Christians Losing Salvation

[Pudgenik]

If we are to look at the Bible as the inspired Word of God, and I do. Then we have to acknowledge also that Jesus had a hand in what was written and how it was orchestrated.

Jesus took His time with this teaching, a teaching of losing your place in heaven, and your salvation.

Not only do we hear it in Jesus own words, but we see it in the example of Judas Iscariot.

I'm sure you've heard the phrase "once saved always saved", it is a false teaching.

It is not by mere chance we hear about Judas.

-----------------------

When the Pharisees confront Jesus about the casting out of demons. Jesus replies with this, " every kingdom divided against itself is headed for ruin." He goes on with, "Now if Satan casts out Satan, he is divided against himself" "But if it is through the Spirit of God that I cast devils out, then know that the kingdom of God has overtaken you."

In Matthew, Jesus says, "many will say to me, 'Lord, Lord, did we not prophesy in your name, cast out demons in your name, work many miracles in your name?" Then I shall tell them to thier faces, I have never known you.

The key here is that this person had cast out demons. That he had to have been in the Lord to do it. 

There is also an example, in Acts, of a man who tried casting out a demon, without the Lord. And the demon throttled him. "The evil spirit replied, "Jesus I recognize, and I know who Paul is, but who are you".

------------------------

Now back with Judas Iscariot. 

The author (Jesus) makes it clear who we are talking about.

When Jesus sends the apostles off to the towns, He gives then the ability to cast out demons and heal people. Notice that Judas Iscariot's full name is used. 

The scripture states, "these are the names of the twelve."

His disciples, after they return rejoicing. Saying "Lord", even the devils submit to us when we use your name. Jesus responds by saying, "do not rejoice that the spirits submit to you; rejoice rather that your names are written in heaven."

So you see, Judas, had to have  the Lord in him, to cast out the devil. And this would have to take place before the devil entered him. 

Jesus said his name was written in Heaven.

It is what Judas chose to do afterwards. His evil was the choice he made.

Following the way of God, Jesus, comes from the heart. And it is an everyday, every second, choice.

 

[Neighbor]

 Jesus said to them, “I am the bread of life; whoever comes to me shall not hunger, and whoever believes in me shall never thirst. But I said to you that you have seen me and yet do not believe. All that the Father gives me will come to me, and whoever comes to me I will never cast out. For I have come down from heaven, not to do my own will but the will of him who sent me. And this is the will of him who sent me, that I should lose nothing of all that he has given me, but raise it up on the last day. For this is the will of my Father, that everyone who looks on the Son and believes in him should have eternal life, and I will raise him up on the last day.”

 

..." And he who searches hearts knows what is the mind of the Spirit, because the Spirit intercedes for the saints according to the will of God. And we know that for those who love God all things work together for good, for those who are called according to his purpose.  For those whom he foreknew he also predestined to be conformed to the image of his Son, in order that he might be the firstborn among many brothers.  And those whom he predestined he also called, and those whom he called he also justified, and those whom he justified he also glorified.

What then shall we say to these things? If God is for us, who can be against us? He who did not spare his own Son but gave him up for us all, how will he not also with him graciously give us all things? Who shall bring any charge against God's elect? It is God who justifies.  Who is to condemn? Christ Jesus is the one who died—more than that, who was raised—who is at the right hand of God, who indeed is interceding for us. Who shall separate us from the love of Christ? Shall tribulation, or distress, or persecution, or famine, or nakedness, or danger, or sword? As it is written,

“For your sake we are being killed all the day long;
    we are regarded as sheep to be slaughtered.”

No, in all these things we are more than conquerors through him who loved us. For I am sure that neither death nor life, nor angels nor rulers, nor things present nor things to come, nor powers, nor height nor depth, nor anything else in all creation, will be able to separate us from the love of God in Christ Jesus our Lord."

 

[Wayne222]

1 hour ago, Neighbor said:

 Jesus said to them, “I am the bread of life; whoever comes to me shall not hunger, and whoever believes in me shall never thirst. But I said to you that you have seen me and yet do not believe. All that the Father gives me will come to me, and whoever comes to me I will never cast out. For I have come down from heaven, not to do my own will but the will of him who sent me. And this is the will of him who sent me, that I should lose nothing of all that he has given me, but raise it up on the last day. For this is the will of my Father, that everyone who looks on the Son and believes in him should have eternal life, and I will raise him up on the last day.”

 

..." And he who searches hearts knows what is the mind of the Spirit, because the Spirit intercedes for the saints according to the will of God. And we know that for those who love God all things work together for good, for those who are called according to his purpose.  For those whom he foreknew he also predestined to be conformed to the image of his Son, in order that he might be the firstborn among many brothers.  And those whom he predestined he also called, and those whom he called he also justified, and those whom he justified he also glorified.

