New revelations????

[Guest shiloh357]

Brother, we should not try to complicate this and get hung up on terms to much.

Yes, we do need to get hung up on terminology. This is not a smorgasboard or one-size fits all. when we muddy water about what words and terms mean, we open ourselves up to false teaching and false prophets.

Every single one of us has revelation (Revealed Knowledge) about God. God gives the increase, all we hear is seed. So, the revelation came from the Holy Spirit and as we continue to give measure to it, more is given.

Most of what you know about God comes from Scripture and not by a direct encounter where God reveals something to you about Himself that He has never shared with anyone else.

[BlessedByTheBest]

Who is giving the revelation? Not the Word, but God. Who is giving the direction for his will for our life? Not the Word, but God.

remember...

John 1:1

1 In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God.

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God is the Word, His revelation is Himself through His Word.

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John 1:14

¹⁴ And the Word was made flesh, and dwelt among us, (and we beheld his glory, the glory as of the only begotten of the Father,) full of grace and truth.

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Jesus Christ is the embodied Word, the Son, but also the Father.

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John 14:15-17

¹⁵ If ye love me, keep my commandments.

¹⁶ And I will pray the Father, and he shall give you another Comforter, that he may abide with you for ever;

¹⁷ Even the Spirit of truth; whom the world cannot receive, because it seeth him not, neither knoweth him: but ye know him; for he dwelleth with you, and shall be in you.

John 14:25-27

²⁵ These things have I spoken unto you, being yet present with you.

²⁶ But the Comforter, which is the Holy Ghost, whom the Father will send in my name, he shall teach you all things, and bring all things to your remembrance, whatsoever I have said unto you.

²⁷ Peace I leave with you, my peace I give unto you: not as the world giveth, give I unto you. Let not your heart be troubled, neither let it be afraid.

John 15:25-27

²⁵ But this cometh to pass, that the word might be fulfilled that is written in their law, They hated me without a cause.

²⁶ But when the Comforter is come, whom I will send unto you from the Father, even the Spirit of truth, which proceedeth from the Father, he shall testify of me:

²⁷ And ye also shall bear witness, because ye have been with me from the beginning.

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and so, since He had to leave us physically, He is still with us in Spirit, for He, the Father, and the Holy Spirit are One.

i feel we should be careful in making these distinctions. it creates unnecessary confusion and disagreement.

if God is revealed to us through the Word, and God is the Word, then God is directly giving the revelation. it cannot be any other way.

through the Holy Spirit we are redeemed, comforted, guided, admonished, corrected, uplifted,,

Jesus Christ the mediator between God and men.

according to God's Divine Will through the Holy Spirit all is revealed to those whom love, seek and praise Him in Spirit and in Truth.

we are to test all Spirits. confide in Christ for ALL revelation, He shall never lead us astray.

John 16

16 These things have I spoken unto you, that ye should not be offended.

² They shall put you out of the synagogues: yea, the time cometh, that whosoever killeth you will think that he doeth God service.

³ And these things will they do unto you, because they have not known the Father, nor me.

⁴ But these things have I told you, that when the time shall come, ye may remember that I told you of them. And these things I said not unto you at the beginning, because I was with you.

⁵ But now I go my way to him that sent me; and none of you asketh me, Whither goest thou?

⁶ But because I have said these things unto you, sorrow hath filled your heart.

⁷ Nevertheless I tell you the truth; It is expedient for you that I go away: for if I go not away, the Comforter will not come unto you; but if I depart, I will send him unto you.

⁸ And when he is come, he will reprove the world of sin, and of righteousness, and of judgment:

⁹ Of sin, because they believe not on me;

¹⁰ Of righteousness, because I go to my Father, and ye see me no more;

¹¹ Of judgment, because the prince of this world is judged.

¹² I have yet many things to say unto you, but ye cannot bear them now.

¹³ Howbeit when he, the Spirit of truth, is come, he will guide you into all truth: for he shall not speak of himself; but whatsoever he shall hear, that shall he speak: and he will shew you things to come.

¹⁴ He shall glorify me: for he shall receive of mine, and shall shew it unto you.

¹⁵ All things that the Father hath are mine: therefore said I, that he shall take of mine, and shall shew it unto you.

¹⁶ A little while, and ye shall not see me: and again, a little while, and ye shall see me, because I go to the Father.

¹⁷ Then said some of his disciples among themselves, What is this that he saith unto us, A little while, and ye shall not see me: and again, a little while, and ye shall see me: and, Because I go to the Father?

