Marnie Posted September 30, 2007 Group: Royal Member Followers: 1 Topic Count: 811 Topics Per Day: 0.12 Content Count: 7,338 Content Per Day: 1.08 Reputation: 76 Days Won: 2 Joined: 10/06/2005 Status: Offline Share Posted September 30, 2007 The Church has no one to blame but itself. sorry i feel compelled to register my disagreement on this. Okay. Who shall we blame? Is somebody twisting the arms of church members to believe heresies rather than the plain Word of G-d? Is the Bible being withheld from the Church? Is there some kind of persecution going on whereby the Church is being told how to act? Don't get me wrong, I love the Church, but the Church is doing this to herself. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
eric Posted September 30, 2007 Group: Graduated to Heaven Followers: 2 Topic Count: 50 Topics Per Day: 0.01 Content Count: 4,073 Content Per Day: 0.52 Reputation: 43 Days Won: 0 Joined: 10/02/2002 Status: Offline Birthday: 08/10/1923 Share Posted September 30, 2007 Hi Marnie, you said, Okay. Who shall we blame? Is somebody twisting the arms of church members to believe heresies rather than the plain Word of G-d? Is the Bible being withheld from the Church? Is there some kind of persecution going on whereby the Church is being told how to act? Don't get me wrong, I love the Church, but the Church is doing this to herself. I believe the church, itself, is as strong now, as it was when Christ established her on the day of pentecost. It's the people, society and the world that has changed. Paul pointed that out in the first chapter of 1Cor, when he spoke of the divisions, of the church. Even then some preferred the teaching of, either Paul or Apollos or Cephas, yet they were all giving the same message that Christ gave them in the top room, where they met. The church can't change, because Christ is the church. It was after all the apostles were killed that new comers came in the scene and it's been the same ever since. It's not the fault of the church, but the new styles of those who are supposed to represent her. You ask, is someone twisting the arms of church members? No not physically, but manipulating their minds with smooth talking and holding back on some important issues concerning the value of their soul life. The church is a marketable commodity now. * leave your bibles at home and we will tell you how to have comfortable, healthy wealthy and wise lives* Of course they listen to heresies, becase a lot of them have never heard of the word. Any church is only as good as it's leadership, and a big heap of them have lost the plot. Marnie, I'm glad you have a good assembly thats based on God's solid foundation and still preaches the truth of the Word. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fiosh Posted October 1, 2007 Group: Royal Member Followers: 1 Topic Count: 73 Topics Per Day: 0.01 Content Count: 3,663 Content Per Day: 0.52 Reputation: 5 Days Won: 0 Joined: 03/20/2005 Status: Offline Author Share Posted October 1, 2007 I'd be interested to hear your comments on this video: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4NtgjNLNpao It's Brian McLaren, one of the prominent figures in the Emergent Church movement...or as they call it, conversation. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paul Edwards Posted October 1, 2007 Group: Members Followers: 0 Topic Count: 1 Topics Per Day: 0.00 Content Count: 15 Content Per Day: 0.00 Reputation: 0 Days Won: 0 Joined: 10/01/2007 Status: Offline Share Posted October 1, 2007 Statistics show that in approx. 20 years (if current trends continue) only 10% of the population of the U.S. will attend church on a regular basis. Some call them the "postmodern" generation. Wow. As far as I'm aware, in Australia and the UK the attendance has falled below 1% already. Don't you think it is better to actually do something to help people rather than listen to the same sermon for the millionth time? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
eric Posted October 1, 2007 Group: Graduated to Heaven Followers: 2 Topic Count: 50 Topics Per Day: 0.01 Content Count: 4,073 Content Per Day: 0.52 Reputation: 43 Days Won: 0 Joined: 10/02/2002 Status: Offline Birthday: 08/10/1923 Share Posted October 1, 2007 Statistics show that in approx. 20 years (if current trends continue) only 10% of the population of the U.S. will attend church on a regular basis. Some call them the "postmodern" generation. Wow. As far as I'm aware, in Australia and the UK the attendance has falled below 1% already. Don't you think it is better to actually do something to help people rather than listen to the same sermon for the millionth time? Sorry, Paul, could you please be a little more explicit? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tsth Posted October 1, 2007 Group: Royal Member Followers: 2 Topic Count: 297 Topics Per Day: 0.04 Content Count: 5,586 Content Per Day: 0.69 Reputation: 193 Days Won: 1 Joined: 04/09/2002 Status: Offline Share Posted October 1, 2007 Statistics show that in approx. 20 years (if current trends continue) only 10% of the population of the U.S. will attend church on a regular basis. Some call them the "postmodern" generation. Whatever you call them, what do you think is behind this? What is creating a generation of young people who feel they do not need the church? Is it the culture? Is the Church pushing them away---or not effectively drawing them in? Is it a more global phenomena? Why are we not effectively reaching this generation with the Gospel? Your views? Thanks, Fiosh Hypocrisy....they know it when they see it. In His Love, Suzanne Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted October 1, 2007 Share Posted October 1, 2007 Statistics show that in approx. 