CWJ Posted January 23, 2004 Group: Diamond Member Followers: 1 Topic Count: 22 Topics Per Day: 0.00 Content Count: 455 Content Per Day: 0.06 Reputation: 8 Days Won: 0 Joined: 01/28/2002 Status: Offline Share Posted January 23, 2004 Jesus fullfilled scripture...so...He picked a devil to betray Him...as to fullfill scriptures. Judas is portrayed as evil hearted throughout the time with Jesus. "that they might be made manifest that they were not all of us." Good post Rick Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
His son Posted January 24, 2004 Group: Diamond Member Followers: 0 Topic Count: 1 Topics Per Day: 0.00 Content Count: 764 Content Per Day: 0.10 Reputation: 6 Days Won: 0 Joined: 12/01/2003 Status: Offline Share Posted January 24, 2004 Quote: Judas was lost from the get-go I think. He was never given by God. totally mans word. These words are not in The Bible. Jesus knew because of His total connection to The Father who knew every choice Judas would make, and He instructed Jesus to call him to the Apostleship. When Judas heard Jesus preach the kingdom, he believed and started in the salvation process, and followed Jesus. My personal opinion on why he did what he did is he thought Jesus would reveal who He was by using the miracles Judas had seen Him use to deliver others from their bondages. And I believe he was deceived into this by satan. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CWJ Posted January 24, 2004 Group: Diamond Member Followers: 1 Topic Count: 22 Topics Per Day: 0.00 Content Count: 455 Content Per Day: 0.06 Reputation: 8 Days Won: 0 Joined: 01/28/2002 Status: Offline Share Posted January 24, 2004 Quote: Judas was lost from the get-go I think. He was never given by God. totally mans word. These words are not in The Bible. Jesus knew because of His total connection to The Father who knew every choice Judas would make, and He instructed Jesus to call him to the Apostleship. When Judas heard Jesus preach the kingdom, he believed and started in the salvation process, and followed Jesus. My personal opinion on why he did what he did is he thought Jesus would reveal who He was by using the miracles Judas had seen Him use to deliver others from their bondages. And I believe he was deceived into this by satan. These words are not in the Bible!!!!!!!!!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
His son Posted January 24, 2004 Group: Diamond Member Followers: 0 Topic Count: 1 Topics Per Day: 0.00 Content Count: 764 Content Per Day: 0.10 Reputation: 6 Days Won: 0 Joined: 12/01/2003 Status: Offline Share Posted January 24, 2004 Quote: Judas was lost from the get-go I think. He was never given by God. totally mans word. These words are not in The Bible. Jesus knew because of His total connection to The Father who knew every choice Judas would make, and He instructed Jesus to call him to the Apostleship. When Judas heard Jesus preach the kingdom, he believed and started in the salvation process, and followed Jesus. My personal opinion on why he did what he did is he thought Jesus would reveal who He was by using the miracles Judas had seen Him use to deliver others from their bondages. And I believe he was deceived into this by satan. These words are not in the Bible!!!!!!!!!! Like I posted it was my personal opinion, and thats all it is. I didn't say that is was in The Bible because we don't know what his motivation was. My statement that none of those words are in The Bible was for what you said about Judas, and that is still true. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CWJ Posted January 25, 2004 Group: Diamond Member Followers: 1 Topic Count: 22 Topics Per Day: 0.00 Content Count: 455 Content Per Day: 0.06 Reputation: 8 Days Won: 0 Joined: 01/28/2002 Status: Offline Share Posted January 25, 2004 If you will read what I wrote you will see i wrote "I think".... I get the feeling you're on my case somewhat...... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Work in Progress Posted January 29, 2004 Group: Royal Member Followers: 2 Topic Count: 123 Topics Per Day: 0.02 Content Count: 3,111 Content Per Day: 0.39 Reputation: 35 Days Won: 0 Joined: 08/29/2002 Status: Offline Share Posted January 29, 2004 Sigh. "God couldn't is an oxymoron. JMO. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest LadyC Posted January 29, 2004 Share Posted January 29, 2004 WIP.... amen! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest idolsmasher Posted January 29, 2004 Share Posted January 29, 2004 Couldn't the fact that Judas hung himself mean that he repented when he realised he was wrong and was remourseful? Why couldn't he have been forgiven? Noboby knew yet about the need to ask Jesus into your heart and Christ's work was not yet completely done until the resurrection and the giving of the Holy Ghost. If Judas had known about that, he might not have taken his life. Lots of people who were possesed of devils have been forgiven and saved. I definitely believe it is possible that he was forgiven by God, because it seemed he was repentant afterward. