The Word - Church

[Christine]

Hello there,

The word translated 'church' is ekkliesia, and means 'an assembly or congregation of called-out ones', and is derived from kaleo (to call or summon), and ek (out of).  The Greek word occurs some 111 times in the New Testament. It has several phases:

1) A future assembly prophesied of in Matthew 16:18:-

‘And I say also unto thee, 
That thou art Peter, 
and upon this rock I will build my church; 
and the gates of hell shall not prevail against it.’

* That ‘rock’ of course being the subject of verse 16, given by revelation of God.

‘And Simon Peter answered and said, 
Thou art the Christ, the Son of the living God.
And Jesus answered and said unto him, 
Blessed art thou, Simon Barjona: 
for flesh and blood hath not revealed it unto thee, 
but my Father which is in heaven.’
(Mat 16:16-17)  

2) The assembly of the people of Israel called out from all other nations (Acts 7:38)

‘This is he, that was in the church in the wilderness 
with the angel which spake to him in the mount Sina, 
and with our fathers: 
who received the lively oracles to give unto us:’
(Act 7:38)  

* 'He' being Moses of course.

3) The 'church of God', which was persecuted by Paul when a Pharisee (Acts 8:3; 1 Cor.15:9):-

‘As for Saul, he made havock of the church, 
entering into every house, 
and haling men and women committed them to prison.’
(Act 8:3)  

‘For I am the least of the apostles, 
that am not meet to be called an apostle, 
because I persecuted the church of God.’
(1Co 15:9)  

4) An assembly of people called out by some common cause (Acts 19:32-40)

‘Some therefore cried one thing, and some another: 
for the assembly was confused;  (ekklesia-church)
and the more part knew not wherefore they were come together.
And they drew Alexander out of the multitude, 
the Jews putting him forward. 
And Alexander beckoned with the hand, 
and would have made his defence unto the people.
(Act 19:32-33)  

5) An assembly of the people called out by the civil magistrate (Acts 19:39) 

‘But if ye enquire any thing concerning other matters, 
it shall be determined in a lawful assembly.’ (ekklesia=church)
(Act 19:39)

6) The synagogue of believing Jews during the transitional period of the Acts, and also of Revelation 2 & 3 (James 2:2,5,14)

‘For if there come unto your assembly a man with a gold ring, in goodly apparel, 
and there come in also a poor man in vile raiment; ... ’

‘Hearken, my beloved brethren, 
Hath not God chosen the poor of this world rich in faith, 
and heirs of the kingdom which He hath promised to them that love Him?
But ye have despised the poor. 
Do not rich men oppress you, and draw you before the judgment seats?
(Jas 2:2, 5-6)  

7) The assembly of the dispensation of the Mystery (the church, which is His Body) as used by Paul in Ephesians, Philippians, and Colossians.

* It will be seen that it is not sufficient merely to use the word 'church'; we must know when such church was formed, the nature of its fellowship, and the dispensation under which it originated.  The 'church in the wilderness' was under law.  The 'church which is His Body' is totally under grace.  The one abounded in rites and ordinances, the other has none.  The hopes of the first were connected with earthly blessings (even though they were to be enjoyed in resurrection); the hope of the second is found in heavenly places.

* It is vital that we make these distinctions if we would avoid confusion or error.

In Christ Jesus
Our risen and glorified,
Saviour, Lord and Head,
Chris

 

[Michael37]

36 minutes ago, Christine said:

Hello there,

The word translated 'church' is ekkliesia, and means 'an assembly or congregation of called-out ones', and is derived from kaleo (to call or summon), and ek (out of).  The Greek word occurs some 111 times in the New Testament. It has several phases:

1) A future assembly prophesied of in Matthew 16:18:-

‘And I say also unto thee, 
That thou art Peter, 
and upon this rock I will build my church; 
and the gates of hell shall not prevail against it.’

* That ‘rock’ of course being the subject of verse 16, given by revelation of God.

