Is believing God word of faith?

[Believer112]

I thought id did answer your question about Paul. Not every prayer gets answered, we don't get everything we want and, Paul's prayer happened to get answered. Praise God.

OK, I didn't see that as your answer.

Because it does not answer what I asked:

~~~~~

Now why did Paul not command the "thorn" to be removed? Was Paul praying unscripturally?

Then the Lord responded, "My grace is sufficient for you. My power is made perfect in weakness."

Did the Lord do this because Paul prayed wrong?

Or was the Lord using this to rely on Him (the Lord) and not on himself (Paul)?

~~~~

I'll look at that post on love.

Here is what I said:

Imagine a teenagers finally given the car keys. The teen says, "Thanks Dad!" and runs off with the car. Then he shows of "his" car to his friends, boasts of "his" driving skills, etc. - yet he never acknowledges the car is his father's, the driving skills he attained were worked into him by his father, even the keys are his father's.

And that's what I see with the WOF - it's all about me and my ability and my faith and my confession and my prayer.

Where is the intimacy with the Lord in all of this? Where is the laying down of pride? And where is the training in love - the greatest command?

And then the Scriptures:

Jer. 9:23-24

23 Thus says the LORD, "Let not a wise man boast of his wisdom, and let not the mighty man boast of his might, let not a rich man boast of his riches ; 24 but let him who boasts boast of this, that he understands and knows Me, that I am the LORD who exercises lovingkindness, justice and righteousness on earth ; for I delight in these things," declares the LORD.

1 Cor. 13:2b - if I have all faith, so as to remove mountains, but do not have love, I am nothing.

Is that prayer correct to have a born again Christian to keep asking for his salvation?

I do not understand why you keep bringing up this argument. To what statement of mine are you rebutting?

The intimacy is when I take the car home and give my Dad a great big hug and say thank you, 1 Thessalonians 5:18 give thanks in all circumstances, for this is God's will for you in Christ Jesus.

I'm not selfish either 1 Corinthians 4:5

Therefore judge nothing before the appointed time; wait till the Lord comes. He will bring to light what is hidden in darkness and will expose the motives of men's hearts. At that time each will receive his praise from God.

I'm not sure where you got the idea that I'm boastful.

God Bless

[nebula]

The intimacy is when I take the car home and give my Dad a great big hug and say thank you, 1 Thessalonians 5:18 give thanks in all circumstances, for this is God's will for you in Christ Jesus.

But if you are giving glory to yourself - my faith, my confession, my strength - how does this give glory to the Lord?

I always credit my father whenever someone compliments me on my driving. It made his day when he found out I credit him like this.

You do not believe it would hurt the father for the son to take credit for what he (the father) had done?

I'm not selfish either 1 Corinthians 4:5

Therefore judge nothing before the appointed time; wait till the Lord comes. He will bring to light what is hidden in darkness and will expose the motives of men's hearts. At that time each will receive his praise from God.

I don't see how my words implies this.

I'm not sure where you got the idea that I'm boastful.

That is not what the Scripture means -

Let me show you a different translation:

Jer. 9:23-24

23 Thus says the Lord: "Let not the wise man glory in his wisdom, Let not the mighty man glory in his might, Nor let the rich man glory in his riches; 24 But let him who glories glory in this, That he understands and knows Me, That I am the Lord, exercising lovingkindness, judgment, and righteousness in the earth. For in these I delight," says the Lord.

