LeavesSeeds Posted June 4, 2016 Group: Advanced Member Followers: 1 Topic Count: 0 Topics Per Day: 0 Content Count: 187 Content Per Day: 0.06 Reputation: 152 Days Won: 0 Joined: 05/09/2016 Status: Offline Share Posted June 4, 2016 Okay, let's deal with this question below: (explain your claims later when you have time, if you can) 6 minutes ago, Joline said: I am talking to you! (1) Why should Jew's repent, it's everyone else's sin that caused their problems? They are keeping ORAL LAW. And the transfer of rituals etc. They have prayers to be holy these replace sacrifices etc. This isn't even about their consent in the Gospel for me. It is about them recognizing their sin. Then maybe they could see that Pharisaic notions will never be in line with repentance. Because they usurped the authority of the priesthood. (1) Answer: Jews should repent to be saved. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted June 4, 2016 Share Posted June 4, 2016 Just now, LeavesSeeds said: Okay, let's deal with this question below: (explain your claims later when you have time, if you can) (1) Answer: Jews should repent to be saved. answer, should Jew's repent to be saved? Do they need an atonement? How did Jew's exiled in punishment respond to their punishment? did they confess they had sinned and not kept his law? Did they return and build the temple? Or did they give the temple mount over to foreign rule? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LeavesSeeds Posted June 4, 2016 Group: Advanced Member Followers: 1 Topic Count: 0 Topics Per Day: 0 Content Count: 187 Content Per Day: 0.06 Reputation: 152 Days Won: 0 Joined: 05/09/2016 Status: Offline Share Posted June 4, 2016 The TITLE of this thread is WHY don't Jews accept Jesus as Messiah & Son of God ? As pointed out by several posters, WHY is because 'christendom' has from the early centuries DEPARTED from JESUS and from Scripture and the Jews have no reason to turn to Jesus if all they know is what 'christendom' has done and taught. 4 minutes ago, Joline said: why do you assume to speak for all Jews here? there are plenty of Jew's which are Catholic, Evangelical. Are you denying the fact that most Jewish Christians are not or have not been, and or remain in the Church? Most Messianic congregations have Gentiles in the majority. I would imagine that is why you all are here. Gentilesd have grown your movement not Jew's For pity sake this movement only began in the 70's. By far most Jews entered in by the Church. Even those Jew's which began this movement themselves were evangelized through the church Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted June 4, 2016 Share Posted June 4, 2016 2 minutes ago, LeavesSeeds said: The TITLE of this thread is WHY don't Jews accept Jesus as Messiah & Son of God ? As pointed out by several posters, WHY is because 'christendom' has from the early centuries DEPARTED from JESUS and from Scripture and the Jews have no reason to turn to Jesus if all they know is what 'christendom' has done and taught. This poster is pointing out her answer. It is because they believe what the sect of the Pharisees have passed down to them. And you all are giving them an excuse to continue in that Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LeavesSeeds Posted June 4, 2016 Group: Advanced Member Followers: 1 Topic Count: 0 Topics Per Day: 0 Content Count: 187 Content Per Day: 0.06 Reputation: 152 Days Won: 0 Joined: 05/09/2016 Status: Offline Share Posted June 4, 2016 Well.... (please go back soon and justify the CLAIMS you made earlier. ) 2 minutes ago, Joline said: (1) answer, should Jew's repent to be saved? Do they need an atonement? (2) How did Jew's exiled in punishment respond to their punishment? (3) did they confess they had sinned and not kept his law? (4)Did they return and build the temple? Or (5) did they give the temple mount over to foreign rule? (1) The answer was just posted before your post. (2) What difference does that make ? (3) What difference does that make today ? (4) What difference does that make today ? (5) What difference does that make today ? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LeavesSeeds Posted June 4, 2016 Group: Advanced Member Followers: 1 Topic Count: 0 Topics Per Day: 0 Content Count: 187 Content Per Day: 0.06 Reputation: 152 Days Won: 0 Joined: 05/09/2016 Status: Offline Share Posted June 4, 2016 Like earlier CLAIMS you made, this appears to be a FALSE CLAIM. Quote where you are getting it from . 