His Ambassador Posted April 22, 2015 Group: Advanced Member Followers: 2 Topic Count: 1 Topics Per Day: 0.00 Content Count: 295 Content Per Day: 0.04 Reputation: 60 Days Won: 0 Joined: 11/19/2005 Status: Offline Birthday: 04/26/1932 Share Posted April 22, 2015 The saints are not in paradise. They were in paradise, but they were taken to heaven. They were in paradise until the resurrection. Jesus went to paradise and preached there and then the saints were taken to heaven. Hell remains in the heart of the earth. The Bible tells us to be absent from the body is to be present with the Lord. The Lord is not in paradise. He is at the right hand of the Father in heaven. Remember Stephen's vision in Acts? New Jerusalem is the eternal home of the saints. It will come down from heaven at the end of the millennial reign of Christ. WE are the saints and we are still on the Earth. The saints who died before us are indeed in Paradise just as the thief on the cross. There are no saints in Heaven or anyplace else. Paradise is the holding place for the righteous dead just as Hades is the holding place for the lost dead. All will be assigned their proper place on Judgement Day. Most visions in the New Testament (especially Johns) are future-tense. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted April 23, 2015 Share Posted April 23, 2015 The saints are not in paradise. They were in paradise, but they were taken to heaven. They were in paradise until the resurrection. Jesus went to paradise and preached there and then the saints were taken to heaven. Hell remains in the heart of the earth. The Bible tells us to be absent from the body is to be present with the Lord. The Lord is not in paradise. He is at the right hand of the Father in heaven. Remember Stephen's vision in Acts? New Jerusalem is the eternal home of the saints. It will come down from heaven at the end of the millennial reign of Christ. Amen~! God is our refuge and strength, a very present help in trouble. Therefore will not we fear, though the earth be removed, and though the mountains be carried into the midst of the sea; Though the waters thereof roar and be troubled, though the mountains shake with the swelling thereof. Selah. There is a river, the streams whereof shall make glad the city of God, the holy place of the tabernacles of the most High. God is in the midst of her; she shall not be moved: God shall help her, and that right early. Psalms 46:1-5 And Amen~! And he shewed me a pure river of water of life, clear as crystal, proceeding out of the throne of God and of the Lamb. In the midst of the street of it, and on either side of the river, was there the tree of life, which bare twelve manner of fruits, and yielded her fruit every month: and the leaves of the tree were for the healing of the nations. And there shall be no more curse: but the throne of God and of the Lamb shall be in it; and his servants shall serve him: And they shall see his face; and his name shall be in their foreheads. And there shall be no night there; and they need no candle, neither light of the sun; for the Lord God giveth them light: and they shall reign for ever and ever. Revelation 22:1-5 WE are the saints and we are still on the Earth. The saints who died before us are indeed in Paradise just as the thief on the cross. There are no saints in Heaven or anyplace else. Paradise is the holding place for the righteous dead just as Hades is the holding place for the lost dead. All will be assigned their proper place on Judgement Day. Most visions in the New Testament (especially Johns) are future-tense. ~ To Be With Therefore we are always confident and know that as long as we are at home in the body we are away from the Lord. For we live by faith, not by sight. We are confident, I say, and would prefer to be away from the body and at home with the Lord. 2 Corinthians 5:6-8 (NIV) Him For since we believe that Jesus died and was raised to life again, we also believe that when Jesus returns, God will bring back with him the believers who have died. 1 Thessalonians 4:14 (NIT) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Raven Posted April 25, 2015 Group: Advanced Member Followers: 4 Topic Count: 15 Topics Per Day: 0.00 Content Count: 395 Content Per Day: 0.12 Reputation: 319 Days Won: 0 Joined: 04/20/2015 Status: Offline Share Posted April 25, 2015 Different interpretations of what we will have in heaven.I don't think we will have literal mansions. KJV John 14 :2-3 2 In my Father's house are many mansions: if it were not so, I would have told you. I go to prepare a place for you. 3 And if I go and prepare a place for you, I will come again, and receive you unto myself; that where I am, there ye may be also. NASB John 14:2-3 In My Father’s house are many dwelling places; if it were not so, I would have told you; for I go to prepare a place for you. 3 If I go and prepare a place for you, I will come again and receive you to Myself, that where I am,there you may be also. NIV John 14:2-3 My Father’s house has many rooms; if that were not so, would I have told you that I am going there to prepare a place for you? 3 And if I go and prepare a place for you, I will come back and take you to be with me that you also may be where I am. I see that God's house is everything, existence, including what we do not see and/or comprehend. In God's house are many realms, of various dimensionalities, including the one we are in now (a combination of four dimensions). Jesus is referring to a realm where our spiritual selves can co-exist with Him. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