What then shall we say to these things? If God is for us, who can be against us? He who did not spare his own Son but gave him up for us all, how will he not also with him graciously give us all things? Who shall bring any charge against God's elect? It is God who justifies.  Who is to condemn? Christ Jesus is the one who died—more than that, who was raised—who is at the right hand of God, who indeed is interceding for us. Who shall separate us from the love of Christ? Shall tribulation, or distress, or persecution, or famine, or nakedness, or danger, or sword? As it is written,

“For your sake we are being killed all the day long;
    we are regarded as sheep to be slaughtered.”

No, in all these things we are more than conquerors through him who loved us. For I am sure that neither death nor life, nor angels nor rulers, nor things present nor things to come, nor powers, nor height nor depth, nor anything else in all creation, will be able to separate us from the love of God in Christ Jesus our Lord."

 

Yes The Lord will keep us. He will keep us. Our Lord Jesus will keep us. He who began a good work in us will finish it. He began a good work in us. Hw will finish it. He will notice it says he will finish it.

 

[frienduff thaylorde]

13 minutes ago, Wayne222 said:

Yes The Lord will keep us. He will keep us. Our Lord Jesus will keep us. He who began a good work in us will finish it. He began a good work in us. Hw will finish it. He will notice it says he will finish it.

 

So if I say that, yet tomorrow walk in sin and live like a devil.  GUESS I am still saved.   NO.

Be looking diligently lest any man FAIL OF.....................THE..............................GRACE OF GOD.

IT is HE WHO DOES WORK WIHTIN US, but its our DUTY to OBEY HIS SPIRIT.    many fall away.   JESUS Don't lie , wayne I know you know he don't.

But I also have never once given MYSELF any credit for MY SALVATION.  ITS ALWAYS BEEN GODS GRACE WORKING WITHIN ME.  but daily I have choice.

Do you think I don't get tempted by the evil flesh .     I Hope you don't think I am stupied enough to act as though I cant be tempted. WE ALL ARE

BUT  what we do WHEN the evil flesh pops its evil into our mind. IS ON US.   THE SPIRIT should scream ALERT , ALERT this is wicked , cease the thought.

Lest we have put the SPIRIT out that is.    IT always works that way with me.   Anytime that flesh starts to rise up ..........the SPIRIT IS RIGHT THEIR  TO WARN ME
 OH NO YA DONT.    we are servants to whom we obey.  BRING EVERY THOUGHT captive to the OBEDIANCE OF CHRIST , is not theory.   IT CAN BE DONE

we have the SPIRIT within us.   but many have quenched it and know not.    That is scary .     The holy spirit is ours if we are CHRISTS.

but many get hardend through the deceitfulness of sin, many fall away in time of temptation to never return.   Some sin and get corrected HEAR it and REPENT

others get corrected and their heart has become so hard in sin, they don't even see it as sin anymore. THAT IS SCARY for them.

THUS let us examine to see if we walk IN THE TRUE FAITH .   ITS ALL ABOUT HIS SAYINGS.   loving and doing them and so easy and light they are.

FOR THE LOVE OF GOD has been shed upon our hearts.  BUT Remember , lust can choke the word.   WE must exhort daily , we must remind and encourage one another

daily.   the SPIRIT works among us all.  OBEY THE SPIRIT.  to the end . amen.

[Pudgenik]

4 hours ago, Neighbor said:

 Jesus said to them, “I am the bread of life; whoever comes to me shall not hunger, and whoever believes in me shall never thirst. But I said to you that you have seen me and yet do not believe. All that the Father gives me will come to me, and whoever comes to me I will never cast out. For I have come down from heaven, not to do my own will but the will of him who sent me. And this is the will of him who sent me, that I should lose nothing of all that he has given me, but raise it up on the last day. For this is the will of my Father, that everyone who looks on the Son and believes in him should have eternal life, and I will raise him up on the last day.”

 

..." And he who searches hearts knows what is the mind of the Spirit, because the Spirit intercedes for the saints according to the will of God. And we know that for those who love God all things work together for good, for those who are called according to his purpose.  For those whom he foreknew he also predestined to be conformed to the image of his Son, in order that he might be the firstborn among many brothers.  And those whom he predestined he also called, and those whom he called he also justified, and those whom he justified he also glorified.

