Questions about the pope and the Catholic faith

[thereselittleflower]

I just got a couple questions I was hoping someone could answer for me. I am not trying to bash anything and I pray this stays rooted in the word of God. I developed these questions watching all the coverage of the pope's visit to the US.

 

1. Is it just me or does it bother anyone else when the pope is called the Holy father? How is it not blaspheme to call the pope the Holy father?

2. What is with the robes and the hat's that the Catholic priests seem to wear? Also, likewise,

3. Where do they get rituals from the do, like swinging that smoking censer or what ever it was. Maybe it is me, but everything in there services seemed to be a rip off of God's commands to the Jews in the Old testament but done badly. 

 

Am I off base with this? Am i missing anything? Everything I saw about the pope's titles , the church services, all of it bothered me. It just seemed wrong, and I'm not even sure I can explain why other than the Holy father thing.

firestormx, let me start with a question, 

why do you think it is blasphemous to call the pope  holy father?

 

Because there is only one HOLY Father and he is in heaven.

So are christians not holy?

Are we not commanded to be holy?    

1 Peter 1:

A Call to Be Holy
…15but like the Holy One who called you, be holy yourselves also in all your behavior;16because it is written, "YOU SHALL BE HOLY, FOR I AM HOLY." 17If you address as Father the One who impartially judges according to each one's work, conduct yourselves in fear during the time of your stay on earth;

 

 

Since all chrsitians are holy and to be holy, and since he, like Paul, like Peter, is a spiritual father to those he shepherds, there is nothing unbiblical or blasphemous about calling him holy father.

 

 

[firestormx]

I just got a couple questions I was hoping someone could answer for me. I am not trying to bash anything and I pray this stays rooted in the word of God. I developed these questions watching all the coverage of the pope's visit to the US.

 

1. Is it just me or does it bother anyone else when the pope is called the Holy father? How is it not blaspheme to call the pope the Holy father?

2. What is with the robes and the hat's that the Catholic priests seem to wear? Also, likewise,

3. Where do they get rituals from the do, like swinging that smoking censer or what ever it was. Maybe it is me, but everything in there services seemed to be a rip off of God's commands to the Jews in the Old testament but done badly. 

 

Am I off base with this? Am i missing anything? Everything I saw about the pope's titles , the church services, all of it bothered me. It just seemed wrong, and I'm not even sure I can explain why other than the Holy father thing.

firestormx, let me start with a question, 

why do you think it is blasphemous to call the pope  holy father?

 

Because there is only one HOLY Father and he is in heaven.

So are christians not holy?

Are we not commanded to be holy?    

Since all chrsitians are holy and to be holy, and since he, like Paul, like Peter, is a spiritual father to those he shepherds, there is nothing unbiblical or blasphemous about calling him holy father.

I respect your opinion but I disagree with you. It's like saying The Holy Spirit. We have a spirit. Because of Jesus we are Holy, But we don't say WE are the Holy Spirit. For there  is one Holy Spirit , there is one Lord Jesus Christ, and there is one Holy God the Father. The pope is not the Holy Father creator of heaven and earth and that is what calling a man that the holy father claims. To me it claims he is the Living God and that is why it is blaspheme to me. 

Edited September 29, 2015 by firestormx

[thereselittleflower]

I just got a couple questions I was hoping someone could answer for me. I am not trying to bash anything and I pray this stays rooted in the word of God. I developed these questions watching all the coverage of the pope's visit to the US.

 

1. Is it just me or does it bother anyone else when the pope is called the Holy father? How is it not blaspheme to call the pope the Holy father?

2. What is with the robes and the hat's that the Catholic priests seem to wear? Also, likewise,

3. Where do they get rituals from the do, like swinging that smoking censer or what ever it was. Maybe it is me, but everything in there services seemed to be a rip off of God's commands to the Jews in the Old testament but done badly. 