¹⁸ They said therefore, What is this that he saith, A little while? we cannot tell what he saith.

¹⁹ Now Jesus knew that they were desirous to ask him, and said unto them, Do ye enquire among yourselves of that I said, A little while, and ye shall not see me: and again, a little while, and ye shall see me?

²⁰ Verily, verily, I say unto you, That ye shall weep and lament, but the world shall rejoice: and ye shall be sorrowful, but your sorrow shall be turned into joy.

²¹ A woman when she is in travail hath sorrow, because her hour is come: but as soon as she is delivered of the child, she remembereth no more the anguish, for joy that a man is born into the world.

²² And ye now therefore have sorrow: but I will see you again, and your heart shall rejoice, and your joy no man taketh from you.

²³ And in that day ye shall ask me nothing. Verily, verily, I say unto you, Whatsoever ye shall ask the Father in my name, he will give it you.

²⁴ Hitherto have ye asked nothing in my name: ask, and ye shall receive, that your joy may be full.

²⁵ These things have I spoken unto you in proverbs: but the time cometh, when I shall no more speak unto you in proverbs, but I shall shew you plainly of the Father.

²⁶ At that day ye shall ask in my name: and I say not unto you, that I will pray the Father for you:

²⁷ For the Father himself loveth you, because ye have loved me, and have believed that I came out from God.

²⁸ I came forth from the Father, and am come into the world: again, I leave the world, and go to the Father.

²⁹ His disciples said unto him, Lo, now speakest thou plainly, and speakest no proverb.

³⁰ Now are we sure that thou knowest all things, and needest not that any man should ask thee: by this we believe that thou camest forth from God.

³¹ Jesus answered them, Do ye now believe?

³² Behold, the hour cometh, yea, is now come, that ye shall be scattered, every man to his own, and shall leave me alone: and yet I am not alone, because the Father is with me.

³³ These things I have spoken unto you, that in me ye might have peace. In the world ye shall have tribulation: but be of good cheer; I have overcome the world.

love to you and God bless..

[Fez]

John 19:30 When Jesus had received the sour wine, he said, "It is finished," and he bowed his head and gave up his spirit.

Closed, finished.

Why do we complicate things? Love Jesus, follow His commandments and wait in Hope. That's all we have to do.

Love Jesus. And wait in Hope.

And "Hope is patience with the lamp lit". And we feed the lamp with prayer and reading of God's competed word. Because Jesus finished it.

[Guest]

The verses really helped

I think I understand what your saying. There is still revelation because, Christ is the revelation. He is the complete revelation given to us, and in him is found all truth and every answer to every question. Regardless of it is Old testament or new. It all points to Christ. So any and all "new" revelation is nothing more than a further illumination of Christ from Christ ( this is what John 5:39 says) . It all has to line up and point to him. Line upon line and precept upon precept because in Christ there is no contradiction. Every revelation must line up to him. Because he is what all revelation and prophecy should all point to if they are from God.

Is this right? Is this what your saying?

Yes

Search the scriptures; for in them ye think ye have eternal life: and they are they which testify of me. John 5:39

The Bible Is Your Mind's Truth Defender

And take the helmet of salvation, and the sword of the Spirit, which is the word of God: Ephesians 6:17

For The Holy Ghost Will Use It To Slice And Dice Out The Sins And The Lies

For the word of God is quick, and powerful, and sharper than any twoedged sword, piercing even to the dividing asunder of soul and spirit, and of the joints and marrow, and is a discerner of the thoughts and intents of the heart. Hebrews 4:12

And The Whole Bible Is Forever True

Being born again, not of corruptible seed, but of incorruptible, by the word of God, which liveth and abideth for ever. 1 Peter 1:23

And Furthermore It Is Our

As newborn babes, desire the sincere milk of the word, that ye may grow thereby: 1 Peter 2:2

God Given Birthright

A new heart also will I give you, and a new spirit will I put within you: and I will take away the stony heart out of your flesh, and I will give you an heart of flesh. And I will put my spirit within you, and cause you to walk in my statutes, and ye shall keep my judgments, and do them. Ezekiel 36-27

~

Jesus answered and said unto him, Verily, verily, I say unto thee, Except a man be born again, he cannot see the kingdom of God. Nicodemus saith unto him, How can a man be born when he is old? can he enter the second time into his mother's womb, and be born? Jesus answered, Verily, verily, I say unto thee, Except a man be born of water and of the Spirit, he cannot enter into the kingdom of God. That which is born of the flesh is flesh; and that which is born of the Spirit is spirit. Marvel not that I said unto thee, Ye must be born again.

