Christ's Perfection

[Sevenseas]

 The entire reason that God sent His Son, was because no other sacrifice could meet the requirements of God who is holy.  No half deity...no half and half of anything.

 

God required a perfect sacrifice...the entire OT system of sacrifices was only a temporary 'fix' until God Himself provided the sacrifice He required.

 

As such, there is no possible interpretation that leaves even the smallest bit of room for diminishing the deity of Jesus Christ.  To assume or say that Christ left part of His

deity in heaven, is to put forward a poor understanding of the reason God sent His only Son in the first place.

 

Where was the part of Christ's deity kept?  In a chest?  In another form?  As an angel?  The Bible puts no such teaching forward and truth be told, I have never heard

anything like what you are attempting to convey Mr Nice.

 

What you propose does remind me of Mormon or even Jehovah Witness doctrines: both of these cults go out of their way to diminish who Christ actually is and they

both handily deny the Biblical teaching that Christ was both fully God and fully man.  

 

Jesus said that He and His Father are ONE...which is what made the religious leaders so angry....they wanted to kill Him because He put Himself on the same level

as God, which they considered blasphemy.  

 

 

 

 

What scripture do you use to declare that Christ was fully God and fully man in the flesh, this hypostatic union?

 

 

Here are two references for you which declare what Jesus said about Himself:

 

 

Then came the Festival of Dedication^b at Jerusalem. It was winter, 23and Jesus was in the temple courts walking in Solomon’s Colonnade. 24The Jews who were there gathered around him, saying, “How long will you keep us in suspense? If you are the Messiah, tell us plainly.”

25Jesus answered, “I did tell you, but you do not believe. The works I do in my Father’s name testify about me, 26but you do not believe because you are not my sheep. 27My sheep listen to my voice; I know them, and they follow me. 28I give them eternal life, and they shall never perish; no one will snatch them out of my hand. 29My Father, who has given them to me, is greater than all^c ; no one can snatch them out of my Father’s hand. 30I and the Father are one.”

 

Further, Jesus also referred to Himself by the same name God revealed Himself to Moses as :  I AM

 

Jesus replied, “If I glorify myself, my glory means nothing. My Father, whom you claim as your God, is the one who glorifies me. 55Though you do not know him, I know him. If I said I did not, I would be a liar like you, but I do know him and obey his word. 56Your father Abraham rejoiced at the thought of seeing my day; he saw it and was glad.”

57“You are not yet fifty years old,” they said to him, “and you have seen Abraham!”

58“Very truly I tell you,” Jesus answered, “before Abraham was born, I am!” 59At this, they picked up stones to stone him, but Jesus hid himself, slipping away from the temple grounds.

 

Jesus referred to Himself in the present tense as being constant, that is, no beginning or end...Abraham was born, yet Jesus says HE IS...I don't know if you can grasp

that or not considering what you believe, but that is the truth of it

 

So, while you, Mr Nice, insist that Jesus left part of Himself behind....doing what or in what form who knows....Jesus actually refers to Himself as fully God...made of

the same substance and equal to and calls Himself by the same name...while on earth...fully God and fully man.

 

I don't expect you to accept these passages.  

[Kan]

Shiloh and MrNice, 

 

Your arguments may be coming from a misunderstanding of each others posts, due to language etc. I'm not sure.

Sometimes you both argue not knowing you both agree and other times...?

 

Terminology may have something to do with it. Different ways of saying it. 

 

I am worried that people will be turned off a valuable subject, actually more than one subject.

 

I think there are several topics in here, all related of course, but which may need to be addressed in sequence, or one at a time?

 

The nature of Divinity, human nature, sinful nature, the definition of temptation and propensities to sin, the nature of Christ in humanity, the definition of perfection, etc.

 

It is very difficult to support any subject without knowing all of them because they are intrinsically related, hence the sermons in each post - Mr Nice.

 

I am eager to hear what succinct points you can both agree on, perhaps if you established that, the details would iron themselves out?

[Kan]

As God, Jesus could not leave any of Himself behind, He was always fully God, but as God He could also subject Himself to a human existence in full, and not in part, and yet remain fully God. Jesus said that He had the power to lay down His life and take it up again. Humans can't do that, but in order to die as a man Christ as God must allow His humanity to die, and be in it while dying. This proves that Jesus was never a victim to His circumstances, but that at every step in His life He subjected Himself fully to the abuses and hardships of this life, in a manner that no man had ever endured. He was tempted in all points, not just a few bad habits like we experience. His life was one of intense suffering which we probably will never know.

