The END of the FLESH - "O death, where is thy sting? O grave, where is thy victory?"

[DeighAnn]

1  Corinthians 15:15 Yea, and we are found false witnesses of God; because we have testified of God that He raised up Christ:

WHOM HE RAISED NOT UP,

 if so be that the dead rise not.


WHEN GOD RAISED UP THE DEAD, THE DEAD WERE RAISED.  THE FIRST OF THE DEAD TO RISE WAS CHRIST.  AND THE GRAVES WERE OPENED AND MANY OF THE SAINTS WALKED AROUND ON THE EARTH BEING SEEN OF MANY.  

DID THEY GO INTO A HOLE IN THE GROUND?  DO YOU THINK THEY WERE WALKING AROUND IN DECAY AND DUST?  OR

DO YOU THINK THEY WERE IN THE SPIRITUAL BODIES, THE FLESH BODY HAVING BEEN SOWN?

 

[DeighAnn]

1Corinthians 15:16 For if the dead rise not, then is not Christ raised:


FOR IF THE DEAD RISE NOT, 


THEN CHRIST IS NOT RAISED


NOTICE WHAT ISN'T SAID? 

IF I WON'T BE RAISING THE DEAD LATER ON

OR

IF THE DEAD DO NOT EVENTUALLY RISE

OR

IF THE DEAD WILL NOT BE RISEN UPON HIS RETURN 

 

[DeighAnn]

AND OF COURSE THE REAL PROBLEM WITH THE RAISE DELAY THEORY

1 Corinthians 15:18 Then they also which are fallen asleep in Christ are perished.



1Corinthians 15:21 For since by man came death, by man came also the resurrection of the dead.

1Corinthians 15:23 But every man in his own order: Christ the firstfruits;




and at the very last those who are alive and remaining
afterward they that are Christ's at his coming.



 

[douggg]

28 minutes ago, DeighAnn said:

1Corinthians 15:16 For if the dead rise not, then is not Christ raised:


FOR IF THE DEAD RISE NOT, 


THEN CHRIST IS NOT RAISED


NOTICE WHAT ISN'T SAID? 

IF I WON'T BE RAISING THE DEAD LATER ON

OR

IF THE DEAD DO NOT EVENTUALLY RISE

OR

IF THE DEAD WILL NOT BE RISEN UPON HIS RETURN 

 

1Corthians15 is about there will be a resurrection of the dead.    The timing depends on what dead and when they become believers in Jesus.     Which can only be determined from a multitude of other passages in the bible.

i.e. 1Corinthians 15:23 But every man in his own order: Christ the firstfruits;

 

The three cases to be resurrected to immortality.

1.  at the last trumpet, at the rapture/resurrection - not known exactly when, but before the wrath of God is poured out upon the earth, when the Day of the Lord begins.

2. at Jesus's return,  first resurrection of the millennial period - at the beginning for the martyred great tribulation saints.

3.  at the last day, second resurrection of the millennial period - at the end, for the great white throne judgment.

 

Edited January 20, 2021 by douggg

[douggg]

51 minutes ago, DeighAnn said:

Do you realize these are the exact same time?  

 

What I know is that the rapture/resurrection takes place before God's wrath is poured out.

Differently, the resurrection (no rapture) in Revelation 20:4-6 is after God wrath is poured out.

[douggg]

1 hour ago, DeighAnn said:

what you have is
a body sown IN CORRPTION AND ISN'T RAISED IN INCORRUPTION UNTIL THE RETURN OF CHRIST AND IN THE MEAN TIME THE SPIRIT GOES TO HEAVEN BODYLESS  

SO WHERE DID GOD TELL YOU THAT.  I AM ASKING FOR GODS WORDS.  SCRIPTURE.  BOOK CHAPTER VERSE.  IF YOU CAN'T DO THAT THEN JUST SAY SO.  

DeighAnn, you are twisting my words, and then asking me to prove your twisted words.

I did not say "the spirit goes to heaven".

What I have been writing is the soul goes to heaven when a person dies, if they are a Christian.

If a person is not a Christian, the soul goes to hell, the place of the dead.

_______________________________________________________________________________

In Revelation 6:9, John saw such souls.      John was able to see the souls because they had some sort of form or body.     

9 And when he had opened the fifth seal, I saw under the altar the souls of them that were slain for the word of God, and for the testimony which they held:

______________________________________________________________________________

Regarding a Christian's soul going to heaven when they die, Paul said...

2Corinthians 5:8 We are confident, I say, and willing rather to be absent from the body, and to be present with the Lord.