3 minutes ago, Joline said: ......And you all are giving them an excuse to continue in that Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Esther4:14 Posted June 4, 2016 Group: Senior Member Followers: 0 Topic Count: 11 Topics Per Day: 0.00 Content Count: 603 Content Per Day: 0.19 Reputation: 628 Days Won: 1 Joined: 08/07/2015 Status: Offline Share Posted June 4, 2016 6 hours ago, LeavesSeeds said: The african americans and others like them / similar situations / were gentiles without Torah. They did not see nor have any common way to compare what others brought to them to see if it was or is true. The Jews have Torah, and could and did compare - and rejected that which was opposed to God's Word, and rightly so. What you are saying suggests that they have more reason to reject Christianity because of their lack of familiarity of the Torah. If their only representation of this new religion is stealing them from their country and letting them die as they take them to a different country where they will force them to work for nothing, separating them from their spouses and children, and beating them and abusing them for objecting to this treatment. I am not seeing this as the gentle banner of the Gospel message... So, you also seem to be saying that when the Jews use the Torah to rightly oppose the belief that accepting Christ constitutes idolatry because the law says, " Fear the LORD your God, serve him only and take your oaths in his name," (Deuteronomy 6:13); Again, the problem we are dealing with is more doctrinal than anything else and it might be better to recognize this and bring the Jewish people the message of the resurrection of Christ rather than expecting them to adopt what we know as the Trinity doctrine, which is opposed to most of the Old Testament outside of "let us make man in our image, " (Genesis 1:26). The Old Testament never gives an indication that the Messianic prophecy includes what we are familiar with as Trinity doctrine. In fact, the Old Testament is very clear that there is one God, only one! Therefore, it becomes a doctrinal subject of opposition with Judaism that would be easier to resolve with preaching the resurrection rather than expecting the Jewish people to adopt the whole quadrinity of the essence at the center of the Father, Son, and Holy Spirit. The Pharisees accepted the resurrection, they just didn't want to accept that His resurrection meant that He was fulfilling the prophecies spoken about Him through the prophets, and that this meant He was given greater authority than they had, and it is the resurrection that demonstrates who He is to begin with. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted June 4, 2016 Share Posted June 4, 2016 4 minutes ago, LeavesSeeds said: Well.... (please go back soon and justify the CLAIMS you made earlier. ) (1) The answer was just posted before your post. (2) What difference does that make ? (3) What difference does that make today ? (4) What difference does that make today ? (5) What difference does that make today ? Does Moses law change? Read the prophets and how they responded to exiles and punishment? Read the prophetic utterances of Moses law, and see their alternatives. You show me wher any of these sources blame the rulers which exiled them for their plight. There is such a thing as listening to neither Christ nor Moses. I fear that is what all this is. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest shiloh357 Posted June 4, 2016 Share Posted June 4, 2016 1 hour ago, Joline said: Thank you. And those of their disciples were they which the Church were dealing with.........................................No different than John the Baptist, Jesus or Paul. No, not at all. Don't just quote the part of what I said that you can twist. You are misrepresenting me. Judaism is not Pharisaism. While the Pharisees survived 70 AD, Pharisaism did not. That is the mistake you are making. Modern Orthodox Judaism is Kabbalistic. It is full of mysticism and occultic practices. Judaism is made up of many different groups that do not follow Orthodoxy. Conservative, Reformed, Reconstructionist, are other groups of Judaism that bear no resemblance to Pharisaism. Hasidism and traditional Orthodox are NOTHING like the ancient Pharisees. And Modern Judaism rejects Jesus based on the church's rejection of them. The church has made it clear that Jews are the killers of Christ, and has been at the forefront of Jewish persecution and anti-Semitism. To try and claim that modern Jews reject Jesus for the same reasons that they did in the first century and completely disregard nearly two millennia of persecution of Jews by the church only demonstrates that you don't squat about Judaism. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LeavesSeeds Posted June 4, 2016 Group: Advanced Member Followers: 1 Topic Count: 0 Topics Per Day: 0 Content Count: 187 Content Per Day: 0.06 Reputation: 152 Days Won: 0 Joined: 05/09/2016 Status: Offline Share Posted June 4, 2016 1 minute ago, Joline said: Does Moses law change? Read the prophets and how they responded to exiles and punishment? Read the prophetic utterances of Moses law, and see their alternatives. You show me wher any of these sources blame the rulers which exiled them for their plight. Why ? You haven't shown any of your CLAIMS (earlier, all clearly denoted). to be true yet. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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