The Christian Views Of music

[NotAllThere]

On 11/30/2020 at 5:30 PM, Starise said:

Another apparent theme are men who can sing higher than some women. Ever wonder why you're straining to sing the lead on some of those tunes? I guess these guys still have their manly parts?

 

Well, I can sing that high quite naturally, and I'm not missing anything. I'm a tenor, but I can sing countertenor quite well (that's in the falsetto range, but without sounding squeaky). Some of it is a matter of practice.  I sometimes harmonise above my daughter - she's an alto. 

In the rock and pop music world, men are encouraged to sing high - it gives greater power on a recording. 

[Starise]

9 hours ago, NotAllThere said:

Well, I can sing that high quite naturally, and I'm not missing anything. I'm a tenor, but I can sing countertenor quite well (that's in the falsetto range, but without sounding squeaky). Some of it is a matter of practice.  I sometimes harmonise above my daughter - she's an alto. 

In the rock and pop music world, men are encouraged to sing high - it gives greater power on a recording. 

I understand some men can do that HOWEVER, the music is for EVERYONE. Only maybe 10% of men can sing that high. 

[Alive]

My favorite is Bob Bennett.

[Starise]

13 minutes ago, Drafido said:

I'm a musician.  My main instrument is the electric guitar, though I started with piano when I was a child, then the acoustic guitar, self taught.  I can play the bass guitar and I even did drums a little.  

From my observation of the kind of music I grew up with in the 80s and 90s, mainly for the electric guitar, I can state with conviction that a lot of the rock and metal stuff is basically Satanic.  But even though I know this spiritually, due to enjoying playing it and recording this music myself, I am somewhat stuck with it.  I don't go for lyrics much, I tend to stick to the sound of the guitar only and I like recording overdubs with several guitars at once.  

You'd be surprised to learn that quite a lot of pop, rock and metal music has some Indian influences.  For example, Jimi Hendrix had Hindu artwork on his album covers.  A lot of music actually contains subliminal messages, especially with the lyrics, so I stay clear of lyrics and focus on instrumental sound.  One of my favourite guitarists is Joe Satriani, though even there there are some themes that are prbably occult.  

It's really hard for me to draw music away from this music because I play it on the guitar every day.  Yet at the same time I know it is a disctraction too.  Instead of playing, I could be reading the Bible.  I could be in prayer, I could be seeking God, yet this music has such a tight grip on me.  And today, there are digital recording amps and software that duplicate the sounds of famous artists, and so it is very tempting to indulge in.

I've barely scratched the surface of this topic with what I have written here.  But yes, the demonic is heavily involved in a lot of modern music.  I even had a jazz phase where I listened to Chick Corea, yet he is a scientologist!  

I'm not familiar with Christian music and actually I rather detest a lot of it, where it seems "Christians" are imitating the world to be trendy.  I find it cringeworthy to be honest.  Growing up in a Catholic church I would sing Christian hymns, some of which I quite like actually.  But when people try to marry Christianity with pop, rock or metal or rap music, I really don't like that.  It seems fake to me and quite silly.

Thanks for sharing some of your background. I believe this is the impression many have about Christian music when coming from a purely secular background concerning music.

When I was younger I went through a music rebellion phase. For me it was because I was running from the heavy handed stupidity that was prevalent at the time in my church. I wasn't as much running to worldly music as I was running away from the mandates in my church concerning music. To me they made no sense. They still don't. I wasn't the type to analyze lyrics then so I listened to the latest rock music and loved it. In contrast to what seemed to be limited and boring in church , I much preferred the rock music. I liked classic rock more than pop. At the time, I seen 80's pop as all sequenced midi on  rudimentary synthesizers. Some of it was catchy but I preferred Boston, Rush, Supertramp and similar to pop. I can play guitars. I have a James Taylor variax, another electric, a few acoustics. I don't consider myself primarily a guitarist though. Nowadays I often play bouzouki or my Martin acoustic when playing anything acoustic related. It's usually to add tracks to my recordings.

I hear you saying that bands like Boston might not be hard enough for you. Maybe you're playing Metallica or similar? The drop D metal tunings? I can see where it might be an adjustment to listen to "church" music after that.

Over time I have come around to like a lot of Christian music. I was never on a crusade to eliminate hymns. I was humming a few on the way from work yesterday. So relaxing. I think relating to the messages in a lot of it won me over. Like you though I there's a bunch of Christian music out there that doesn't float my boat.