 

Am I off base with this? Am i missing anything? Everything I saw about the pope's titles , the church services, all of it bothered me. It just seemed wrong, and I'm not even sure I can explain why other than the Holy father thing.

firestormx, let me start with a question, 

why do you think it is blasphemous to call the pope  holy father?

 

Because there is only one HOLY Father and he is in heaven.

So are christians not holy?

Are we not commanded to be holy?    

Since all chrsitians are holy and to be holy, and since he, like Paul, like Peter, is a spiritual father to those he shepherds, there is nothing unbiblical or blasphemous about calling him holy father.

I respect your opinion but I disagree with you. It's like saying The Holy Spirit. We have a spirit. Because of Jesus we are Holy, But we don't say WE are the Holy Spirit. For there  is one Holy Spirit , there is one Lord Jesus Christ, and there is one Holy God the Father. The pope is not the Holy Father creator of heaven and earth and that is what calling a man that the holy father claims. To me it claims he is the Living God and that is why it is blaspheme to me. 

Are you called holy by God?

 

[firestormx]

I just got a couple questions I was hoping someone could answer for me. I am not trying to bash anything and I pray this stays rooted in the word of God. I developed these questions watching all the coverage of the pope's visit to the US.

 

1. Is it just me or does it bother anyone else when the pope is called the Holy father? How is it not blaspheme to call the pope the Holy father?

2. What is with the robes and the hat's that the Catholic priests seem to wear? Also, likewise,

3. Where do they get rituals from the do, like swinging that smoking censer or what ever it was. Maybe it is me, but everything in there services seemed to be a rip off of God's commands to the Jews in the Old testament but done badly. 

 

Am I off base with this? Am i missing anything? Everything I saw about the pope's titles , the church services, all of it bothered me. It just seemed wrong, and I'm not even sure I can explain why other than the Holy father thing.

firestormx, let me start with a question, 

why do you think it is blasphemous to call the pope  holy father?

 

Because there is only one HOLY Father and he is in heaven.

So are christians not holy?

Are we not commanded to be holy?    

Since all chrsitians are holy and to be holy, and since he, like Paul, like Peter, is a spiritual father to those he shepherds, there is nothing unbiblical or blasphemous about calling him holy father.

I respect your opinion but I disagree with you. It's like saying The Holy Spirit. We have a spirit. Because of Jesus we are Holy, But we don't say WE are the Holy Spirit. For there  is one Holy Spirit , there is one Lord Jesus Christ, and there is one Holy God the Father. The pope is not the Holy Father creator of heaven and earth and that is what calling a man that the holy father claims. To me it claims he is the Living God and that is why it is blaspheme to me. 

Are you called holy by God?

 

irrelevant, I am not claiming to be the Holy Father creator of heaven and earth, the pope is every time he acknowledges that title.

[thereselittleflower]

I just got a couple questions I was hoping someone could answer for me. I am not trying to bash anything and I pray this stays rooted in the word of God. I developed these questions watching all the coverage of the pope's visit to the US.

 

1. Is it just me or does it bother anyone else when the pope is called the Holy father? How is it not blaspheme to call the pope the Holy father?

2. What is with the robes and the hat's that the Catholic priests seem to wear? Also, likewise,

3. Where do they get rituals from the do, like swinging that smoking censer or what ever it was. Maybe it is me, but everything in there services seemed to be a rip off of God's commands to the Jews in the Old testament but done badly. 

 

Am I off base with this? Am i missing anything? Everything I saw about the pope's titles , the church services, all of it bothered me. It just seemed wrong, and I'm not even sure I can explain why other than the Holy father thing.

firestormx, let me start with a question, 

why do you think it is blasphemous to call the pope  holy father?

 

Because there is only one HOLY Father and he is in heaven.

So are christians not holy?

Are we not commanded to be holy?    

Since all chrsitians are holy and to be holy, and since he, like Paul, like Peter, is a spiritual father to those he shepherds, there is nothing unbiblical or blasphemous about calling him holy father.

