ayin jade Posted March 6, 2015 Group: Worthy Ministers Followers: 44 Topic Count: 6,178 Topics Per Day: 0.87 Content Count: 43,799 Content Per Day: 6.19 Reputation: 11,244 Days Won: 58 Joined: 01/03/2005 Status: Offline Author Share Posted March 6, 2015 I know what the "right" things to say are, and what we as Christians are told we should say, but I am not going to live in a naïve, fantasy world for the sake of saying the "right" things. Do you read what you write? Do you really not see how this sounds? You are basically saying that living the life Christ wants us to live is a naive fantasy world. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest shiloh357 Posted March 6, 2015 Share Posted March 6, 2015 No, what I am saying is that when Jesus was talking about loving our enemies, it was not meant to be at the expense of commonsense and moral responsibility. Again, I am not saying that the Church should take up arms and fight ISIS. But at the same time, I don't believe is sitting around thinking that at some point in the future ISIS is going to experience some kind of revival and get suddenly get saved. Furthermore, Jesus was addressing personal relationships and how we face persecution for our faith. He was not addressing how a nation responds to a serious and existential threat to our security like ISIS presents. It is safe to say that ISIS isn't going to stop until they are destroyed, and the US destroys them there, or we have to fight them in our streets where we will not have a military advantage due to the fact that we won't be able to use artillery, armor, bombers and missiles in the middle of Main Street. I am praying for God's judgment to fall on them and destroy them because unless that happens, they are going to keep getting bigger and bigger and until they can take over an Arab country and end up with planes and even more American made weapons that we have sold Arab nations. At the end of the day, someone is going to die and it is either us or them. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JustinM Posted March 6, 2015 Group: Royal Member Followers: 4 Topic Count: 144 Topics Per Day: 0.02 Content Count: 4,512 Content Per Day: 0.68 Reputation: 625 Days Won: 10 Joined: 04/11/2006 Status: Offline Birthday: 10/07/1979 Share Posted March 6, 2015 Why would anyone expect members of ISIS to convert to Christianity right now? They believe allah is on their side and that they are winning because of him. If their faith continues to be reaffirmed by their successes, they will never turn to Christ. Praying for our persecuted brothers, sisters and the children. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ayin jade Posted March 6, 2015 Group: Worthy Ministers Followers: 44 Topic Count: 6,178 Topics Per Day: 0.87 Content Count: 43,799 Content Per Day: 6.19 Reputation: 11,244 Days Won: 58 Joined: 01/03/2005 Status: Offline Author Share Posted March 6, 2015 Why would anyone expect members of ISIS to convert to Christianity right now? They believe allah is on their side and that they are winning because of him. If their faith continues to be reaffirmed by their successes, they will never turn to Christ. Praying for our persecuted brothers, sisters and the children. Why expect anyone to convert? Why expect paul to have converted when he was winning against Christians and felt he had God on his side? Thing is, people can convert. One can pray isis is stopped and one can pray they get saved without comments that come across as hatred or that dismiss the Christian words that sound too "sunday school". Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest shiloh357 Posted March 6, 2015 Share Posted March 6, 2015 Well barring an Damascus road conversion, ISIS will have to be destroyed. If that miracle happens, great. But I am not going to be to presumptuous about it happening. Right now hundreds and even thousands of fellow believers are being beheaded and crucified and our government is doing nothing about it. Again, I see nothing wrong with praying for God's judgment to fall on them, 'cause they are not going to get saved. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hall7 Posted March 7, 2015 Group: Diamond Member Followers: 2 Topic Count: 75 Topics Per Day: 0.02 Content Count: 1,385 Content Per Day: 0.31 Reputation: 491 Days Won: 5 Joined: 04/25/2012 Status: Offline Share Posted March 7, 2015 Shiloh... 9 With the tongue we praise our Lord and Father, and with it we curse human beings, who have been made in God’s likeness. 10 Out of the same mouth come praise and cursing. My brothers and sisters, this should not be. 11 Can both fresh water and salt water flow from the same spring? 