 

 

 

 

[douggg]

2 hours ago, DeighAnn said:

I could also do ruach and nephesh if you would like.  Would that help you to understand what I understand?   

I think stick to Jesus's use of the word "soul".

https://www.kingjamesbibleonline.org/search.php?q=soul&bsec=N&order=0

[DeighAnn]

4 hours ago, douggg said:

I think stick to Jesus's use of the word "soul".

https://www.kingjamesbibleonline.org/search.php?q=soul&bsec=N&order=0

IT's official then.  

[DeighAnn]

There are some today who believe we rise from the dead, but not until Christ returns.  

There are some today who believe our flesh goes into the ground and  only our soul/spirit goes to God, but without a 'body'.  Which brings up a whole side topic of soul and spirit being 2 completely different things independent of each other, which I don't believe

I believe that when this flesh body dies, our heavenly body is quickened/made alive and it is that heavenly body soul and spirit that returns to God.  

And this is WHY I believe as I do.  I will explain as I go my beliefs of each verse.

If any one can SHOW GODS WORD, aka where 'it is written' whether it be straight through as this will be or here a little there a little WITH commentary , please do.  I am not looking for what some 'man' THINKS.  Nor am I looking for how 'man' EXPLAINS.  IF I have gotten something wrong, PLEASE GIVE SCRIPTURE with the explanation as I do here, to avoid the 'circle' that goes no where and only causes CONFUSION.   I WILL NOT BE YELLING, JUST USING CAPS TO DISTINGUISH BETWEEN GODS WORDS AND MINE.  




1 Corinthians 15:12 Now if Christ be preached that He rose from the dead, how say some among you that there is no resurrection of the dead?
EITHER  WE BELIEVE THAT CHRIST DEFEATED DEATH OR WE DON'T.  IF HE DID THEN THE GRAVE/EARTH CAN NOT KEEP ANY PART OF A 'BEING' HERE EXCEPT THAT WHICH CAME FROM IT AKA THE FLESH.  
 

1 Corinthians 15:13 But if there be no resurrection of the dead, then is Christ not risen:
EITHER THE DEAD RISE OR THEY DON'T.  IF CHRIST IS RISEN SO TOO ARE ALL THOSE WHO HAVE DIED.

1 Corinthians 15:14 And if Christ be not risen, then is our preaching vain, and your faith is also vain.
IF CHRIST ISN'T RISEN THEN ALL OF THIS IS FOR NOUGT, IT IS JUST DELUSION. VOID OF ANY SORT OF TRUTH AT ALL.  

1 Corinthians 15:15 Yea, and we are found false witnesses of God; because we have testified of God that He raised up Christ: whom He raised not up, if so be that the dead rise not.
JUST TRYING TO BE SUPER CLEAR,  WE ARE NOTHING MORE THAN LIARS IF DEATH IS STILL REIGNING.  IF DEATH IS STILL IN CONTROL THEN THERE IS NO WAY CHRIST HAS RAISED UP. SAME AS THE DEAD HAVE NOT BEEN RAISED UP.  DEATH PRODUCES THE SAME EFFECT UPON ALL FLESH, CHRIST INCLUDED.  IT DOES NOT GET TO PICK AND CHOOSE.  ALL REMAIN DEAD OR NONE REMAIN DEAD.  
 

1 Corinthians 15:16 For if the dead rise not, then is not Christ raised:
AGAIN, JUST TO EMPHASIZE  IF THE DEAD DON'T, CHRIST DON'T.  CAUSE CHRIST DIED SAME AS EVERYONE ELSE.  

1 Corinthians 15:17 And if Christ be not raised, your faith is vain; ye are yet in your sins.
APPARENTLY IT WAS A HARD TO BELIEVE AND UNDERSTAND FROM THE BEGINNING.  BUT ADDED TO THIS IS THE REASON FOR DEATH IN THE FIRST PLACE, SIN.  REMAIN DEAD IS TO REMAIN IN SIN.  CHRIST JUST PAID AN AWESOME PRICE TO MAKE THIS OF EFFECT.

1 Corinthians 15:18 Then they also which are fallen asleep in Christ are perished.
THERE GOES THAT 'SOUL SLEEP' .  ONCE AGAIN EITHER DEATH WAS DEFEATED OR IT WASN'T.  EITHER OUR SINS ARE FORGIVEN BY THE PRICE PAID ON THE CROSS OR IT WASN'T.  EITHER DEATH CAME BY SIN OR IT DIDN'T.   
 

