Was AD 70 the Parousia?

[PGA]

Hi Danielzk,

For the most part I feel you did not answer my questions highlighted in blue. If your theology of a thousand years is shown by Scripture to have been fulfilled in the first century then the thousand years that you are taking as a literal 1000 years needs to be looked at in a different light or possibly in an alternative way, such as that the 1000 years started in B.C. thus ending in A.D. 70.

Peter

Hi Peter,

You have been asked a dozen questions at least a dozen times and you do not answer any , You have said that that the 1000 year reign of Christ started 2000 years ago ,,,you simply do not understand any of this ,,,point blank God tells us that satan is unable to deceive anyone when he is in the abyss for 1000 years and so far there has NEVER been time that satan has not been able to deceive nations of people,,just one of things you avoid cause you know it is true ..even before the 1000 years begin there are several matters that have been shown to you MULTIPLE TIMES and as always you either avoid altogether or post scripture that is not even close to the matter ,

,It seems you have no idea what the 1000 years are for and the purpose, you simply do not understand how it is that Jesus wants to show the world, that last generation of human flesh and blood how great His Grace really is that he would allow a generation of people to grow up with Jesus ruling the world and how HE reigns and that during His reign the will be 99.9% peace on earth, No wars anywhere animals that normally would kill another stop eating meat and start eating grass and grain and vegetation ,,and even with such a wonderful peaceful world that mankind can still be deceived by satan , GOD tells us that when Jesus sets up HIS KINGDOM on earth it will NEVER END..you just do not understand this !

Revelation 20

And I saw an angel coming down out of heaven, having the key to the Abyss and holding in his hand a great chain.

2 He seized the dragon, that ancient serpent, who is the devil, or Satan, and bound him for a thousand years.

3 He threw him into the Abyss, and locked and sealed it over him, to keep him from deceiving the nations anymore until the thousand years were ended. After that, he must be set free for a short time.

7 When the thousand years are over, Satan will be released from his prison

PROVE THIS HAS HAPPENED....you know you cannot so in order to avoid truth you refuse to accept GODS WORD as real and want to say it is not literal

Sorry dude but it gets boring that you never address questions asked of you that you know if you did answer you'd have to face facts that you want to avoid...it is monotonous to go over over and over and the same things and you won't answer cause you know you have to face facts that you simply do not understand scripture , you have been duped into a false doctrine.

Hi Danielzk,

The explanations I have given you and others are not acceptable to your mindset. I understand that. I have been through what I consider reasonable answers in other posts, both yours and others. You have a lot of question to answer that I have asked you also. It is a two way street. I see your tactic as trying to shift all the onus to my position alone. How many of my questions have you answered in my most recent posts?

Has Jesus crushed Satan (Romans 15:20)? If Satan is not crushed then he still holds the power of death. Did Jesus gain the victory over Satan and death (Hebrews 2:14; 1 John 3:8)? Has He freed you from the fear of death (Hebrews 2:15)? Are we living in the New Covenant or the Old Covenant? Is Jesus currently Lord and King? If so then it has great significance on how you interpret the 1000 years.

Please answer these questions.

Peter

[PGA]

Peter thanks for trying to answer my question,but the answer you gave seems to spiritualize things that are meant to be literal. I believe in a literal second coming of Christ and a literal resurrection of the dead at which time the born again will receive literal immortal bodies to rule and reign with the Lord.

How do you know all these things you mention are literal, especially the Second Coming? What verses are you thinking of that point to a literal second coming?

Where was Jesus going and where is Jesus now? He said He was going to His Father and that He would come and take them (the disciples) to be where He was (John 14:1-3). Where did Paul say his citizenship was (Phil. 3:20)? What were all the Old Covenant saints looking for (Hebrews 11:16)? Where did they go (Hebrews 12:22)? Are we to fix our eyes on the physical or that which is not seen? How did God come in the OT because Jesus said in Matthew 16:26-27 that He was coming in the same manner/glory that the Father came in the OT.

http://asiteforthelord.com/id15.html

Peter

[Montana Marv]

]Rev 9:16 - The number of the mounted troops was 200 million. I heard their number. or (200 thousand thousand) Very literal 200,000,000. This equates to what China has with all their military reserves, and this in the 1970's.

Very literal = horses

China never had and never will have a 200-million-horse military.

E

China (East) is capable of fielding an army of 200,000,000 soilders now with its reserves. Next will come the horses to ride on. Demonic in nature. This is about prophesy. Future to be unfolded. This is what John heard.

Ye of little faith. Isa 7:14b - The virgin will be with child and will give birth to a son, and will call him Immanuel. This is impossible, a virgin to give birth. But it happened, just as Scripture foretold.

The same with Rev 9:16. Things may not add up now, but wait a while, they will, as this is prophesy.

In Christ

Montana Marv

[ENOCH2010]

Peter thanks for trying to answer my question,but the answer you gave seems to spiritualize things that are meant to be literal. I believe in a literal second coming of Christ and a literal resurrection of the dead at which time the born again will receive literal immortal bodies to rule and reign with the Lord.