Always fully God, always subject to a complete and honest human existence. Only an honest God would and could do that.

 

When Christ performed miracles through His Divinity, it did not violate His dependence as a human being on the Father, because, as Sevenseas pointed out, He was one in purpose and will with the Father.

 

An error which is sometimes entertained, is that because Christ was God, He was not tempted as we are. The answer is simple, He laid aside His Divinity, remaining fully human until death. Yet at any time He could have left earth, and be done with sinners, only a passionate love for humanity and the desire of God kept Him true to the plan.

[Mr Nice]

 The entire reason that God sent His Son, was because no other sacrifice could meet the requirements of God who is holy.  No half deity...no half and half of anything.

 

God required a perfect sacrifice...the entire OT system of sacrifices was only a temporary 'fix' until God Himself provided the sacrifice He required.

 

As such, there is no possible interpretation that leaves even the smallest bit of room for diminishing the deity of Jesus Christ.  To assume or say that Christ left part of His

deity in heaven, is to put forward a poor understanding of the reason God sent His only Son in the first place.

 

Where was the part of Christ's deity kept?  In a chest?  In another form?  As an angel?  The Bible puts no such teaching forward and truth be told, I have never heard

anything like what you are attempting to convey Mr Nice.

 

What you propose does remind me of Mormon or even Jehovah Witness doctrines: both of these cults go out of their way to diminish who Christ actually is and they

both handily deny the Biblical teaching that Christ was both fully God and fully man.  

 

Jesus said that He and His Father are ONE...which is what made the religious leaders so angry....they wanted to kill Him because He put Himself on the same level

as God, which they considered blasphemy.  

 

 

 

 

What scripture do you use to declare that Christ was fully God and fully man in the flesh, this hypostatic union?

 

 

Here are two references for you which declare what Jesus said about Himself:

 

 

Then came the Festival of Dedication^b at Jerusalem. It was winter, 23and Jesus was in the temple courts walking in Solomon’s Colonnade. 24The Jews who were there gathered around him, saying, “How long will you keep us in suspense? If you are the Messiah, tell us plainly.”

25Jesus answered, “I did tell you, but you do not believe. The works I do in my Father’s name testify about me, 26but you do not believe because you are not my sheep. 27My sheep listen to my voice; I know them, and they follow me. 28I give them eternal life, and they shall never perish; no one will snatch them out of my hand. 29My Father, who has given them to me, is greater than all^c ; no one can snatch them out of my Father’s hand. 30I and the Father are one.”

 

Further, Jesus also referred to Himself by the same name God revealed Himself to Moses as :  I AM

 

Jesus replied, “If I glorify myself, my glory means nothing. My Father, whom you claim as your God, is the one who glorifies me. 55Though you do not know him, I know him. If I said I did not, I would be a liar like you, but I do know him and obey his word. 56Your father Abraham rejoiced at the thought of seeing my day; he saw it and was glad.”

57“You are not yet fifty years old,” they said to him, “and you have seen Abraham!”

58“Very truly I tell you,” Jesus answered, “before Abraham was born, I am!” 59At this, they picked up stones to stone him, but Jesus hid himself, slipping away from the temple grounds.

 

Jesus referred to Himself in the present tense as being constant, that is, no beginning or end...Abraham was born, yet Jesus says HE IS...I don't know if you can grasp

that or not considering what you believe, but that is the truth of it

 

So, while you, Mr Nice, insist that Jesus left part of Himself behind....doing what or in what form who knows....Jesus actually refers to Himself as fully God...made of

the same substance and equal to and calls Himself by the same name...while on earth...fully God and fully man.

 

I don't expect you to accept these passages.  

 

First, I do agree that Jesus has always been and I have never stated otherwise, so please don't claim I have because that is bearing false witness.  God did provide the sacrifice.  The sacrifice was not in the form of God but man.  Why? Christ had to come in the flesh to be made the faithful high priest, learning obedience through the things He suffered, in order to be the perfect sacrifice.  As deity, Christ did not fit the mold God had planned which is why God sent Him to earth in the flesh.  Christ was perfected in the flesh.  This is the connection you are missing.  I am diminishing nothing of His deity but only representing God's plan from the beginning.  As I have previously stated, man was created as a completely faithful seed but we chose to turn from God.  Christ was sent to this earth in the same fashion, but lived the life we were created to live as a servant of God.  Christ did this in the flesh demonstrating God’s plan for us and to show how we also can be one with the Father.

