The AntiChrist

[AnotherSinner]

the antichrist is a spirit. read where in 2 john it says what that is and is also 1 john 4. beasts are goverments not persons. daniel saw beasts not persons and each beast he saw had a name given,ie greece, medio-persia,babylon and rome

the beast and false prophet are thrown into the lake of fire...... how do you throw a government into a lake of fire???

I have done some study on the book of Daniel, but it has been years. Even then while I grasped some of it. I would not mind a refresher. However, Jason asks an interesting question here. Scripture has said that the beast and the false prophet will be thrown into the lake of fire. How does one throw a government into a lake of fire?

Anyone have any insight here?

[Zemke]

Ezekiel 28 speaks about the king of Tyre. No sense writing out the entire chapter here. It's obvious this prophecy is two fold in speaking of the king of Tyre and also the coming man of sin. His end will be with fire. There is a play with words near the end that could be read as dealing with nations but the overall context is dealing with one specific being.

[Lauri]

A government is only made up of people with earthly power.

The Bible clearly states that the fourth beast (which from study of Daniel we know represents a kingdom or nation) will be cast into the lake of fire.

(Daniel 7:23 KJV) Thus he said, The fourth beast shall be the fourth kingdom upon earth, which shall be diverse from all kingdoms, and shall devour the whole earth, and shall tread it down, and break it in pieces.

(Revelation 19:20 KJV) And the beast was taken, and with him the false prophet that wrought miracles before him, with which he deceived them that had received the mark of the beast, and them that worshipped his image. These both were cast alive into a lake of fire burning with brimstone.

(Revelation 20:10 KJV) And the devil that deceived them was cast into the lake of fire and brimstone, where the beast and the false prophet are, and shall be tormented day and night for ever and ever.

(Revelation 20:15 KJV) And whosoever was not found written in the book of life was cast into the lake of fire.

God will destroy the whole earth by fire.

(Nahum 1:5 KJV) The mountains quake at him, and the hills melt, and the earth is burned at his presence, yea, the world, and all that dwell therein.

After the wicked are destroyed God will create at new heaven and earth.

(Isaiah 65:17 KJV) For, behold, I create new heavens and a new earth: and the former shall not be remembered, nor come into mind.

(2 Peter 3:10 -13 KJV) But the day of the Lord will come as a thief in the night; in the which the heavens shall pass away with a great noise, and the elements shall melt with fervent heat, the earth also and the works that are therein shall be burned up.

11) Seeing then that all these things shall be dissolved, what manner of persons ought ye to be in all holy conversation and godliness,

12) Looking for and hasting unto the coming of the day of God, wherein the heavens being on fire shall be dissolved, and the elements shall melt with fervent heat?

13) Nevertheless we, according to his promise, look for new heavens and a new earth, wherein dwelleth righteousness.

[Lauri]

Remember that Daniel was given these prophecies of the future directly from God and they all came true.

Here is the statue dream compared to the visions of beasts from Daniel chapter 7 & 8.

Dan 2:32 This image's head was of fine gold, his breast and his arms of silver, his belly and his thighs of brass,

Dan 2:33 His legs of iron, his feet part of iron and part of clay.

Dan 2:34 Thou sawest till that a stone was cut out without hands, which smote the image upon his feet that were of iron and clay, and brake them to pieces.

Dan 2:35 Then was the iron, the clay, the brass, the silver, and the gold, broken to pieces together, and became like the chaff of the summer threshingfloors; and the wind carried them away, that no place was found for them: and the stone that smote the image became a great mountain, and filled the whole earth.

BABYLON

= Golden Head

Dan 2:37 Thou, O king, art a king of kings: for the God of heaven hath given thee a kingdom, power, and strength, and glory.

Dan 2:38 And wheresoever the children of men dwell, the beasts of the field and the fowls of the heaven hath he given into thine hand, and hath made thee ruler over them all. Thou art this head of gold.

= Lion with wings

Dan 7:4 The first was like a lion, and had eagle's wings: I beheld till the wings thereof were plucked, and it was lifted up from the earth, and made stand upon the feet as a man, and a man's heart was given to it.