I respect your opinion but I disagree with you. It's like saying The Holy Spirit. We have a spirit. Because of Jesus we are Holy, But we don't say WE are the Holy Spirit. For there  is one Holy Spirit , there is one Lord Jesus Christ, and there is one Holy God the Father. The pope is not the Holy Father creator of heaven and earth and that is what calling a man that the holy father claims. To me it claims he is the Living God and that is why it is blaspheme to me. 

Are you called holy by God?

 

irrelevant, I am not claiming to be the Holy Father creator of heaven and earth, the pope is every time he acknowledges that title.

It's completely relevant.

You're not a shepherd with a flock in your care

but you are a chrsitian, and as a christian you are called holy by God, are you not?

I think that you understand the logic but don't want to admit what I am saying is logical.  

A shepherd of the flock of christ is rightly called a "father" as we see done in scripture.

Such a shepherd is also a christian, and so is called holy by God.

One who is a chrstian is rightly called holy by God; and one who is also a shepherd of God's flock is rightly called "father" as we have seen in scripture above.  This means it is logically correct to call a person who is both  "holy father."

 

This is a matter of logic and reason, and God never asks us to put our logic and reason on the shelf.  He says  "Come, let us reason together."

Denying the logic of all this does not make it disappear.

 

 

 

[firestormx]

I just got a couple questions I was hoping someone could answer for me. I am not trying to bash anything and I pray this stays rooted in the word of God. I developed these questions watching all the coverage of the pope's visit to the US.

 

1. Is it just me or does it bother anyone else when the pope is called the Holy father? How is it not blaspheme to call the pope the Holy father?

2. What is with the robes and the hat's that the Catholic priests seem to wear? Also, likewise,

3. Where do they get rituals from the do, like swinging that smoking censer or what ever it was. Maybe it is me, but everything in there services seemed to be a rip off of God's commands to the Jews in the Old testament but done badly. 

 

Am I off base with this? Am i missing anything? Everything I saw about the pope's titles , the church services, all of it bothered me. It just seemed wrong, and I'm not even sure I can explain why other than the Holy father thing.

firestormx, let me start with a question, 

why do you think it is blasphemous to call the pope  holy father?

 

Because there is only one HOLY Father and he is in heaven.

So are christians not holy?

Are we not commanded to be holy?    

Since all chrsitians are holy and to be holy, and since he, like Paul, like Peter, is a spiritual father to those he shepherds, there is nothing unbiblical or blasphemous about calling him holy father.

I respect your opinion but I disagree with you. It's like saying The Holy Spirit. We have a spirit. Because of Jesus we are Holy, But we don't say WE are the Holy Spirit. For there  is one Holy Spirit , there is one Lord Jesus Christ, and there is one Holy God the Father. The pope is not the Holy Father creator of heaven and earth and that is what calling a man that the holy father claims. To me it claims he is the Living God and that is why it is blaspheme to me. 

Are you called holy by God?

 

irrelevant, I am not claiming to be the Holy Father creator of heaven and earth, the pope is every time he acknowledges that title.

It's completely relevant.

You're not a shepherd with a flock in your care

but you are a chrsitian, and as a christian you are called holy by God, are you not?

I think that you understand the logic but don't want to admit what I am saying is logical.  

A shepherd of the flock of christ is rightly called a "father" as we see done in scripture.

Such a shepherd is also a christian, and so is called holy by God.

One who is a chrstian is rightly called holy by God; and one who is also a shepherd of God's flock is rightly called "father" as we have seen in scripture above.  This means it is logically correct to call a person who is both  "holy father."

 

This is a matter of logic and reason, and God never asks us to put our logic and reason on the shelf.  He says  "Come, let us reason together."

Denying the logic of all this does not make it disappear.