Are you more interested in knowing the Lord, or the strength of your faith?

~~~~

And you still did not answer my question -

Was Paul wrong for asking the Lord to take away the thorn rather than commanding the thorn to leave? Was he praying unscripturally?

[enoob57]

Also from the blue letter bible: the Spirit of the Lord. Spirit= ruwach in Hebrew and Holy Spirit, Spirit= pneuma

No, there are two different Hebrew words for Spirit used in those verses.

No. Ruwach is the Hebrew word for spirit, pneuma is the Greek word for spirit. Since the OT was written primarily in Hebrew, then the word used for "Spirit" in the Psalms would have been ruwach. In the NT, which was written in Greek, the word pneuma is used. The Spirit being referred to is the same in both Testaments, regardless, that being the Holy Spirit. David had the same Holy Spirit that we have.

David is praying this prayer and writing it down in a Psalm because he is in the distress and agony of remorse over his sin with Bathsheba. He had seen The Holy Spirit removed from Saul for disobedience, why would he not be concerned that the same thing could happen to him? Your 'teacher' says this prayer is an insult to Christ. Your 'teacher' has a few things to learn. How could this prayer be an insult to Christ when Christ had not even come yet, and the Holy Spirit had not been given to all believers equally? David had no such assurances, so his distress was very real to him. He is praying a prayer of repentance. And we are to pray prayers of repentance as well. There is no such thing as repenting once and being done with the process because we will continue to make blunders and mistakes which we need to repent of. There is nothing wrong with David's prayer even today when spoken from a humble heart which knows it has wronged God in some way and longs for forgiveness. There is nothing insulting about that prayer, even today. In fact, it is a prayer that I pray often, especially in regards to the portion about renewing a steadfast spirit in me. In fact, I believe I will pray that prayer right now. It is a model prayer that all believers should find useful and encouraging:

"Hide your face from my sins and blot out all my iniquity. Create in me a pure heart, O God, and renew a steadfast spirit within me. Do not cast me from your presence or take your Holy Spirit from me. Restore to me the joy of your salvation and grant me a willing spirit, to sustain me. Then I will teach transgressors your ways, and sinners will turn back to you."

Because we are in a unique place "the end of days" and the whole council of God lays at our own whim to peruse or search diligently this is true-

Luke 12:48

48 But he who did not know, yet committed things deserving of stripes, shall be beaten with few. For everyone to whom much is given, from him much will be required; and to whom much has been committed, of him they will ask the more.

NKJV

because we have such a great weight of giving from The Lord "The Holy Spirit of God" (the seal of eternity within) where ever we stand if it is within the bounds of the whole council then we stand with God and there is no grief In Him. Even though we are there and remember our sins and have grief for them still yet we are just living within the truth of Scripture

1 Tim 6:10

10 For the love of money is a root of all kinds of evil, for which some have strayed from the faith in their greediness, and pierced themselves through with many sorrows.

NKJV

For this is the sorrow of all the children of God that we have, knowing Him, sinned and within us He has testified of His presence by grief thats is not of this world... For us to have taken that which men have lifted up as their God and lifted them up also by the dedication to them...

1 Cor 3:11-13

11 For no other foundation can anyone lay than that which is laid, which is Jesus Christ. 12 Now if anyone builds on this foundation with gold, silver, precious stones, wood, hay, straw, 13 each one's work will become clear; for the Day will declare it, because it will be revealed by fire; and the fire will test each one's work, of what sort it is.

NKJV

and have supported them (the people who hold these things before God) by action or voice we have put out into the world a ripple of sins that have consequences that we are all living under in this world today...

I have said all this so that we might see that even though the Greatness of Our Loving Lord forgets those sins He reminds us of them here and now with the world around us!!! Whenever we separate ourselves from the problems that are in the world as if they are not partly our failing we lie to ourselves and truth cannot be in the same place as the lie within.... as for me I wish that I hold no lies within and that is the goal or mark that Paul presses toward ... because God requires consequence so we will remember them till He puts it from us... it will be after the all of creation that does not have the breath of life is burnt up and judgment for all who are not dressed with the blood of Christ wherein death and hell is swallowed up and a New Heaven and a New Earth wherein ONLY righteousness dwells and with His own Hand will He wipe the remembrance from our being... into the eternities complete in Him... Love Steven

Phil 3:14

14 I press toward the goal for the prize of the upward call of God in Christ Jesus.

NKJV

even if it kills me... oh wait thats how I get there

I Love Happy endings and so does Our Father for He has written it so! I rejoice that He is Lord and that there are none like Him!!!

[Believer112]

