one rejects God on an intellectual basis. They can cloak their rejection in intellectualism, but the truth is, when there is sin in your life, then either the sin or God has to go. Both cannot co-exist together. People can come up with all kinds of excuses, usually like the one you offer which is the supernatural events that took place in Scripture and so forth. But they are nothing but excuses.

As for Ezekiel 23:20, most children that are far enough along in their study of the Bible to be reading such obscure passages are usually at a spiritual place where such references would not cause them to go over the edge. Besides the only thing that the verse is trying show is the inordinate readiness of the ancient Israelites to accept idolatry.

QUOTE(shiloh357 @ Jun 18 2005, 01:58 AM)

The Bible does not attempt to prove the existence of God.

[AgnosticFront84]

"There she lusted after her lovers.....[Ezekiel 23:30]

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Where did you get that bible quote from? The translations I have are this:

30 These things will be done to you because you have whored after the nations, and because you are defiled with their idols. (MKJV)

30 have brought this upon you, because you lusted after the nations and defiled yourself with their idols. (NIV)

30I will do these things unto thee, because thou hast gone a whoring after the heathen, and because thou art polluted with their idols.(KJV)

30'These things will be done to you because you have played the harlot with the nations, because you have defiled yourself with their idols. (NASB)

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

My apologies: Ezekiel 23:20

[ayin jade]

You do realize that this is not talking about a female but rather a nation. The passage serves to express the eagerness of the people of the Jews after idolatry. Context is everything.

[Kabowd]

No one will ever be converted because of a clever conversation, eloquent answers or logical conclusions. People become redeemed and are made alive because God gives them faith by His grace. While I whole-heartedly believe we should all seek to understand why we believe what we believe, and I am in 100% agreement that we should be able to "defend the faith"...at the same time, I think it's important to remember that a ready defense does not mean this is how we should evangelize. You don't argue someone into the faith. Instead, Scripture teaches us that it's kindness that leads to repentance and that it's the Holy Spirit that draws ppl to Himself.

The Word of God is powerful and alive, no doubt. But very often the most convincing thing to those who don't believe is honestly just ppl living the faith. If we are faithful to be trophies of God's grace, walk with integrity and love as we've been loved then this will be the light in the darkness.

[ted]

Context is everything.

Unless, of course, it goes against a point one is trying to make.

AF, what was it that made you change your mind about God?

You mentioned that your were Pentacostal for a number of years, but you then changed.

How so?

Thanks,

t.

[AgnosticFront84]

You do realize that this is not talking about a  female but rather a nation. The passage serves to express the eagerness of the people of the Jews after idolatry. Context is everything.

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I do, but will a 10-year-old? My point was that it could be offensive to a young person who will read and most likely comprehend that for what it says.

[ayin jade]

Does a 10 yr old read Ezekiel? Most 10 yr olds have kids bibles. They tend not to read the complex prophecies in the bible, only the historical parts.

[Kabowd]

You do realize that this is not talking about a  female but rather a nation. The passage serves to express the eagerness of the people of the Jews after idolatry. Context is everything.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

I do, but will a 10-year-old? My point was that it could be offensive to a young person who will read and most likely comprehend that for what it says.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

I mean no offense by this at all, but honestly...this has got to be one of the lamest excuses I've ever heard anyone try to use to discredit the Bible. I mean, plucking an obsure verse out of it's context and inventing a scenario which could *possibly* cause someone some concern is hardly a fair assessment of the book as a whole. For goodness sakes, you could take a book of Nursery Rhymes, pull out a single verse about the big bad wolf and scare a child to death with it too. If you want to talk about insulting intelligence, please, let's at least put together something more concrete and probable than the remote possibility of a small child perusing through the Old Testament and coming across a few bewildering passages.