How do you know all these things you mention are literal, especially the Second Coming? What verses are you thinking of that point to a literal second coming?

Where was Jesus going and where is Jesus now? He said He was going to His Father and that He would come and take them (the disciples) to be where He was (John 14:1-3). Where did Paul say his citizenship was (Phil. 3:20)? What were all the Old Covenant saints looking for (Hebrews 11:16)? Where did they go (Hebrews 12:22)? Are we to fix our eyes on the physical or that which is not seen? How did God come in the OT because Jesus said in Matthew 16:26-27 that He was coming in the same manner/glory that the Father came in the OT.

http://asiteforthelord.com/id15.html

Peter

Rev 21 vs 3 is pretty clear about God coming to be with us, Rev 19 vs 16 says he is coming back. The Bible is full of scripture about the second coming of the Lord.

Second Peter chapter 3 is a good source of info everybody should look to and understand.

Are you teaching that Jesus came back in 70 AD and resurrected the disciples that had been killed? Did John miss it,because the book of Rev. wasn't written until 90 AD,or are you saying the first resurrection has already past,and the only resurrection remaining is the great white thrown.

As far where Jesus is right now,I think he is with the Father preparing the new Jerusalem for his people.

[Guest shiloh357]

Peter thanks for trying to answer my question,but the answer you gave seems to spiritualize things that are meant to be literal. I believe in a literal second coming of Christ and a literal resurrection of the dead at which time the born again will receive literal immortal bodies to rule and reign with the Lord.

How do you know all these things you mention are literal, especially the Second Coming? What verses are you thinking of that point to a literal second coming?

Where was Jesus going and where is Jesus now? He said He was going to His Father and that He would come and take them (the disciples) to be where He was (John 14:1-3). Where did Paul say his citizenship was (Phil. 3:20)? What were all the Old Covenant saints looking for (Hebrews 11:16)? Where did they go (Hebrews 12:22)? Are we to fix our eyes on the physical or that which is not seen? How did God come in the OT because Jesus said in Matthew 16:26-27 that He was coming in the same manner/glory that the Father came in the OT.

http://asiteforthelord.com/id15.html

Peter

Peter, I take it you don't believe that Jesus is coming back in a literal body 2nd coming. We are told that Jesus will return in the manner in which He ascended into heaven.

And when he had said these things, as they were looking on, he was lifted up, and a cloud took him out of their sight. And while they were gazing into heaven as he went, behold, two men stood by them in white robes, and said, "Men of Galilee, why do you stand looking into heaven? This Jesus, who was taken up from you into heaven, will come in the same way as you saw him go into heaven."

(Act 1:9-11)

If the parousia occured in 70 AD and we are living in the millennial reign now, if the kind of rampant wickedness we see in our world and the continuing violence and hostility toward those who follow Christ is representative of the conditions of the millennial reign of Christ, I can only conclude that the millennial reign of Christ is the biggest failure in human history.

[PGA]

Hi Enoch,

How do you know all these things you mention are literal, especially the Second Coming? What verses are you thinking of that point to a literal second coming?

Where was Jesus going and where is Jesus now? He said He was going to His Father and that He would come and take them (the disciples) to be where He was (John 14:1-3). Where did Paul say his citizenship was (Phil. 3:20)? What were all the Old Covenant saints looking for (Hebrews 11:16)? Where did they go (Hebrews 12:22)? Are we to fix our eyes on the physical or that which is not seen? How did God come in the OT because Jesus said in Matthew 16:26-27 that He was coming in the same manner/glory that the Father came in the OT.

http://asiteforthelord.com/id15.html

Peter -Me

Rev 21 vs 3 is pretty clear about God coming to be with us, Rev 19 vs 16 says he is coming back. The Bible is full of scripture about the second coming of the Lord. -Enoch

How is God with you now? Is He physically in your presence? Is Christ reigning on earth in you even though He is in heaven? If He reigns in you then has not His kingdom come upon you? At various times in His ministry He disclosed to those in His presences that His kingdom was NEAR, at the door. Was He mistaken? Did He postpone His kingdom because someone was able to throw a wrench into God's plans?

Second Peter chapter 3 is a good source of info everybody should look to and understand. -Enoch

Just how well do you understand it? I think you are trying to pull something that was primarily directed at people in the 1 century and make it apply to you today.

Eilseben made some good point on the word 'elements' back in post # 384. In fact, chapter 3 starts out by referring to what I believe is 1 Peter. Who was Peter addressing in 1 Peter?

Have you noticed the time frame in 1 Peter?

Notice Chapter 1:1

1 Peter 1:1

New International Version (NIV)

1 Peter, an apostle of Jesus Christ,

To God’s elect, exiles scattered throughout the provinces of Pontus, Galatia, Cappadocia, Asia and Bithynia,

How does that relate to you today? Do you live in one of these provinces?

It says that what the prophets searched intently for was not revealed to them for they were serving these 1st century believers.