What then shall we say to these things? If God is for us, who can be against us? He who did not spare his own Son but gave him up for us all, how will he not also with him graciously give us all things? Who shall bring any charge against God's elect? It is God who justifies.  Who is to condemn? Christ Jesus is the one who died—more than that, who was raised—who is at the right hand of God, who indeed is interceding for us. Who shall separate us from the love of Christ? Shall tribulation, or distress, or persecution, or famine, or nakedness, or danger, or sword? As it is written,

“For your sake we are being killed all the day long;
    we are regarded as sheep to be slaughtered.”

No, in all these things we are more than conquerors through him who loved us. For I am sure that neither death nor life, nor angels nor rulers, nor things present nor things to come, nor powers, nor height nor depth, nor anything else in all creation, will be able to separate us from the love of God in Christ Jesus our Lord."

 

Good quotes

[Amazing Horse]

6 hours ago, Pudgenik said:

If we are to look at the Bible as the inspired Word of God, and I do. Then we have to acknowledge also that Jesus had a hand in what was written and how it was orchestrated.

Jesus took His time with this teaching, a teaching of losing your place in heaven, and your salvation.

Not only do we hear it in Jesus own words, but we see it in the example of Judas Iscariot.

I'm sure you've heard the phrase "once saved always saved", it is a false teaching.

It is not by mere chance we hear about Judas.

-----------------------

When the Pharisees confront Jesus about the casting out of demons. Jesus replies with this, " every kingdom divided against itself is headed for ruin." He goes on with, "Now if Satan casts out Satan, he is divided against himself" "But if it is through the Spirit of God that I cast devils out, then know that the kingdom of God has overtaken you."

In Matthew, Jesus says, "many will say to me, 'Lord, Lord, did we not prophesy in your name, cast out demons in your name, work many miracles in your name?" Then I shall tell them to thier faces, I have never known you.

The key here is that this person had cast out demons. That he had to have been in the Lord to do it. 

There is also an example, in Acts, of a man who tried casting out a demon, without the Lord. And the demon throttled him. "The evil spirit replied, "Jesus I recognize, and I know who Paul is, but who are you".

------------------------

Now back with Judas Iscariot. 

The author (Jesus) makes it clear who we are talking about.

When Jesus sends the apostles off to the towns, He gives then the ability to cast out demons and heal people. Notice that Judas Iscariot's full name is used. 

The scripture states, "these are the names of the twelve."

His disciples, after they return rejoicing. Saying "Lord", even the devils submit to us when we use your name. Jesus responds by saying, "do not rejoice that the spirits submit to you; rejoice rather that your names are written in heaven."

So you see, Judas, had to have  the Lord in him, to cast out the devil. And this would have to take place before the devil entered him. 

Jesus said his name was written in Heaven.

It is what Judas chose to do afterwards. His evil was the choice he made.

Following the way of God, Jesus, comes from the heart. And it is an everyday, every second, choice.

 

Jesus was Jew who came to Jews to proclaim that Messiah has arrived and preach Kingdom of God but they reject him so he took gospel of salvation to Gentiles through Paul and let Romans murder about 1M Jews to scatter them all over world from Jerusalem as punishment , Christians moved out of Jerusalem before 70 A.D.

 

Now you can't lose your salvation .

It's free gift - 1 Corinthians 15:1-4

Not of Works - Ephesians 2:8-9

You can't buy it clearly stated in Acts 8:20-23

20 But Peter said unto him, Thy money perish with thee, because thou hast thought that the gift of God may be purchased with money.

21 Thou hast neither part nor lot in this matter: for thy heart is not right in the sight of God.

22 Repent therefore of this thy wickedness, and pray God, if perhaps the thought of thine heart may be forgiven thee.

23 For I perceive that thou art in the gall of bitterness, and in the bond of iniquity.

 

About Judas , Holy Spirit was given at pentecost , before that it could leave just like David prayer in OT to God that he will not take his Spirit away from him .

When you get born again you get sealed with it Ephesians 1:13-14.

Also if you think that you can lose your salvation then Jesus just lied about it in John 10:28-30 so he either is not God because he just sinned or you might be wrong i wonder which one is true .

 

About these people in MAtthew 7:21-23 Saying Lord , Lord ...

They think that they go to heaven because of thier works , which takes us back to Acts 8:20-23 and Ephesians 2:8-9 .These people here are the ones who preach works salvation and think that they can go to heaven based on how they live .

 

Also you would need to enlighten me how to get unborn after i was born again in John 3:3  so i can lose my salvation .

1 John 5:13 Tells us that we know that we have eternal life . If we could lose it then it could not be eternal in first place , and also it's "have" not will have or had .

 

I can continue more but i think that's enought .

 

Edited September 9, 2017 by Amazing Horse

[frienduff thaylorde]

I was going to write a post asking where is dear sister wandao1.    I missed you sister.    I had not seen you in a bit.

