Floatingaxe Posted July 4, 2007 Group: Royal Member Followers: 3 Topic Count: 62 Topics Per Day: 0.01 Content Count: 9,613 Content Per Day: 1.45 Reputation: 656 Days Won: 9 Joined: 03/11/2006 Status: Offline Birthday: 05/31/1952 Share Posted July 4, 2007 Working at celibacy isn't necessary. Jesus heals and restores, and frees people from homosexuality. Are you saying that we will be free from all temptation? Are you free from all temptation to sin? I don't think that is what scripture says. Homosexuality is no different from any other sin. Yes it is. It is an addicting behaviour--sexual addiction. It can also be a demon. Deliverance is required. God does that so well, that there is no more temptation! That can happen, anything can happen with God. But in general you are wrong about temptation and what is promised. Saying sin is a "demon" or some sin is somehow called out as worse or better is not really scriptural. Scripture certainly does not promise us that sort of freedom from temptation. Often it is a lifelong struggle. The alcoholic must daily ask for freedom and struggle with the temptation, and yes God will and does help that person overcome. We should never trivialize the very very hard decades of struggle that people will go through to fight temptations of all kinds including homosexual temptations. This may mean that the person struggling with this must be a life long celibate. Of course all people who are not married are called to lifelong celibacy. Some Christians who fight homosexual temptations finally after years of struggle no longer desire people of the same sex, some Christians never totally lose these temptations, we all have a cross to carry. The one thing God does NOT promise us is an easy time of it on this earth; doctrines which do promise this are setups for failures and despondency. However God does promise us help and deliverence from sin no doubt about that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Floatingaxe Posted July 4, 2007 Group: Royal Member Followers: 3 Topic Count: 62 Topics Per Day: 0.01 Content Count: 9,613 Content Per Day: 1.45 Reputation: 656 Days Won: 9 Joined: 03/11/2006 Status: Offline Birthday: 05/31/1952 Share Posted July 4, 2007 Working at celibacy isn't necessary. Jesus heals and restores, and frees people from homosexuality. Are you saying that we will be free from all temptation? Are you free from all temptation to sin? I don't think that is what scripture says. Homosexuality is no different from any other sin. Yes it is. It is an addicting behaviour--sexual addiction. It can also be a demon. Deliverance is required. God does that so well, that there is no more temptation! That can happen, anything can happen with God. But in general you are wrong about temptation and what is promised. Saying sin is a "demon" or some sin is somehow called out as worse or better is not really scriptural. Scripture certainly does not promise us that sort of freedom from temptation. Often it is a lifelong struggle. The alcoholic must daily ask for freedom and struggle with the temptation, and yes God will and does help that person overcome. We should never trivialize the very very hard decades of struggle that people will go through to fight temptations of all kinds including homosexual temptations. This may mean that the person struggling with this must be a life long celibate. Of course all people who are not married are called to lifelong celibacy. Some Christians who fight homosexual temptations finally after years of struggle no longer desire people of the same sex, some Christians never totally lose these temptations, we all have a cross to carry. The one thing God does NOT promise us is an easy time of it on this earth; doctrines which do promise this are setups for failures and despondency. However God does promise us help and deliverence from sin no doubt about that. Do you limit God? Do you not believe in full deliverance by His mighty power? Do you think that God cannot deliver so totally that there is no further temptation? Come now! The desire that we see in homosexuality is not even normal! It is a perversion apart from the temptation to sin in other areas. Not all of us struggle with that particular sin. It is a sin set apart. We all struggle with various levels of lust, but homosexuality is over the top. It is a BONDAGE! It is a stronghold! These things are demonic. I believe that not in every case, but in many, there is a demon of sodomy there. Once delivered by the power of the Holy Spirit, you are delivered! Free---totally! No more struggle, thank Jesus! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest LadyC Posted July 4, 2007 Share Posted July 4, 2007 the passage was written about those who had KNOWN GOD (not had some abstract knowledge of, but had known Him personally), not about those who had never had a relationship with Him. you and i have had this discussion before. if YOU push hard enough, it still won't fit... known God personally? you know God through scripture. plus scripture wasnt written to the romans to know God personally. and Jesus didnt travel to Rome so they can know Him personally. Even if someone traveled into Rome and spread the news that doesnt qualify as personal. Youre right we've had this talk and Paul wrote it criticizing Nero and if you want to fit it to say homosexuals fit this cause then by all means....swing away. no dear, i don't just know God thru scripture, i have a PERSONAL relationship with Him. don't you? and we've had this discussion before. you never could come up with anything to refute what i provided scripturally, and even admitted that you may need to study the context of the passage in more depth. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest lovinghim4ever Posted July 4, 2007 Share Posted July 4, 2007 This debate will always be around, however I pray everyone remember that homosexuality is NOT an unforgivable sin. It is a struggle for some just like other sins are a struggle for others, however it is NOT unforgivable. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Him_Crucified330 Posted July 4, 2007 Group: Junior Member Followers: 1 Topic Count: 3 Topics Per Day: 0.00 Content Count: 115 Content Per Day: 0.02 Reputation: 1 Days Won: 0 Joined: 07/03/2007 Status: Offline Birthday: 03/30/1989 Author Share Posted July 4, 2007 I would have to agree with Floatingaxe, that homosexuality is definately a demonic spirit that comes upon that person. How do I know? Because dispite what they say, God does not create homosexual people, they aren't born that way. Why therefore, do they have those 'feelings'? Because they have somehow opened themselves up to that spirit and are now in bondage over it. I think that the best place to start praying first for my Uncle, is that The Lord would somehow deliver him from that spirit of homosexuality. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vickilynn Posted July 4, 2007 Group: Royal Member Followers: 2 Topic Count: 138 Topics Per Day: 0.02 Content Count: 3,997 Content Per Day: 0.63 Reputation: 19 Days Won: 0 Joined: 02/13/2007 Status: Offline Share Posted July 4, 2007 This debate will always be around, however I pray everyone remember that homosexuality is NOT an unforgivable sin. It is a struggle for some just like other sins are a struggle for others, however it is NOT unforgivable. Shalom, ONLY if the person repents. As long as they are UNrepentant, there is no forgiveness. This is the crux of the discussion. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mightyshins Posted July 4, 2007 Group: Members Followers: 0 Topic Count: 3 Topics Per Day: 0.00 Content Count: 15 Content Per Day: 0.00 Reputation: 0 Days Won: 0 Joined: 07/04/2007 Status: Offline Share Posted July 4, 2007 You know what to do with your uncle? You preach to him the word until he casts you out of his life, if he truly loves you in return he will listen and heed to your word, of course you have to preach to him in faith that he will come through. Jesus did that very thing and they killed him, I'm more than certain if you tried that you would see a change, and if you didn't then you would have suffered in Christ's name. My friend once told me when he preaches, he looks at it as if that person doesn't heed to his word it is his fault that it didn't sink in, it's not a lie he tells himself, it was the only way to describe it to me at that time. It's his conviction and zeal that he has for god. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Smalcald Posted July 5, 2007 Group: Royal Member Followers: 0 Topic Count: 32 Topics Per Day: 0.00 Content Count: 5,258 Content Per Day: 0.76 Reputation: 42 Days Won: 3 Joined: 06/16/2005 Status: Offline Birthday: 07/22/1960 Share Posted July 5, 2007 Working at celibacy isn't necessary. Jesus heals and restores, and frees people from homosexuality. Are you saying that we will be free from all temptation? Are you free from all temptation to sin? I don't think that is what scripture says. Homosexuality is no different from any other sin. Yes it is. It is an addicting behaviour--sexual addiction. It can also be a demon. Deliverance is required. God does that so well, that there is no more temptation! That can happen, anything can happen with God. But in general you are wrong about temptation and what is promised. Saying sin is a "demon" or some sin is somehow called out as worse or better is not really scriptural. Scripture certainly does not promise us that sort of freedom from temptation. Often it is a lifelong struggle. The alcoholic must daily ask for freedom and struggle with the temptation, and yes God will and does help that person overcome. We should never trivialize the very very hard decades of struggle that people will go through to fight temptations of all kinds including homosexual temptations. This may mean that the person struggling with this must be a life long celibate. Of course all people who are not married are called to lifelong celibacy. Some Christians who fight homosexual temptations finally after years of struggle no longer desire people of the same sex, some Christians never totally lose these temptations, we all have a cross to carry. The one thing God does NOT promise us is an easy time of it on this earth; doctrines which do promise this are setups for failures and despondency. However God does promise us help and deliverence from sin no doubt about that. Do you limit God? Do you not believe in full deliverance by His mighty power? Do you think that God cannot deliver so totally that there is no further temptation? Come now! The desire that we see in homosexuality is not even normal! It is a perversion apart from the temptation to sin in other areas. Not all of us struggle with that particular sin. It is a sin set apart. We all struggle with various levels of lust, but homosexuality is over the top. It is a BONDAGE! It is a stronghold! These things are demonic. I believe that not in every case, but in many, there is a demon of sodomy there. Once delivered by the power of the Holy Spirit, you are delivered! Free---totally! No more struggle, thank Jesus! All sin is a perversion of some sort to God's plan. I don't limit God, how could I? But God has not promised us any sort of freedom from temptation; God has not promised us that we would not have to struggle against the flesh. Indeed we know that we have to fight and would with faith WANT to fight against the fiery darts of lust and all sin which hit all humans, including homosexuals. It may indeed happen that God will lift all temptation in a certain area; God could also cure someone's cancer. But it is not necessary for God to do so nor is it promised. What I worry about with your idea is that people wrestling with gay temptation or temptation to cheat on their wife or temptation to fornication or porn or drugs or whatever numerous sins which afflict us, may feel that if these temptations don't totally go away, that God has abandoned them, that they don't have enough faith or some other false test that humans have put on this whole thing. When in reality we are promised only that we will have to suffer and struggle, and in the end if we run the race with endurance we shall have salvation. There is no quick fix. In the case of a homosexual temptation it may mean a life of battling this temptation, it may mean a life time of celibacy for this person and we should be strong enough to admit this and be straight with homosexuals about what we are asking of them. Of course we must ask all people the same thing. The man, who cheats on his wife, is never free to marry another and is also called to be celibate or reconciled to his wife. So we must be consistent in these areas. I notice that we seem to call out homosexuality as some sort of special sin, I think it may have to do with the fact that most of us are not burdened with this temptation and thus feel quite self righteous in our condemnation, but God forbid we should start talking about divorce, then all bets are off. We don't seem to be consistent in sexual sin and this hurts our ministry to homosexuals in my opinion. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MeCajunboy Posted July 5, 2007 Group: Diamond Member Followers: 2 Topic Count: 113 Topics Per Day: 0.02 Content Count: 1,430 Content Per Day: 0.23 Reputation: 33 Days Won: 1 Joined: 12/24/2006 Status: Offline Birthday: 06/28/1952 Share Posted July 5, 2007 My Uncle is a homosexual, and as you can imagine this is hard for me because I love him very much. He's so incredibly funny, and fun to be around, that it kills me to think of this lifestyle he is stuck in. So I have this question: Do you think that homosexuals, if they believe in Jesus, will go to hell? I know that 1 Cor 6:9 says "Do you not know that the unrighteous will not inhereit the kingdom of God? Do not be decieved. Niether fornicators, nor idolaters, nor adulturers, nor homosexuals, nor sodomites (male homosexuals).....10 will inherit the kingdom of God." I always have thought that verse means exactly what it says, until I came across this verse: Romans 14:17 "For the kingdom of God is not eating and drinking, but righteousness and peace and joy in the Holy Spirit." Which would obviously mean that a homosexual cannot experience those things while in that sin. Please tell me what you think on this subject. Thanks! Be Blessed, ~Aaron hi iam kind of new, but im my opinion he should be saved(let jesus and God in heart)and try and turn from that stuff...he may struggle but as long as he try...im no expert just my opinion.if hes already saved then forget the part i said about getting saved...anyway see ya around bye Cajunboy::::: Blessings Shanee, While we respect you for being here and all opinions are welcome, it is better in situations like these to lean fully on "God's Words." And I think if you take a moment to view your index of your Bible and do a search on Immoral Sex, Impure Sex, or Unclean Sex you will find the term Homosexuality nowadays connected with it. That's not to say if you mean that Her Uncle can repent from the sin of homosexuality at any time and live within God's Laws, that God would not consider him at that point, but until then , each of us knows our faith until we are "right with God !" Welcome and Blessings Cajunboy Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MeCajunboy Posted July 5, 2007 Group: Diamond Member Followers: 2 Topic Count: 113 Topics Per Day: 0.02 Content Count: 1,430 Content Per Day: 0.23 Reputation: 33 Days Won: 1 Joined: 12/24/2006 Status: Offline Birthday: 06/28/1952 Share Posted July 5, 2007 Working at celibacy isn't necessary. Jesus heals and restores, and frees people from homosexuality. Are you saying that we will be free from all temptation? Are you free from all temptation to sin? I don't think that is what scripture says. Homosexuality is no different from any other sin. Temptation never ends. I think sexual sin of any kind is different from other sins and much harder to maintain the victory over. Cajunboy:: I agree to a point, but for one who takes pleasure in killing others, he/she might say the same thing you are saying of sexual sin! We can't imagine to know what lurk in people's hearts and minds. I wonder if you are feeling this because we know it is so prevailent in the world today?? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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