 

If Christ considered Himself as fully God, why refer only to His Father as the One who is good?

 

Mar 10:17-18  As He was setting out on a journey, a man ran up to Him and knelt before Him, and asked Him, "Good Teacher, what shall I do to inherit eternal life?"  (18)  And Jesus said to him, "Why do you call Me good? No one is good except God alone.

 

If He is fully God why does He claim to be seeking the glory of God and not His own glory?  If they are one and the same then there is no separation between them so the glory would also be His own.  But this is not what He states.

Joh 8:49-50  Jesus answered, "I do not have a demon; but I honor My Father, and you dishonor Me.  (50)  "But I do not seek My glory; there is One who seeks and judges.

 

If equality with God was something for Christ to grasp why does He keep saying all He did was what the Father commanded?  Would He not be commanding Himself?

Joh 12:48-50  "He who rejects Me and does not receive My sayings, has one who judges him; the word I spoke is what will judge him at the last day.  (49)  "For I did not speak on My own initiative, but the Father Himself who sent Me has given Me a commandment as to what to say and what to speak.  (50)  "I know that His commandment is eternal life; therefore the things I speak, I speak just as the Father has told Me."

Joh 14:10-11  "Do you not believe that I am in the Father, and the Father is in Me? The words that I say to you I do not speak on My own initiative, but the Father abiding in Me does His works.  (11)  "Believe Me that I am in the Father and the Father is in Me; otherwise believe because of the works themselves.

 

Jesus continues to explain why He and His Father are one, abiding in each other, and declares that God will abide in us.  Christ Himself also stated that the Father was greater than He was further explaining why equality with God was not something He thought could be grasped.

 

Joh 14:20-28  "In that day you will know that I am in My Father, and you in Me, and I in you.  (21)  "He who has My commandments and keeps them is the one who loves Me; and he who loves Me will be loved by My Father, and I will love him and will disclose Myself to him."  (22)  Judas (not Iscariot) *said to Him, "Lord, what then has happened that You are going to disclose Yourself to us and not to the world?"  (23)  Jesus answered and said to him, "If anyone loves Me, he will keep My word; and My Father will love him, and We will come to him and make Our abode with him.  (24)  "He who does not love Me does not keep My words; and the word which you hear is not Mine, but the Father's who sent Me.  (25)  "These things I have spoken to you while abiding with you.  (26)  "But the Helper, the Holy Spirit, whom the Father will send in My name, He will teach you all things, and bring to your remembrance all that I said to you.  (27)  "Peace I leave with you; My peace I give to you; not as the world gives do I give to you. Do not let your heart be troubled, nor let it be fearful.  (28)  "You heard that I said to you, 'I go away, and I will come to you.' If you loved Me, you would have rejoiced because I go to the Father, for the Father is greater than I.

 

Joh 15:4-10  "Abide in Me, and I in you. As the branch cannot bear fruit of itself unless it abides in the vine, so neither can you unless you abide in Me.  (5)  "I am the vine, you are the branches; he who abides in Me and I in him, he bears much fruit, for apart from Me you can do nothing.  (6)  "If anyone does not abide in Me, he is thrown away as a branch and dries up; and they gather them, and cast them into the fire and they are burned.  (7)  "If you abide in Me, and My words abide in you, ask whatever you wish, and it will be done for you.  (8)  "My Father is glorified by this, that you bear much fruit, and so prove to be My disciples.  (9)  "Just as the Father has loved Me, I have also loved you; abide in My love.  (10)  "If you keep My commandments, you will abide in My love; just as I have kept My Father's commandments and abide in His love.

 

Jesus also refers to God as the only true God and sets himself apart from God declaring further the inequality.  Everything that the Father has is His and likewise all the Son has is the Father’s but this is not equality.  His glory He left in heaven when He came to earth.  This glory had to be returned to Him.  God gave Christ glory, there is a separation.  These are Christ’s words not mine.

 

Joh 17:3-5  "This is eternal life, that they may know You, the only true God, and Jesus Christ whom You have sent.  (4)  "I glorified You on the earth, having accomplished the work which You have given Me to do.  (5)  "Now, Father, glorify Me together with Yourself, with the glory which I had with You before the world was.

 

Joh 17:24  "Father, I desire that they also, whom You have given Me, be with Me where I am, so that they may see My glory which You have given Me, for You loved Me before the foundation of the world.

 

When Christ says “before Abraham was born, I am”, He is speaking of having been since the beginning, before the foundation of the world.  It is in reference to time, not in equality of name with God.  He is not saying His name is I AM as God did to Moses in the burning bush.  Moses asked what he should call God, whereas the Jews were arguing about Christ’s age and not about His name. 

