Do you think tattoos are sinful?

[artsylady]

Where do verses that contain "judge for yourselves" "everything is permissible" or "To the Jews I became a Jew" apply to you?

To the tag team. (you know who you are. )

What do these mean to you? Please, no beating around the bush.

[Vickilynn]

Obviously he is.

Shalom Artsy,

I'm sorry, but you're very wrong. And you are not in a position to judge his heart. You can't speak for our brother.

If he sees it as sinful, obviously he'll be offended.

Wrong again. False assumption based on your own perception and projection. Not even remotely related to anything our brother said. Again, wrongly judging someone's heart is pretty serious. I think you should consider that more than the tattoo question.

#5. Butero is posting his Scriptural beliefs in answer to the OP's question, as YOU are, and he has that right. You do not have the right to judge him.

I know. I just wonder when we can all grow up on concentrate on matters that really do matter.

Since you don't own this board, you are not a Moderator and you are not even the OP, I guess it's not your call as to what we talk about. You are being very rude to the OP who DID think it important enough to ask about. As for growing up, well Artsy, I'd say you should follow your own advice. You are wasting everyone's time in this thread arguing whether we should talk about it. Since you care about important things so much, please stop hijacking this thread.

The weaker brother thinks that something the stronger brother does is sinful. The stronger brother has a stronger concious, the weaker has a weaker conscious.

False. That is NOT what the Scriptures say. Please read what I posted in Romans 14. It explains it very clearly and it is not what you define.

I'm more worried about his judgement of others on these debatable matters.

Butero is not judging anyone. The only one doing that is you dear.

The weaker brother is more spiritually immature.

The "weaker brother" is not the one who stands on Scriptural convictions. The spiritually immature is the one calling names, judging hearts and getting all worked up because someone holds differing views than themselves. THAT is spiritually immature Artsy.

It's time to grow up is all I'm saying.

Yes, please, go ahead. It takes a spiritually mature person to stand firm in their convictions and not attack others who hold differing ones. Let's see some maturity and "growing up." from your end. You are so busy pointing a finger, you can't see the 4 pointing back at you.

I've seen the same debate here probably 10 times over the last 5 years or so. Can we ever get past these and onto more important issues?

Feel free to skip this topic if it is not important to you. As I said before, you don't have the right to determine what other people talk about on this board. And you are being very inconsiderate to the OP and the people here who DO wish to discuss this. That is not your right.

It's time to grow up here.

Yes, please do.

[artsylady]

Then you explain to me why that wouldn't cover literally everything? Is it ok to judge for yourself if we can commit adultery, steal, kill, bear false witness, and if not, how come? You are using these verses to defend a practice we are told is wrong in scripture. What about these other sins?

Is that what YOU think? Have you thought about this before?

[Vickilynn]

I do believe it is a sin to get a tattoo. Leviticus 19:28 says, "Ye shall not make any cuttings in your flesh for the dead, nor print any marks upon you: I am the LORD."

A tattoo is printing marks on your body. The question always comes up with regard to intentions. Some people believe that what is being spoken of here only relates to marks for the dead, but that is not necessarily the case. The word "nor" is used to separate two differen't things, first making cuttings in your flesh for the dead, and secondly, printing marks on your body.

I do not believe I am going to convince tattoo enthusiastes to come around to my way of thinking on this subject based on this verse, but since the question was asked, "Do you think tattoos are sinful?," it is my opinion that they are. To me, getting a tattoo defiles your body. 1 Corinthians 3:16,17

16 Know ye not that ye are the temple of God, and that the Spirit of God dwelleth in you?

17 If any man defile the temple of God, him shall God destroy; for the temple of God is holy, which temple ye are.

I believe that the reason we have such an increase in tattoos, is because Satan is leading people to alter their appearance from what God intended them to look like. He didn't give us skin covered in pictures and words, when he created us in his image. Unlike changes in hair style, or the use of make-up, these are actual permanent alterations to a person's natural image.

Ultimately, every person will decide for themselves if they are going to get tattoos. Every time I write a comment stating that tattoos are sinful, it is usually followed by numerous comments that they are fine. This thread is full of posts defending the practice. I would suggest you seek the Lord about it before proceding.

Thank you Vickilynn for clarifying what I was trying to do. We had a question asked by someone who sincerly desired to know if it was sinful and wrong to get a tattoo. All of this back and forth firestorm came as a result of my giving my opinion in this post. It seems as though there are some here at WB that don't like it if someone has a differing opinion than their own.

Shalom Butero,

Yes, I know. And then they turn around and call someone else "spiritually immature" when what they are doing is most immature, both spiritually and emotionally.

