fenwar Posted August 11, 2005 Group: Advanced Member Followers: 0 Topic Count: 1 Topics Per Day: 0.00 Content Count: 161 Content Per Day: 0.02 Reputation: 0 Days Won: 0 Joined: 06/16/2005 Status: Offline Share Posted August 11, 2005 "Loving your enemy" was given in the context of dealing with people on a personal level. Which you are stubbornly refusing to do. We are supposed to deal with people on a personal level; that is the only level at which anyone will be grafted in. If we believe that Christ's love cannot transcend national boundaries then we have been "completely defeated already". Can you Love such an enemy ? Can you seek to allow yourself to question his motives and his grievances against you? CHRIST not only did but continues to do so . CAN WE??? You are sooooo naive, Eadora. It is that naivety that the terrorists/and their supporters feed off of. The naivety to love unconditionally like a little child? The naivety to extend the hand of friendship to a savage brute? That is exactly what Jesus did to sinful mankind. And yes, it got him killed. Just like he knew it would all along. If he wants to kill me, what difference does it make what his motives are? The terrorists have no rational reason for killing in the first place. You are living in a fantasy, Eadora. If you want to give them your throat, be my guest. Your definition of "loving" an enemy is not what Jesus taught, and you sully it everytime you talk about it. Your handling of that Scripture is trainwreck, theologically speaking. Fortunately, those of us, who know something about hermeneutics are not moved by such tragic and obscene handling of that principle. So making threats of war on these people would not be a tragic and obscene handling of it....? Jesus has told us about something that is worth dying for. No-one who dies speaking love in Jesus' name will ever die in vain. Why are you so afraid to die? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
followerofjesus Posted August 11, 2005 Group: Diamond Member Followers: 1 Topic Count: 31 Topics Per Day: 0.00 Content Count: 1,013 Content Per Day: 0.14 Reputation: 5 Days Won: 0 Joined: 03/08/2004 Status: Offline Share Posted August 11, 2005 We must lose our life in order to gain it. Those who have seen that before know exactly what it means. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nebula Posted August 11, 2005 Group: Royal Member Followers: 10 Topic Count: 5,823 Topics Per Day: 0.76 Content Count: 45,870 Content Per Day: 5.95 Reputation: 1,897 Days Won: 83 Joined: 03/22/2003 Status: Offline Birthday: 11/19/1970 Share Posted August 11, 2005 I heard on the news last night about a recently released video from a terrorist speaking in English why they hate us - It's because we are not Muslim and all infidels need to be killed. Yeah, our "understanding them" is really going to win them to Christ. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dgolvach Posted August 11, 2005 Group: Diamond Member Followers: 1 Topic Count: 110 Topics Per Day: 0.02 Content Count: 1,254 Content Per Day: 0.17 Reputation: 6 Days Won: 0 Joined: 07/28/2004 Status: Offline Author Share Posted August 11, 2005 I actually do love and pray for those who I would rather see dead than be allowed to murder my family. I hope they get saved but I am not about to be willing to put my friends and loved ones at risk by making excuses for them.(Islamist). Nowhere in the Bible does it say to sacrafice your children's future so you can please the Muslims. Sorry !! Dan Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Eadora Posted August 11, 2005 Group: Advanced Member Followers: 1 Topic Count: 8 Topics Per Day: 0.00 Content Count: 226 Content Per Day: 0.03 Reputation: 0 Days Won: 0 Joined: 12/03/2004 Status: Offline Birthday: 04/24/1945 Share Posted August 11, 2005 Here are the people of GreenPeace. They do not profess a fundamentalist belief in Christ. But they do most definitely seem to practice Christ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dgolvach Posted August 11, 2005 Group: Diamond Member Followers: 1 Topic Count: 110 Topics Per Day: 0.02 Content Count: 1,254 Content Per Day: 0.17 Reputation: 6 Days Won: 0 Joined: 07/28/2004 Status: Offline Author Share Posted August 11, 2005 But they do most definitely seem to practice Christ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dgolvach Posted August 11, 2005 Group: Diamond Member Followers: 1 Topic Count: 110 Topics Per Day: 0.02 Content Count: 1,254 Content Per Day: 0.17 Reputation: 6 Days Won: 0 Joined: 07/28/2004 Status: Offline Author Share Posted August 11, 2005 Christ instructs us to love our enemies, which does not mean a submission to their hostile agendas or domination. