Guest shiloh357 Posted May 20, 2014 Share Posted May 20, 2014 Shiloh357 - You can believe the Bible or you can believe in Evolution, but you cannot have both and still have a coherent theology. I can quite easily believe, with qualifications, in both based on scripture. I don't quite see where the "Big Bang" in any way contradicts scripture...we know one thing "In the beginning God..." then within in the limitations imposed by His word, creation is quite open to interpretation. It is obvious too that the BB is offensive to many as it posits a beginning, thus myriad opposing views and work towards a non-BB cosmology. I am sure you can and you can justify and rationalize it to yourself in way that works to your satisfaction. It still leaves with a confused and incoherent theology. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest shiloh357 Posted May 20, 2014 Share Posted May 20, 2014 That the Creation was the thought and that it was then made real. If space before the Big Bang was empty, devoid of matter, then its natural state is dark. Light and Life that comes with it, have to be physically introduced. 'Let there be light' is the Big Bang. No, "let there be light" is not the big bang. Let there be light was first ever manifestation of God's Shekinah glory. The first thing that comes on the scene is God's glory. it is the same glory that man cannot look upon without being destroyed. It is the same light (although in measured form) that shone around Jesus on the Mt. of Transfiguration. We need stop surrendering the interpretation of Scripture the scientific community (and to Hollywood for that matter). I can see visible light as being a manifestation of God's glory, but I wonder how you came to this conclusion and how you can say that it is absolutely so. The light manifested by God at the start is not the visible light we see. It was the light that God produces and the only that emanates from Him anywhere it is mentioned in scripture. It is His Shekinah, the inapproachable light. Ok, great. How can you be so sure? sure about what? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
*Zion* Posted May 20, 2014 Group: Royal Member Followers: 16 Topic Count: 154 Topics Per Day: 0.04 Content Count: 3,245 Content Per Day: 0.78 Reputation: 2,397 Days Won: 9 Joined: 12/09/2012 Status: Offline Birthday: 05/11/1984 Share Posted May 20, 2014 That light is in fact God's glory manifested. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tolken Posted May 20, 2014 Group: Advanced Member Followers: 0 Topic Count: 3 Topics Per Day: 0.00 Content Count: 405 Content Per Day: 0.11 Reputation: 98 Days Won: 0 Joined: 02/27/2014 Status: Offline Share Posted May 20, 2014 Shiloh357 - I am sure you can and you can justify and rationalize it to yourself in way that works to your satisfaction. It still leaves with a confused and incoherent theology. No need for me to "rationalize" simply an unconfused and coherent reading of Genesis 1. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest shiloh357 Posted May 20, 2014 Share Posted May 20, 2014 That light is in fact God's glory manifested. God is the only thing/person in existence. There are no natural light sources anywhere else. Where else would the light have emanated from than from Him? If you know of other sources of light that preexisted the stars, suns and any other celestial luminaries, please provide a list of such for review. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest shiloh357 Posted May 20, 2014 Share Posted May 20, 2014 Shiloh357 - I am sure you can and you can justify and rationalize it to yourself in way that works to your satisfaction. It still leaves with a confused and incoherent theology. No need for me to "rationalize" simply an unconfused and coherent reading of Genesis 1. Existing only within the confines of your imagination. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
*Zion* Posted May 20, 2014 Group: Royal Member Followers: 16 Topic Count: 154 Topics Per Day: 0.04 Content Count: 3,245 Content Per Day: 0.78 Reputation: 2,397 Days Won: 9 Joined: 12/09/2012 Status: Offline Birthday: 05/11/1984 Share Posted May 20, 2014 Hi Shiloh, I'm not picking a fight, I'm just asking a question brother God said "Let there be light." I'm very sure that God is more than able to create something out of nothing. And as for this light pre-existing the stars (pay attention to the order in which things are created): Genesis 1 1 In the beginning God (prepared, formed, fashioned, and) created the heavens and the earth. 2 The earth was without form and an empty waste, and darkness was upon the face of the very great deep. The Spirit of God was moving (hovering, brooding) over the face of the waters. 3 And God said, Let there be light; and there was light. 4 And God saw that the light was good (suitable, pleasant) and He approved it; and God separated the light from the darkness. 5 And God called the light Day, and the darkness He called Night. And there was evening and there was morning, one day. 6 And God said, Let there be a firmament [the expanse of the sky] in the midst of the waters, and let it separate the waters [below] from the waters [above]. 7 And God made the firmament [the expanse] and separated the waters which were under the expanse from the waters which were above the expanse. And it was so. 8 And God called the firmament Heavens. And there was evening and there was morning, a second day. 9 And God said, Let the waters under the heavens be collected into one place [of standing], and let the dry land appear. And it was so. 10 God called the dry land Earth, and the accumulated waters He called Seas. And God saw that this was good (fitting, admirable) and He approved it. 11 And God said, Let the earth put forth [tender] vegetation: plants yielding seed and fruit trees yielding fruit whose seed is in itself, each according to its kind, upon the earth. And it was so. 12 The earth brought forth vegetation: plants yielding seed according to their own kinds and trees bearing fruit in which was their seed, each according to its kind. And God saw that it was good (suitable, admirable) and He approved it. 13 And there was evening and there was morning, a third day. 14 And God said, Let there be lights in the expanse of the heavens to separate the day from the night, and let them be signs and tokens [of God’s provident care], and [to mark] seasons, days, and years, 15 And let them be lights in the expanse of the sky to give light upon the earth. And it was so. 16 And God made the two great lights—the greater light (the sun) to rule the day and the lesser light (the moon) to rule the night. He also made the stars. 