YEC's cannot reconcile "tohu wabohu" in Gen 1:2 with the same 2 words in Jer 4:23!

[BeyondET]

4 minutes ago, SavedOnebyGrace said:

Afraid not. That is pre Day 1.

Fare enough, I'm not trying to force a belief on someone.

Basically that's what it is pre day 1 introduction.

 

Edited August 13, 2023 by BeyondET

[SavedOnebyGrace]

15 minutes ago, BeyondET said:

Reality, plants can't live without sun light. I don't have to make up a hypothesis on how they could without the sun. Sure God can do it but I can trust what He created as a fact.

So you rewrite Genesis to agree with science, but only you are permitted to do this. Interesting.

[BeyondET]

1 hour ago, SavedOnebyGrace said:

So you rewrite Genesis to agree with science, but only you are permitted to do this. Interesting.

Anyone can believe in that, when did I say no one is permitted?.

I know not many would think of such things, it's a bit of a reach in faith.

There's no science needed place a house plant in your closet make sure no light is getting in, eventually it will die.

Edited August 14, 2023 by BeyondET

[SavedOnebyGrace]

19 minutes ago, BeyondET said:

Anyone can believe in that, when did I say no one is permitted?.

I know not many would think of such things, it's a bit of a reach of faith.

There's no science needed place a house plant in your closet make sure no light is getting in, eventually it will die.

I guess what I'm saying is we have believers believing in all types of things all using the same bible. As an OEC, I look at Genesis 1:1-1:2 as predating the seven days of creation starting with Genesis 1:3. Whether these were 24 hour days of not, I'm not sure. But I have been taking them in order. If a person considers God's light (actually Jesus since all things were created through Him), the day order is less important scientifically. The Sun, Earth and Moon could have been created in Genesis 1:1, just not visible until Day 4 on Earth. This would account for the different ages of these celestial objects. How long is a day? I don't know. The Sun can make things grow even when cloudy. The Day-Age Creationists have their own ideas of how long a day is.

[FreeGrace]

13 hours ago, BeyondET said:

I read the days as such, 1,2,4,3,5,6,7.

You mentioned "extra" days.  All I see here is days out of order.  Where are the "extra" days, and where do you find them in Scripture?

13 hours ago, BeyondET said:

Indeed the universe is old, but that doesn't mean the time between verse 1 and 2 happened over a long period of time. No human knows that but God. Could of been an hour or a billion years.

The wording of v.2 SHOWS that the earth became a wasteland.  Unless someone or something had a nuclear bomb laying around, I seriously doubt "an hour".

And, what is more, we don't know how long the original creation of earth was untouched BEFORE whatever happened to cause it to be a wasteland.

And it doesn't matter.  What is clearly obvious is that the universe and earth are very old.  And v.2 gives us the reason, without the details.

You have no idea how the earth is very much older than Adam, but I do, and from Scripture.  

One more thing.  You relate the days in Genesis 1 as creation days.  I call them restoration days.  

So, the question remains;  how do you reconcile 6 days of creation (24 hr days) with a very old earth, since it is clear that Adam was created on day 6.  

So you still have a problem with your view.

Edited August 14, 2023 by FreeGrace

[FreeGrace]

11 hours ago, SavedOnebyGrace said:

I guess what I'm saying is we have believers believing in all types of things all using the same bible. As an OEC, I look at Genesis 1:1-1:2 as predating the seven days of creation starting with Genesis 1:3.

Well, this is kind of weird.  If v.3 BEGINS creation, then THAT would be when dating of the earth BEGINS.  Yet, you view v.1-2 as a pre-creation creation, or something.

Your view gots problems.

It would seem your view is that God created something (v.1-2) and then started over in v.3.  Why?

[BeyondET]

3 hours ago, FreeGrace said:

You mentioned "extra" days.  All I see here is days out of order.  Where are the "extra" days, and where do you find them in Scripture?

The wording of v.2 SHOWS that the earth became a wasteland.  Unless someone or something had a nuclear bomb laying around, I seriously doubt "an hour".

And, what is more, we don't know how long the original creation of earth was untouched BEFORE whatever happened to cause it to be a wasteland.

And it doesn't matter.  What is clearly obvious is that the universe and earth are very old.  And v.2 gives us the reason, without the details.

You have no idea how the earth is very much older than Adam, but I do, and from Scripture.  

One more thing.  You relate the days in Genesis 1 as creation days.  I call them restoration days.  

So, the question remains;  how do you reconcile 6 days of creation (24 hr days) with a very old earth, since it is clear that Adam was created on day 6.  

So you still have a problem with your view.

Your wrong again, you said extra days not me, we have already discussed that. There are other days than just day 1 where verse 1:2 is. That's what I meant if you didn't comprehend.

Show me in scripture that it says each day was 24 hour days?

Edited August 14, 2023 by BeyondET

[FreeGrace]

7 minutes ago, BeyondET said:

Your wrong again, you said extra days not me, we have already discussed that.

Somebody said it.  You're the most recent poster.

7 minutes ago, BeyondET said:

Show me in scripture that it says each day was 24 hour days?

Uh, easy. morning and evening.  v.5,8,13,19,23, and 31.  6 days of of 24 hours each.

That's what 'morning and evening' refer to.

Or, prove from Scripture that the "days" mentioned in the above verses either CANNOT be 24 hour days, or somewhere in Scripture it tells us something other than 24 hour days.

My answer is logical, reasonable, and Scriptural.  What is your answer?

[BeyondET]

54 minutes ago, FreeGrace said:

Somebody said it.  You're the most recent poster.

Uh, easy. morning and evening.  v.5,8,13,19,23, and 31.  6 days of of 24 hours each.

That's what 'morning and evening' refer to.

Or, prove from Scripture that the "days" mentioned in the above verses either CANNOT be 24 hour days, or somewhere in Scripture it tells us something other than 24 hour days.

My answer is logical, reasonable, and Scriptural.  What is your answer?

Somebody said it and Im just the next poster? What does that mean you dont care who said it just accuse anybody?

You don't know if earth was spinning a thousand miles and hour if at all. You need midday and midnight to complete a 24 hour day.

Edited August 14, 2023 by BeyondET

[BeyondET]

54 minutes ago, FreeGrace said:

Uh, easy. morning and evening.  v.5,8,13,19,23, and 31.  6 days of of 24 hours each.

That's what 'morning and evening' refer to.

Or, prove from Scripture that the "days" mentioned in the above verses either CANNOT be 24 hour days, or somewhere in Scripture it tells us something other than 24 hour days.

My answer is logical, reasonable, and Scriptural.  What is your answer?

Interesting are you a OEC and a YER?. Young Earth Restorationist 

Edited August 14, 2023 by BeyondET