The Lion.--In the vision of Daniel 7, the first beast seen by the prophet was a lion. For the use of the lion as a symbol, read Jeremiah 4: 7; 50: 17, 43, 44. The lion as first seen in the vision before us had eagle's wings. The symbolic use of wings is impressively described in Habakkuk 1: 6-8, where it is said that the Chaldeans should "fly as the eagle that hasteth to eat."

From these symbols we may easily deduce that Babylon was a kingdom of great strength, and that under Nebuchadnezzar its conquests were extended with great rapidity. But there came a time when the wings were plucked. It no longer rushed upon its prey like an eagle. The boldness and spirit of the lion were gone. A man's heart--weak, timorous, and faint--took the place of a lion's strength. Such was the case with the nation during the closing years of its history, when it had become enfeebled and effeminate through wealth and luxury.

MEDIA – PERSIA

= Breastplate of Silver

Dan 2:39 And after thee shall arise another kingdom inferior to thee, and another third kingdom of brass, which shall bear rule over all the earth.

= The Bear

Dan 7:5 And behold another beast, a second, like to a bear, and it raised up itself on one side, and it had three ribs in the mouth of it between the teeth of it: and they said thus unto it, Arise, devour much flesh.

.--As in the image of Daniel 2, so in this series of symbols a marked deterioration is noticed as we descend from one kingdom to another. The silver of the breast and arms is inferior to the gold of the head. The bear is inferior to the lion. Medo-Persia fell short of Babylon in wealth, magnificence, and brilliance. The bear raised itself up on one side. The kingdom was composed of two nationalities, the Medes and the Persians.

= The Two Horns

Dan 8:3 Then I lifted up mine eyes, and saw, and, behold, there stood before the river a ram which had two horns: and the two horns were high; but one was higher than the other, and the higher came up last.

Dan 8:4 I saw the ram pushing westward, and northward, and southward; so that no beasts might stand before him, neither was there any that could deliver out of his hand; but he did according to his will, and became great.

Dan 8:20 The ram which thou sawest having two horns are the kings of Media and Persia.

Kingdoms of Media and Persia.--In verse 20 an interpretation of this symbol is given in plain language: "The ram which thou sawest having two horns are the kings of Media and Persia." We have only therefore to consider how well the power answers to the symbol in question. The two horns represented the two nationalities of which the empire was composed. The higher came up last. This symbolized Persia, which at first was simply an ally of the Medes, but later came to be the leading division of the empire. The directions in which the ram pushed denote the directions in which the Medes and Persians carried their conquests. No earthly powers could stand before them as they marched toward the exalted position to which the providence of God had summoned them. So successful were their conquests that in the days of Ahasuerus (Esther 1: 1) the Medo-Persian kingdom, consisting of one hundred twenty-seven provinces, extended from India to Ethiopia, the boundaries of the then-known world.

The same fact is represented by the two horns of the ram in Daniel 8. Of these horns it is said that the higher horn came up last, and of the bear that it raised itself up on one side. This was fulfilled by the Persian division of the kingdom, for although it came up last, it attained the higher eminence, becoming a dominant influence in the nation. (See comments on Daniel 8: 3.) The three ribs doubtless signify the three provinces of Babylon, Lydia, and Egypt, which were especially oppressed by Medo-Persia. The command, "Arise, devour much flesh," would naturally refer to the stimulus given to the Medes and Persians by the overthrow of these provinces. The character of the power is well represented by a bear. The Medes and Persians were cruel and rapacious, robbers and spoilers of the people. This Medo-Persian kingdom continued from the overthrow of Babylon by Cyrus to the battle of Arbela in 331 B.C., a period of 207 years.

GREECE

= Belly and Thighs of Brass

Dan 2:39 And after thee shall arise another kingdom inferior to thee, and another third kingdom of brass, which shall bear rule over all the earth.

= Leopard with 4 wings

Dan 7:6 After this I beheld, and lo another, like a leopard, which had upon the back of it four wings of a fowl; the beast had also four heads; and dominion was given to it.