‘And Simon Peter answered and said, 
Thou art the Christ, the Son of the living God.
And Jesus answered and said unto him, 
Blessed art thou, Simon Barjona: 
for flesh and blood hath not revealed it unto thee, 
but my Father which is in heaven.’
(Mat 16:16-17)  

2) The assembly of the people of Israel called out from all other nations (Acts 7:38)

‘This is he, that was in the church in the wilderness 
with the angel which spake to him in the mount Sina, 
and with our fathers: 
who received the lively oracles to give unto us:’
(Act 7:38)  

* 'He' being Moses of course.

3) The 'church of God', which was persecuted by Paul when a Pharisee (Acts 8:3; 1 Cor.15:9):-

‘As for Saul, he made havock of the church, 
entering into every house, 
and haling men and women committed them to prison.’
(Act 8:3)  

‘For I am the least of the apostles, 
that am not meet to be called an apostle, 
because I persecuted the church of God.’
(1Co 15:9)  

4) An assembly of people called out by some common cause (Acts 19:32-40)

‘Some therefore cried one thing, and some another: 
for the assembly was confused;  (ekklesia-church)
and the more part knew not wherefore they were come together.
And they drew Alexander out of the multitude, 
the Jews putting him forward. 
And Alexander beckoned with the hand, 
and would have made his defence unto the people.
(Act 19:32-33)  

5) An assembly of the people called out by the civil magistrate (Acts 19:39) 

‘But if ye enquire any thing concerning other matters, 
it shall be determined in a lawful assembly.’ (ekklesia=church)
(Act 19:39)

6) The synagogue of believing Jews during the transitional period of the Acts, and also of Revelation 2 & 3 (James 2:2,5,14)

‘For if there come unto your assembly a man with a gold ring, in goodly apparel, 
and there come in also a poor man in vile raiment; ... ’

‘Hearken, my beloved brethren, 
Hath not God chosen the poor of this world rich in faith, 
and heirs of the kingdom which He hath promised to them that love Him?
But ye have despised the poor. 
Do not rich men oppress you, and draw you before the judgment seats?
(Jas 2:2, 5-6)  

7) The assembly of the dispensation of the Mystery (the church, which is His Body) as used by Paul in Ephesians, Philippians, and Colossians.

* It will be seen that it is not sufficient merely to use the word 'church'; we must know when such church was formed, the nature of its fellowship, and the dispensation under which it originated.  The 'church in the wilderness' was under law.  The 'church which is His Body' is totally under grace.  The one abounded in rites and ordinances, the other has none.  The hopes of the first were connected with earthly blessings (even though they were to be enjoyed in resurrection); the hope of the second is found in heavenly places.

* It is vital that we make these distinctions if we would avoid confusion or error.

In Christ Jesus
Our risen and glorified,
Saviour, Lord and Head,
Chris

 

Further more, the word “church” actually comes from a different Greek word “kuriakon"
 

Quote

 

Kuriakon actually means “pertaining to the lord.” It is used twice in scripture: 1 Cor 11:20 The “ Lord’s [ kuriakon]supper;” and Rev 1:10, the “ Lord’s [ kuriakon] day.” In those passages it is the supper belonging to the Lord and the day belonging to the Lord respectively.

Kuriakon, kirche, and church, all meant simply a religious building originally used by pagans and later used by Christians following pagan customs. Christians originally didn’t use buildings, which distinguished them from the pagans whose focus was on building, statues, ritual and physical objects. [Copied from The Origin Of The Word Church at scribd.com]

 

 

[Global Mission]

Good topic..

-important topic to discuss / search / reflect.. at this hour.

 

 

 

 

[frienduff thaylorde]

Now one and all,    throw those hands up and praise the LORD .    Be ye HOLY for HE is HOLY and throw up praises to the LORD .  

