Talk on Politics & Politicians (for SA and HE)

[Bread_of_Life]

Haha! Just when you thought I'd deserted you, I'm back!

Boy, it's been a really hectic time, and continues to be. I've just started my new job on Monday, I'm campaigning every night and weekend for a Labour Party victory in our general election over here, and then I've got a private life to squeeze in! So I've not had much "me" time, or time to post on (any) bulletin boards. Sorry bout that guys!

HorizonEast

Dude! How are you?

Right, a reply at last:

I

[Bread_of_Life]

Labour Party? I pegged you as a Lib Dem or a Green

Edited April 21, 2005 by ScientificAtheist

[Bread_of_Life]

horizoneast

I would like to hear your opinion of Mr. Blair as compared to Mr. Bush.

Well, I think that Mr Blair is a far better leader than Mr Bush, in the sense that he has been committed to investing in Nationalised health and education, and that he has stated that healthcare free at the point of delivery is part of his core value set. He has also shown a lot less contempt for international institutions, although unfortunately, not by much. Mr Blair has also been better at handling the economy, whilst Mr Bush has overstimulated his economy and is in line for a hard re-adjustment within his second term or just after, Mr Blair and Mr Brown have led to sustainable growth, and our readjustment will inevitably be softer.

However, there is a lot with which I disagree. I disagree with his agenda (or anti-agenda) on civil rights. There are people locked up in Britain without trial, charge, or due process, and that is wrong, whichever way you cut it, and whatever they are suspected of doing. There is also the issue of the use of ASBOs, anti-social behaviour orders, which have been used to create ad hoc laws for certain people, based on community prejudice. This is also wrong.

I also have serious reservations about his ideas about a market in public services. I work with the NHS, and I feel strongly about it, and I believe that introducing a market within the NHS is counterproductive for both staff and patients. I disagree with the idea of foundation hospitals, foundation schools, or any other sort of market within public services - because it is typically the rich and able that gain from markets, and not the poor and needy, who most require public services.

I also am very concerned with Mr Blair's agenda on criminal justice. In 1997 we were promised a government that was "tough on crime, tough on the causes of crime" - whereas what was delivered is a government that is disproportionately tough (even draconian) on crime - and has delivered many more police officers (which is obviously good), but has done little on the causes of crime. The largest causes of crime are the lack of opportunity, lack of education, deprivation, and drug and alcohol abuse is poorer communities. The disease of poverty infects our youth with dysfunction in their family life, ineffectiveness in their schooling, stagnancy in the opportunities in their area, ill-health, and the pressures of alcohol and substances. These inevitably lead many young people in the poorest households to turn to crime either to feed their habits, or because it is presented as the easiest and best way to social self-improvement.

What we need is real outreach, opportunity and education in our inner city communities - but instead throughout the Labour government the richest have got richer, and the poorest poorer. This is very concerning indeed, especially on criminal justice. We are now preoccupied with criminalising more and more of our young people without asking the question of why more and more are turning to criminality and drugs. What we need is to promote strong families, strong communities, strong education, and strong opportunities - to create households and areas where there is pride and hope, not despair and cynicism and illiteracy.

Also, I cannot sanction Mr Blair's foreign policy, especially his closeness to George Bush's agenda. Whilst I believe that the US and UK had a special responsibility to remove Saddam Hussain (having helped to install and arm him) I don't trust for a second, and nor should Mr Blair, the intentions of people like Donald Rumsfeld who were after all the very people who gave Saddam Hussain WMDs and allowed him to use them against his own people. There is no sense in which I believe that America's intentions in Iraq were benevolant, and nor do I believe that Iraq was the most pressing security or humanitarian issue in the world, and thus I can't help but believe that this was the wrong war, with the wrong partners, at the wrong time - and with very little pre-planning. This has led inevitably to huge civil unrest and civilian casualties in Iraq, as well as a neglect for the real and current massacres going on in places like Sudan, where muslim arabs have killed hundreds of thousands, if not more, black Christians.

I have many other smaller grumbles.

I have also admitted to you that I am an avowed agnosti-leprechaunist. I don

Edited April 22, 2005 by Saved by Grace

[WayneB]

Since I closed the Predictions and Evolution thread, I received a most gracious request to find some method that the discussion from that thread could continue. This is the best I could do in that I split off the posts that were focused on the topic at hand AND not full of acrimonious debate.

I will move those posts to this new thread so that the fruitful discussion between SA and HE can continue. Others all welcome to join the discussion BUT leave your raucous diatribe out of your posts.

I hope this is agreeable to all parties.

ONE CATCH though... no more leprechauns. Nick, I understood your point but others took it and made it offensive.

Bless you,

Wayne

[Bread_of_Life]

But... the leprechauns are my friends!

[WayneB]

But... the leprechauns are my friends!

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

I knew there was somthing "special" about you Nik. Now when you sober up, they will be gone...along with the pink elephants.