The Leopard.--The third kingdom, Grecia, is here represented by the symbol of a leopard. If wings upon the lion signified rapidity of conquest, they would signify the same here. The leopard itself is a swift-footed beast, but this was not sufficient to represent the career of the nation here symbolized. It must have wings in addition. Two wings, the number the lion had, were not sufficient; the leopard must have four. This would denote unprecedented celerity of movement, which we find to be a historical fact in the Grecian kingdom. The conquests of Grecia under Alexander had no parallel in ancient times for suddenness and rapidity. His military achievements are summarized by W. W. Tarn:

= The Rough Goat

Dan 8:5 And as I was considering, behold, an he goat came from the west on the face of the whole earth, and touched not the ground: and the goat had a notable horn between his eyes.

Dan 8:6 And he came to the ram that had two horns, which I had seen standing before the river, and ran unto him in the fury of his power.

Dan 8:7 And I saw him come close unto the ram, and he was moved with choler against him, and smote the ram, and brake his two horns: and there was no power in the ram to stand before him, but he cast him down to the ground, and stamped upon him: and there was none that could deliver the ram out of his hand.

Dan 8:8 Therefore the he goat waxed very great: and when he was strong, the great horn was broken; and for it came up four notable ones toward the four winds of heaven.

Dan 8:21 And the rough goat is the king of Grecia: and the great horn that is between his eyes is the first king.

Kingdom of Grecia.--"As I was considering," said the prophet. Here is an example for every lover of truth and all how have any regard for spiritual things. when Moses saw the burning bush, he said, "I will now turn aside, and see this great sight." How few are willing at the present time to turn aside from their pursuit of business or pleasure to consider the important themes which god seeks to bring to their attention. The symbol here introduced is explained to Daniel by the angel. "The rough goat is the king [or kingdom] of Grecia." Verse 21. Concerning the fitness of this symbol to represent the Grecian, or Macedonian, people, Thomas Newton observes that the Macedonians, "About two hundred years before Daniel, were denominated AEgeadae, or the goat's people." He explains the origin of the name as recounted by heathen authors: "Caranus, their first king, going with a great multitude of Greeks to seek new habitations in Macedonia, was commanded by the oracle to take the goats for his guides to empire: and afterwards seeing a herd of goats flying from a violent storm, he followed them to Edessa, and there fixed the seat of his empire, made the goats his ensigns or standards and called the city AEgeae, or the goat's town, and the people AEgeadae, or the goat's people. . . . The city of AEgeae, or AEgeae, was the usual burying place of the Macedonian kings.

It is also very remarkable that Alexander's son by Roxana was named Alexander AEgus, of the son of the goat; and some of Alexander's successors are represented in their coins with goat's horns." [2]

The "goat came from the west on the face of the whole earth." That is, Greece lay west of Persia and attacked from that direction. The Greek army swept everything on the face of the earth before it.

The goat "touched not the ground." Such was the marvelous celerity of this movements that he seemed to fly from point to point with the swiftness of the wind. The same characteristic of speed is indicated by the four wings of the leopard in the vision of Daniel 7, representing the same nation.

Alexander the "Notable Horn."--The notable horn between his eyes is explained in verse 21 to be the first king of the Macedonian Empire. This king was Alexander the Great.

A concise account of the overthrow of the Persian Empire by Alexander is given in verses 6 and 7. The battles between the Greeks and the Persians are said to have been exceedingly fierce. Some of the scenes recorded in history vividly bring to mind the figure used in the prophecy--a ram standing before the river, and the goat running toward him "the fury of his power." Alexander first vanquished the generals of Darius at the River Granicus in Phrygia. He next attacked and routed Darius at the passes of Issus in Cilicia, and afterward defeated him on the plains of Arbela in Syria. This latter battle occurred in 331 B.C., and marked the fall of the Persian Empire. By this event Alexander became master of the whole country. Concerning verse 6--"He [the goat] came to the ram that had two horns, which I had seen standing before the river, and ran unto him in the fury of his power"--Thomas Newton says: "One can hardly read these words without having some image of Darius's army standing and guarding the River Granicus, and of Alexander on the other side with his forces plunging in, swimming across the stream, and rushing on the enemy with all the fire and fury that can be imagined."

Dan 8:8 Therefore the he goat waxed very great: and when he was strong, the great horn was broken; and for it came up four notable ones toward the four winds of heaven.

