Keras Posted March 21, 2023 Group: Diamond Member Followers: 2 Topic Count: 56 Topics Per Day: 0.02 Content Count: 1,686 Content Per Day: 0.63 Reputation: 301 Days Won: 0 Joined: 12/31/2016 Status: Offline Birthday: 08/07/1941 Author Share Posted March 21, 2023 5 hours ago, WilliamL said: Paul teaches otherwise: What Paul teaches in 1 Cor 15:22, is the martyrs killed during the 42 month period of world control by Satan. Proved by Revelation 20:4 Also his Prophecy in 1 Cor 15:50-56, plainly refers to what will happen at the GWT Judgment; after the Millennium. You quoted: The Lord comes in clouds, every eye sees him, the dead are raised, the elect ascend, the Jews are converted, the heathen wail, the Wrath begins. Is this a Bible verse or have you just made it up to suit your beliefs? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WilliamL Posted March 21, 2023 Group: Royal Member Followers: 10 Topic Count: 99 Topics Per Day: 0.03 Content Count: 5,125 Content Per Day: 1.48 Reputation: 2,556 Days Won: 4 Joined: 11/06/2014 Status: Offline Birthday: 09/01/1950 Share Posted March 21, 2023 10 hours ago, Keras said: What Paul teaches in 1 Cor 15:22, is the martyrs killed during the 42 month period of world control by Satan. What Paul teaches there is the res of the dead "at His Parousia." 15:23 The same Parousia foretold in Matt. 24:3, 27 and 1 Thes. 4:15 and 2 Thes. 2:1 etc. But NOT in Rev. 2o! 10 hours ago, Keras said: You quoted: The Lord comes in clouds, every eye sees him, the dead are raised, the elect ascend, the Jews are converted, the heathen wail, the Wrath begins. Is this a Bible verse or have you just made it up to suit your beliefs? That is a quick summary of prophesied events to take place at Christ's 6th Seal Parousia. https://www.worthychristianforums.com/blogs/entry/2211-the-parousia-of-the-son-of-man/ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Keras Posted March 21, 2023 Group: Diamond Member Followers: 2 Topic Count: 56 Topics Per Day: 0.02 Content Count: 1,686 Content Per Day: 0.63 Reputation: 301 Days Won: 0 Joined: 12/31/2016 Status: Offline Birthday: 08/07/1941 Author Share Posted March 21, 2023 8 hours ago, WilliamL said: What Paul teaches there is the res of the dead "at His Parousia." 15:23 The same Parousia foretold in Matt. 24:3, 27 and 1 Thes. 4:15 and 2 Thes. 2:1 etc. But NOT in Rev. 2o! So the Bible contradicts itself! I vehemently disagree. Paul never says 'ALL' the dead....... Only mortal humans will populate the earth during the Millennium. Proved by Isaiah 65:20, Zechariah 14:16 8 hours ago, WilliamL said: That is a quick summary of prophesied events to take place at Christ's 6th Seal Parousia. That summary is a bunch of wishful thinking and scriptural error. The Lord WILL Return in the clouds and all those alive then, will see Him. Then the dead martyrs of the 42 month reign of the Anti-Christ will be raised, the elect will be gathered to Him in Jerusalem, the Christian Jews: the surviving remnant, with them, the heathen are all dead and the wrath of God is all over before Jesus Returns. Revelation 15:1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WilliamL Posted March 21, 2023 Group: Royal Member Followers: 10 Topic Count: 99 Topics Per Day: 0.03 Content Count: 5,125 Content Per Day: 1.48 Reputation: 2,556 Days Won: 4 Joined: 11/06/2014 Status: Offline Birthday: 09/01/1950 Share Posted March 21, 2023 1 hour ago, Keras said: Paul never says 'ALL' the dead... 1 hour ago, Keras said: Jesus did. John 5:[28] Marvel not at this: for the hour is coming, in the which all that are in the graves shall hear his voice, [29] And shall come forth; they that have done good, unto the resurrection of life; and they that have done evil, unto the resurrection of damnation. 1 hour ago, Keras said: ...the wrath of God is all over before Jesus Returns. Revelation 15:1 People 'hide from the face' of Jesus after the 6th seal has been opened. That is when the revelation of His Parousia/Presence begins again in the world, and God's Wrath begins. Rev. 6:16-17 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Keras Posted March 22, 2023 Group: Diamond Member Followers: 2 Topic Count: 56 Topics Per Day: 0.02 Content Count: 1,686 Content Per Day: 0.63 Reputation: 301 Days Won: 0 Joined: 12/31/2016 Status: Offline Birthday: 08/07/1941 Author Share Posted March 22, 2023 1 hour ago, WilliamL said: Jesus did. John 5:[28] Marvel not at this: for the hour is coming, in the which all that are in the graves shall hear his voice, [29] And shall come forth; they that have done good, unto the resurrection of life; and they that have done evil, unto the resurrection of damnation. In that Prophecy, Jesus is referring to the Great White Throne Judgment. As described in Revelation 20:11-15, the final Judgment of everyone who has ever lived. Nowhere does scripture say anyone other than the GT martyrs will be resurrected when Jesus Returns. 1 hour ago, WilliamL said: People 'hide from the face' of Jesus after the 6th seal has been opened. That is when the revelation of His Parousia/Presence begins again in the world, and God's Wrath begins. Rev. 6:16-17 Right, the Sixth Seal is the next prophesied event that will take place. It sets the scene for all the rest that must happen before Jesus Returns. About 10 years later. Placing the Sixth Seal at the Return, makes you guilty of shuffling Revelation. Not a good idea to mess with that Book. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WilliamL Posted March 22, 2023 Group: Royal Member Followers: 10 Topic Count: 99 Topics Per Day: 0.03 Content Count: 5,125 Content Per Day: 1.48 Reputation: 2,556 Days Won: 4 Joined: 11/06/2014 Status: Offline Birthday: 09/01/1950 Share Posted March 22, 2023 11 hours ago, Keras said: Nowhere does scripture say anyone other than the GT martyrs will be resurrected when Jesus Returns Dan. 12:-3, 1Cor. 15, & 1 Thes. 4:14ff. all day that. Which verses you reject in their context. 12 hours ago, Keras said: Placing the Sixth Seal at the Return, makes you guilty of shuffling Revelation. It places everything in proper order. The saints who are raptured at the 6th Seal are the ones "who came out of the GT" in 7:14. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Keras Posted March 22, 2023 Group: Diamond Member Followers: 2 Topic Count: 56 Topics Per Day: 0.02 Content Count: 1,686 Content Per Day: 0.63 Reputation: 301 Days Won: 0 Joined: 12/31/2016 Status: Offline Birthday: 08/07/1941 Author Share Posted March 22, 2023 6 hours ago, WilliamL said: Dan. 12:-3, 1Cor. 15, & 1 Thes. 4:14ff. all day that. Which verses you reject in their context. However you have to view it; there is no scripture that that says there will be a general resurrection of dead people when Jesus Returns. But many verses show that will happen after the Millennium. A logical and sensible thing, when Eternity commences and mortal humanity ceases. 6 hours ago, WilliamL said: It places everything in proper order. The saints who are raptured at the 6th Seal are the ones "who came out of the GT" in 7:14. The Book of Revelation does have the 7 Seals, 7 Trumpets and 7 Bowls in their correct order. Explain how a scroll can be opened before all the seals are removed. The 'saints' dressed in white robes, Revelation 7:14, are those people who stood firm in their faith and trusted the Lord for their protection, during the just happened Sixth Seal worldwide disaster. They are not in heaven and are not immortal, as yet. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WilliamL Posted March 22, 2023 Group: Royal Member Followers: 10 Topic Count: 99 Topics Per Day: 0.03 Content Count: 5,125 Content Per Day: 1.48 Reputation: 2,556 Days Won: 4 Joined: 11/06/2014 Status: Offline Birthday: 09/01/1950 Share Posted March 22, 2023 (edited) 2 hours ago, Keras said: Explain how a scroll can be opened before all the seals are removed. Because they are opened in serial order, not parallel. 2 hours ago, Keras said: The 'saints' dressed in white robes, Revelation 7:14, are those people who stood firm in their faith and trusted the Lord for their protection, during the just happened Sixth Seal worldwide disaster. They are not in heaven and are not immortal, as yet. They stand before God's heavenly throne among the angels and 24 elders and they are not in heaven? Please. Edited March 22, 2023 by WilliamL Typo Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Keras Posted March 22, 2023 Group: Diamond Member Followers: 2 Topic Count: 56 Topics Per Day: 0.02 Content Count: 1,686 Content Per Day: 0.63 Reputation: 301 Days Won: 0 Joined: 12/31/2016 Status: Offline Birthday: 08/07/1941 Author Share Posted March 22, 2023 1 hour ago, WilliamL said: Because they are opened in serial order, not parallel. The Seals, Trumpets and Bowls will be opened in the order they are Written. Why not? 1 hour ago, WilliamL said: They stand before God's heavenly throne among the angels and 24 elders and they are not in heaven? Please. Thinking that God's Throne is confined to heaven is your mistake. Ezekiel 1:1 saw it while standing by the river Kebar. Stephen saw it - Acts 7:36 The entire chapter of Revelation 7, is all about earthly events. From the gathering of all the faithful Christians to Jerusalem, Rev 7:1-14, Ezekiel 36:8-12; to the Eternal state. Revelation 7:15-17 Paralleled by Revelation 21:1-7 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WilliamL Posted March 23, 2023 Group: Royal Member Followers: 10 Topic Count: 99 Topics Per Day: 0.03 Content Count: 5,125 Content Per Day: 1.48 Reputation: 2,556 Days Won: 4 Joined: 11/06/2014 Status: Offline Birthday: 09/01/1950 Share Posted March 23, 2023 19 hours ago, Keras said: Thinking that God's Throne is confined to heaven is your mistake. Ezekiel 1:1 saw it while standing by the river Kebar. Stephen saw it - Acts 7:36 Revelation never speaks of God's temple & throne as being in any other place than in heaven. Wherein John was "caught up" to, where he saw the elders and angels, whom the Rev. 7:9-14 saints stand in the midst of. That is far different than them merely seeing heaven in vision, as Ezekiel & Stephen did. You cannot provide any evidence (other than solely your word) that the temple they serve "in" is earthly, when such is never said in Revelation. Quite the contrary! 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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