But today my heart was happy when I seen your name.    You sing sister.   LOVE THE LORD and the LORD WE LOVE amen.

[Guest Wanda01]

5 minutes ago, frienduff thaylorde said:

I was going to write a post asking where is dear sister wandao1.    I missed you sister.    I had not seen you in a bit.

But today my heart was happy when I seen your name.    You sing sister.   LOVE THE LORD and the LORD WE LOVE amen.

Aww. Thank you. It makes my heart happy to know I have been thought of. Blessings!

[Wayne222]

Those who Fall away were never born again. We have a new heart that fears and loves God that is why we will not Fall away.

[Neighbor]

19 hours ago, frienduff thaylorde said:

So if I say that, yet tomorrow walk in sin and live like a devil.  GUESS I am still saved.   NO.

Be looking diligently lest any man FAIL OF.....................THE..............................GRACE OF GOD.

IT is HE WHO DOES WORK WIHTIN US, but its our DUTY to OBEY HIS SPIRIT.    many fall away.   JESUS Don't lie , wayne I know you know he don't.

But I also have never once given MYSELF any credit for MY SALVATION.  ITS ALWAYS BEEN GODS GRACE WORKING WITHIN ME.  but daily I have choice.

Do you think I don't get tempted by the evil flesh .     I Hope you don't think I am stupied enough to act as though I cant be tempted. WE ALL ARE

BUT  what we do WHEN the evil flesh pops its evil into our mind. IS ON US.   THE SPIRIT should scream ALERT , ALERT this is wicked , cease the thought.

Lest we have put the SPIRIT out that is.    IT always works that way with me.   Anytime that flesh starts to rise up ..........the SPIRIT IS RIGHT THEIR  TO WARN ME
 OH NO YA DONT.    we are servants to whom we obey.  BRING EVERY THOUGHT captive to the OBEDIANCE OF CHRIST , is not theory.   IT CAN BE DONE

we have the SPIRIT within us.   but many have quenched it and know not.    That is scary .     The holy spirit is ours if we are CHRISTS.

but many get hardend through the deceitfulness of sin, many fall away in time of temptation to never return.   Some sin and get corrected HEAR it and REPENT

others get corrected and their heart has become so hard in sin, they don't even see it as sin anymore. THAT IS SCARY for them.

THUS let us examine to see if we walk IN THE TRUE FAITH .   ITS ALL ABOUT HIS SAYINGS.   loving and doing them and so easy and light they are.

FOR THE LOVE OF GOD has been shed upon our hearts.  BUT Remember , lust can choke the word.   WE must exhort daily , we must remind and encourage one another

daily.   the SPIRIT works among us all.  OBEY THE SPIRIT.  to the end . amen.

"What shall we say then? Are we to continue in sin that grace may abound?  By no means! How can we who died to sin still live in it?  Do you not know that all of us who have been baptized into Christ Jesus were baptized into his death?  We were buried therefore with him by baptism into death, in order that, just as Christ was raised from the dead by the glory of the Father, we too might walk in newness of life.

For if we have been united with him in a death like his, we shall certainly be united with him in a resurrection like his.  We know that our old self was crucified with him in order that the body of sin might be brought to nothing, so that we would no longer be enslaved to sin. For one who has died has been set free from sin.  Now if we have died with Christ, we believe that we will also live with him. We know that Christ, being raised from the dead, will never die again; death no longer has dominion over him. For the death he died he died to sin, once for all, but the life he lives he lives to God.  So you also must consider yourselves dead to sin and alive to God in Christ Jesus.

 Let not sin therefore reign in your mortal body, to make you obey its passions. Do not present your members to sin as instruments for unrighteousness, but present yourselves to God as those who have been brought from death to life, and your members to God as instruments for righteousness. For sin will have no dominion over you, since you are not under law but under grace.

 

 What then? Are we to sin because we are not under law but under grace? By no means! Do you not know that if you present yourselves to anyone as obedient slaves, you are slaves of the one whom you obey, either of sin, which leads to death, or of obedience, which leads to righteousness?  But thanks be to God, that you who were once slaves of sin have become obedient from the heart to the standard of teaching to which you were committed,  and, having been set free from sin, have become slaves of righteousness. I am speaking in human terms, because of your natural limitations. For just as you once presented your members as slaves to impurity and to lawlessness leading to more lawlessness, so now present your members as slaves to righteousness leading to sanctification.

For when you were slaves of sin, you were free in regard to righteousness. But what fruit were you getting at that time from the things of which you are now ashamed? For the end of those things is death. But now that you have been set free from sin and have become slaves of God, the fruit you get leads to sanctification and its end, eternal life. For the wages of sin is death, but the free gift of God is eternal life in Christ Jesus our Lord."