 

 

 

What is the proper understanding of the verse Matthew 23:9 that says , " call no man father on earth  ". Don't tell me what it doesn't mean like you did above, tell me what it does mean. I understand what you are saying. I just completely disagree. Everything in me cringes when I here a man, a lowly sinful man say he is the creator of heaven and earth, he is the one and only Holy Father. I thank you for your input, and your understanding of what your point of view is on this, I really do. But no man is worthy to make himself equal to God the Father ,except one who is, was , and always will be sinless, like Jesus Christ.

[thereselittleflower]

I just got a couple questions I was hoping someone could answer for me. I am not trying to bash anything and I pray this stays rooted in the word of God. I developed these questions watching all the coverage of the pope's visit to the US.

 

1. Is it just me or does it bother anyone else when the pope is called the Holy father? How is it not blaspheme to call the pope the Holy father?

2. What is with the robes and the hat's that the Catholic priests seem to wear? Also, likewise,

3. Where do they get rituals from the do, like swinging that smoking censer or what ever it was. Maybe it is me, but everything in there services seemed to be a rip off of God's commands to the Jews in the Old testament but done badly. 

 

Am I off base with this? Am i missing anything? Everything I saw about the pope's titles , the church services, all of it bothered me. It just seemed wrong, and I'm not even sure I can explain why other than the Holy father thing.

firestormx, let me start with a question, 

why do you think it is blasphemous to call the pope  holy father?

 

Because there is only one HOLY Father and he is in heaven.

So are christians not holy?

Are we not commanded to be holy?    

Since all chrsitians are holy and to be holy, and since he, like Paul, like Peter, is a spiritual father to those he shepherds, there is nothing unbiblical or blasphemous about calling him holy father.

I respect your opinion but I disagree with you. It's like saying The Holy Spirit. We have a spirit. Because of Jesus we are Holy, But we don't say WE are the Holy Spirit. For there  is one Holy Spirit , there is one Lord Jesus Christ, and there is one Holy God the Father. The pope is not the Holy Father creator of heaven and earth and that is what calling a man that the holy father claims. To me it claims he is the Living God and that is why it is blaspheme to me. 

Are you called holy by God?

 

irrelevant, I am not claiming to be the Holy Father creator of heaven and earth, the pope is every time he acknowledges that title.

It's completely relevant.

You're not a shepherd with a flock in your care

but you are a chrsitian, and as a christian you are called holy by God, are you not?

I think that you understand the logic but don't want to admit what I am saying is logical.  

A shepherd of the flock of christ is rightly called a "father" as we see done in scripture.

Such a shepherd is also a christian, and so is called holy by God.

One who is a chrstian is rightly called holy by God; and one who is also a shepherd of God's flock is rightly called "father" as we have seen in scripture above.  This means it is logically correct to call a person who is both  "holy father."

 

This is a matter of logic and reason, and God never asks us to put our logic and reason on the shelf.  He says  "Come, let us reason together."

Denying the logic of all this does not make it disappear.

 

 

 

What is the proper understanding of the verse Matthew 23:9 that says , " call no man father on earth  ". Don't tell me what it doesn't mean like you did above, tell me what it does mean. I understand what you are saying. I just completely disagree. Everything in me cringes when I here a man, a lowly sinful man say he is the creator of heaven and earth, he is the one and only Holy Father. I thank you for your input, and your understanding of what your point of view is on this, I really do. But no man is worthy to make himself equal to God the Father ,except one who is, was , and always will be sinless, like Jesus Christ.

 

I just got a couple questions I was hoping someone could answer for me. I am not trying to bash anything and I pray this stays rooted in the word of God. I developed these questions watching all the coverage of the pope's visit to the US.

 

1. Is it just me or does it bother anyone else when the pope is called the Holy father? How is it not blaspheme to call the pope the Holy father?

2. What is with the robes and the hat's that the Catholic priests seem to wear? Also, likewise,

3. Where do they get rituals from the do, like swinging that smoking censer or what ever it was. Maybe it is me, but everything in there services seemed to be a rip off of God's commands to the Jews in the Old testament but done badly. 