 

Let us look at the rest of the passage where Christ said the “I and the Father are one”.

Joh 10:30-38  "I and the Father are one."  (31)  The Jews picked up stones again to stone Him.  (32)  Jesus answered them, "I showed you many good works from the Father; for which of them are you stoning Me?"  (33)  The Jews answered Him, "For a good work we do not stone You, but for blasphemy; and because You, being a man, make Yourself out to be God."  (34)  Jesus answered them, "Has it not been written in your Law, 'I SAID, YOU ARE GODS'?  (35)  "If he called them gods, to whom the word of God came (and the Scripture cannot be broken),  (36)  do you say of Him, whom the Father sanctified and sent into the world, 'You are blaspheming,' because I said, 'I am the Son of God'?  (37)  "If I do not do the works of My Father, do not believe Me;  (38)  but if I do them, though you do not believe Me, believe the works, so that you may know and understand that the Father is in Me, and I in the Father."

 

Christ addressed their misunderstanding of what He stated which is why he phrased the question the way He did.   "I showed you many good works from the Father; for which of them are you stoning Me?"  He then quickly corrected them of their wrongful thoughts reminding them of what the scriptures said about those to whom the word of God came, that they are gods (yes I am sure this is where the Mormons get their beliefs, not understanding it was about oneness).  They were gods because they were the children of God.  Christ and the Father are one because the Father is in Him and He is in the Father, because Christ is doing that which the Father commanded Him. 

Finally, being “one” is about unity, not of being one in the same person, equality, etc.  For Christ’s desire is that those who are His may be one with Him and the Father just as he and the Father are one.

 

Joh 17:20-23  "I do not ask on behalf of these alone, but for those also who believe in Me through their word;  (21)  that they may all be one; even as You, Father, are in Me and I in You, that they also may be in Us, so that the world may believe that You sent Me.  (22)  "The glory which You have given Me I have given to them, that they may be one, just as We are one;  (23)  I in them and You in Me, that they may be perfected in unity, so that the world may know that You sent Me, and loved them, even as You have loved Me.

 

1Jn 2:20-27  But you have an anointing from the Holy One, and you all know.  (21)  I have not written to you because you do not know the truth, but because you do know it, and because no lie is of the truth.  (22)  Who is the liar but the one who denies that Jesus is the Christ? This is the antichrist, the one who denies the Father and the Son.  (23)  Whoever denies the Son does not have the Father; the one who confesses the Son has the Father also.  (24)  As for you, let that abide in you which you heard from the beginning. If what you heard from the beginning abides in you, you also will abide in the Son and in the Father.  (25)  This is the promise which He Himself made to us: eternal life.  (26)  These things I have written to you concerning those who are trying to deceive you.  (27)  As for you, the anointing which you received from Him abides in you, and you have no need for anyone to teach you; but as His anointing teaches you about all things, and is true and is not a lie, and just as it has taught you, you abide in Him. (28)  Now, little children, abide in Him, so that when He appears, we may have confidence and not shrink away from Him in shame at His coming.

 

We are to be one with God through our obedience and love of the Father just like Christ claimed He is one with God through His love and obedience to the Father.

[Mr Nice]

As God, Jesus could not leave any of Himself behind, He was always fully God, but as God He could also subject Himself to a human existence in full, and not in part, and yet remain fully God. Jesus said that He had the power to lay down His life and take it up again. Humans can't do that, but in order to die as a man Christ as God must allow His humanity to die, and be in it while dying. This proves that Jesus was never a victim to His circumstances, but that at every step in His life He subjected Himself fully to the abuses and hardships of this life, in a manner that no man had ever endured. He was tempted in all points, not just a few bad habits like we experience. His life was one of intense suffering which we probably will never know.

Always fully God, always subject to a complete and honest human existence. Only an honest God would and could do that.

 

When Christ performed miracles through His Divinity, it did not violate His dependence as a human being on the Father, because, as Sevenseas pointed out, He was one in purpose and will with the Father.

 

An error which is sometimes entertained, is that because Christ was God, He was not tempted as we are. The answer is simple, He laid aside His Divinity, remaining fully human until death. Yet at any time He could have left earth, and be done with sinners, only a passionate love for humanity and the desire of God kept Him true to the plan.