1 Peter 1:10-12

New International Version (NIV)

¹⁰ Concerning this salvation, the prophets, who spoke of the grace that was to come to you, searched intently and with the greatest care, ¹¹ trying to find out the time and circumstances to which the Spirit of Christ in them was pointing when he predicted the sufferings of the Messiah and the glories that would follow. ¹² It was revealed to them that they were not serving themselves but you, when they spoke of the things that have now been told you by those who have preached the gospel to you by the Holy Spirit sent from heaven. Even angels long to look into these things.

Listen - LISTEN - to what Paul says:

1 Peter 4:7

New International Version (NIV)

⁷The end of all things is near. Therefore be alert and of sober mind so that you may pray.

Now go to this verse and read the rest of the context to see who is being addressed.

These early Christians were facing all kinds of trials, first from their fellow Jews and then later from the Romans.

1 Peter 4:17

New International Version (NIV)

¹⁷ For it is time for judgment to begin with God’s household; and if it begins with us, what will the outcome be for those who do not obey the gospel of God?

Are you teaching that Jesus came back in 70 AD and resurrected the disciples that had been killed? -Enoch

That is what I believe Scripture is teaching. What does it matter what I believe unless it conforms to His word? And resurrected not only the disciples but all who were dead and in the ground that believed/trusted/relied on Him.

Did John miss it,because the book of Rev. wasn't written until 90 AD,or are you saying the first resurrection has already past,and the only resurrection remaining is the great white thrown. -Enoch

No, John did not miss it. You assume the book was written around A.D. 90 based on what certain Christians have taught, but there is good evidence (on which I'm not going to lay down right now because of time restraints) that it was written before the fall of Jerusalem. Google Kenneth Gentry if you want to hear a little, or read Arthur M. Ogden who wrote "The Avenging of the Apostles and Prophets - Commentary on Revelation) for two such sources.

If you want me to present some of the reasons then just let me know and I will try to set aside some time.

As far where Jesus is right now,I think he is with the Father preparing the new Jerusalem for his people. -Enoch

I think the New Jerusalem is a heavenly place that has already been prepared and these saints, these early disciples, these apostles are now with Him where He is.

John 8:23-32

New International Version (NIV)

²³ But he continued, “You are from below; I am from above. You are of this world; I am not of this world. ²⁴ I told you that you would die in your sins; if you do not believe that I am he, you will indeed die in your sins.”

²⁵ “Who are you?” they asked.

“Just what I have been telling you from the beginning,” Jesus replied. ²⁶ “I have much to say in judgment of you. But he who sent me is trustworthy, and what I have heard from him I tell the world.”

²⁷ They did not understand that he was telling them about his Father. ²⁸ So Jesus said, “When you have lifted up^[a] the Son of Man, then you will know that I am he and that I do nothing on my own but speak just what the Father has taught me. ²⁹ The one who sent me is with me; he has not left me alone, for I always do what pleases him.” ³⁰ Even as he spoke, many believed in him.

Dispute Over Whose Children Jesus’ Opponents Are

³¹ To the Jews who had believed him, Jesus said, “If you hold to my teaching, you are really my disciples. ³² Then you will know the truth, and the truth will set you free.”

Footnotes:

1. John 8:28 The Greek for lifted up also means exalted.
   

I hope these words from the Spirit speak to you!

Jesus told the High Priest in Matthew 26:63-64 that once He was lifted up to the right hand of God they would see Him coming on the clouds of heaven. That meant judgment (and also salvation for those who were ready and waiting).

I have to wrap it up for tonight.

Peter

[PGA]

Hi Shiloh,

I already expressed some of my opinions on Acts 1:9 previously (I thought it was on this thread), but I will try and answer you within the next few days - hopefully tomorrow night.

Peter

[Montana Marv]

70 AD - No, No, No

Ezk 43:1-7 - Then the man brought me to the gate facing east, and I saw the glory of the God of Israel coming from the east. His voice was like the roar of rushing waters, and the land was radiant with his glory. The vision I saw was like the vision I had seen when he came to destroy the city and like I had seen by the Kebar River, and I fell facedown. The glory of the Lord entered the temple through the gate facing east. Then the Sprit lifted me up and brought me into the inner court, and the glory of the Lord filled the temple. While the man was standing besides me, I heard someone speaking to me from inside the temple. He said Son of man, this is the place of my throne and the place for the soles of my feet. This is where I will live among the Israleites forever. The house of Israel will never again defile my holy name ---.

BTW, the Mt of Olives is due east of the temple mount.

A Big question is; Does the house of Israel still defile God?

In Christ

Montana Marv

[Montana Marv]

A Big question is; Does the house of Israel still defile God?

No.

When did Christ enter through the east gate?

In Christ

Montana Marv

[ENOCH2010]

Thank you Peter for a thought filled post. I am beginning to think that some of the preterits teaching may be valid,but the majority of it leaves me with a spirit i'm not familiar with.

It doesn't give me a feeling of peace and joy,it leaves me with a feeling of nothing in the future to hope for.Because I see the world and civilization getting worse, not better as the Bible says the millennial reign will be. My hope is when Jesus returns there will be no more pain and death,no more heart aches,he will finally show people how we are to treat each other and live our lives in a Godly way forever.