 

Am I off base with this? Am i missing anything? Everything I saw about the pope's titles , the church services, all of it bothered me. It just seemed wrong, and I'm not even sure I can explain why other than the Holy father thing.

firestormx, let me start with a question, 

why do you think it is blasphemous to call the pope  holy father?

 

Because there is only one HOLY Father and he is in heaven.

So are christians not holy?

Are we not commanded to be holy?    

Since all chrsitians are holy and to be holy, and since he, like Paul, like Peter, is a spiritual father to those he shepherds, there is nothing unbiblical or blasphemous about calling him holy father.

I respect your opinion but I disagree with you. It's like saying The Holy Spirit. We have a spirit. Because of Jesus we are Holy, But we don't say WE are the Holy Spirit. For there  is one Holy Spirit , there is one Lord Jesus Christ, and there is one Holy God the Father. The pope is not the Holy Father creator of heaven and earth and that is what calling a man that the holy father claims. To me it claims he is the Living God and that is why it is blaspheme to me. 

Are you called holy by God?

 

irrelevant, I am not claiming to be the Holy Father creator of heaven and earth, the pope is every time he acknowledges that title.

It's completely relevant.

You're not a shepherd with a flock in your care

but you are a chrsitian, and as a christian you are called holy by God, are you not?

I think that you understand the logic but don't want to admit what I am saying is logical.  

A shepherd of the flock of christ is rightly called a "father" as we see done in scripture.

Such a shepherd is also a christian, and so is called holy by God.

One who is a chrstian is rightly called holy by God; and one who is also a shepherd of God's flock is rightly called "father" as we have seen in scripture above.  This means it is logically correct to call a person who is both  "holy father."

 

This is a matter of logic and reason, and God never asks us to put our logic and reason on the shelf.  He says  "Come, let us reason together."

Denying the logic of all this does not make it disappear.

 

 

 

What is the proper understanding of the verse Matthew 23:9 that says , " call no man father on earth  ". Don't tell me what it doesn't mean like you did above, tell me what it does mean. I understand what you are saying. I just completely disagree. Everything in me cringes when I here a man, a lowly sinful man say he is the creator of heaven and earth, he is the one and only Holy Father. I thank you for your input, and your understanding of what your point of view is on this, I really do. But no man is worthy to make himself equal to God the Father ,except one who is, was , and always will be sinless, like Jesus Christ.

It's hyperbole

 - like Jesus telling us to pluck out our eyes or cut off our hands and feet if they cause us to sin.

Do you think he literally means to pluck out our eyes or cut off our hands or feet?

No.

He was there and here using a very common figure of speech used often in the middle east back then and today known as hyperbole.

What did Jesus mean by "call no man father"  ?

Jesus was pointing out the hypocrisy of the Pharisees and Teachers of the Law.  This is the context.   What precedes his words about call no man father is the context:

Matthew 23:6-7 

"And they love the place of honor at feasts and the best seats in the Synagogues, and salutations in the market places, and being called rabbi." 

So what Jesus was saying is don't be  hypocrites like the Pharisees and Teachers of the Law are.

 

And Jesus says towards the end of this discourse:

 11“But the greatest among you shall be your servant. 

 

And this is the essence of the Papacy - to be the servant of all the Church.   It doesn't make one equal to God, but is to make one the servant of all.

 

The phrase "holy father" does not make anyone equal to God.

I hope you see now this is where you are mistaken.   This is simply your bias speaking, your own sensibilities being projected onto what Catholics say.  

Please understand:  NO WAY does any Catholic mean or understand that calling the Pope "holy father" is making him equal with God.  Any Catholic would be horrified by such a suggestion.

It is really, really important one understand what the other means by the words they use and not wrongly impute them them an understanding that doesn't exist.

if Catholics meant what you think they mean by those words, I would be cringing inside too - probably harder than you!!  lol   

But Catholics don't mean that at all  - not even close!