 

First, if Christ is God, then nothing is impossible for Him.  If this is the case, then why do you want to claim He could not leave part of Himself (His Glory) in heaven with the Father?  As I pointed out in my response to Sevenseas, Christ asked God to glorify Him with the glory He had in the beginning, meaning He did not have this glory while on earth in the flesh.  He also declared the Father was greater than Himself.  There was an inequality with God of some type.

 

I agree as a man He suffered through everything the Bible declares.  I believe Christ died, not just His humanity.  The Son of God died for us and God raised Him from the dead.  If Christ Himself did not die, if it was only His flesh, then God did not make a sacrifice for us.  This is the great price that God paid for us, just like Abraham was willing to offer his son as a sacrifice.  God stopped Abraham but He did not stop Himself from offering His own Son.  Christ went willingly to the cross obeying His Father's commands.

 

You say only an honest God would and could do what Christ did.  The Bible says that serving God alone was never out of man's reach but we have chosen not to obey Him.  I am sure this is not a commonly held belief, but it is what the Bible says.  God has never demanded more than what we are capable of handling.  His command has always been LOVE.  He sent His Son to earth to demonstrate how to live the way we were created to live.  He gave us a bonus, the Holy Spirit, so that we would absolutely have no excuse for not obeying Him.  Christ walked according to the Spirit to demonstrate how to love God.

 

Deu 30:9-11  "Then the LORD your God will prosper you abundantly in all the work of your hand, in the offspring of your body and in the offspring of your cattle and in the produce of your ground, for the LORD will again rejoice over you for good, just as He rejoiced over your fathers;  (10)  if you obey the LORD your God to keep His commandments and His statutes which are written in this book of the law, if you turn to the LORD your God with all your heart and soul.  (11)  "For this commandment which I command you today is not too difficult for you, nor is it out of reach.

 

1Co 10:13  No temptation has overtaken you but such as is common to man; and God is faithful, who will not allow you to be tempted beyond what you are able, but with the temptation will provide the way of escape also, so that you will be able to endure it.

 

Christ used none of His divinity while on the earth.  This is probably the greatest difference between what we believe. Christ said the Father did the works through Him.  Christ was the agent, but not the power behind the works.  He also said those believed in Him would do even greater works, this they did through the Spirit.

 

Joh 14:10-12  "Do you not believe that I am in the Father, and the Father is in Me? The words that I say to you I do not speak on My own initiative, but the Father abiding in Me does His works.  (11)  "Believe Me that I am in the Father and the Father is in Me; otherwise believe because of the works themselves.  (12)  "Truly, truly, I say to you, he who believes in Me, the works that I do, he will do also; and greater works than these he will do; because I go to the Father.

 

Act 2:22  "Men of Israel, listen to these words: Jesus the Nazarene, a man attested to you by God with miracles and wonders and signs which God performed through Him in your midst, just as you yourselves know--

 

Likewise it was through the Spirit that He overcame temptation, presenting Himself without blemish to God.

 

Heb 9:13-14  For if the blood of goats and bulls and the ashes of a heifer sprinkling those who have been defiled sanctify for the cleansing of the flesh,  (14)  how much more will the blood of Christ, who through the eternal Spirit offered Himself without blemish to God, cleanse your conscience from dead works to serve the living God?

 

It was the Father who could save Him from the hour and who could let the cup pass from Him.  As you say in your last paragraph, He did lay aside His divinity so that He could go through what we go through with respect to temptation.

 

Joh 12:27  "Now My soul has become troubled; and what shall I say, 'Father, save Me from this hour'? But for this purpose I came to this hour.

 

Mat 26:38-42  Then He *said to them, "My soul is deeply grieved, to the point of death; remain here and keep watch with Me."  (39)  And He went a little beyond them, and fell on His face and prayed, saying, "My Father, if it is possible, let this cup pass from Me; yet not as I will, but as You will."  (40)  And He *came to the disciples and *found them sleeping, and *said to Peter, "So, you men could not keep watch with Me for one hour?  (41)  "Keep watching and praying that you may not enter into temptation; the spirit is willing, but the flesh is weak."  (42)  He went away again a second time and prayed, saying, "My Father, if this cannot pass away unless I drink it, Your will be done."

 

Summary

·   Christ was before the world began.

·   Christ is the Son of God and was given glory by God in the beginning, John 17:24.

·   Man was created in Their image as a completely faithful seed that turned from God,             Genesis 1:26 and Jeremiah 2:21.