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest LadyC Posted January 29, 2004 Share Posted January 29, 2004 Couldn't the fact that Judas hung himself mean that he repented when he realised he was wrong and was remourseful? Why couldn't he have been forgiven? Noboby knew yet about the need to ask Jesus into your heart and Christ's work was not yet completely done until the resurrection and the giving of the Holy Ghost. If Judas had known about that, he might not have taken his life. Lots of people who were possesed of devils have been forgiven and saved. I definitely believe it is possible that he was forgiven by God, because it seemed he was repentant afterward. we will have to wait til we get to heaven to know if Judas repented. the Bible tells us that he repented to the chief priests, but does not indicate whether he repented to God. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rick Posted January 29, 2004 Group: Diamond Member Followers: 0 Topic Count: 5 Topics Per Day: 0.00 Content Count: 265 Content Per Day: 0.03 Reputation: 2 Days Won: 0 Joined: 06/19/2002 Status: Offline Share Posted January 29, 2004 Couldn't the fact that Judas hung himself mean that he repented when he realised he was wrong and was remourseful? Why couldn't he have been forgiven? Noboby knew yet about the need to ask Jesus into your heart and Christ's work was not yet completely done until the resurrection and the giving of the Holy Ghost. If Judas had known about that, he might not have taken his life. Lots of people who were possesed of devils have been forgiven and saved. I definitely believe it is possible that he was forgiven by God, because it seemed he was repentant afterward. we will have to wait til we get to heaven to know if Judas repented. the Bible tells us that he repented to the chief priests, but does not indicate whether he repented to God. Judas indeed was mentioned as having showed repentance in that he returned the money he was given for betraying Jesus. But the question of his repentance lies in what was he remorseful of? Was it that he had betrayed innocent blood ? He acknowledged that he did. Being sorrowful for sin does not in itself bring forgiveness for sin. Being remorseful over accepting money for a wrong does not mean forgiveness of sin as well. Somthing that jumps out to me is that even though he was remorseful, he never asked to be forgiven. Instead, we are told things about Judas that may imply that more was actually taking place within him than we realize. for example, " While I was with them in the world, I kept them in thy name: Those that Thou gavest Me I have kept. and none of them is lost, but the son of perdition: that the scripture might be fufilled." John 17:12 This verse implies that one of them was lost. The son of perdition, that the scriptures might be fulfilled. In this verse, Jesus also says He kept the others. He watched over them protected them etc. The scriptures refer to Judas as a devil. and we are told that satan entered into him. " Jesus answered them, Have not I chosen you twelve, and one of you is a devil ? He spake of Judas Iscariot the son of Simon: for it was he that should betray Him, being one of the twelve." John 6:70-71. " Then entered Satan into judas surnamed Iscariot, being of the number of the twelve." Luke 22:3 There is a clear distinction here that it was more than a mere demon or devil that entered into Judas. But Satan Himself. The mention of the son of perdition being lost in John 17:12 reveals Jesus indeed knew who was in control in Judas. The son of perdition is again mentioned in Thessalonians, revealing what this title entails. " Let no man deceive you by any means: for that day shall not come except there be a falling away first, and that man of sin be revealed, the son of perdition. Who opposeth and exalteth himself above all that is called God, or that is worshipped; so that he as God sitteth in the temple of God, shewing himself that he is God. " 2 Thess. 2:3- 4. We are also told that Judas went to his own place. I often wondered why it was described as his own place. But believe it to be because of what that place was prepared for. " That he may take part of this ministry and apostleship by which Judas by transgression fell, that he might go to his own place." Acts 1:25 " Then shall He say to them on His left hand, depart from Me ye cursed, into everlasting fire, prepared for the Devil and His angels." Matt. 25:41. This may not clear the issue up, but hopefully it will show that Jesus indeed knew that He was dealing with Satan through Judas. And that the repentance that Judas showed was not a repentance that led to his asking for forgiveness, or one that would change the title he acquired as the son of perdition, by the indwelling Satan. Rick Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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