Acts like the Transiberian Orchestra you might like. They play rocked up Christmas music and use the guitar in ways that it sounds more like classical music. I went to hear them in concert. 

I guess we are all on different journeys. The devil certainly has his music no doubt. I see nothing wrong with those kinds of guitars ( in the style you like) within Christian contexts. Where we might part is I am now open to all kinds of music...and as I pulled away from a rock only perspective years ago I began to see much of it as almost too primal and basic compared to what we as humans are capable of. In an orchestra we have maybe 100 musicians all very talented often playing complex parts. In a rock band we have mainly 4 people give or take. Much like the modern praise teams albeit with a much different sound. It takes a long time to learn to play guitar like a pro and I think God has a place for it. 

Since that time I've made lots of styles of music. Some of it Christian and some of it isn't overtly Christian, but a Christian made it  I'm not going to link it now because I'm not here to "toot my horn". I can cook up just about anything in my studio if I have the time to do it. I like the ability to investigate variety. I don't feel stuck in a rut like that, but unfortunately mixing things up doesn't bode well for followers who liked one thing and now I'm doing another thing.

 

[Starise]

3 minutes ago, Drafido said:

Yeah, Metallica, Guns N Roses, Satriani, Steve Vai, Def Leppard, Jimi Hendrix, plus countless numbers of sheet music by lots of different artists in different styles, blues, jazz, country, pop, that I can sight read and play at the same time.  My main go to's are Metallica and Satriani.  This doesn't mean I am stuck on them or that some of the older rock bands like Boston, as you entioned, are easy to play.  Quite often they are not easy to play.  What I have found as I've got older is that some of the easier stuff is HARDER to play.  Slow tempos, arpeggios, ballads, even simple chord changes present some difficulties to me sometimes.  But technically I am not even brilliant compared to some people out there.  So I just use my playing as a hobby for the most part.  I wouldn't want to pretend to make Christian music in the style of a metal guitar instrumental though!  I don't quite think that would work...

If a person can play well in the bedroom they can play well for 5 people. If they can play well for 5 people they can play well for 50 people. If they can play well for 50 people they can play well for 50000 people. Remember God almost never chooses to use the best and the brightest for His work. Probably why He has used me in the past.

I sometimes pick up the guitar and muck around with a few software programs. I use Guitar Rig and Amplitube if playing in software. I use some of the lesser ones too. I have line 6 hardware and some outboard pedals. I'm not serious enough to invest in those new modeling amps. It becomes almost a never ending money pit looking for the perfect tone. I have come to realize it's more about the artist than the tones. That said, there's a right way and wrong way to record heavy guitars. Giving guitars that "spacial" vibe is easier with certain plugins.

If you look at extremely gifted musicians showing off their abilities (for the record I think Hendrix was possessed and had a little help from his music demon), back OT though lets pick someone. You might not be familiar with Jordan Rudess. keyboard prodigy, graduated Juliard. Keyboardist for Dream Theatre. Not a Christian so far as I know. Fingers like spiders on steroids. He plays in such a way there's never any room for a message. Yes it's highly complex, but lacks what Christian music has. A message. The focus is always on the player and I don't think this is what God usually uses for that very reason.

[Starise]

2 minutes ago, Drafido said:

Yes I use Amplitube sometimes, and my main gear is Line 6, of which I have quite a few things lying around.  I believe it is important to get an original tone that sounds good, but without sacrificing it with the rest of the "band".  Most of the famous musicians can play very well on crappy instruments, which shows the "sound" really comes from them and not the gear they use.  And then the band vibe is the most important quality, because it is in the collaboration between the musicians where the real good sound comes from, and not the individuals isolated in the band.  

The air itself, funnily enough, is the medium that can make a difference in the recorded sound.  Hence microphones instead of digital software directly plugged into the motherboard changes the quality of the sound.

Most of the famous rock musicians of the past like Hendrix and John Lennon, admitted they were possessed.  John Lennon said that when he made music he felt like a psychic medium.  I don't know quite how this works, that people who behave normally and don't become mentally ill, can act like psychic mediums who are possessed without their behaviour becoming totally insane, like they are in control but when they compose their art they are taken over by something, but that is the way it seems to be.  LIke they have a demon inside them, but it isn't making them roll around on the floor, speak in demonic tongues, quiver, shiver and shake, and display the behaviours of a schizophrenic.  

Not sure if you've used cabinet IRs? You can get results similar to micing  a guitar amp in the stairwell. I haven't played with it much so I'm not an expert at it. I do have an interest in it.Several guitarists I'm familiar with have used them to great effect. These are recorded reflections you can load into software guitar setups. Guitar amp sims have come a long way wouldn't you say? My line 6 hardware is the HD500. 

You bring up a very interesting subject concerning these rock musicians. I always felt a lot of their success was based on help from the prince of this world.Almost all of them were experimenting with drugs and many were into eastern religions i.e. the Beatles involvement in Indian mysticism. Many of those religions use the drugs to get into these "alternate states", i.e. shamans. Even the ones that claim it's all a front to advance the band, that they aren't really into the religion aspects of it had help of another kind, even if it was financing to become a world dominating band. The devil is a liar and he will lie about anything. 

I have studied demons and possession. I claim no special knowledge on the subject, yet I have gleaned a lot of info from the many books I have read on the subject and I have experienced some of it or heard first hand accounts of it myself. I understand anyone can write a book and make a claim, however after awhile you begin to pick up on similarities in some of these occurances that come from different sources.Eventually I was able to put a framework of basic demon operations together that was satisfactory for me. The Bible is my main reference on the subject but I use other sources. Some demonic possessions are latent. The demon influences and even controls unnoticed. There may be more possessions like this that those more noticed for obvious reasons. I believe if you are close enough to the person you would know regardless.

So mainly I see the whole music business as put forth in a worldly non Christian context as seething with evil spiritual influences start to finish. I believe there are even some so called Christian acts involved. To be fair, many of the musicians didn't set out to "follow the devil" but by being in that ecosystem they partake in it and advance it. Many others though, are not so naive' and know exactly who they follow and what they are doing.

[GandalfTheWise]

(Just realized I'm getting off the trend of this thread.  A quick aside here.)

My main instruments are a Roland A90EX, an Epiphone Korean copy of a Strat, a Fender Twin (late 80s), and an Eko  acoustic bass (made in Italy, which I got used back in the late 70s, and now to my surprise a collector's item) along with a 40+ year old small Gretsch bass amp.  I've also got a banjo sitting around.    I've got an old 3 function analog pedal sitting around somewhere.   For the most part, my guitar tone was clean channel, distorted channel, and Twin spring reverb turned on or off.  Despite all the sounds (which are now vintage I s'pose), I only use a handful on the A90 anymore.

My musical style has leaned toward treating a song as a chord progression and theme to be built on within the limits of one's skills and influenced by one's "style" and "taste".   For example, my hands naturally fit about a 6th on a keyboard with an octave being a stretch.  My strength is rapid passages within a short range of notes.  A weakness is spread out chords and flowing arpeggios because my hands simply can't reach that well.   What's the old saying from one of the Clint Eastwood movies?  "A man's got to know his limitations."  I spend my time practicing and creating what I can be good at doing rather than trying to be good at what someone else is good at.

I just simply find I feel the difference between "live" playing which changes and evolves each time a song is played versus having mastered a series of notes in sequence.  I simply cannot make myself rehearse something to get it "right" but I can play with something time after time shaping and changing it.   One of my favorite guitarists is Ralph Towner.  I fit stuff I hear into 3 categories, "I can play that", "Give me some time, and I can play that", and "I'll never be able to play that".  He's in the latter category for me.   On YouTube, there are a handful of performances of his "Jamaica Stopover" from different stages in his career including one recently from in his late 70s.  (Note a few with that label are covers by others.) Each time it is slightly different.  It's like it is a living growing thing that has changed over the years in his hands.   In contrast, I've heard a couple covers that were near perfect note by note from one of Towner's performances.  They were well done and obviously much rehearsed, but they were too perfect and mechanical.  When Towner plays it, it's like he is having fun and just playing around or goofing around with the guitar.  When these other guitarists played it, it felt mechanical.   

[NotAllThere]

5 hours ago, Starise said:

I understand some men can do that HOWEVER, the music is for EVERYONE. Only maybe 10% of men can sing that high. 

But but... I get to feel smug!  Ah well. I can always harmonise somewhere up there.

Another issue with pitch is that what's comfortable for women isn't always comfortable for men. That has a tendency to limit range.

[Alive]

8 minutes ago, rhomphaeam said:

God With Us

Just looked this brother up. What a lovely brother and a simple manner. Really enjoyed that. Thanks. 

You are welcome--he is a lovely brother, indeed.

A number of his songs cause me to weep in joy.

Give a listen to 1951

[GandalfTheWise]

3 hours ago, Drafido said:

Is that you Joe?  LOL

I think I'm missing a reference to someone well known, or else I bear a striking resemblance to some remark.