Matthew 24, for Jews or for Christians?

[iamlamad]

Sister wrote,

The false prophet is only given 3 1/2 years to rule in Jerusalem.  When his temple is declared finished and he sits in there as God, we have 45 days to fill.  This time period would be when the nations all come in and gather to war at the 6th trumpet.  They will be against the false prophet and his allies.  It will take time for all his enemies to plan, gather and come in to attack.  The false prophet will have to gather his allies also. 

So in the 45 days, this happens, and they start warring each other.  But Christ comes to stop that war or else no flesh would be saved. This would be his appearing in the air.  They get confused, and regather together to fight Christ at Meggido.  I would say if the firstfriuts (144,000) get picked up, it would be now on the 1335th day, unless there is a scripture to point out otherwise.

The rest will come shortly, after them, the dead in Christ, and the remainder of those who are alive in Christ, the whole majority together.

 

Sister, I have not heard this use of the 45 days ever. How do you know when the temple will be finished? There will be some time of the daily sacrifices taking place before the abomination.

 

WHERE do you get that the nations gather at the 6th trumpet? That is when a heavenly army kills 1/3 of our planet. (I don't think this is an earthly army.)  Always remember, Jesus comes in chapter 19. That will be OVER 3 1/2 years, or OVER 42 months past the abomination. He does not stop in the air at that coming; He comes to FIGHT the battle of Armageddon, and will touch His feet to the mount of Olives. It is His PRETRIB coming where He comes only to the air and in the clouds.

 

I believe most people consider the 1290 days to mean 30 days AFTER the 70th week has finished. And the 1335th day is yet another 45 days after that. What do these days represent? We can only guess because the bible does not tell us. One day could be the official start of the Millennial reign of Christ, after the sheep and goat judgment. One day could be the cleansing of the temple. We just don't know.

 

The fleeing, as seen in Rev. 12:6 will be their fleeing because they saw the abomination. Those that don't flee then, may find a way to flee when the city is surrounded, but it may be very difficult to flee then.

 

The 144,000 are seals BEFORE the 70th week begins, and are raptured close to the midpoint of the week. The 7th trumpet marks the exact midpoint. (The time of the abomination: note that they flee into the wilderness just after the 7th trumpet.)

 

LAMAD

[Montana Marv]

LAMAD

 

Maybe an answer to your question above. 

 

I believe most people consider the 1290 days to mean 30 days AFTER the 70th week has finished. And the 1335th day is yet another 45 days after that. What do these days represent? We can only guess because the bible does not tell us. One day could be the official start of the Millennial reign of Christ, after the sheep and goat judgment. One day could be the cleansing of the temple. We just don't know.

 

The extra 30 days maybe the duration of Armageddon.  The extra 45 days maybe the time it takes the birds of the air to eat the flesh of men and horses.  We are talking about maybe over 1 Billion people, and over 200 Million horses.  Equivalent to over 460 sq. miles of armies packed like sardines trying to get to Armageddon.  It will take a while for the last of them to reach Armageddon.  And the Valley of Megiddo occupies only about 180 sq. miles.

 

In Christ

Montana Marv

[Salty]

I see that bad interpretation of the 200 million locust army of Rev.9 those like Hal Lindsey put in his book The Late Great Planet Earth a long time ago, has many still fooled.

 

That is not the Armageddon army out of the northern quarters that's to come upon Israel on the last day of this world when our Lord Jesus returns. The Armageddon army is given in the Ezekiel 38 & 39 Scripture, specific nations that will come upon Israel on the last day. That nation alignment of Ezekiel is almost complete today.

 

The 200 million locust army of Rev.9 happens DURING the 6th Trumpet - 2nd Woe period, which is not the last day, but instead is the great tribulation timing when the dragon reigns for 42 months. That 6th trumpet - 2nd woe period is the timing of God's two witnesses prophesying in Jerusalem for 1260 days. The killing of the 1/3 in Rev.9 is about a spiritual killing to the soul by deception to the coming Antichrist/false messiah who will play Christ in Jerusalem for the end of this world.