Daniel 9: 1-24 Gabriel the angel of the Lord came to him in about three minutes, at least that how long it took me to read verses 1-24. As soon as he began to pray the answer was given.

Denial 10: 1-14 This time he had to wait 21 days with fasting! I believe if he would have quit his fast or started doubting; one minute prior to his answer, his prayer wouldn

[Guest man]

We all have a measure of faith. It

[Believer112]

Also from the blue letter bible: the Spirit of the Lord. Spirit= ruwach in Hebrew and Holy Spirit, Spirit= pneuma

No, there are two different Hebrew words for Spirit used in those verses.

No. Ruwach is the Hebrew word for spirit, pneuma is the Greek word for spirit. Since the OT was written primarily in Hebrew, then the word used for "Spirit" in the Psalms would have been ruwach. In the NT, which was written in Greek, the word pneuma is used. The Spirit being referred to is the same in both Testaments, regardless, that being the Holy Spirit. David had the same Holy Spirit that we have.

David is praying this prayer and writing it down in a Psalm because he is in the distress and agony of remorse over his sin with Bathsheba. He had seen The Holy Spirit removed from Saul for disobedience, why would he not be concerned that the same thing could happen to him? Your 'teacher' says this prayer is an insult to Christ. Your 'teacher' has a few things to learn. How could this prayer be an insult to Christ when Christ had not even come yet, and the Holy Spirt had not been given to all believers equally? David had no such assurances, so his distress was very real to him. He is praying a prayer of repentance. And we are to pray prayers of repentance as well. There is no such thing as repenting once and being done with the process because we will continue to make blunders and mistakes which we need to repent of. There is nothing wrong with David's prayer even today when spoken from a humble heart which knows it has wronged God in some way and longs for forgiveness. There is nothing insulting about that prayer, even today. In fact, it is a prayer that I pray often, especially in regards to the portion about renewing a steadfast spirit in me. In fact, I believe I will pray that prayer right now. It is a model prayer that all believers should find useful and encouraging:

"Hide your face from my sins and blot out all my iniquity. Create in me a pure heart, O God, and renew a steadfast spirit within me. Do not cast me from your presence or take your Holy Spirit from me. Restore to me the joy of your salvation and grant me a willing spirit, to sustain me. Then I will teach transgressors your ways, and sinners will turn back to you."

Thanks for that, it was in greek. I'm still learning. The teacher wasn't criticizing David he's saying New Testament believer! This is what was written:

" As New Testament believers to pray this same prayer would be an insult to what Christ has done for us. God created a new heart in us when we were born again (2 Cor. 5:17) and sealed it with His Holy Spirit so it would never be polluted again (Eph. 1:13). He promised He would never leave us nor forsake us (Heb. 13:5), and His love, joy, and peace are now a permanent part of our born-again spirits (Gal. 5:22). Yet multitudes of New Testament Christians pray and sing the exact opposite of this."

It will be like me asking God to save me, everyday. I would be insulting Jesus and His word. It would be like I didn't believe in Rom 10: 9,10. Some of our prayers do go against God's word.

Its like give me peace Lord, Give me peace! Jesus saying what do you want me to do. I've already given you peace 2000 years ago!

John 14:27

Peace I leave with you; my peace I give you. I do not give to you as the world gives. Do not let your hearts be troubled and do not be afraid.

This is what I believe.

[enoob57]

This is the easiest way for you to see that the Word or Faith movement leads away from God instead of to God:

John 1:1

1 In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God.

NKJV

This is saying- before all that has beginning... I (The I Am that I AM) have established the eternities for there is no other but ME! Within this eternities satan the highest created forgot this simple truth that he had beginning! It is the most precious truth, this beginning, so do we.... yet though I have no experience as to sensual perception of this truth I believe and this is the substance of things hoped for in me that God in the end shall return all that is Holy and undefiled back into the eternities with Him.

Isa 44:6-8

6 "Thus says the Lord, the King of Israel,And his Redeemer, the Lord of hosts:'I am the First and I am the Last; Besides Me there is no God. 7 And who can proclaim as I do? Then let him declare it and set it in order for Me,Since I appointed the ancient people.And the things that are coming and shall come, Let them show these to them. 8 Do not fear, nor be afraid; Have I not told you from that time, and declared it? You are My witnesses.Is there a God besides Me?Indeed there is no other Rock; I know not one.'"

NKJV

The Rock Speaks here-

Matt 20:15-16

15 Is it not lawful for me to do what I wish with my own things? Or is your eye evil because I am good?' 16 So the last will be first, and the first last. For many are called, but few chosen."

NKJV

and again here-

Rev 22:12-20

12 "And behold, I am coming quickly, and My reward is with Me, to give to every one according to his work. 13 I am the Alpha and the Omega, the Beginning and the End, the First and the Last."

14 Blessed are those who do His commandments, that they may have the right to the tree of life, and may enter through the gates into the city. 15 But outside are dogs and sorcerers and sexually immoral and murderers and idolaters, and whoever loves and practices a lie.