 

 

 

 

 

Edited September 29, 2015 by thereselittleflower

[firestormx]

I just got a couple questions I was hoping someone could answer for me. I am not trying to bash anything and I pray this stays rooted in the word of God. I developed these questions watching all the coverage of the pope's visit to the US.

 

1. Is it just me or does it bother anyone else when the pope is called the Holy father? How is it not blaspheme to call the pope the Holy father?

2. What is with the robes and the hat's that the Catholic priests seem to wear? Also, likewise,

3. Where do they get rituals from the do, like swinging that smoking censer or what ever it was. Maybe it is me, but everything in there services seemed to be a rip off of God's commands to the Jews in the Old testament but done badly. 

 

Am I off base with this? Am i missing anything? Everything I saw about the pope's titles , the church services, all of it bothered me. It just seemed wrong, and I'm not even sure I can explain why other than the Holy father thing.

firestormx, let me start with a question, 

why do you think it is blasphemous to call the pope  holy father?

 

Because there is only one HOLY Father and he is in heaven.

 

The phrase "holy father" does not make anyone equal to God.

I hope you see now this is where you are mistaken.   This is simply your bias speaking, your own sensibilities being projected onto what Catholics say.  

Please understand:  NO WAY does any Catholic mean or understand that calling the Pope "holy father" is making him equal with God.  Any Catholic would be horrified by such a suggestion.

It is really, really important one understand what the other means by the words they use and not wrongly impute them them an understanding that doesn't exist.

if Catholics meant what you think they mean by those words, I would be cringing inside too - probably harder than you!!  lol   

But Catholics don't mean that at all  - not even close!

 

I think we are going to have to agree to disagree on this. I believe you are genuine in what you are saying ( you really believe what you are saying is correct ) , i just think your wrong. 

  I could never call a man Holy Father because to me the only one worthy of that title is God in heaven. When ever I hear that title I think of calling a man God the Father. I thank you for your understanding but I honestly believe that pope and the Catholic church believe he is equal to God. Look at the title Vicar of Christ for crying out loud. Everything about that title i have found says it means that the pope has the same authority as Jesus over the church here on earth. That is making the pope equal to God.  Thanks for the talk and the posts

[thereselittleflower]

 

 

The phrase "holy father" does not make anyone equal to God.

I hope you see now this is where you are mistaken.   This is simply your bias speaking, your own sensibilities being projected onto what Catholics say.  

Please understand:  NO WAY does any Catholic mean or understand that calling the Pope "holy father" is making him equal with God.  Any Catholic would be horrified by such a suggestion.

It is really, really important one understand what the other means by the words they use and not wrongly impute them them an understanding that doesn't exist.

if Catholics meant what you think they mean by those words, I would be cringing inside too - probably harder than you!!  lol   

But Catholics don't mean that at all  - not even close!

 

I think we are going to have to agree to disagree on this. I believe you are genuine in what you are saying ( you really believe what you are saying is correct ) , i just think your wrong. 

  I could never call a man Holy Father because to me the only one worthy of that title is God in heaven. When ever I hear that title I think of calling a man God the Father. I thank you for your understanding but I honestly believe that pope and the Catholic church believe he is equal to God. Look at the title Vicar of Christ for crying out loud. Everything about that title i have found says it means that the pope has the same authority as Jesus over the church here on earth. That is making the pope equal to God.  Thanks for the talk and the posts

Well you may honestly believe this, but that doesn't make your belief correct.  

No one in the Catholic Church believes he is equal to God.

I can explain the title Vicar of God if you like.   It harkens back to the Old Testament and the office of the Chief Steward in the Davidic Kingdom.  The Chierf Steward was essentially 2nd in command in the kingdom, so that when the king was absent, the Chief Steward ruled in his place, and his word was as though the king spoke. In the Old Testament there is a story where God removes one Chief Steward and installs a new one:

 

Isaiah 22

 15Thus says the Lord GOD of hosts,
            “Come, go to this steward,
            To Shebna, who is in charge of the royal household,

      16‘What right do you have here,
            And whom do you have here,
            That you have hewn a tomb for yourself here,
            You who hew a tomb on the height,
            You who carve a resting place for yourself in the rock?