[Sister]

 

Matthew 24 is only half of our Lord's answer to His disciples.  Matthew 25 was also included. 

 

Christ mentions those that are living in Judea after the abomination of desolation (Jews).  Then after the tribulation He mentions the sign of His coming, when He be coming in the clouds, and then He will send the angels to gather His elect (Christians who are ready).  Then finally, He will return to the earth and judge the nations (sheep and goats - Matt. 25:31-46), this is the sign of the end of the age.

 

 

Cheers

Then He will send the angels to gather His elect (Jews [Hebrews] from both heaven and earth).

[the bride of Christ will have already been in heaven for 7 plus years, and will return WITH him.]

 

Mark 13:19   For in those days shall be affliction, such as was not from the beginning of the creation which God created unto this time, neither shall be.

Mark 13:20   And except that the Lord had shortened those days, no flesh should be saved: but for the elect's sake, whom he hath chosen, he hath shortened the days.

Mark 13:24   But in those days, after that tribulation, the sun shall be darkened, and the moon shall not give her light,

Mark 13:25   And the stars of heaven shall fall, and the powers that are in heaven shall be shaken.

Mark 13:26   And then shall they see the Son of man coming in the clouds with great power and glory.

Mark 13:27   And then shall he send his angels, and shall gather together his elect from the four winds, from the uttermost part of the earth to the uttermost part of heaven.

 

Lamad

 

The days that will be shortened, is that big war in Israel.  If Christ doesn't put a stop to it, their weapons of mass destruction will kill all flesh.

He stops that war where they are fighting each other by appearing in the air,

The war is suddenly disrupted,

now they start fighting Christ himself.

They re-gather in Megido (Armageddon)  This is the war against the lamb.

 

After the tribulation the saints will be picked up (raptured)

Not before the tribulation, but at the last trumpet, the coming.

[iamlamad]

 

 

Matthew 24 is only half of our Lord's answer to His disciples.  Matthew 25 was also included. 

 

Christ mentions those that are living in Judea after the abomination of desolation (Jews).  Then after the tribulation He mentions the sign of His coming, when He be coming in the clouds, and then He will send the angels to gather His elect (Christians who are ready).  Then finally, He will return to the earth and judge the nations (sheep and goats - Matt. 25:31-46), this is the sign of the end of the age.

 

 

Cheers

Then He will send the angels to gather His elect (Jews [Hebrews] from both heaven and earth).

[the bride of Christ will have already been in heaven for 7 plus years, and will return WITH him.]

 

Mark 13:19   For in those days shall be affliction, such as was not from the beginning of the creation which God created unto this time, neither shall be.

Mark 13:20   And except that the Lord had shortened those days, no flesh should be saved: but for the elect's sake, whom he hath chosen, he hath shortened the days.

Mark 13:24   But in those days, after that tribulation, the sun shall be darkened, and the moon shall not give her light,

Mark 13:25   And the stars of heaven shall fall, and the powers that are in heaven shall be shaken.

Mark 13:26   And then shall they see the Son of man coming in the clouds with great power and glory.

Mark 13:27   And then shall he send his angels, and shall gather together his elect from the four winds, from the uttermost part of the earth to the uttermost part of heaven.

 

Lamad

 

The days that will be shortened, is that big war in Israel.  If Christ doesn't put a stop to it, their weapons of mass destruction will kill all flesh.

He stops that war where they are fighting each other by appearing in the air,

The war is suddenly disrupted,

now they start fighting Christ himself.

They re-gather in Megido (Armageddon)  This is the war against the lamb.

 

After the tribulation the saints will be picked up (raptured)

Not before the tribulation, but at the last trumpet, the coming.

 

That's strange;  all my life I have heard that the days of great tribulation - greater than at any time on earth ever - will be the Beast and False prophet with their mark and image, forcing all in the world to accept the mark. And to make it even worse, NO ONE can buy or sell without the mark. Since one of the vials turns all the fresh water to blood, there will be NO WATER to drink, so thirst will be terrible for those who refuse the mark. So what makes these days "great tribulation?" It is the great PRESSURE put upon people to take the mark.