I think we should simply go on with the discussion and ignore the side argument of the validity of this discussion.

[Vickilynn]

Where do verses that contain "judge for yourselves" "everything is permissible" or "To the Jews I became a Jew" apply to you?

What do these mean to you? Please, no beating around the bush.

Shalom Artsy,

I take Scriptures IN CONTEXT and consider the full impact of the Scriptures. I don't take some words here and there and try to make a doctrine out of them. If you'd like to discuss Scriptures and proper hermeneutics pertaining to this topic, great. However, tossing a few words out and not considering the context or entire meaning and trying to make them fit your position is not something I consider worthwhile responding to.

You want to talk Scripture? Then, we need to look at Scripture in context and correctly examine the meaning and application.

[WillingToDie]

I hope that the next generation isn't full of people that simply want to discount sections of scripture because they might supposedly turn some people away from Christianity. That seems to be what you are suggesting.

This whole debate seems to be getting a little personal.

Butero, those who say that there is nothing wrong with tattoos are not ignoring parts of scripture. They are, in fact, acknowledging Leviticus 19, but their interpretation is different from yours. There is no need to rehash this interpretation, as it has been given several times in this thread. As far as i've seen, those who are against tattoos have not refuted this interpretation, but rather seem to say "nuh uh" and continue on their way.

Also, I find it interesting that you place the prohibition to marking the skin under moral law, when given the context it seems clear that it should more properly fall under the priest's law.

However, I doubt any of this will change your mind, Butero, since i get the feeling that nothing we can say will get you to change your mind on teh subject, as your mind is already made up.

[artsylady]

Do you have an actual source for what you stated about people using ashes of the dead to tattoo themselves, and just how would that work?

No, another poster made the comment. I am waiting to see if he or she will be expanding on the subject. Could be possible that this is what they did. Wouldn't surprise me.

Everything else you mentioned could apply equally to you.

Hmmm. Okay, I'll go through them.

Also, that some people are very rigid and stubborn in their beliefs and despite any new informatioin choose to believe that ancient false ceremonial worship equates to the current trend of ink on ones skin.

Actually at first glace of this verse, I used to think tattooing meant tattooing as we know it today. Upon further reflection, it's obviously not, so I was not stubborn and rigid in this.

I think I am learning that there may be fear in changing one's mind. If one has a very straightforward, simple list of do's and don'ts, they don't have to fear going off tract, but this could also very well be a trap in the way of judgement and self-righteousness towards those who feel differently.

Well, I do think that God leads us on different paths and I do believe that others may be on a different path than I am and may find something permissable that I don't deem permissable for myself, but I'm not going to say it's permissable for them becaus that would be wrong. That being said, I refer to such things as debatable matters. Clearly, there are scriptures in the Bible that are not debatable as well. So I don't think this applies to me. I don't have fear my do's and don't are obviously spelled out in scripture.

That people don't want to realize or maybe admit that Christians have a marketing problem to the rest of the world do to our own ineffective teaching from the past.

Actually, I DO realize there is a marketing problem and am saddened with it and hope that this can change.

[artsylady]

In reality Artsylady, I think you are the one that needs to grow up and realize that just because there are people that don't agree with you, that doesn't make their positions wrong.

Here's the difference.

I do not say tattooing is a sin or good for anyone. It's PERSONAL - between the person and God - not me. I'm not the one to say.

You say it's wrong, all wrong, and a sin across the board.

Again, if this was a discussion among new Christians who can't take the context into view then I would not bother. But Christians who have been Christians for a long time need to realize that the Bible is a spiritual source for believers led by the spirit of God, according to his or her own called and individual purpose.

In addition, the only reason why threads like this continue so long is because of people like you that want to keep arguing in them.

Pot- kettle- black.

I find that extremely funny since you say it is not important.

I corrected myself. It SHOULD not be important. Some make mountains out of molehills and in doing so, maximize outer appearances and minimize the important heart issues.

How many posts do you have in this thread? How many posts did you place in other threads in the last couple of days by comparison? It seems to me like you put a lot of importance in this subject.

Yes, and it's not about me or my own personal agenda. I've stated before many times, I don't have a tattoo and most likely won't get one. It's about the lost.

You may not care about the marketing problem Christianity obviously has, but I care and very deeply.

[Vickilynn]

Shalom,

Butero has presented Scriptures for his position and WHY he believes they say that a tattoo is a sin. That is what was asked in this thread by the OP. I appreciate Butero's clear, firm stand on the Scriptures and for those reading, his explanations of WHY he believes they apply to this topic.

This is what discussion is all about!

[Vickilynn]

Pot- kettle- black.

Shalom,

And THIS comment from someone calling other people spiritually "immature"?

Right.