·   Because man would not turn to serve the living God, He sent His Son to earth in the            flesh just as we are in the flesh and He remained a completely faithful seed.

  o Christ left His glory/divinity in heaven with the Father because He had to be just like              us, so that He could become our faithful high priest and the perfect sacrifice for our              sins, by learning obedience through the things he suffered, Hebrews.

    o He was sent to turn us from our wicked ways, Acts 3:26, and to show us how to be              perfect as our father in heaven is perfect, leaving us an example of what it means                to love as God loves, 1 Peter 2:21-25.  His life on earth was the exact representation            of God’s nature and He is the radiance of God’s glory, Hebrews 1:1-4.

    o Christ died for us.  He died while we were yet sinners, while we were still helpless,              Romans 5:6-8.  He died to grant us repentance from and forgiveness of our sins,                  Acts 5:30-32, and to free us from the bondage of sin, Romans 6:4-7.

    o Christ died and was raised by the power of God, Acts 2:24.

    o He returned to the Father (being fully glorified/exalted by the Father again as He was            in the beginning), John 17:5, Acts 5:30-32.

·   He sent the Holy Spirit, the Helper, to those who obey Him, Acts 5:32.  We walk in                newness of life, Romans 6:3-10, and of the Spirit, Romans 7:6, because we are no              longer helpless.

     o We are given His Spirit so we can live like Christ, being led by the Spirit we do not               fulfill the desires of the flesh; therefore we are not under the Law because we are                 producing the fruit of the Spirit, Galatians 5:16-18, 22-23.

  o Because we are slaves of obedience through sanctification of the Spirit, we are made          righteous with the outcome of eternal life, Romans 6:16-22, and because we walk                according to the Spirit the righteous requirement of the Law is fulfilled for us by Christ,          Romans 8:1-4.

  o Therefore, since we keep His Word, we become one with Him like Christ is one with            the Father, John 17:20-23, having His love perfected in us, 1 John 2:3-6.

·   Now, Christ is waiting for the day when He will come again to take those who show their      love for Him and the Father, through obedience to His commands by the guidance of          the Holy Spirit.

[Guest shiloh357]

There is nothing in the Bible that says that Jesus left part of His Godhood in heaven.   The Bible says that He left the glory of His deity, but it does not say He left his deity in whole or in part.  He surrendered some of the privileges of deity but He did not leave part of His deity in heaven.   To  say that He did is heresy.  

 

No matter how long and drawn out your posts are, and no matter how much you drone on and on, you are, at the end of the day, a false teacher and all TRUE Christians should steer clear of what you are proclaiming.

[Kan]

Yes, I believe the scriptures teach what you are basically saying that God became flesh. When I say that the Son of God laid aside His Divinity, I mean laid aside. Something only He as God could do. I do not believe that Christ pretended to be flesh but became it, so that He could die for us. It is a mystery.

You mentioned the glory He asked for which He had in the beginning. I understand that glory to be the oneness He had because He was equal with the Father, but as a human being He had limitations as we do. Some people understand that glory, as something to do with a physical richness, which does not predominate my thinking about "glory."

[Kan]

When the man called Jesus good, the answer of Jesus was no one is good but God, He was saying that He was God because He was good. Only He could say that. This does not diminish His oneness with humanity at all.

[Kan]

There is nothing in the Bible that says that Jesus left part of His Godhood in heaven.   The Bible says that He left the glory of His deity, but it does not say He left his deity in whole or in part.  He surrendered some of the privileges of deity but He did not leave part of His deity in heaven.   To  say that He did is heresy.  

 

No matter how long and drawn out your posts are, and no matter how much you drone on and on, you are, at the end of the day, a false teacher and all TRUE Christians should steer clear of what you are proclaiming.

I would like to hear from him to see what he means by "leaving a part of Deity behind." It's one of those terms which has more than one aspect of thought, and I don't want to dismiss him as a heretic just yet, because the issue of the nature of Christ on earth, is central to the gospel, and a prime target of the devil. I John 4:3. 

[Guest shiloh357]

He has already explained what he means and he did it numerous times.  Go back through the thread.  He doesn't believe that Jesus was fully God on earth.   Mr. Nice believes that we are expected to never sin even once after salvation and if you sin a single time, you lose your salvation. 

 

That speaks to how he views Jesus.   If Jesus was sinless because he was fully God, that is not something we can attain, but if Jesus wasn't fully God, if Jesus left deity in whole or in part, then the locus of Jesus' sinlessness was in His humanity, not His deity.  That plays into his view that if you sin just one time, it means you have lost your salvation and that you didn't overcome sin. 

 

It is a false Gospel and a heresy on the nature of Christ.