1 Corinthians 15:19 If in this life only we have hope in Christ, we are of all men most miserable.
IF WE ARE NOT RAISED UP AND OUT FROM THE DEATH OF THE FLESH TO RETURN TO GOD  WHAT IS THE POINT?

1 Corinthians 15:20 But now is Christ risen from the dead, and become the firstfruits of them that slept.

THEM THAT SLEPT.  PAST.  NO LONGER IN SLEEP BUT RISEN.  NOT WAITING FOR A FUTURE DATE AS DEATH WAS IMMEDIATELY  DEFEATED.

1 Corinthians 15:21 For since by man came death, by man came also the resurrection of the dead.
BY ONE IT CAME BY,  BY ANOTHER IT WENT AWAY

1 Corinthians 15:22 For as in Adam all die, even so in Christ shall all be made alive.
WHO DIES IN ADAM?  ALL THE GOOD THE BAD AND THE UGLY.  WHO IS MADE ALIVE IN CHRIST?  THE GOOD THE BAD AND THE UGLY.  (before losing your mind remember there is lots more to it, let it go right now)

1 Corinthians 15:23 But every man in his own order: Christ the firstfruits; afterward they that are Christ's at his coming.
THOSE WHO HAVE LIVED AND DIED ARE ALREADY GONE, CHRIST BEING THE FIRST.  THERE IS COMING A TIME,  WHEN CHRIST RETURNS,   ALL FLESH WILL DIE.  (before losing your mind remember there is lots more to it, let it go for right now)

1 Corinthians 15:24 Then cometh the end, when He shall have delivered up the kingdom to God, even the Father; when He shall have put down all rule and all authority and power.
(before losing your mind...I am trying to be single minded, BUT coming to the end of the Lords Day)

1 Corinthians 15:25 For He must reign, till He hath put all enemies under His feet.
LAKE OF FIRE TIME

1 Corinthians 15:26 The last enemy that shall be destroyed is death.
SATAN HAS BEEN LOOSED FOR A SHORT SEASON, LAST WAR TAKEN PLACE, ALL EVIL PERISHED

1 Corinthians 15:27 For He hath put all things under his feet. But when He saith all things are put under Him, it is manifest that He is excepted, which did put all things under Him.
 

1 Corinthians 15:28 And when all things shall be subdued unto Him, then shall the Son also Himself be subject unto Him that put all things under Him, that God may be all in all.

(brief side - when all have been judged, all evil into the lake of fire, the need for a Saviour will no longer be needed, if that helps here a little)

1 Corinthians 15:29 Else what shall they do which are baptized for the dead, if the dead rise not at all? why are they then baptized for the dead?

1 Corinthians 15:30 And why stand we in jeopardy every hour?

1 Corinthians 15:31 I protest by your rejoicing which I have in Christ Jesus our Lord, I die daily.

1 Corinthians 15:32 If after the manner of men I have fought with beasts at Ephesus, what advantageth it me, if the dead rise not? let us eat and drink; for to morrow we die.

 1 Corinthians 15:33 Be not deceived: evil communications corrupt good manners.
BIG SIGH

1 Corinthians 15:34 Awake to righteousness, and sin not; for some have not the knowledge of God: I speak this to your shame.


 NOW WE ARE GETTING TO THE MATTER AT HAND

1 Corinthians 15:35 But some man will say, How are the dead raised up? and with what body do they come?
ENDS THAT DISEMBODIED SPIRIT/SOUL TRIP

 

1 Corinthians 15:36 Thou fool, that which thou sowest is not quickened, except it die:
HORTICULTURE LESSON  GOING TO PLANT A SEED CAUSE YOU WANT TO GROW A TREE.  THAT SEED GOES INTO THE GROUND.  FOR A PLANT TO GROW THAT SEED ITSELF MUST DIE.  IF THE SEED DOESN'T DIE A PLANT CAN'T BE PRODUCED.  

1 Corinthians 15:37 And that which thou sowest, thou sowest not that body that shall be, but bare grain, it may chance of wheat, or of some other grain:
WE DIE SAME AS THE SEED DIES TO PRODUCE THE SPRITUAL BODY.  THE SPRITUAL BODY CAN NOT BE PRODUCED UNLESS THE SEED DIES.  (or it is the last twinkling of an eye)

1 Corinthians 15:38 But God giveth it a body as it hath pleased him, and to every seed his own body.
EVERY SEED THAT DIES PRODUCES A BODY. 