20 years (if current trends continue) only 10% of the population of the U.S. will attend church on a regular basis. Some call them the "postmodern" generation. Whatever you call them, what do you think is behind this? What is creating a generation of young people who feel they do not need the church? Is it the culture? Is the Church pushing them away---or not effectively drawing them in? Is it a more global phenomena? Why are we not effectively reaching this generation with the Gospel? Your views? Thanks, Fiosh Having read through the thread, I'll take a crack at it. Many good points have been made. Some of the points are ones I hadn't even thought of. It seems to me that the problem is multi-layered. It took years for things to get this "bad" and it cannot be fixed over night. "There is no easy fix." is another way to put it. I think one of the big reasons the younger folks are not coming to church is partly from the way there are raised now. The family unit is all but destroyed, except for certain cultural groups (in the U.S.). Broken families, single parents, all the modern "toys" we have now. Then there's the hypocrisy they see in the church itself, the factions, lack of unity, and of course the loudly public falls of some mega-church leaders on TV don't help either. Then there's the media, MTV, VH1, and all the rest filling their minds with junk. Sounds pretty hopeless, doesn't it? Here's the good part -- God is still on the throne! I don't see from Scripture that anything can "stop" the church that Jesus started all those years ago. The only way things will turn around is when the believers (who are the Church!) get serious about getting right with God. On our knees repentance and individual and group prayer. That's how people get right and a revival gets started. It's like the 19th century preachers who shook the world back then -- without a watt of electricity for a PA system, much less electric guitars. Those men shook cities and nations by the power of God -- God used them. He still uses people today. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EricH Posted October 1, 2007 Group: Royal Member Followers: 3 Topic Count: 366 Topics Per Day: 0.05 Content Count: 10,933 Content Per Day: 1.57 Reputation: 212 Days Won: 1 Joined: 04/21/2005 Status: Offline Share Posted October 1, 2007 This is nothing new. The boomer generation left the church in huge numbers during the 1960's because it was "too establishment". They came back later when they had kids of their own, so their kids could have the "church experience". That is why children's ministries became the rage in the last few decades. Now that the boomers kids have griwn, many of them are pulling out again. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Marnie Posted October 1, 2007 Group: Royal Member Followers: 1 Topic Count: 811 Topics Per Day: 0.12 Content Count: 7,338 Content Per Day: 1.08 Reputation: 76 Days Won: 2 Joined: 10/06/2005 Status: Offline Share Posted October 1, 2007 I believe the church, itself, is as strong now, as it was when Christ established her on the day of pentecost. It's the people, society and the world that has changed. Paul pointed that out in the first chapter of 1Cor, when he spoke of the divisions, of the church. Even then some preferred the teaching of, either Paul or Apollos or Cephas, yet they were all giving the same message that Christ gave them in the top room, where they met. The church can't change, because Christ is the church. It was after all the apostles were killed that new comers came in the scene and it's been the same ever since. It's not the fault of the church, but the new styles of those who are supposed to represent her. You ask, is someone twisting the arms of church members? No not physically, but manipulating their minds with smooth talking and holding back on some important issues concerning the value of their soul life. The church is a marketable commodity now. * leave your bibles at home and we will tell you how to have comfortable, healthy wealthy and wise lives* Of course they listen to heresies, becase a lot of them have never heard of the word. Any church is only as good as it's leadership, and a big heap of them have lost the plot. Marnie, I'm glad you have a good assembly thats based on God's solid foundation and still preaches the truth of the Word. Well, that was my whole point, but you put it so well. The Church is very good at self-sabotage. We may want to blame the devil, the world, the flesh, and all the minions of Hell, but we have the power to choose their way or G-d's way. I agree: the Church, the TRUE Church is alive and well. There is NO battle between G-d and the Devil. Our G-d is victorious and so are we, but association. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
eric Posted October 1, 2007 Group: Graduated to Heaven Followers: 2 Topic Count: 50 Topics Per Day: 0.01 Content Count: 4,073 Content Per Day: 0.52 Reputation: 43 Days Won: 0 Joined: 10/02/2002 Status: Offline Birthday: 08/10/1923 Share Posted October 1, 2007 You are right, Marnie. There is no battle between God and the devil. The sting was taken out of satan's tail at calvary, and now all he can do is buzz around making noises. The gates of hell cannot prevail against the church built on the rock. I believe that its only a matter of time, with all the negative publicity the church is meeting, such as the hate crime laws,etc, she will be driven underground, That will seperate the true saints from the pew warmers. That's when you will see the church shine...........or maybe I,m just wishful thinking. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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