dad2 Posted March 27 Group: Diamond Member Followers: 0 Topic Count: 18 Topics Per Day: 0.01 Content Count: 1,505 Content Per Day: 0.97 Reputation: 184 Days Won: 0 Joined: 01/28/2020 Status: Offline Author Share Posted March 27 35 minutes ago, The Barbarian said: We all know why they won't. Because you know what would happen. We know the next time the world is judged it will be by fire not water. That's why. If God did not tell Noah to build that ark and how and why and in what timeframe etc, it would have been foolishness to build a boat. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RV_Wizard Posted March 28 Group: Senior Member Followers: 1 Topic Count: 6 Topics Per Day: 0.01 Content Count: 738 Content Per Day: 0.80 Reputation: 313 Days Won: 0 Joined: 10/22/2021 Status: Offline Birthday: 09/05/1962 Share Posted March 28 4 hours ago, The Barbarian said: You're still trying to fit reality with the ancient Hebrew ideas of the universe. That passage assumes a flat earth with a dome shaped sky with windows in it through which rain fell Just another lie. No, I did not write this. No, I'm not trying to make what happened fit anything. Why don't you just be honest and admit that there is nothing in the Bible you believe? Evolution did not happen. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Barbarian Posted March 28 Group: Royal Member Followers: 3 Topic Count: 27 Topics Per Day: 0.00 Content Count: 5,051 Content Per Day: 0.66 Reputation: 969 Days Won: 0 Joined: 06/20/2003 Status: Offline Share Posted March 28 1 hour ago, RV_Wizard said: Just another lie. No, I did not write this. No, I'm not trying to make what happened fit anything. When you try to interpret "under heaven" as literal, you have accepted the ancient Hebrew conception of a flat earth with a solid domed sky. Why don't you just be honest and admit it? Is there anything in the Bible you actually believe? 1 hour ago, RV_Wizard said: Evolution did not happen. It happens and is observed constantly around us. No point in denial. Would you like me to show you some more examples? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RV_Wizard Posted March 28 Group: Senior Member Followers: 1 Topic Count: 6 Topics Per Day: 0.01 Content Count: 738 Content Per Day: 0.80 Reputation: 313 Days Won: 0 Joined: 10/22/2021 Status: Offline Birthday: 09/05/1962 Share Posted March 28 8 hours ago, The Barbarian said: When you try to interpret "under heaven" as literal, you have accepted the ancient Hebrew conception of a flat earth with a solid domed sky. No, the heavens are above the earth. What the Hebrews thought and what the Bible actually says are different notions. "Everything under the whole heaven" applies to the entire earth. Likewise, Shoel was thought to be in the earth; under the mountains. Not knowing its exact location doesn't mean it doesn't exist. 8 hours ago, The Barbarian said: It happens and is observed constantly around us. Speciation happens, which is why we have so many species now they would never fit into an ark. However, dogs and cats have no common ancestor. Humans' only ancestors are other humans. All the common animals were created in six days. Does that mean God couldn't change a group of animals to do a specific job in a specific location? Not at all. God can created another species any time He thinks there should be one. The creation glorifies the Creator. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RdJ Posted March 28 Group: Diamond Member Followers: 1 Topic Count: 66 Topics Per Day: 0.02 Content Count: 1,090 Content Per Day: 0.35 Reputation: 610 Days Won: 0 Joined: 10/11/2015 Status: Offline Birthday: 05/25/1970 Share Posted March 28 15 hours ago, The Barbarian said: You're still trying to fit reality with the ancient Hebrew ideas of the universe. That passage assumes a flat earth with a dome shaped sky with windows in it through which rain fell. Only one side of a spherical earth could be under heaven as the Hebrews considered it. You see, creationists, faced with the fact that the Ark would not have been even close to big enough to hold seven pairs (or two for unclean) of all the animals existing on the Earth today, suppose that there was some kind of hypersuperevolution that produced all the others in a few thousand years. It may be that they thought that, but what does it matter? God said it, so He didn't mean the earth is flat. And maybe there was a rakea and that's why they got so old. I don't believe hypersuperevolution. The Bible says Noah had a dove and a raven. Not one type of bird. Abraham: So He said to him, “Bring Me a three-year-old heifer, a three-year-old female goat, a three-year-old ram, a turtledove, and a young pigeon.” Genesis 15:9 NKJV https://bible.com/bible/114/gen.15.9.NKJV Moses wasn't that long after Noah. These are the animals which you may eat: the ox, the sheep, the goat, the deer, the gazelle, the roe deer, the wild goat, the mountain goat, the antelope, and the mountain sheep. But these you shall not eat: the eagle, the vulture, the buzzard, the red kite, the falcon, and the kite after their kinds; the ostrich, the short-eared owl, the sea gull, and the hawk after their kinds; the little owl, the screech owl, the white owl, the stork, the heron after its kind, and the hoopoe and the bat. Deuteronomy 14:4-5, 12-13, 15-16, 18 NKJV https://bible.com/bible/114/deu.14.4-18.NKJV But polar bears for instance, they can still mate with brown bears, so they just changed after the flood, because they adapted to the climate. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Barbarian Posted March 28 Group: Royal Member Followers: 3 Topic Count: 27 Topics Per Day: 0.00 Content Count: 5,051 Content Per Day: 0.66 Reputation: 969 Days Won: 0 Joined: 06/20/2003 Status: Offline Share Posted March 28 1 hour ago, RdJ said: It may be that they thought that, but what does it matter? God said it, so He didn't mean the earth is flat. And maybe there was a rakea and that's why they got so old. My point. Instead of accounting for the things the Hebrews believed about the world at the time, some people try to insert it into the actual message He's giving us. 1 hour ago, RdJ said: I don't believe hypersuperevolution. I don't, either. YE creationists invented it when they realized that there was no way to keep all species of animals on the ark for a year. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Barbarian Posted March 28 Group: Royal Member Followers: 3 Topic Count: 27 Topics Per Day: 0.00 Content Count: 5,051 Content Per Day: 0.66 Reputation: 969 Days Won: 0 Joined: 06/20/2003 Status: Offline Share Posted March 28 5 hours ago, RdJ said: But polar bears for instance, they can still mate with brown bears, so they just changed after the flood, because they adapted to the climate. There is a transitional form, Ursus maritumus tyrranus, which was more like a brown bear, but showed adapations for cold, snowy, and marine environments. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RV_Wizard Posted March 29 Group: Senior Member Followers: 1 Topic Count: 6 Topics Per Day: 0.01 Content Count: 738 Content Per Day: 0.80 Reputation: 313 Days Won: 0 Joined: 10/22/2021 Status: Offline Birthday: 09/05/1962 Share Posted March 29 11 hours ago, The Barbarian said: YE creationists invented it when they realized that there was no way to keep all species of animals on the ark for a year. It is not lost on us that when I asked you which, if any, parts of the Bible you believed you had no answer. The laws of nature behave as they do because God made them that way. If it serves His purpose to reverse the rotation of the earth He can do so without negative consequence. If He decides perform a miracle it is as easy as commanding it. If He decides to preserve life and re-introduce it on the other side of a flood that destroys all other living things, He doesn't need your permission. You believe that the conclusions of science supersede the teaching of the Bible. In truth, God's word trumps natural law every time. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SavedOnebyGrace Posted March 31 Group: Royal Member Followers: 0 Topic Count: 11 Topics Per Day: 0.04 Content Count: 4,058 Content Per Day: 14.97 Reputation: 5,191 Days Won: 0 Joined: 07/30/2023 Status: Online Share Posted March 31 On 10/16/2023 at 8:07 PM, teddyv said: Talk to the oil and gas industry. They use radiometric dating extensively. Also, why 4300 years? The earth, as posited by YEC's is over 6000 years old. We know physics is working in the past as it does today because we can see observe stars and other distant objects as they were many thousands, to millions, to billions of years ago. Scientists also use ice cores to determine how the atmosphere has changed over time. How the Earth's magnetic field has changed. The shifting of continents, the rearranging lands and seas - Noah's Flood, Lucifer's Flood and the other global floods - can be seen in the ice cores AND dated. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RV_Wizard Posted March 31 Group: Senior Member Followers: 1 Topic Count: 6 Topics Per Day: 0.01 Content Count: 738 Content Per Day: 0.80 Reputation: 313 Days Won: 0 Joined: 10/22/2021 Status: Offline Birthday: 09/05/1962 Share Posted March 31 Basically, the gap theory, which for some incorporates the so-called Lucifer’s flood, teaches that many millions of years ago God created a perfect heaven and earth (Genesis 1:1). At that time, Satan was the ruler of the earth, which was inhabited by a race of men with no souls. Satan rebelled, and sin entered the universe after Satan’s rebellion and fall from heaven. Satan’s fall also brought God’s judgment in the form of a flood named for him: Lucifer’s flood. All the plant, animal, and human fossils upon the earth today were caused by this flood and do not bear any genetic relationship with the plants, animals and humans living today. This Luciferian flood is said to have occurred between Genesis 1:1 and 1:2, and it was this event that explains the “waters” and that reduced the world to the “without form and void” state in Genesis 1:2 (KJV). source In other words, it's heresy, and just another example of the many false doctrines which will arise in the last day before the return of Jesus Christ. Lucifer is a fallen archangel whose future is eternal damnation. He never ruled some mystical pre-earth that existed before the universe did. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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