      17‘Behold, the LORD is about to hurl you headlong, O man.
            And He is about to grasp you firmly

      18And roll you tightly like a ball,
            To be cast into a vast country;
            There you will die
            And there your splendid chariots will be,
            You shame of your master’s house.’

      19“I will depose you from your office,
            And I will pull you down from your station.

      20“Then it will come about in that day,
            That I will summon My servant Eliakim the son of Hilkiah,

      21And I will clothe him with your tunic
            And tie your sash securely about him.
            I will entrust him with your authority,
            And he will become a father to the inhabitants of Jerusalem and to the house of Judah.

      22“Then I will set the key of the house of David on his shoulder,
            When he opens no one will shut,
            When he shuts no one will open.

      23“I will drive him like a peg in a firm place,
            And he will become a throne of glory to his father’s house.

24“So they will hang on him all the glory of his father’s house, offspring and issue, all the least of vessels, from bowls to all the jars. 25“In that day,” declares the LORD of hosts, “the peg driven in a firm place will give way; it will even break off and fall, and the load hanging on it will be cut off, for the LORD has spoken.”

 

 

This was a well known story to all Jewish men.

Jesus uses it to tell Peter who Peter will be:

 

 

Matthew 16

Peter Confesses Jesus as the Christ

13 When Jesus came into the region of Caesarea Philippi, He asked His disciples, saying, “Who do men say that I, the Son of Man, am?”

14 So they said, “Some say John the Baptist, some Elijah, and others Jeremiah or one of the prophets.”

15 He said to them, “But who do you say that I am?”

16 Simon Peter answered and said, “You are the Christ, the Son of the living God.”

17 Jesus answered and said to him, “Blessed are you, Simon Bar-Jonah, for flesh and blood has not revealed this to you, but My Father who is in heaven.18 And I also say to you that you are Peter, and on this rock I will build My church, and the gates of Hades shall not prevail against it. 19 And I will give you the keys of the kingdom of heaven, and whatever you bind on earth will be bound in heaven, and whatever you loose on earth will be loosed[d] in heaven.”

20 Then He commanded His disciples that they should tell no one that He was Jesus the Christ.

 

Notice the parallels.   These were not lost on Peter and the disciples.  They instantly understood the parallel between what Jesus just said to Peter and what God said about Eliakim.    Peter had just told Jesus who Jesus is,  now Jesus tells Peter who Peter is an will be in His kingdom.  

In the New Covenant, in the Kingdom of heaven, Peter would occupy the same office that Eliakim occupied in the Davidic Kingdom.    

Other terms for this office of Chief Steward would be Majordomo, Prime Minister, Vicar.

So in calling the Pope the Vicar of God the Church is looking back to these words of Jesus which called forward the words of God in Isaiah and acknowledging the office of Chief Steward, Chief Shepherd, Majordomo, Prime Minister, Vicar, that Jesus picked Peter to fill in His kingdom, and yes it means he operates in that authority of the King, which is Jesus, in the governance of the Church in Jesus' absence.  But that does not make him equal to God.    But rather, in following the words of Jesus we were talking about earlier, the Vicar of Christ is to be the servant of all.

So, far from being something sinister, it is something Catholics see to be very grounded in scripture and the words of Christ.

 

 

Edited September 29, 2015 by thereselittleflower

[gdemoss]

So in Matthew 16 the disciples clearly understood that Peter would be second in command in the kingdom of heaven only second to the King which is Jesus but seemingly forgot all about that by Matthew 18 when they all began asking who is greatest?  That is illogical at best.  I am quite sure you have a logical way to explain your inconsistant beliefs away.  Just because something is logical doesn't make it true.