Great Horn Broken.--The conqueror is greater than the conquered. The ram, Medo-Persia, became "great;" the goat, Greece, became "very great." "When he was strong, the great horn was broken." Human foresight and speculation would have said, When he becomes weak, his kingdom torn by rebellion, or weakened by luxury, then the horn will be broken, and the kingdom shattered. But Daniel saw it broken in the prime of its strength, at the height of tis power, when every beholder would have exclaimed, Surely, the kingdom is established, and nothing can overthrow it. Thus it is often with the wicked. The horn of their strength is broken when they think they stand most firm. The Scripture says, "Let him that thinketh he standeth take heed lest he fall." 1 Corinthians 10: 12.

Four Notable Horns Come Up.--After Alexander's death there arose much contention among his followers respecting the succession. After a seven days' contest it was agreed that his natural brother, Philip Aridaeus, should be declared king. By him, and by Alexander's infant sons, Alexander AEgus and Hercules, the name and show of the Macedonian Empire were for a time sustained. But the boys were soon murdered, and the family of Alexander became extinct. Then the chief commanders of the army, who had gone into different parts of the empire as governors of the provinces, assumed the title of king. They at once began warring against one another to such a degree that within a few years after Alexander's death, the number was reduced to four--the exact number specified in prophecy.

Four notable horns were to come up toward the four winds of heaven in place of the great horn that was broken. These were Cassander, who had Greece and the neighboring countries; Lysimachus, who had Asia Minor; Selecus, who had Syria and Babylon, and from whom came the line of kings known as the "Seleucidae," so famous in history; and Ptolemy, son of Lagus, who had Egypt, and from whom sprang the "Lagidae." These held dominion toward the four winds of heaven. Cassander had the western parts, Lysimachus the northern regions, Seleucus the eastern countries, and Ptolemy the southern portion of the empire. These four horns may therefore be named Macedonia, Thrace (which then included Asia Minor, and those parts lying on the Hellespont and the Bosphorus), Syria, and Egypt.

[Lauri]

Pagan ROME

= Legs of Iron

Dan 2:40 And the fourth kingdom shall be strong as iron: forasmuch as iron breaketh in pieces and subdueth all things: and as iron that breaketh all these, shall it break in pieces and bruise.

Papal ROME

= Feet of Iron and Clay

Dan 2:41 And whereas thou sawest the feet and toes, part of potters' clay, and part of iron, the kingdom shall be divided; but there shall be in it of the strength of the iron, forasmuch as thou sawest the iron mixed with miry clay.

Dan 2:42 And as the toes of the feet were part of iron, and part of clay, so the kingdom shall be partly strong, and partly broken.

Dan 2:43 And whereas thou sawest iron mixed with miry clay, they shall mingle themselves with the seed of men: but they shall not cleave one to another, even as iron is not mixed with clay.

= Dreadful and Diverse Beast

Dan 7:7 After this I saw in the night visions, and behold a fourth beast, dreadful and terrible, and strong exceedingly; and it had great iron teeth: it devoured and brake in pieces, and stamped the residue with the feet of it: and it was diverse from all the beasts that were before it; and it had ten horns.

Dan 7:8 I considered the horns, and, behold, there came up among them another little horn, before whom there were three of the first horns plucked up by the roots: and, behold, in this horn were eyes like the eyes of man, and a mouth speaking great things.

= Little Horn

Dan 8:9 And out of one of them came forth a little horn, which waxed exceeding great, toward the south, and toward the east, and toward the pleasant land.

Dan 8:10 And it waxed great, even to the host of heaven; and it cast down some of the host and of the stars to the ground, and stamped upon them.

Dan 8:11 Yea, he magnified himself even to the prince of the host, and by him the daily sacrifice was taken away, and the place of his sanctuary was cast down.

Dan 8:12 And an host was given him against the daily sacrifice by reason of transgression, and it cast down the truth to the ground; and it practised, and prospered.

The field of vision here is substantially the same as that covered by Nebuchadnezzar's image of Daniel 2, and the vision of Daniel 7. In both these prophetic delineations we have found that the power which succeeded Grecia as the fourth great power was Rome. The only natural inference would be that the little horn, the power which in this vision succeeds Grecia as an "exceeding great" kingdom, is also Rome.