[Christine]

On 8/2/2018 at 9:14 AM, Michael37 said:

Further more, the word “church” actually comes from a different Greek word “kuriakon"
 

 

'When ye come together therefore into one place, 
this is not to eat the Lord's supper.'
(1 Cor 11:20)  

‘I was in the Spirit on the Lord's day, 
and heard behind me a great voice, as of a trumpet,’
(Rev 1:10)  

Thank you, @Michael37,

Yes, kuriakos means:- 'belonging to the Lord,'

* This is not translated as 'church' though is it? In 1Cor.11:20, it is obviously an 'assembling' of believers together in one place, and therefore could be called an assembly or church, but it is not referred to as such in 1 Cor. 11:20, nor is it translated so in Revelation 1:10. It is the supper itself that is described as the Lord's in 1 Cor. 11:20, and not those assembled; and in Revelation 11:10 it is 'the Lord's day', which is being referred to in this way, as belonging to the Lord.

* So it cannot be said to be the church that kuriakon is referring to: either the people who comprise it or the building, not in these verses anyway; yet these are the only two occasions where this word is used.

In Christ Jesus

Chris

 

 

 

Edited August 3, 2018 by Christine

[Michael37]

5 hours ago, Christine said:

'When ye come together therefore into one place, 
this is not to eat the Lord's supper.'
(1 Cor 11:20)  

‘I was in the Spirit on the Lord's day, 
and heard behind me a great voice, as of a trumpet,’
(Rev 1:10)  

Thank you, @Michael37,

Yes, kuriakos means:- 'belonging to the Lord,'

* This is not translated as 'church' though is it? It is obviously an 'assembling' being together in one place, and therefore could be called an assembly or church, but it is not referred to as such in 1 Cor. 11:20, nor is it translated so in Revelation 1:10. It is the supper itself that is described as the Lord's in 1 Cor. 11:20, and not those assembled; and in Revelation 11:10 it is 'the Lord's day', which is being referred to in this way, as belonging to the Lord.

* So it cannot be said to be the church that kuriakon is referring to: either the people who comprise it or the building, not in these verses anyway; yet these are the only two occasions where this word is used.

In Christ Jesus

Chris

Back in the 1st century the use of kuriakos was for items or property belonging to a lord or master. The pagan temples were said to belong to whatever pagan god was worshipped there, and that god was the lord or master so the temple was the kuriakos or lord's house/property.

You can see how the word would also be adopted for buildings specifically dedicated for use by professing Christians. 

[Christine]

8 hours ago, Michael37 said:

Back in the 1st century the use of kuriakos was for items or property belonging to a lord or master. The pagan temples were said to belong to whatever pagan god was worshipped there, and that god was the lord or master so the temple was the kuriakos or lord's house/property.

You can see how the word would also be adopted for buildings specifically dedicated for use by professing Christians. 

 

Yes, @Michael37, thank you, I see what you mean; but it is not used by the Holy Spirit in this way in the New Testament, and that is all that concerns me.. It is man who has so used it, and not God.  

* Wonderfully, we are spoken of as God's building though aren't we. An Holy Temple in the Lord. (1 Cor.3:9 & Eph..2:21).

Praise His Holy Name!

Thank you, Michael.

In Christ Jesus

Our risen and glorified,

Saviour, Lord and Head.

Chris

 

 

Edited August 3, 2018 by Christine

[Marilyn C]

On ‎8‎/‎2‎/‎2018 at 3:25 PM, Christine said:

 

6) The synagogue of believing Jews during the transitional period of the Acts, and also of Revelation 2 & 3 (James 2:2,5,14)

‘For if there come unto your assembly a man with a gold ring, in goodly apparel, 
and there come in also a poor man in vile raiment; ... ’

‘Hearken, my beloved brethren, 
Hath not God chosen the poor of this world rich in faith, 
and heirs of the kingdom which He hath promised to them that love Him?
But ye have despised the poor. 
Do not rich men oppress you, and draw you before the judgment seats?
(Jas 2:2, 5-6)  

7) The assembly of the dispensation of the Mystery (the church, which is His Body) as used by Paul in Ephesians, Philippians, and Colossians.

* It will be seen that it is not sufficient merely to use the word 'church'; we must know when such church was formed, the nature of its fellowship, and the dispensation under which it originated.  The 'church in the wilderness' was under law.  The 'church which is His Body' is totally under grace.  The one abounded in rites and ordinances, the other has none.  The hopes of the first were connected with earthly blessings (even though they were to be enjoyed in resurrection); the hope of the second is found in heavenly places.