 

LAMAD

[Sister]

Sister, there will be SO MANY that will make it to heaven during the days of great tribulation. Every one who refuses the Mark and loses hsis or her head will make it to heaven, if they do this for their belief in Jesu.

I agree with you here.  All those who die for Christ's sake will have their places reserved in heaven. 

 

 

Where do you find the door closed once the trumpets begin?

 

After the saints are persecuted.

Revelation 15:8   And the temple was filled with smoke from the glory of God, and from his power; and no man was able to enter into the temple, till the seven plagues of the seven angels were fulfilled.

 

No man can receive salvation during this time.  Unbelievers cannot be converted during this time.  No salvation offered. Too late, they missed the boat.

The temple has always been opened.  Salvation has been freely offered to all, but there is a cut off point, when the 7 angels come out to punish the world, no one can come to God during this time.

There is not one scripture that states any man will repent during this time, but the opposite, they will be cursing God.

 

Revelation 9:20   And the rest of the men which were not killed by these plagues yet repented not of the works of their hands, that they should not worship devils, and idols of gold, and silver, and brass, and stone, and of wood: which neither can see, nor hear, nor walk:

  Revelation 9:21   Neither repented they of their murders, nor of their sorceries, nor of their fornication, nor of their thefts.

  Revelation 16:9   And men were scorched with great heat, and blasphemed the name of God, which hath power over these plagues: and they repented not to give him glory.

  Revelation 16:11   And blasphemed the God of heaven because of their pains and their sores, and repented not of their deeds.

[iamlamad]

I see that bad interpretation of the 200 million locust army of Rev.9 those like Hal Lindsey put in his book The Late Great Planet Earth a long time ago, has many still fooled.

 

That is not the Armageddon army out of the northern quarters that's to come upon Israel on the last day of this world when our Lord Jesus returns. The Armageddon army is given in the Ezekiel 38 & 39 Scripture, specific nations that will come upon Israel on the last day. That nation alignment of Ezekiel is almost complete today.

 

The 200 million locust army of Rev.9 happens DURING the 6th Trumpet - 2nd Woe period, which is not the last day, but instead is the great tribulation timing when the dragon reigns for 42 months. That 6th trumpet - 2nd woe period is the timing of God's two witnesses prophesying in Jerusalem for 1260 days. The killing of the 1/3 in Rev.9 is about a spiritual killing to the soul by deception to the coming Antichrist/false messiah who will play Christ in Jerusalem for the end of this world.

Salty, please try to find this theory in ANY commentary written at any time. lI suspect it is a theory held only by YOU.

 

¹⁸ By these three was the third part of men killed, by the fire, and by the smoke, and by the brimstone, which issued out of their mouths.

¹⁹ For their power is in their mouth, and in their tails: for their tails were like unto serpents, and had heads, and with them they do hurt.

²⁰ And the rest of the men which were not killed by these plagues yet repented not of the works of their hands, that they should not worship devils, and idols of gold, and silver, and brass, and stone, and of wood: which neither can see, nor hear, nor walk:

²¹ Neither repented they of their murders, nor of their sorceries, nor of their fornication, nor of their thefts.

 

This is very simply language, and the words make perfect sense in their literal sense. Trying to make they say something different is nonsense. This is very clearly PHYSICAL death. Notice that it is the REST of the people that did not repent. Those that died could not repent, for they were DEAD.

 

LAMAD

[Sister]

That's strange;  all my life I have heard that the days of great tribulation - greater than at any time on earth ever - will be the Beast and False prophet with their mark and image, forcing all in the world to accept the mark. And to make it even worse, NO ONE can buy or sell without the mark. Since one of the vials turns all the fresh water to blood, there will be NO WATER to drink, so thirst will be terrible for those who refuse the mark. So what makes these days "great tribulation?" It is the great PRESSURE put upon people to take the mark.

 

 

You are right Lamad. 