The little horn comes froth from one of the horns of the goat. How, it may be asked, can that be true of Rome? Earthly governments are not introduced into prophecy until they become in some way connected with the people of God. Rome became connected with the Jews, the people of God at that time, by the famous Jewish League in 161 B.C. [7] But seven years before this, that is, 168 B.C., Rome had conquered Macedonia, and made that country a part of its empire. Rome is therefore introduced into prophecy just as, from the overthrow of the Macedonian horn of the goat, it is going forth to new conquests in other directions. It appeared to the prophet as coming forth from of the horns of the goat.

The little horn waxed great toward the south. This was true of Rome. Egypt was made a province of the Roman Empire in 30 B.C., and continued such for some centuries.

The little horn waxed great toward the east. This also was true of Rome. She conquered Syria in 65 B.C., and made it a province.

The little horn waxed great toward the pleasant land. So did Rome. Judea is called "the pleasant land" in many scriptures. The Romans made it a province of their empire in 63 B.C., and eventually destroyed the city and the temple, and scattered the Jews throughout the earth.

The little horn "waxed great, even to ["against," margin] the host of heaven; and it cast down some of the host and of the stars to the ground." Rome did this also. In this expressions two figures are introduced, "the host" and "the stars." When used in a symbolic sense concerning events taking place on earth, these figures refer almost always to the people of God and their leaders. In verse 13 of this chapter we read that both the sanctuary and the host will be trodden under foot. Here undoubtedly reference is made to God's people and the place of their worship. The stars would naturally represent the leaders of the work of God. This thought is further indicated in one of the applications of Revelation 12: 4 where we read that the great red dragon, a symbol of Rome, cast down a third part of the stars to the ground.

The little horn "magnified himself even to the Prince of the host." Rome alone did this. In the interpretation (verse 25) the little horn is said to "stand up against the Prince of princes." This is clearly an allusion to the crucifixion of our Lord under the jurisdiction of the Romans.

Rome in Two Aspects.--By the little horn "the daily sacrifice was taken away." This little horn symbolized Rome in its entire history, including its two phases, pagan and papal. These two phases are elsewhere spoken of as the "daily" (sacrifice is a supplied word) and the "transgression of desolation;" the daily (desolation) evidently signifying the pagan form, and the transgression of desolation, the papal. (See comments on verse 13.) In the actions ascribed to this power, sometimes one form is spoken of, sometimes the other. "by him [the papal form] the daily [the pagan form] was taken away." Pagan

Rome was remodeled into papal Rome. "The place of his sanctuary," or worship, the city of Rome, was cast down. The seat of government was removed by Constantine to Constantinople, A.D. 330. This same transaction is brought to view in Revelation 13: 2, where it is said that the dragon, pagan Rome, gave to the beast, papal Rome, his seat, the city of Rome.

A "host was given him [the little horn] against the daily." The barbarians that subverted the Roman Empire in the changes, attritions, and transformations of those times, became converts to the Catholic faith, and the instruments of the dethronement of their former religion. Though conquering Rome politically, they were themselves vanquished religiously by the theology of Rome, and became the perpetuators of the same empire in another phase. This was brought about by reason of "transgression;" that is, by the working of the mystery of iniquity. The papacy may be called a system of iniquity because it has done its evil work under the pretense of the pure and undefiled religion. Of this false religious system, Paul wrote in the first century to the Thessalonians, "The mystery of iniquity doth already work." 2 Thessalonians 2: 7.

The little horn "cast down the truth to the ground, and practiced and prospered." This describes in few words the work and career of the papacy. The truth is by it hideously caricatured, loaded with traditions, turned into mummery and superstition, cast down and obscured.

Of this ecclesiastical power it is declared that it has "practiced"--practiced its deceptions on the people, practiced in schemes of cunning to carry out its own ends and aggrandize its own power.

Likewise it has "prospered." It has made war upon the saints, and prevailed against them. It has well-nigh run its allotted career, and is soon to be broken without hand, to be given to the burning flame, and to perish in the consuming glories of the second appearing of our Lord.

Rome meets all the specifications of the prophecy. No other power does meet them. Hence Rome, and on other, is the power in question. The inspired descriptions given in the word of God of the character of this system are fully met, and the prophecies concerning it have been most strikingly and accurately fulfilled in history.