1 Corinthians 15:39 All flesh is not the same flesh: but there is one kind of flesh of men, another flesh of beasts, another of fishes, and another of birds.
NOT ONLY DIFFERENT KINDS OF FLESH BUT (and I don't know)
 

1 Corinthians 15:40 There are also celestial bodies, and bodies terrestrial: but the glory of the celestial is one, and the glory of the terrestrial is another.
THE SEED THAT MUST DIE WAS A GOOD SEED AND THE BODY THAT COMES FROM ITS DEATH IS A GOOD BODY ALSO, JUST DIFFERENT. 


 

MAYBE FINISH LATER  

[DeighAnn]

14 hours ago, douggg said:

I think stick to Jesus's use of the word "soul".

https://www.kingjamesbibleonline.org/search.php?q=soul&bsec=N&order=0

I tried, I failed.  It wasn't official after all.  

Actually you are sticking to the "Jesus's use of the word" no matter which one, cause He is the word made flesh.  He is the walking, talking breathing, word of God, the OLD COVENANT.  


Eccl 12 .. the body goes to the dust, the spirit returns to God who gave it.  
THATS  OLD COVENANT




NEW COVENANT =  

Luke 24:34 Saying, The Lord is risen indeed, and hath appeared to Simon.

Luke 24:35 And they told what things were done in the way, and how He was known of them in breaking of bread.

Luke 24:36 And as they thus spake, Jesus himself stood in the midst of them, and saith unto them, Peace be unto you.

Luke 24:37 But they were terrified and affrighted, and supposed that they had seen a spirit.

I AM GOING TO PROPOSE THAT BEFORE CHRIST, THE SPIRIT 'BODYLESS' WENT BACK TO GOD, ( the sting of death?) 

BUT AFTER CHRIST  IT WAS RAISED CELESTIAL. (oh death where is thy sting?)  and that EVERYONE is resurrected immediately upon death, the good bad and ugly because Christ died for the sins of the world.  
 

But they didn't understand

Luke 24:38 And He said unto them, Why are ye troubled? and why do thoughts arise in your hearts?

Luke 24:39 Behold my hands and my feet, that it is I myself: handle me, and see; for a spirit hath not flesh and bones, as ye see me have.

  'SPIRIT' ALONE  (BODYLESS)  IS NOT  HOW WE ARE RAISED FROM THE DEAD  anymore.

CHRIST , THE FIRST FRUITS OF THE "DEATH DEFEATED" RAISING UP OF THE DEAD.


HEAVENLY FLESH AND BONE, but same  SPIRIT/SOUL,  THE WHOLE BEING
(NO BLOOD)
become a HEAVENLY BODY,  (to one side of the gulf or the other)

THE FLESH  "SEED"  DEAD IN THE GROUND forever going back to dust. 

 
Luke 24:40 And when He had thus spoken, He shewed them his hands and his feet.

Luke 24:41 And while they yet believed not for joy, and wondered, He said unto them, Have ye here any meat?

ARE WE BEING given new MEAT?  Does this new meat wean us a bit off the milk so we can see with new eyes?  More mature eyes?

Luke 24:42 And they gave him a piece of a broiled fish, and of an honeycomb.

Luke 24:43 And He took it, and did eat before them.

Luke 24:44 And He said unto them, These are the words which I spake unto you, while I was yet with you, that all things must be fulfilled, which were written in the law of Moses, and in the prophets, and in the psalms, CONCERNING ME.

( CATCH THAT EXPLAINING OF 

Matthew 5:17 Think not that I am come to destroy the law, or the prophets: I am not come to destroy, but to fulfil.

Matthew 5:18 For verily I say unto you, Till heaven and earth pass, one jot or one tittle shall in no wise pass from the law, till all be fulfilled.)

 

Luke 24:45 Then opened He their understanding, that they might understand the scriptures,

Luke 24:46 And said unto them, Thus it is written, and thus it behoved Christ to suffer, and to rise from the dead the third day:

Luke 24:47 And that repentance and remission of sins should be preached in His name among all nations, beginning at Jerusalem.

Luke 24:48 And ye are witnesses of these things.

 

Luke 24:49 And, behold, I send the promise of my Father upon you: but tarry ye in the city of Jerusalem, until ye be endued with power from on high.

Luke 24:50 And He led them out as far as to Bethany, and He lifted up his hands, and blessed them.

Luke 24:51 And it came to pass, while He blessed them, He was parted from them, and carried up into heaven.

Luke 24:52 And they worshipped Him, and returned to Jerusalem with great joy: