WarmRoom Posted June 1, 2013 Group: Nonbeliever Followers: 0 Topic Count: 3 Topics Per Day: 0.00 Content Count: 141 Content Per Day: 0.04 Reputation: 24 Days Won: 2 Joined: 05/21/2013 Status: Offline Share Posted June 1, 2013 Your assuming they will fail at celibacy shilo can the holy spirit not fill them up and give them the strength to resist temptation.Matthew 19:10-12The disciples said to him, “If such is the case of a man with his wife, it is better not to marry.” But he said to them, “Not everyone can receive this saying, but only those to whom it is given. For there are eunuchs who have been so from birth, and there are eunuchs who have been made eunuchs by men, and there are eunuchs who have made themselves eunuchs for the sake of the kingdom of heaven. Let the one who is able to receive this receive it.”They want to receive celibacy this is their solution to fighting the wages of sin. Celibacy is not for everyone but for some it is their only option. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest shiloh357 Posted June 1, 2013 Share Posted June 1, 2013 Being guilty of lust is one thing. Justifying it and claiming it is not really sinful to have lustful desire is something else altogether. For that reason, your question pretty much misses the point, which is not at all surprising. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WarmRoom Posted June 1, 2013 Group: Nonbeliever Followers: 0 Topic Count: 3 Topics Per Day: 0.00 Content Count: 141 Content Per Day: 0.04 Reputation: 24 Days Won: 2 Joined: 05/21/2013 Status: Offline Share Posted June 1, 2013 I don't think they are justifying anything Shilo I think they find it just as despicable as you they probably even hate themselves for it. Which is why they are trying to shield themselves from sexual thoughts. I think they classify themselves as homosexual in the medical sense not the spirtual Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest shiloh357 Posted June 1, 2013 Share Posted June 1, 2013 Your assuming they will fail at celibacy shilo can the holy spirit not fill them up and give them the strength to resist temptation. Matthew 19:10-12 The disciples said to him, “If such is the case of a man with his wife, it is better not to marry.” But he said to them, “Not everyone can receive this saying, but only those to whom it is given. For there are eunuchs who have been so from birth, and there are eunuchs who have been made eunuchs by men, and there are eunuchs who have made themselves eunuchs for the sake of the kingdom of heaven. Let the one who is able to receive this receive it.” They want to receive celibacy this is their solution to fighting the wages of sin. Celibacy is not for everyone but for some it is their only option. They will fail because the Holy Spirit isn't a part of what they are doing. They are still homosexuals in their heart of hearts and don't believe being that way is a sin. That automatically means that they are not going get any help from the Holy Spirit. That they are employing a nonbiblical concept called "celibacy" is also another reason why they are not operating in the power of the Holy Spirit. They will fail so long as they continue to this endeavor because they are trying to accomplish what only Christ in us can accomplish. Celibacy is not biblical. The Bible doesn't teach celibacy. It teaches the opposite of celibacy. The Bible is pro-sex. God gave us sexuality as a gift and sex is to between a husband (male) and his wife (female), period. No sex outside of the biblical model. God intended for husbands and wives to have sex and to have a lot of it and that it would be an expression of love between them. Celibacy is a old ascetic practice that goes all the way back to the gnostics. It has nothing to do with the Bible. Celibacy is a futile and meaningless act. So long as they continue down the road they are heading, they will find that their efforts will gain them nothing with God. God isn't interested in people performing well enough for Him. They can't. You cannot "fight the wages of sin." You are not even using that phrase correcly. The "wages of sin" is death. Sin's payment is eternal death. But Eternal Life is the free gift of God (Rom. 6:23) Death is the result of sin; eternal LIFE is the result of coming to Jesus for salvation. Nothing you do, no matter how grand and glorious it may appear to men will gain any favor with God. In Matthew 7, many will come to Jesus' throne claiming to have done many great things in His Name and He will say to them, "Depart from me workers of iniquity for I never knew you." They tried to appeal to the Judge on the grounds of their efforts, but God's standard is based on righteousness by grace through faith. God's standard isn't "goodness;" the standard is righteousness and you can only get that from Jesus. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gandalf Posted June 1, 2013 Group: Removed from Forums for Breaking Terms of Service Followers: 1 Topic Count: 0 Topics Per Day: 0 Content Count: 377 Content Per Day: 0.09 Reputation: 29 Days Won: 1 Joined: 05/28/2013 Status: Offline Share Posted June 1, 2013 The issue is sin the sin in which we were conceived because of the original sin of Adam and Eve. I do not know the mind of the homosexual but I do know that we live in a sinful world and that it is so easy to judge another. I do not know the struggles of those who see one of the same sex as attractive but if one who is heterosexual can control his feelings for one of the opposite sex can not one who is a homosexual control his feelings also? We would not judge as harshly one who is a heterosexual as we would a homosexual. Why? Its self-righteousness! Jesus hated it, probably more than sexual sin, if the gospels are to be believed. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest shiloh357 Posted June 1, 2013 Share Posted June 1, 2013 The issue is sin the sin in which we were conceived because of the original sin of Adam and Eve. I do not know the mind of the homosexual but I do know that we live in a sinful world and that it is so easy to judge another. I do not know the struggles of those who see one of the same sex as attractive but if one who is heterosexual can control his feelings for one of the opposite sex can not one who is a homosexual control his feelings also? We would not judge as harshly one who is a heterosexual as we would a homosexual. Why? Its self-righteousness! Jesus hated it, probably more than sexual sin, if the gospels are to be believed. It is not self-righteousness to reflect biblical values that state that homosexuality is a sin and that sin begins in the heart.. Do you believe homosexuality is a sin, Gandalf?? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gandalf Posted June 1, 2013 Group: Removed from Forums for Breaking Terms of Service Followers: 1 Topic Count: 0 Topics Per Day: 0 Content Count: 377 Content Per Day: 0.09 Reputation: 29 Days Won: 1 Joined: 05/28/2013 Status: Offline Share Posted June 1, 2013 The issue is sin the sin in which we were conceived because of the original sin of Adam and Eve. I do not know the mind of the homosexual but I do know that we live in a sinful world and that it is so easy to judge another. I do not know the struggles of those who see one of the same sex as attractive but if one who is heterosexual can control his feelings for one of the opposite sex can not one who is a homosexual control his feelings also? We would not judge as harshly one who is a heterosexual as we would a homosexual. Why? Its self-righteousness! Jesus hated it, probably more than sexual sin, if the gospels are to be believed. It is not self-righteousness to reflect biblical values that state that homosexuality is a sin and that sin begins in the heart.. Do you believe homosexuality is a sin, Gandalf?? It is self-righteousness to judge homosexual sin more harshly that heterosexual sin, which is the point at issue! Jesus pronounced woe on the self-righteous, who thought they knew and kept the rules and judged those whom they thought didn't! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest shiloh357 Posted June 1, 2013 Share Posted June 1, 2013 It is self-righteousness to judge homosexual sin more harshly that heterosexual sin, which is the point at issue! Jesus pronounced woe on the self-righteous, who thought they knew and kept the rules and judged those whom they thought didn't! I am not judging it more harshly. If you read my postings, I have come down just as hard on heterosexual adultery, fornication, pornography, lust, incest, etc. At no time did I ever say that heterosexual sexual sin was not as bad. Evidently, you have decided to assign values to my posts that I don't possess. I would suggest that you try to know what you are talking about before making unfounded and incorrect assumptions. You didn't answer the question: Do you believe that homosexuality is a sin, Gandalf?? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WarmRoom Posted June 1, 2013 Group: Nonbeliever Followers: 0 Topic Count: 3 Topics Per Day: 0.00 Content Count: 141 Content Per Day: 0.04 Reputation: 24 Days Won: 2 Joined: 05/21/2013 Status: Offline Share Posted June 1, 2013 can you view homosexuality in a medical sense vs the spiritual sense Shilo?as far as semantics goes there could be a difference between what they view the term yet agree with your position. Their fear is that sex of any kind could promote those feelings and because of their disposition to homosexual sin it is better to avoid sex to prevent the urges that this might cause.their belief that the holy spirit can fill them up and prevent sexual desires is more logical than the holy spirit filling them up and completely changing their biological functions. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gunar Posted June 1, 2013 Group: Removed from Forums for Breaking Terms of Service Followers: 0 Topic Count: 0 Topics Per Day: 0 Content Count: 19 Content Per Day: 0.00 Reputation: 0 Days Won: 0 Joined: 06/01/2013 Status: Offline Birthday: 10/20/1952 Share Posted June 1, 2013 I am a member of the MCC. And this church is open to LGBT people. I believe, that it is the best for all Christians to live in celebace. Until they are married. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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