[jasoncran]

the antichrist is a spirit. read where in 2 john it says what that is and is also 1 john 4. beasts are goverments not persons. daniel saw beasts not persons and each beast he saw had a name given,ie greece, medio-persia,babylon and rome

the beast and false prophet are thrown into the lake of fire...... how do you throw a government into a lake of fire???

concepts as in under destruction the lake of fire exist and its called the dead sea. its a reference to the destruction of said goverments.

the lake of fire isnt hell as hell is thrown in to it.

so its a metaphor of gods destruction and judgment. where is rome today? and the eu aint rome as its bigger than rome and its aint doing to well either.

[AnotherSinner]

the antichrist is a spirit. read where in 2 john it says what that is and is also 1 john 4. beasts are goverments not persons. daniel saw beasts not persons and each beast he saw had a name given,ie greece, medio-persia,babylon and rome

the beast and false prophet are thrown into the lake of fire...... how do you throw a government into a lake of fire???

concepts as in under destruction the lake of fire exist and its called the dead sea. its a reference to the destruction of said goverments.

the lake of fire isnt hell as hell is thrown in to it.

so its a metaphor of gods destruction and judgment. where is rome today? and the eu aint rome as its bigger than rome and its aint doing to well either.

Oh sorry Jason, I thought you were the one who asked. It was Other One. Yikes...that is what I get for waiting till noon for my morning coffee.

[AnotherSinner]

Pagan ROME

= Legs of Iron

Dan 2:40 And the fourth kingdom shall be strong as iron: forasmuch as iron breaketh in pieces and subdueth all things: and as iron that breaketh all these, shall it break in pieces and bruise.

Papal ROME

= Feet of Iron and Clay

Dan 2:41 And whereas thou sawest the feet and toes, part of potters' clay, and part of iron, the kingdom shall be divided; but there shall be in it of the strength of the iron, forasmuch as thou sawest the iron mixed with miry clay.

Dan 2:42 And as the toes of the feet were part of iron, and part of clay, so the kingdom shall be partly strong, and partly broken.

Dan 2:43 And whereas thou sawest iron mixed with miry clay, they shall mingle themselves with the seed of men: but they shall not cleave one to another, even as iron is not mixed with clay.

= Dreadful and Diverse Beast

Dan 7:7 After this I saw in the night visions, and behold a fourth beast, dreadful and terrible, and strong exceedingly; and it had great iron teeth: it devoured and brake in pieces, and stamped the residue with the feet of it: and it was diverse from all the beasts that were before it; and it had ten horns.

Dan 7:8 I considered the horns, and, behold, there came up among them another little horn, before whom there were three of the first horns plucked up by the roots: and, behold, in this horn were eyes like the eyes of man, and a mouth speaking great things.

= Little Horn

Dan 8:9 And out of one of them came forth a little horn, which waxed exceeding great, toward the south, and toward the east, and toward the pleasant land.

Dan 8:10 And it waxed great, even to the host of heaven; and it cast down some of the host and of the stars to the ground, and stamped upon them.

Dan 8:11 Yea, he magnified himself even to the prince of the host, and by him the daily sacrifice was taken away, and the place of his sanctuary was cast down.

Dan 8:12 And an host was given him against the daily sacrifice by reason of transgression, and it cast down the truth to the ground; and it practised, and prospered.

The field of vision here is substantially the same as that covered by Nebuchadnezzar's image of Daniel 2, and the vision of Daniel 7. In both these prophetic delineations we have found that the power which succeeded Grecia as the fourth great power was Rome. The only natural inference would be that the little horn, the power which in this vision succeeds Grecia as an "exceeding great" kingdom, is also Rome.

The little horn comes froth from one of the horns of the goat. How, it may be asked, can that be true of Rome? Earthly governments are not introduced into prophecy until they become in some way connected with the people of God. Rome became connected with the Jews, the people of God at that time, by the famous Jewish League in 161 B.C. [7] But seven years before this, that is, 168 B.C., Rome had conquered Macedonia, and made that country a part of its empire. Rome is therefore introduced into prophecy just as, from the overthrow of the Macedonian horn of the goat, it is going forth to new conquests in other directions. It appeared to the prophet as coming forth from of the horns of the goat.

The little horn waxed great toward the south. This was true of Rome. Egypt was made a province of the Roman Empire in 30 B.C., and continued such for some centuries.