* It is vital that we make these distinctions if we would avoid confusion or error.

In Christ Jesus
Our risen and glorified,
Saviour, Lord and Head,
Chris

 

Hi Christine,

Good topic to be explored. So can you please share some scriptures to back up your thoughts on why you believe that the group in 6) is different from the group in 7) ? I realise this is a big subject so just for starters some points maybe.

regards, Marilyn.

[Michael37]

17 minutes ago, Christine said:

 

Yes, @Michael37, thank you, I see what you mean; but it is not used by the Holy Spirit in this way in the New Testament, and that is all that concerns me.. It is man who has so used it, and not God.

Amen. Now for the reveal - the in-home ekklesia that I am a part of actively discourages the use of the word church in favour of ekklesia. If needs must it is spelled out, c-h-u-r-c-h, and always referring to the non-biblical aspect that we have left, some of us having held leadership positions. 

Edited August 3, 2018 by Michael37
omission

[Christine]

On 8/3/2018 at 9:25 AM, Marilyn C said:

Hi Christine,

Good topic to be explored. So can you please share some scriptures to back up your thoughts on why you believe that the group in 6) is different from the group in 7) ? I realise this is a big subject so just for starters some points maybe.

regards, Marilyn.

 

On 8/2/2018 at 8:25 AM, Christine said:

6) The synagogue of believing Jews during the transitional period of the Acts, and also of Revelation 2 & 3 (James 2:2,5,14)

‘For if there come unto your assembly a man with a gold ring, in goodly apparel, 
and there come in also a poor man in vile raiment; ... ’

‘Hearken, my beloved brethren, 
Hath not God chosen the poor of this world rich in faith, 
and heirs of the kingdom which He hath promised to them that love Him?
But ye have despised the poor. 
Do not rich men oppress you, and draw you before the judgment seats?
(Jas 2:2, 5-6)  

Hi Marilyn,

Thank you for your question.  You ask for scriptures to back up my thoughts expressed in point (6) of my OP, quoted above.  

* The synagogue of believing Jews during the Acts period, the object of James 2 and Revelation 2 & 3: are obviously very different from the Church which is the Body of Christ.  For apart from the fact that the knowledge of that latter church company was still 'hid in God' (Eph.3:9) during the period of the Acts, their hope and calling are different.  

* They looked for either the coming of the Kingdom promised by God to Israel, or for a city made without hands - the New Jerusalem, the hope of such as Abraham, who looked for it by faith.  Whereas the Church which is the Body of Christ is a new creation, a joint company, made up of individual Jew and Gentile believers united in Christ on an equal footing; something unheard of prior to the revelation of God made known to Paul exclusively following the laying aside (temporarily) of Israel in unbelief at the end of the Acts period, for Him to administer as it's Steward.  This company has a hope which is situated in heavenly places in Christ Jesus, whose blessings are all spiritual blessings, unlike those of 'the church in the wilderness', or that of the gospels or the Acts periods.

* I have not provided Scriptural reference here, as you asked, because I am preparing to go out; but this is an outline of my thinking, which I will be able to provide scriptural references for when I return.  However a comparison of the content of the letters of Paul, written prior to the revelation of God to Him concerning 'The Mystery' related to the Body of Christ (Eph 3) (not the mystery of Christ by the way), and those which follow will provide much of the evidential scriptures required. Those following being, Ephesians, Philippians, Colossians, 1 & 2 Timothy and Titus: - Philemon being of a more personal nature).

* Coming back to this: it is only by a comparison of the hope expressed in The Acts, the early letters of Paul, and those of such as James, Peter and John, with the content of Ephesians, Colossians, Philippians, 1 & 2 Timothy and Titus, that the differences in calling will be observed, as I say.  Individual references would be helpful, but time will not allow me to search for and provide them at this time.

In Christ Jesus

Chris

 

 

Edited August 4, 2018 by Christine