His Ambassador Posted April 25, 2015 Group: Advanced Member Followers: 2 Topic Count: 1 Topics Per Day: 0.00 Content Count: 295 Content Per Day: 0.04 Reputation: 60 Days Won: 0 Joined: 11/19/2005 Status: Offline Birthday: 04/26/1932 Share Posted April 25, 2015 Different interpretations of what we will have in heaven.I don't think we will have literal mansions. KJV John 14 :2-3 2 In my Father's house are many mansions: if it were not so, I would have told you. I go to prepare a place for you. 3 And if I go and prepare a place for you, I will come again, and receive you unto myself; that where I am, there ye may be also. NASB John 14:2-3 In My Father’s house are many dwelling places; if it were not so, I would have told you; for I go to prepare a place for you. 3 If I go and prepare a place for you, I will come again and receive you to Myself, that where I am,there you may be also. NIV John 14:2-3 My Father’s house has many rooms; if that were not so, would I have told you that I am going there to prepare a place for you? 3 And if I go and prepare a place for you, I will come back and take you to be with me that you also may be where I am. I see that God's house is everything, existence, including what we do not see and/or comprehend. In God's house are many realms, of various dimensionalities, including the one we are in now (a combination of four dimensions). Jesus is referring to a realm where our spiritual selves can co-exist with Him. Read the last part of Rev. 20 and the first part of 21 if you want to know where we will spend eternity. It's NOT in Heaven. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Raven Posted April 25, 2015 Group: Advanced Member Followers: 4 Topic Count: 15 Topics Per Day: 0.00 Content Count: 395 Content Per Day: 0.12 Reputation: 319 Days Won: 0 Joined: 04/20/2015 Status: Offline Share Posted April 25, 2015 Read the last part of Rev. 20 and the first part of 21 if you want to know where we will spend eternity. It's NOT in Heaven. Hello His Ambassador. Rev 21:1 Then I saw a new heaven and a new earth, for the first heaven and the first earth had passed away, and there was no longer any sea. Could not the new heaven be a new sky, stars, galaxies, and universe. And the new earth be a new place in a new realm. The first heaven and earth had passed away... Could this not mean our old realm no longer exists but replaced by another realm suited for our finer, softer, delicate (eternal) spiritual selves. The reference to 'eternity', as far as I understand the word, means everlasting. The Alpha and the Omega, both start and end of time, refers to timelessness. Could there not be a realm (mansion) that does not include the dimension of time. Our current realm is trapped and perishable due to time, for all things will pass. The realm of everlasting life is not set be time, it is the Alpha and Omega (God). The new realm, the New Jerusalem, cannot be described by language because linguistics is defined by time. The biblical description of the New Jerusalem is our way of transferring the knowing from our spirit-mind to the knowledge/logic of the body-mind. The New Jerusalem description contains all the good and valued concepts, from this realm, to symbolize value of what cannot be described; for the spiritual realm it is not of this world. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Floatingaxe Posted April 25, 2015 Group: Royal Member Followers: 3 Topic Count: 62 Topics Per Day: 0.01 Content Count: 9,613 Content Per Day: 1.45 Reputation: 656 Days Won: 9 Joined: 03/11/2006 Status: Offline Birthday: 05/31/1952 Share Posted April 25, 2015 The saints are not in paradise. They were in paradise, but they were taken to heaven. They were in paradise until the resurrection. Jesus went to paradise and preached there and then the saints were taken to heaven. Hell remains in the heart of the earth. The Bible tells us to be absent from the body is to be present with the Lord. The Lord is not in paradise. He is at the right hand of the Father in heaven. Remember Stephen's vision in Acts? New Jerusalem is the eternal home of the saints. It will come down from heaven at the end of the millennial reign of Christ. WE are the saints and we are still on the Earth. The saints who died before us are indeed in Paradise just as the thief on the cross. There are no saints in Heaven or anyplace else. Paradise is the holding place for the righteous dead just as Hades is the holding place for the lost dead. All will be assigned their proper place on Judgement Day. Most visions in the New Testament (especially Johns) are future-tense. All saints are now in heaven with Jesus, the dwelling place of the Father. Paradise, or Abraham's Bosom, the place where OT saints who had died went to await their Messiah, is now empty. Hades is where the dead outside of Christ are now, awaiting Judgment. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Floatingaxe Posted April 25, 2015 Group: Royal Member Followers: 3 Topic Count: 62 Topics Per Day: 0.01 Content Count: 9,613 Content Per Day: 1.45 Reputation: 656 Days Won: 9 Joined: 03/11/2006 Status: Offline Birthday: 05/31/1952 Share Posted April 25, 2015 I would like to say I'm surprised this conversation has gone on this long but I'm really not because I know we have trouble letting go of our fairy tales. As I told you in my previous post if you want to know where we will spend Eternity read the last part of Rev. 20 and the first part of 21. That makes it clear that our eternal home is NOT Heaven. Yes, our eternal home is here, and the City of God, the New Jerusalem, will descend to earth, and suspend above it, and God will dwell with us (we will already be here, having been ruling with Jesus for 1000 years). In the meantime all saints who have died are with Him there. There is no other place for the redeemed, but with God. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
