JohnS Posted January 9, 2004 Group: Royal Member Followers: 0 Topic Count: 193 Topics Per Day: 0.02 Content Count: 1,459 Content Per Day: 0.18 Reputation: 5 Days Won: 0 Joined: 02/28/2002 Status: Offline Birthday: 09/20/1965 Share Posted January 9, 2004 Just curious. Does not supporting the troops mean that you endorse 300,000 Iraqis in mass graves or Iraqis being fed into plastic shredders? Uh....no! I take this to mean you fully support the actions of those in the video. I fail to grasp how anyone. especially Christians, can endorse what this clip shows. Does supporting the troops mean you support waging war and killing thousands on false pretences(a nice way to say bold faced lying and deceiving)? Does the fact that Saddam was a nasty fellow excuse Bush for this fraud and the loss of life that ensued, or the guys in this video for cold blooded murder? Will God excuse their behavior? Again, this thread was not about Saddam and his regime's crimes, some of which America gave him a helping hand with, we are talking about American troops of whom Bush is commander in chief. Sorry, I didn't watch the clip and you couldn't care less either. Your mind was made up long before. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tyler Posted January 10, 2004 Group: Advanced Member Followers: 0 Topic Count: 8 Topics Per Day: 0.00 Content Count: 222 Content Per Day: 0.03 Reputation: 0 Days Won: 0 Joined: 10/19/2003 Status: Offline Share Posted January 10, 2004 Do you not know they would do the same thing or worse? But this isn't about "them." It's about American troops and Christian endorsement of them. Just curious. Does not supporting the troops mean that you endorse 300,000 Iraqis in mass graves or Iraqis being fed into plastic shredders? I did not endorse Six Million Jews being thrown into the ovens...But I know alot of Christian Men (Americans) who gave their lives to stop it! No One is saying, Good day, today lets go Kill some Iraqi's! After 9-11 did America really have a choice to do nothing?? Only Christ Saves Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest daughterofaking Posted January 10, 2004 Share Posted January 10, 2004 I have no doubt that our own military has some individuals who are capable of unspeakable acts. However, I cannot call their individual actions a "war crime" so much as a crime against man by a man. Face it -- there are bad apples everywhere -- even in our own military but it doesn't ruin the whole cart. Well said, River! :t: I don't doubt that there has been SOME cases of US (and UK) soldiers abusing Iraqis but I'm sick and tired of the way the liberals try to make out all US soldiers are behaving like Nazis in Iraq and Afghanistan. That article OA posted mentioned FOUR soldiers engaging in this sort of abuse. There must be hundreds of US soldiers in Iraq so it's a bit unfair to judge them all by a few rotten apples. So to say such abuse is "widespread" is very unfair to the majority of decent US soldiers in Iraq. Plus these thugs were punished for their behaviour and rightly so! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Catsmeow Posted January 10, 2004 Group: Royal Member Followers: 0 Topic Count: 439 Topics Per Day: 0.06 Content Count: 7,315 Content Per Day: 0.93 Reputation: 356 Days Won: 0 Joined: 11/21/2002 Status: Offline Share Posted January 10, 2004 DOAK: Well said, sister! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest LadyC Posted January 10, 2004 Share Posted January 10, 2004 There must be hundreds of US soldiers in Iraq so it's a bit unfair to judge them all by a few rotten apples. as of Christmas, the number of US soldiers in iraq was 130,000... so my comment may sound a bit ann coulter-ish, but i believe anyone who dares to ask should we really support our troops because of a relatively few isolated incidents of inappropriate and/or criminal behavior is being treasonous. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OneAccord Posted January 10, 2004 Group: Diamond Member Followers: 1 Topic Count: 147 Topics Per Day: 0.02 Content Count: 1,587 Content Per Day: 0.20 Reputation: 7 Days Won: 0 Joined: 10/03/2002 Status: Offline Share Posted January 10, 2004 I guess the question is what is meant by 'supporting the troops'. My heart breaks for those sons and daughter caught up as pawns in the political chessgame, while the kings and queens sit in corporate boardrooms counting score, the horrors that they have witnessed, the fear they must live with not being able to trust anyone they meet and wondering who's next, all the amputees. I think about their future too which looks pretty bleak if we can look to the fate of a large number of Vietnam vets as a foreshadowing of what's to come. Huge numbers of Vietnam vets committed suicide, are homeless, are alcoholics and addicts, suffer terribly from post-traumatic stress syndrome, are afflicted by violent episodes directed at spouses, children, loved ones, haunted by horrid memories of things they have seen, hell on earth. My heart breaks for the Iraqi soldiers, too, for all the same reasons. The abuses shown on the video and the article serve to demonstrate what war can do to people, turn them into killers and capable of atrocities that will haunt them for the rest of their lives if they come out of it with a shred of conscience. It's obvious that all of the soldiers are not behaving this way, I'm sure most would rather come on home. But I also think these abuses are not all that uncommon, these portraits are just the ones that got caught. On the flip side you can say that not all the Iraqi soldiers are cold-blooded killers either, plotting horrid torture for their victims. Most are sons and daughters, fathers and husbands, caught up in a brutal, desperate, complicated war on their own land. We are so lucky it is 'over there'. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest idolsmasher Posted January 10, 2004 Share Posted January 10, 2004 You are soo right on with this post OA! What a heavy heavy price to pay for the average soldier who doesn't even know the real motives behind the war and why he is really there. Sorry, I didn't watch the clip and you couldn't care less either. Your mind was made up long before. Sorry if I misjudged you but we're discussing the clip John. Maybe you should follow the thread a bit more. Check the clip and tell me where you stand on it. No One is saying, Good day, today lets go Kill some Iraqi's! I'm sure this has been said by a good number of American troops on a number of occasions. You would have to be naive not to think so. After 9-11 did America really have a choice to do nothing?? Show me the link between Saddam and Osama! It doesn't exist or it would have been huge news. All we've gotten so far is speculation and misinformation from Bush supporters and neo-con think tanks. I did not endorse Six Million Jews being thrown into the ovens...But I know alot of Christian Men (Americans) who gave their lives to stop it! Do you really think America went to war with Germany to save the Jews? Don't you think it is more because they were afraid of Germany becoming a super power. I doubt it had anything to do with atrocities and everything to do with power. Anyway, that was a different situation altogether, but as long as you are bringing up the Nazi's, check this out: Bush/Hitler comparisons by a holocaust survivor. so my comment may sound a bit ann coulter-ish Yes you do, ha ha ha! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OneAccord Posted January 10, 2004 Group: Diamond Member Followers: 1 Topic Count: 147 Topics Per Day: 0.02 Content Count: 1,587 Content Per Day: 0.20 Reputation: 7 Days Won: 0 Joined: 10/03/2002 Status: Offline Share Posted January 10, 2004 Good link, Smash. I hope people read it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest idolsmasher Posted January 10, 2004 Share Posted January 10, 2004 Been there , done that. Is Iraq covered under the Geneva Convention? Not all nations are. I think our troops learned from Viet Nam. Sure I know, someone is going to bring up Lt. Calley now. However, the troops looked relaxed after the shooting, there was no camera on them during so you don't know what they looked like. The liberal press does all sorts of doctoring of tapes, mostly to make us and the present administration look bad. Saddam Hussein has just been declared a prisoner of war under the Geneva convention. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest yod Posted January 10, 2004 Share Posted January 10, 2004 Show me the link between Saddam and Osama! They are both brutal murderers of innocent people en masse for their own pleasure. Thats enough reason to wipe their faces off the desert of Babylon. Any old excuse will do for those kind of people. Most Americans know this basic fact...and that is why they don't care WHAT you have against Bush or this war. Middle Eastern punks have been pushing America around since the assassination of our Ambassador by Yassir Arafat in the 60's. He hasn't changed his stripes either, by the way, but when the Marine Barracks were car-bombed by Imad Muggniyahh (Iranian who is still at large yet we know he lives in the Bekka Valley of Lebanon) and we CAN'T do anything because of the diplomatic covering of a pariah state like Iran.....or Syria, or Iraq, or Saudi Arabia, or Yemen, or Iran, or Pakistan, or Libya, or WHOEVER?????? We don't care that there are no WMDs being found in Iraq. We all knew he would have them if he could get them and was willing to help anyone who opposed us. Just like the Taliban, we can't have terrorist states with evil intent against us anymore since 911. They want a fight? We'll let them have it but we would just as soon get it over with now. I said a long time ago that this war would make an example to our enemies that they don't want to mess with us while sucking all the "wild cards" into Iraq to get themselves killed. It's happening. Iran wants to talk nice.....Libya gives up her nuclear aspirations.....Eygpt is having talks with Iran about peace.....Pakistan and India.....North Korea.....even Syria is being quiet! Think about it. Would those nations have changed theri belligerent ways if we had not given them a little "initiative"? You guys are missing the whole point G'head..G'head (that's Jersey-speak) We're counting on it Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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