17 And God set them in the expanse of the heavens to give light upon the earth, 18 To rule over the day and over the night, and to separate the light from the darkness. And God saw that it was good (fitting, pleasant) and He approved it. I don't see anywhere in the scriptures that that first light He made was a manifestation of His glory. I just wondered where you got that idea from. That's all. Once again, be blessed Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tolken Posted May 20, 2014 Group: Advanced Member Followers: 0 Topic Count: 3 Topics Per Day: 0.00 Content Count: 405 Content Per Day: 0.11 Reputation: 98 Days Won: 0 Joined: 02/27/2014 Status: Offline Share Posted May 20, 2014 Shiloh357 - Existing only within the confines of your imagination. Rather insubstantial response, and hardly qualifies to anything other than a feeble attempt to disregard any valid perspectives other then your own. Obviously you have difficulty with a clear reading of Genesis...... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest shiloh357 Posted May 20, 2014 Share Posted May 20, 2014 Shiloh357 - Existing only within the confines of your imagination. Rather insubstantial response, and hardly qualifies to anything other than a feeble attempt to disregard any valid perspectives other then your own. Obviously you have difficulty with a clear reading of Genesis...... the point I made earlier is that (and I realize this thread is not about evolution) that man was made independent of any other life form on earth according to Scripture. That makes the theory incompatible with the Bible. There is no reconciliation possible except what you can dream up or imagine. The same applies to the big bang. The Bible says that the stars were created after the earth, and after the plants/vegetation. The Big Bang puts the stars in existence before the earth, and thus before anything that was created on our earth. Since the Bible is never wrong and is always 100% accurate because it comes from an all-knowing God who was there and who never commits an error, it is only in your imagination that any scientific theory that contradicts the Bible is somehow reconcilable to the the Bible. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest shiloh357 Posted May 20, 2014 Share Posted May 20, 2014 Hi Shiloh, I'm not picking a fight, I'm just asking a question brother God said "Let there be light." I'm very sure that God is more than able to create something out of nothing. And as for this light pre-existing the stars (pay attention to the order in which things are created): Genesis 1 1 In the beginning God (prepared, formed, fashioned, and) created the heavens and the earth. 2 The earth was without form and an empty waste, and darkness was upon the face of the very great deep. The Spirit of God was moving (hovering, brooding) over the face of the waters. 3 And God said, Let there be light; and there was light. 4 And God saw that the light was good (suitable, pleasant) and He approved it; and God separated the light from the darkness. 5 And God called the light Day, and the darkness He called Night. And there was evening and there was morning, one day. 6 And God said, Let there be a firmament [the expanse of the sky] in the midst of the waters, and let it separate the waters [below] from the waters [above]. 7 And God made the firmament [the expanse] and separated the waters which were under the expanse from the waters which were above the expanse. And it was so. 8 And God called the firmament Heavens. And there was evening and there was morning, a second day. 9 And God said, Let the waters under the heavens be collected into one place [of standing], and let the dry land appear. And it was so. 10 God called the dry land Earth, and the accumulated waters He called Seas. And God saw that this was good (fitting, admirable) and He approved it. 11 And God said, Let the earth put forth [tender] vegetation: plants yielding seed and fruit trees yielding fruit whose seed is in itself, each according to its kind, upon the earth. And it was so. 12 The earth brought forth vegetation: plants yielding seed according to their own kinds and trees bearing fruit in which was their seed, each according to its kind. And God saw that it was good (suitable, admirable) and He approved it. 13 And there was evening and there was morning, a third day. 14 And God said, Let there be lights in the expanse of the heavens to separate the day from the night, and let them be signs and tokens [of God’s provident care], and [to mark] seasons, days, and years, 15 And let them be lights in the expanse of the sky to give light upon the earth. And it was so. 16 And God made the two great lights—the greater light (the sun) to rule the day and the lesser light (the moon) to rule the night. He also made the stars. 17 And God set them in the expanse of the heavens to give light upon the earth, 18 To rule over the day and over the night, and to separate the light from the darkness. And God saw that it was good (fitting, pleasant) and He approved it. I don't see anywhere in the scriptures that that first light He made was a manifestation of His glory. I just wondered where you got that idea from. That's all. Once again, be blessed I understand. The onus is you to explain what that light is if it is not His glory. His glory is the only light that would have existed at that time. He lives in approachable light. He didn't "make" the light. The light came from Him. He is the only place where it would have come from. The Bible describes His Shekinah as "light." Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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