16 "I, Jesus, have sent My angel to testify to you these things in the churches. I am the Root and the Offspring of David, the Bright and Morning Star."

17 And the Spirit and the bride say, "Come!" And let him who hears say, "Come!" And let him who thirsts come. Whoever desires, let him take the water of life freely.

A Warning

18 For I testify to everyone who hears the words of the prophecy of this book: If anyone adds to these things, God will add to him the plagues that are written in this book; 19 and if anyone takes away from the words of the book of this prophecy, God shall take away his part from the Book of Life, from the holy city, and from the things which are written in this book.

I Am Coming Quickly

20 He who testifies to these things says, "Surely I am coming quickly."

NKJV

We are held under the obedience of His Word as He holds Himself and we shall always be the Worshipers of Him Who has no beginning... Love Steven

[Believer112]

This is the easiest way for you to see that the Word or Faith movement leads away from God instead of to God:

John 1:1

1 In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God.

NKJV

This is saying- before all that has beginning... I (The I Am that I AM) have established the eternities for there is no other but ME! Within this eternities satan the highest created forgot this simple truth that he had beginning! It is the most precious truth, this beginning, so do we.... yet though I have no experience as to sensual perception of this truth I believe and this is the substance of things hoped for in me that God in the end shall return all that is Holy and undefiled back into the eternities with Him.

Isa 44:6-8

6 "Thus says the Lord, the King of Israel,And his Redeemer, the Lord of hosts:'I am the First and I am the Last; Besides Me there is no God. 7 And who can proclaim as I do? Then let him declare it and set it in order for Me,Since I appointed the ancient people.And the things that are coming and shall come, Let them show these to them. 8 Do not fear, nor be afraid; Have I not told you from that time, and declared it? You are My witnesses.Is there a God besides Me?Indeed there is no other Rock; I know not one.'"

NKJV

The Rock Speaks here-

Matt 20:15-16

15 Is it not lawful for me to do what I wish with my own things? Or is your eye evil because I am good?' 16 So the last will be first, and the first last. For many are called, but few chosen."

NKJV

and again here-

Rev 22:12-20

12 "And behold, I am coming quickly, and My reward is with Me, to give to every one according to his work. 13 I am the Alpha and the Omega, the Beginning and the End, the First and the Last."

14 Blessed are those who do His commandments, that they may have the right to the tree of life, and may enter through the gates into the city. 15 But outside are dogs and sorcerers and sexually immoral and murderers and idolaters, and whoever loves and practices a lie.

16 "I, Jesus, have sent My angel to testify to you these things in the churches. I am the Root and the Offspring of David, the Bright and Morning Star."

17 And the Spirit and the bride say, "Come!" And let him who hears say, "Come!" And let him who thirsts come. Whoever desires, let him take the water of life freely.

A Warning

18 For I testify to everyone who hears the words of the prophecy of this book: If anyone adds to these things, God will add to him the plagues that are written in this book; 19 and if anyone takes away from the words of the book of this prophecy, God shall take away his part from the Book of Life, from the holy city, and from the things which are written in this book.

I Am Coming Quickly

20 He who testifies to these things says, "Surely I am coming quickly."

NKJV

We are held under the obedience of His Word as He holds Himself and we shall always be the Worshipers of Him Who has no beginning... Love Steven

All those are nice scriptures. Steve I have you in thought and prayer. I am believing for God to work a miracle in your life. I think everyone here has allowed satan to deceive them about the Word and God. I love God with all my heart and soul! Am I wrong for believing every letter of the Word? Am i wrong for having faith in the word. Or is it, not how you guys would like me to have it? I've been placed in this movement box. I wonder if Jesus was placed in a movement box by the pharisees? God Bless you and I'm going to keep believing God for you.

[nebula]

Our faith in our prayers

Is it Scriptural to have faith in anything other than God?

[Guest man]

I've been placed in this movement box.

You place yourself inside that box when you make statements like the one below.

I think everyone here has allowed satan to deceive them about the Word and God.

You've totally isolated yourself from others by saying you're right and everyone else is wrong. There's no room in your spirit for growth because you know it all. There's nothing anyone here can teach you. You place all your trust in the teachings of an earthly being. When his words are disputed, you say we are under the influence of satan.

You admit that you've only been studying the bible for only a year or so and have come to know everything. I've been doing this on and off for 30 some years and I'm still learning.

I'm going to keep believing God for you.

If you knew anything about the Word of God you would know you can't believe in God for someone else.

Yes, you are in a box and until you learn to open your heart to the Spirit of God, you will always remain in that box.