As soon as the Mark is enforced, it will be great tribulation for everyone.  The saints being persecuted by the false prophet with the world on his side,

by starving them, being made homeless, treated as outcasts, wrongly accused, killed, inprisoned,

and then the world experience their tribulation from God, for taking part and sharing in Babylon's sins, and for what they did to the saints, and for all the ungodly acts they committed in their lifetime.

They will be tormented even worse.  Double.

It is going to be a very sorrowful time,

but only the saints get the happy ending.

[iamlamad]

 

Sister, there will be SO MANY that will make it to heaven during the days of great tribulation. Every one who refuses the Mark and loses hsis or her head will make it to heaven, if they do this for their belief in Jesu.

I agree with you here.  All those who die for Christ's sake will have their places reserved in heaven. 

 

 

Where do you find the door closed once the trumpets begin?

 

After the saints are persecuted.

Revelation 15:8   And the temple was filled with smoke from the glory of God, and from his power; and no man was able to enter into the temple, till the seven plagues of the seven angels were fulfilled.

 

No man can receive salvation during this time.  Unbelievers cannot be converted during this time.  No salvation offered. Too late, they missed the boat.

The temple has always been opened.  Salvation has been freely offered to all, but there is a cut off point, when the 7 angels come out to punish the world, no one can come to God during this time.

There is not one scripture that states any man will repent during this time, but the opposite, they will be cursing God.

 

Revelation 9:20   And the rest of the men which were not killed by these plagues yet repented not of the works of their hands, that they should not worship devils, and idols of gold, and silver, and brass, and stone, and of wood: which neither can see, nor hear, nor walk:

  Revelation 9:21   Neither repented they of their murders, nor of their sorceries, nor of their fornication, nor of their thefts.

  Revelation 16:9   And men were scorched with great heat, and blasphemed the name of God, which hath power over these plagues: and they repented not to give him glory.

  Revelation 16:11   And blasphemed the God of heaven because of their pains and their sores, and repented not of their deeds.

 

Why don't you just take this in the literal sense in which it is written? The literal sense is that NO HUMAN BEING will be allowed into the temple IN HEAVEN until the vials are completed. This has nothing at all to do with salvation on earth.Without a doubt saints on earth will still be being put to death, and they will certainly be escorted to heaven when they die - they will just not be allowed into the temple in heaven.

 

LAMAD

[Montana Marv]

I see that bad interpretation of the 200 million locust army of Rev.9 those like Hal Lindsey put in his book The Late Great Planet Earth a long time ago, has many still fooled.

 

That is not the Armageddon army out of the northern quarters that's to come upon Israel on the last day of this world when our Lord Jesus returns. The Armageddon army is given in the Ezekiel 38 & 39 Scripture, specific nations that will come upon Israel on the last day. That nation alignment of Ezekiel is almost complete today.

 

The 200 million locust army of Rev.9 happens DURING the 6th Trumpet - 2nd Woe period, which is not the last day, but instead is the great tribulation timing when the dragon reigns for 42 months. That 6th trumpet - 2nd woe period is the timing of God's two witnesses prophesying in Jerusalem for 1260 days. The killing of the 1/3 in Rev.9 is about a spiritual killing to the soul by deception to the coming Antichrist/false messiah who will play Christ in Jerusalem for the end of this world.

Salty

 

Read the Scripture;  Rev 9:17 - 19  - The horses and their riders I saw in my vision looked like this...  The heads of the horses looked like this...  The power of the horses was in their mouths and in their tails. Absolutely nothing about locust here. Rev 16:12 - The sixth angel poured out his bowl on the river Euphrates, and its water was dried up to prepare the way for the kings of the East.

 

The soul cannot be killed.

 

This 200 Million is part of the Armageddon army.  Daniel 11:40-45 - At the time of the end the kings of the South will engage him in battle, the king of the North will storm out against him with chariots and cavalry and a great fleet of ships.  He will invade many countries and sweep through them like a flood.  He will also invade the Beautiful Land.  Many countries will fall, But Edom, Moab and the leaders Ammon will be delivered from his hand. (Hmm, this is where Israel is to flee to)... But reports from the East (200 Million) and North will alarm him.  Europe is his army.

 

In Christ

Montana Marv