The wind bloweth where it listeth, and thou hearest the sound thereof, but canst not tell whence it cometh, and whither it goeth: so is every one that is born of the Spirit. Nicodemus answered and said unto him, How can these things be? Jesus answered and said unto him, Art thou a master of Israel, and knowest not these things? John 3:3-10

Eat Beloved

But he answered and said, It is written, Man shall not live by bread alone, but by every word that proceedeth out of the mouth of God. Matthew 4:4

Eat

Thy words were found, and I did eat them; and thy word was unto me the joy and rejoicing of mine heart: for I am called by thy name, O LORD God of hosts. Jeremiah 15:16

~

Be Blessed Beloved Of The KING

I will worship toward thy holy temple, and praise thy name for thy lovingkindness and for thy truth: for thou hast magnified thy word above all thy name. Psalms 138:2

Love, Your Brother Joe

~

The Bible contains the mind of God, the state of man, the way of salvation, the doom of sinners, and the happiness of believers.

Its doctrines are holy, its precepts are binding, its histories are true, and its decisions immutable.

Read it to be wise, believe it to be safe, and practice it to be holy.

It contains light to direct you, food to support you, and comfort to cheer you.

It is the traveler's map, the pilgrim's staff, the pilot's compass, the soldier's sword, and the Christian's charter.

Here Paradise is restored, Heaven opened, and the gates of hell disclosed.

Christ is its grand subject, our good its design, and the glory of God its end.

It should fill the memory, rule the heart and guide the feet.

Read it slowly, frequently and prayerfully.

It is a mine of wealth, a Paradise of glory, and a river of pleasure.

It is given to you in life, will be open in the judgment, and be remembered forever.

It involves the highest responsibility, rewards the greatest labor, and condemns all who trifle with its holy precepts.

From The Front Of My Gideon New Testament

[firestormx]

These were my questions, in my first post of this thread.

1. What is your understanding of No New Revelations or No New Knowledge?

2. How does this affect things like dreams and visions and the gift of prophecy?

3. The apostles were the foundation, christ the cornerstone. But if there is No new revelations, how do the walls and roof get built?

I aslo in a post a little further down on the first page posted these links, that as I was doing my research and study of this I came across.

http://www.bible-tea...revelation.html

Read this one first

http://www.tms.edu/tmsj/tmsj14h.pdf

These were my questions. Not can canon be changed or added to. I understand that some of you see this as the same. I don't.. I understand when someone says no new revelation, that no can ever receive any revelation of any kind, ever. That's the implication of no new revelation. That it affects things like dreams, visions, and prophecy. Because all such dreams, visions and prophecy if they are true, must come from God, and are a revelation of him and his will for us. Take paul's vision of Chrsit, when Jesus said, paul would be taken all the way to rome. Then I posted these links. Where in the one I put read first, is especially using scripture in what I thought ( but wasn't sure) was an improper way. He lays out all the conseqenses of no new revelation. I've never once, said I think there is something that should be added to the bible, because I don't. I wanted to know from the start, what does no new revelation means to you, what's the implacation, if there can't be any revelations at all, how does that affect things like dreams visions and prophecy, and our walk with God. This is what I asked. Not should canon be added. I asked a question a few posts back, it was is new revelation and revelation the same things. I think yes. in the general meaning of the word yes. You don't have a revelation on something you already know and understand, it's always new to you, that's why it's a revelation. You might say I am saying change the canon, I'm not. You might say, or think I'm saying, the canon isn't complete. I'm not. I just can't accept that there is no more revelation ( same thing as new revelation) at all, in any way.

[Guest]

So even though the bible don't say the canon is closed, since YOU haven't recieved or heard any new revelation then there can't be any?

I remember when I died. Leagelly dead, and dead long enough my brain was not active. The bible says to be absent from the body is present with the lord. That is very true. Because it's what happen to me. The things I saw were beyond words, and the scripture it's self could not contain God, not even the earth itself. People have told me here that Jesus is the full and final revelation of God to us. But you could also argue he was nothing more than A further illumination on who God is. After what I saw when I died, I know better than to say the bible contains the complete and entire fullness of God, and if he chooses to reveal that than that is his choice.

I tend to agree with you!

