munari Posted June 19, 2002 Group: Royal Member Followers: 1 Topic Count: 12 Topics Per Day: 0.00 Content Count: 444 Content Per Day: 0.05 Reputation: 8 Days Won: 0 Joined: 03/08/2002 Status: Offline Share Posted June 19, 2002 Elect, It sounds like you are saying that I am not saved. I have a question, will good save you against your will? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wordsower Posted June 19, 2002 Group: Royal Member Followers: 2 Topic Count: 42 Topics Per Day: 0.01 Content Count: 1,545 Content Per Day: 0.19 Reputation: 30 Days Won: 0 Joined: 05/18/2002 Status: Offline Birthday: 09/27/1968 Share Posted June 19, 2002 Munari, I don't know you're heart and I'm not judging, but from what I know of you, you're indeed saved and just carrying around some extra worrisome baggage as I stated before. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
munari Posted June 19, 2002 Group: Royal Member Followers: 1 Topic Count: 12 Topics Per Day: 0.00 Content Count: 444 Content Per Day: 0.05 Reputation: 8 Days Won: 0 Joined: 03/08/2002 Status: Offline Share Posted June 19, 2002 You are right, there are many Catholics who do not understand their faith. That is sad, I used to be one of them. But, when I started learning about it, I was amazed that I had missed those things for SO MANY years. Word, may I make a suggestion. If you are ever looking for a gift for your Catholic friend, buy her a book. I'd suggest either "The Lamb's Supper: The Mass As Heaven On Earth" or "Hail, Holy Queen", both by Scott Hahn. Out of the two, I would suggest "The Lamb's Supper" more since the Mass is the point of the Catholic faith. Its a great book and gave me an incredible appreciation for the Mass and made me look at it in a whole new light. After I read that book, Mass was no longer boring! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
elect Posted June 19, 2002 Group: Members Followers: 0 Topic Count: 1 Topics Per Day: 0.00 Content Count: 41 Content Per Day: 0.01 Reputation: 0 Days Won: 0 Joined: 05/24/2002 Status: Offline Share Posted June 19, 2002 Munari, Â Â Â From your posts, I would have to say, "Seek the Lord". I hope you are not insulted by that. I only want whats best for you. My opinion is of the same value as the Pope's, or anyone else- its fallible. You added, "I have a question, will good save you against your will?" I'm not sure if you wrote what you meant or if you meant to say "God", instead of "good", so, being long-winded, I'll try to answer both ways : Q. Will God save you against your will? A. The short answer is 'no'. But what do we have to do with *short* answers?! . The Lord is all-powerful, and He has an Almighty way of sweetly, but surely, making you willing- "Thy people shall be willing in the day of thy power,..." Â Â Â Â Â Â Â Â Â Â Â Â Â Â Â Â Â Â Â Â Â Â Â Â Â Â Â Â Â Â Â Â Â Â Ps.110.3 "For it is God which worketh in you both to will and to do of His good pleasure." Â Â Â Â Â Â Â Â Â Â Â Â Â Â Â Â Â Â Â Â Phil.2.13 "Because thy rage against Me, and thy tumult, is come up into Mine ears, therefore will I put My hook in thy nose, and My bridle in thy lips, and I will turn thee back by the way by which thou camest." Â Â Â Â Â Â Â Â Â Â Â Â Â Â Â Â Â Â Â Â Is.37.29 Q. Will good save you? A. No. Not against, with, or instead of, our will.- "But we are all as an unclean thing, and all our righteousnesses are as filthy rags; and we all do fade as a leaf; and our iniquities, like the wind, have taken us away." Â Â Â Â Â Â Â Â Â Â Â Â Â Â Â Â Â Â Â Â Â Â Â Â Â Â Â Â Â Â Â Â Â Â Â Is.64.6 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest astralis Posted June 19, 2002 Share Posted June 19, 2002 From your posts, I would have to say, "Seek the Lord". I hope you are not insulted by that. I only want whats best for you. My opinion is of the same value as the Pope's, or anyone else- its fallible. When the Pope speaks ex-Cathedra, he is not speaking of opinion but truth with the authority given from Jesus. Â Because of this your opinion does not have the same value as the Pope. But, because the Pope rarely speaks ex-Cathedra, your opinion is fallible like the Pope's is on everyday matters. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wordsower Posted June 20, 2002 Group: Royal Member Followers: 2 Topic Count: 42 Topics Per Day: 0.01 Content Count: 1,545 Content Per Day: 0.19 Reputation: 30 Days Won: 0 Joined: 05/18/2002 Status: Offline Birthday: 09/27/1968 Share Posted June 20, 2002 Munari, Thanks for the suggestion. Â I don't think she would take it well though. Â I don't think she is at a place where she wants to learn anything. Â I do try to share Jesus with her and peak her interest a little. Â It appears she is like many "christians" Â just "doing" what she's been taught to do and not really for her own growth, if that makes sense. Â So many are "religious" and do not have Jesus at the center of their lives. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
munari Posted June 20, 2002 Group: Royal Member Followers: 1 Topic Count: 12 Topics Per Day: 0.00 Content Count: 444 Content Per Day: 0.05 Reputation: 8 Days Won: 0 Joined: 03/08/2002 Status: Offline Share Posted June 20, 2002 Elect, I did mean to say "God" and not "good" in that question. Astralis, I second your comment. Word, That's too bad. You can blame on me and say that this guy on the internet gave you the suggestion    That way, you won't take any heat that may come from it. What you could do too is actually read the book so you can learn a little bit about her and my faith and then say to her (if this is true after you have read it), "This guy on the message board suggested this book to me and the other non-Catholics, I was wondering if you would like to read it too because it was pretty interesting." Just an idea. I do have one comment though, and its not meant as a poke at you, but just an observation. When you said that some Christians "that don't have Jesus at the center of their life", I got a thought. How many of us actually DO have Jesus at the center of our life? For Jesus to be at our center, that would mean that we would never sin, we would always choose the best thing in any situation. I don't think any of us can say that. I think what sets many people apart from others is the DESIRE to have Christ at the center of their life and then do everything they can to accomplish that, even if we know it will never be fully done. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Jean-Claude Posted June 20, 2002 Share Posted June 20, 2002 I'll make it as simple as possible for everyone. The Holy Spirit is a gift: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
munari Posted June 20, 2002 Group: Royal Member Followers: 1 Topic Count: 12 Topics Per Day: 0.00 Content Count: 444 Content Per Day: 0.05 Reputation: 8 Days Won: 0 Joined: 03/08/2002 Status: Offline Share Posted June 20, 2002 "See then the kindness and the severity of God: severity toward those who have fallen, but God Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wordsower Posted June 20, 2002 Group: Royal Member Followers: 2 Topic Count: 42 Topics Per Day: 0.01 Content Count: 1,545 Content Per Day: 0.19 Reputation: 30 Days Won: 0 Joined: 05/18/2002 Status: Offline Birthday: 09/27/1968 Share Posted June 20, 2002 Munari, I consider Christ to be at the center of my life, not because I'm so "good", I am definately not, but trying everyday. Â He is the center because He is the most important thing in my life, above anything or everything I can think of. Â If everything came tumbling down around me, He would be there. That's my definition of Christ at the center. Â :inlove: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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