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Eadora Posted August 11, 2005 Group: Advanced Member Followers: 1 Topic Count: 8 Topics Per Day: 0.00 Content Count: 226 Content Per Day: 0.03 Reputation: 0 Days Won: 0 Joined: 12/03/2004 Status: Offline Birthday: 04/24/1945 Share Posted August 11, 2005 Yoh! doglovach This is not a command to lay down like a foolish lamb and allow a group of religous nutcases to terrorize you and yours. I can also show you in the Bible where men are to protect their families. <{POST_SNAPBACK}> Fairly spoken. If you check some of my other posts you will see that I advocate an active defense against insane evil when it comes against us. But I also advocate that we allow ourselves to address the causes and circumstances that allow that kind of evil to propagate and grow. If we allow ourselves only to address the evil of terrorism, we address only the symptom of the cancer that allows it to grow. We must approach our enemy with the spirit of love and allow ourselves to hear his grievances. As long as we are responding only to the hate that he holds for us by occupying and making war against his countries, and bombing his cities and villages, as long as our only response is retaliation, we cannot claim to be the ambassadors of Christ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dgolvach Posted August 11, 2005 Group: Diamond Member Followers: 1 Topic Count: 110 Topics Per Day: 0.02 Content Count: 1,254 Content Per Day: 0.17 Reputation: 6 Days Won: 0 Joined: 07/28/2004 Status: Offline Author Share Posted August 11, 2005 We must approach our enemy with the spirit of love and allow ourselves to hear his grievances. As long as we are responding only to the hate that he holds for us by occupying and making war against his countries, and bombing his cities and villages, as long as our only response is retaliation, we cannot claim to be the ambassadors of Christ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest shiloh357 Posted August 11, 2005 Share Posted August 11, 2005 QUOTE(shiloh357 @ Aug 11 2005, 09:18 AM) "Loving your enemy" was given in the context of dealing with people on a personal level. Which you are stubbornly refusing to do. We are supposed to deal with people on a personal level; that is the only level at which anyone will be grafted in. If we believe that Christ's love cannot transcend national boundaries then we have been "completely defeated already". No, you misunderstand. Jesus' commandment to "love your enemies" was given within the context of how to deal with those who gossip, defraud us, and so forth. We are to return such evil with kindness. Jesus was not addressing foreign policy. He was not dictating how we respond to those who threaten our existance. They have made no secret of their reasons why they hate us. It is just that people like you and Eadora don't want to believe what they say. Their hatred for us is not based upon something that can be "loved" away. It is an irrational unappeasable hatred that says, "I hate you because you exist." This element must be uncovered and either eradicated from our borders through deportation, or they must be destroyed. QUOTE QUOTE Can you Love such an enemy ? Can you seek to allow yourself to question his motives and his grievances against you? CHRIST not only did but continues to do so . CAN WE??? You are sooooo naive, Eadora. It is that naivety that the terrorists/and their supporters feed off of. The naivety to love unconditionally like a little child? The naivety to extend the hand of friendship to a savage brute? That is exactly what Jesus did to sinful mankind. And yes, it got him killed. Just like he knew it would all along. Nonsense.... The Bible does not teach that we are to love unconditionally as a little child. The Bible says that we enter the Kingdom of God with the faith of a child. You need to read your Bible for a change. The reasons that Jesus went to the cross had nothing to do with how you are trying to characterize it. Jesus was not "killed." Jesus willingly gave His life. His life was a sacrifice for sin. His death was not the result of His being killed at the hands of His enemies. QUOTE If he wants to kill me, what difference does it make what his motives are? The terrorists have no rational reason for killing in the first place. You are living in a fantasy, Eadora. If you want to give them your throat, be my guest. Your definition of "loving" an enemy is not what Jesus taught, and you sully it everytime you talk about it. Your handling of that Scripture is trainwreck, theologically speaking. Fortunately, those of us, who know something about hermeneutics are not moved by such tragic and obscene handling of that principle. So making threats of war on these people would not be a tragic and obscene handling of it....? Jesus has told us about something that is worth dying for. No-one who dies speaking love in Jesus' name will ever die in vain. Why are you so afraid to die? You need to come down and live in the real world. People like you only give encouragement and inspiration to the terrorists. If I didn't know better, I would say that you are one of their apologists. You would prefer the terrorists destroy us, while we stand around quoting Bible verses, than for us to actually defend our selves and faimilies. It would appear from all of your inane posts, that you are, for the most part rooting for the terrorists. If you had to choose who lives and who dies, you sooner see us die, and the terrorists, be successful in their endeavors. Any attempt or desire on our part to preserve ourselves from their evil is characterized by you as being unbiblical. Why else would you ask me why I am "afraid" to die. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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