John 21:25

And there are also many other things which Jesus did, the which, if they should be written every one, I suppose that even the world itself could not contain the books that should be written. Amen.

Amen~!

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It Has Been Quoted Here Before

Knowing this first, that no prophecy of the scripture is of any private interpretation. 1 Peter 1:20

And Even As A Child (1948) Off And On I've Been Reading The Bible

Deep calleth unto deep at the noise of thy waterspouts: all thy waves and thy billows are gone over me. Yet the LORD will command his lovingkindness in the daytime, and in the night his song shall be with me, and my prayer unto the God of my life. Psalms 42:7-8

And Every Time I Open It Up My Heart Leaps And Sometimes My Jaw Drops

And Sometimes I Weep (LORD, You Wrote This For Me~!) And So It Gets A Little Deeper

Sanctify them through thy truth: thy word is truth. John 17:17

And Jesus Becomes More And More Clearer in Both Testimonies

Charity never faileth: but whether there be prophecies, they shall fail; whether there be tongues, they shall cease; whether there be knowledge, it shall vanish away. For we know in part, and we prophesy in part.

But when that which is perfect is come, then that which is in part shall be done away.

When I was a child, I spake as a child, I understood as a child, I thought as a child: but when I became a man, I put away childish things.

For now we see through a glass, darkly; but then face to face: now I know in part; but then shall I know even as also I am known.

And now abideth faith, hope, charity, these three; but the greatest of these is charity. 1 Corinthians 13:8-13

Even As My Homecoming Gets A Little Closer

As the hart panteth after the water brooks, so panteth my soul after thee, O God. Psalms 42:1

~

Be Blessed Beloved Of The KING

Love, Your Brother Joe

[nebula]

Shiloh -

OK, since I am obviously not getting what you mean by "revelation", would you give an example or two of what this is?

Maybe that will help.

[nebula]

So there is no Scripture to back this claim that is being treated as if the Lord said He would cease revealing Himself to us?

No, but such can be demonstrated.

And this is what is bugging me.

It is appearing as if "man's wisdom" has determined "the Canon" is closed.

If man can't use his mental faculties to deterine new revelation, why can man use his mental faculties to determine "the closed Canon" concept?

Does that make more sense?

[nebula]

I'm not sure about the intent (motivation) of those on the thread but I'd like to remind us all of a few things.

The first thing is Worthy is first a ministry that just happens to have a discussion forum. The second is that disrespect towards God's Word will not be allowed.

From the Worthy SoF (Statement of Faith)

We believe that the 66 books of the Canon, from Genesis to Revelation are the exhaustive, inerrant and inspired word of God.

From the WCF ToS (Terms of Service)

You may not post any material that is disrespectful of God, Jesus Christ, the Holy Spirit, or the Bible.

Please proceed with caution.

God bless,

GE

No worries - I'm just digging.

[Guest shiloh357]

Shiloh -

OK, since I am obviously not getting what you mean by "revelation", would you give an example or two of what this is?

Maybe that will help.

Look at the difference between how God revealed Himself to the Abraham and the Children of Israel and now different He was from the gods of the ancient pagans.

He was radically different, the polar opposite of gods concocted by pagans. The biblical concept of a loving and redemptive God, was foreign to that part of the world. Having a God who was ompotent, omniscient, omnipresent, a God who was fully self-sufficient, needing no human assistance, a righteous God who was not fickle, who could be trusted to be faithful to everything He says and promises, and who is not sexually immoral like human beings; a holy God who is not plagued with the same moral failings as human beings, was a "revelation" to the ancient world. No such God ever entered their minds. They had no point of reference for such a God.

That is why the Scripture says that there is no god like YHVH.

Jesus was the revelation of who God is.

No one has ever seen God; the only God, who is at the Father's side, he has made him known.

(Joh 1:18)

John 14:9 and Hebrews 1:1 also confirm that Jesus is the revelation of God and Hebrews 1:1 tells us that Jesus is the final revelation of God. God has in these last days spoken to us through His Son. Jesus is God's final word to mankind. That is why we believe that the canon is closed. Jesus has accomplished what God intended in terms of revealing Him to mankind and providing a means for redemption.

Again, I think you are applying a subjective sense to "revelation" and in doing so, are confusing it with illumination. Revelation is corporate. It is God revealing Himself to mankind. Illumination is more local and personal. It is God giving more light on what has already been revealed. Unfortunately, many people call that "revelation," and it isn't.