The little horn waxed great toward the east. This also was true of Rome. She conquered Syria in 65 B.C., and made it a province.

The little horn waxed great toward the pleasant land. So did Rome. Judea is called "the pleasant land" in many scriptures. The Romans made it a province of their empire in 63 B.C., and eventually destroyed the city and the temple, and scattered the Jews throughout the earth.

The little horn "waxed great, even to ["against," margin] the host of heaven; and it cast down some of the host and of the stars to the ground." Rome did this also. In this expressions two figures are introduced, "the host" and "the stars." When used in a symbolic sense concerning events taking place on earth, these figures refer almost always to the people of God and their leaders. In verse 13 of this chapter we read that both the sanctuary and the host will be trodden under foot. Here undoubtedly reference is made to God's people and the place of their worship. The stars would naturally represent the leaders of the work of God. This thought is further indicated in one of the applications of Revelation 12: 4 where we read that the great red dragon, a symbol of Rome, cast down a third part of the stars to the ground.

The little horn "magnified himself even to the Prince of the host." Rome alone did this. In the interpretation (verse 25) the little horn is said to "stand up against the Prince of princes." This is clearly an allusion to the crucifixion of our Lord under the jurisdiction of the Romans.

Rome in Two Aspects.--By the little horn "the daily sacrifice was taken away." This little horn symbolized Rome in its entire history, including its two phases, pagan and papal. These two phases are elsewhere spoken of as the "daily" (sacrifice is a supplied word) and the "transgression of desolation;" the daily (desolation) evidently signifying the pagan form, and the transgression of desolation, the papal. (See comments on verse 13.) In the actions ascribed to this power, sometimes one form is spoken of, sometimes the other. "by him [the papal form] the daily [the pagan form] was taken away." Pagan

Rome was remodeled into papal Rome. "The place of his sanctuary," or worship, the city of Rome, was cast down. The seat of government was removed by Constantine to Constantinople, A.D. 330. This same transaction is brought to view in Revelation 13: 2, where it is said that the dragon, pagan Rome, gave to the beast, papal Rome, his seat, the city of Rome.

A "host was given him [the little horn] against the daily." The barbarians that subverted the Roman Empire in the changes, attritions, and transformations of those times, became converts to the Catholic faith, and the instruments of the dethronement of their former religion. Though conquering Rome politically, they were themselves vanquished religiously by the theology of Rome, and became the perpetuators of the same empire in another phase. This was brought about by reason of "transgression;" that is, by the working of the mystery of iniquity. The papacy may be called a system of iniquity because it has done its evil work under the pretense of the pure and undefiled religion. Of this false religious system, Paul wrote in the first century to the Thessalonians, "The mystery of iniquity doth already work." 2 Thessalonians 2: 7.

The little horn "cast down the truth to the ground, and practiced and prospered." This describes in few words the work and career of the papacy. The truth is by it hideously caricatured, loaded with traditions, turned into mummery and superstition, cast down and obscured.

Of this ecclesiastical power it is declared that it has "practiced"--practiced its deceptions on the people, practiced in schemes of cunning to carry out its own ends and aggrandize its own power.

Likewise it has "prospered." It has made war upon the saints, and prevailed against them. It has well-nigh run its allotted career, and is soon to be broken without hand, to be given to the burning flame, and to perish in the consuming glories of the second appearing of our Lord.

Rome meets all the specifications of the prophecy. No other power does meet them. Hence Rome, and on other, is the power in question. The inspired descriptions given in the word of God of the character of this system are fully met, and the prophecies concerning it have been most strikingly and accurately fulfilled in history.

Lauri, have you by chance done any Beth Moore studies?

[Lauri]

No, I do not know who Beth Moore is.

Just caught her on you tube - too much performing for me - I'm not into this new age Christianity.

The Bible is enough, conviction from the Holy Spirit does the work and Jesus died to wash away my sins.

Not I, but Christ. Not I, but Christ.

Edited April 8, 2012 by Lauri

[OneLight]

Here is a link to a very interesting video on the antichrist.

It is part of a 36 DVD Seminar on the book of Revelation.

http://amazingdiscoveries.tv/media/130/217-the-crime-of-all-ages/

Will look into it.

Was hoping for more scriptural discussion.....

May I ask what you believe? You have not mentioned this yet.