12 My brothers and sisters, can a fig tree bear olives, or a grapevine bear figs? Neither can a salt spring produce fresh water. James 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hippie333 Posted March 7, 2015 Group: Royal Member Followers: 15 Topic Count: 114 Topics Per Day: 0.03 Content Count: 1,236 Content Per Day: 0.29 Reputation: 673 Days Won: 1 Joined: 10/24/2012 Status: Offline Birthday: 12/18/1970 Share Posted March 7, 2015 Well barring an Damascus road conversion, ISIS will have to be destroyed. If that miracle happens, great. But I am not going to be to presumptuous about it happening. Right now hundreds and even thousands of fellow believers are being beheaded and crucified and our government is doing nothing about it. Again, I see nothing wrong with praying for God's judgment to fall on them, 'cause they are not going to get saved. 'cause they are not going to get saved. and I am curious as to how "you" know who will and won't become saved? I am not looking for debate here Shiloh, only an attempt to get you to notice something that I and others have noticed lately. You are very knowledgeable and a good man, I admire many things about you brother....but in the past few months, you have been letting ( for lack of a better terminology and explanation) fear and anger over these groups undermine seasoning what you say with grace and love. That's all....I just wanted to bring that to your attention, nothing personal or anything...I just have been noticing some changes in your posts and wording in the past few months, and hoped that in review you will notice them as well. Love ya man! God Bless, Hip Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ayin jade Posted March 7, 2015 Group: Worthy Ministers Followers: 44 Topic Count: 6,178 Topics Per Day: 0.87 Content Count: 43,799 Content Per Day: 6.19 Reputation: 11,244 Days Won: 58 Joined: 01/03/2005 Status: Offline Author Share Posted March 7, 2015 I agree with what hippie said. I can understand the anger. Im angry too at the hate and murders that isis and any terrorist is committing. BUT I cant give in to the flesh and hate them too. Jesus died for them as well. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest shiloh357 Posted March 7, 2015 Share Posted March 7, 2015 I have faith, but I also have commonsense. There isn't going to be some revival among ISIS and I think it is pretty save to say that.. There are people who are so irretrievably wicked that even God says He hates them (Ps. 5:5). If God isn't going to save them, then I pray that He judges and destroys them. That's not out of line with anything in the Bible. Psalms 7, 35, 55, 58, 59, 79, 109, 137, and 139 contain prayers of imprecation. Imprecation refers to invocation of God's justice and judgment against His enemies and it is consistent with a biblical worldview. And those Scriptures are just as relevant to the Christian as any other part of the Bible (though you will almost never hear a sermon drawn from many of those texts). Jesus' teachings about loving and praying for our enemies had to do with how to hold up under persecution and with personal relationships. To apply this to existential threats like ISIS is a misapplication of that teaching. Jesus was not telling the US government to love their enemies. He was not addressing how a nation or government addresses threats like ISIS and other terrorists groups. God is still a God of justice and judgment and I see nothing wrong with asking God to judge ISIS. If every member of ISIS gets saved and they start the First Baptist Church of Mosul, Iraq, that's great. But I am a realist. I look at the situation for what it is and I am not going to pretend that there is any realistic hope for this group of terrorists. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ayin jade Posted March 7, 2015 Group: Worthy Ministers Followers: 44 Topic Count: 6,178 Topics Per Day: 0.87 Content Count: 43,799 Content Per Day: 6.19 Reputation: 11,244 Days Won: 58 Joined: 01/03/2005 Status: Offline Author Share Posted March 7, 2015 When 9/11 happened, I was crushed by what happened. I still havent looked at the list of the dead. I likely knew someone in the twin towers that day since I grew up on long island. So once we knew it was muslim terrorists that killed so many, I started to pray for their destruction. With a vengeance. That didnt go over well with the Lord. He let me know right away in my first prayer that I needed to change my prayer. He showed me that I should pray first for their salvation, and then pray that they are stopped. Not destroyed. Just stopped from causing harm. Ever been chastised by the Lord in prayer? Its not pretty. I felt pretty silly. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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