His Ambassador Posted April 26, 2015 Group: Advanced Member Followers: 2 Topic Count: 1 Topics Per Day: 0.00 Content Count: 295 Content Per Day: 0.04 Reputation: 60 Days Won: 0 Joined: 11/19/2005 Status: Offline Birthday: 04/26/1932 Share Posted April 26, 2015 Read the last part of Rev. 20 and the first part of 21 if you want to know where we will spend eternity. It's NOT in Heaven. Hello His Ambassador. Rev 21:1 Then I saw a new heaven and a new earth, for the first heaven and the first earth had passed away, and there was no longer any sea. Could not the new heaven be a new sky, stars, galaxies, and universe. And the new earth be a new place in a new realm. The first heaven and earth had passed away... Could this not mean our old realm no longer exists but replaced by another realm suited for our finer, softer, delicate (eternal) spiritual selves. The reference to 'eternity', as far as I understand the word, means everlasting. The Alpha and the Omega, both start and end of time, refers to timelessness. Could there not be a realm (mansion) that does not include the dimension of time. Our current realm is trapped and perishable due to time, for all things will pass. The realm of everlasting life is not set be time, it is the Alpha and Omega (God). The new realm, the New Jerusalem, cannot be described by language because linguistics is defined by time. The biblical description of the New Jerusalem is our way of transferring the knowing from our spirit-mind to the knowledge/logic of the body-mind. The New Jerusalem description contains all the good and valued concepts, from this realm, to symbolize value of what cannot be described; for the spiritual realm it is not of this world. The New Earth means a new ball in the new heavens (space) with no seas for us to live on eternally. Yes "new heavens" mean space as we know it. I do not believe there will be any time in eternity. The New Jerusalem is Jesus' headquarters which comes down out of Heaven but the Bible does not say anything about it landing on the New Earth. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
His Ambassador Posted April 26, 2015 Group: Advanced Member Followers: 2 Topic Count: 1 Topics Per Day: 0.00 Content Count: 295 Content Per Day: 0.04 Reputation: 60 Days Won: 0 Joined: 11/19/2005 Status: Offline Birthday: 04/26/1932 Share Posted April 26, 2015 The saints are not in paradise. They were in paradise, but they were taken to heaven. They were in paradise until the resurrection. Jesus went to paradise and preached there and then the saints were taken to heaven. Hell remains in the heart of the earth. The Bible tells us to be absent from the body is to be present with the Lord. The Lord is not in paradise. He is at the right hand of the Father in heaven. Remember Stephen's vision in Acts? New Jerusalem is the eternal home of the saints. It will come down from heaven at the end of the millennial reign of Christ. WE are the saints and we are still on the Earth. The saints who died before us are indeed in Paradise just as the thief on the cross. There are no saints in Heaven or anyplace else. Paradise is the holding place for the righteous dead just as Hades is the holding place for the lost dead. All will be assigned their proper place on Judgement Day. Most visions in the New Testament (especially Johns) are future-tense. All saints are now in heaven with Jesus, the dwelling place of the Father. Paradise, or Abraham's Bosom, the place where OT saints who had died went to await their Messiah, is now empty. Hades is where the dead outside of Christ are now, awaiting Judgment. There are no saints in heaven. The saints will live on the New Earth. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Raven Posted April 26, 2015 Group: Advanced Member Followers: 4 Topic Count: 15 Topics Per Day: 0.00 Content Count: 395 Content Per Day: 0.12 Reputation: 319 Days Won: 0 Joined: 04/20/2015 Status: Offline Share Posted April 26, 2015 Read the last part of Rev. 20 and the first part of 21 if you want to know where we will spend eternity. It's NOT in Heaven. Hello His Ambassador. Rev 21:1 Then I saw a new heaven and a new earth, for the first heaven and the first earth had passed away, and there was no longer any sea. Could not the new heaven be a new sky, stars, galaxies, and universe. And the new earth be a new place in a new realm. The first heaven and earth had passed away... Could this not mean our old realm no longer exists but replaced by another realm suited for our finer, softer, delicate (eternal) spiritual selves. The reference to 'eternity', as far as I understand the word, means everlasting. The Alpha and the Omega, both start and end of time, refers to timelessness. Could there not be a realm (mansion) that does not include the dimension of time. Our current realm is trapped and perishable due to time, for all things will pass. The realm of everlasting life is not set be time, it is the Alpha and Omega (God). The new realm, the New Jerusalem, cannot be described by language because linguistics is defined by time. The biblical description of the New Jerusalem is our way of transferring the knowing from our spirit-mind to the knowledge/logic of the body-mind. The New Jerusalem description contains all the good and valued concepts, from this realm, to symbolize value of what cannot be described; for the spiritual realm it is not of this world. The New Earth means a new ball in the new heavens (space) with no seas for us to live on eternally. Yes "new heavens" mean space as we know it. I do not believe there will be any time in eternity. The New Jerusalem is Jesus' headquarters which comes down out of Heaven but the Bible does not say anything about it landing on the New Earth. A new Earth would point to a new planet of sorts. But a new earth points to a new ground. Maybe your reference to a New Jerusalem not landing on the New Earth, is that of another post. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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