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Bad scientific arguments against evolution: Part 1


one.opinion

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Guest shiloh357
6 hours ago, one.opinion said:

That really didn’t answer my question. Why not use a word for “perfect” if that is what He meant? What reason would He have to use a different word if it was indeed perfect?

To communicate emphatically the pleasure He took in what He made.   The point is that "good" from God's standpoint is always perfect because has no sliding scale with respect to "good."   Again, it is synonymous with perfection.   But evolution implies imperfection, and that simply doesn't fit with how God operates.   God cannot create imperfection.

When we say that God is "good,"  He is always "good" in sense of perfection.

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1 hour ago, Abdicate said:

Thanks for proving my point. Matt 7:21-22.

Your implicit accusation is way off-base, my brother. Fake Christians do not produce the fruits of the Spirit that I have seen first-hand.

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1 hour ago, Abdicate said:

Don't get hung up on translations when God used the words He meant.

I do believe He used the words He meant. Which is curious because He didn’t use a word for “perfect”.

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5 minutes ago, one.opinion said:

Your implicit accusation is way off-base, my brother. Fake Christians do not produce the fruits of the Spirit that I have seen first-hand.

That is not what The Lord says

Matt 24:24

24 For there shall arise false Christs, and false prophets, and shall shew great signs and wonders; insomuch that, if it were possible, they shall deceive the very elect.
KJV

 

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1 hour ago, enoob57 said:

That is not what The Lord says

I see "great signs and wonders", I do not see "Fruits of the Spirit".

Galatians 5:22-23 "But the fruit of the Spirit is love, joy, peace, forbearance, kindness, goodness, faithfulness, gentleness and self-control. Against such things there is no law."

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Just now, one.opinion said:

I see "great signs and wonders", I do not see "Fruits of the Spirit".

Galatians 5:22-23 "But the fruit of the Spirit is love, joy, peace, forbearance, kindness, goodness, faithfulness, gentleness and self-control. Against such things there is no law."

taking the understanding farther

2 Cor 11:14-15

14 And no marvel; for Satan himself is transformed into an angel of light.

15 Therefore it is no great thing if his ministers also be transformed as the ministers of righteousness; whose end shall be according to their works.
KJV


anything can be presented to another but only essence can get through Christ into the everlasting.... 

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14 hours ago, enoob57 said:

what I said is fact about the law …  You need to critique the post more :) 

No offense, but your post is not worth my time or effort to critique.

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3 minutes ago, Saved.One.by.Grace said:

No offense, but your post is not worth my time or effort to critique.

This is simply for the edification of those following the thread

1 Cor 8:1-3

8 Now as touching things offered unto idols, we know that we all have knowledge. Knowledge puffeth up, but charity edifieth.

2 And if any man think that he knoweth anything, he knoweth nothing yet as he ought to know.

3 But if any man love God, the same is known of him.
KJV


We all are in this boat... knowing not as we ought and let us continue in knowledge with God's Word as preeminent in the pursuit... 

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48 minutes ago, one.opinion said:

Your implicit accusation is way off-base, my brother. Fake Christians do not produce the fruits of the Spirit that I have seen first-hand.

:)  You're not in a dialog about science and evidence here.  You are in a dialog of conviction and faith that God did things a particular way.  I learned this last year in a "dialog" (I'll be polite) with a flat-earther.  At first I suspected he was a troll, but came to the conclusion he was absolutely convinced God created the earth flat.  For him, it was not a matter of physical evidence (because he had evidence of his own proving the earth was flat) and discussing which evidence was more credible.  It was a matter of defending scripture for him.  He seemed absolutely convinced scripture taught the earth was flat, therefore any evidence to the contrary had to either be fake, in error, intentional lies, or some type of spiritual deceit.  He kept pulling out the same half a dozen or so proofs and would not tolerate the slightest criticism of any of them.  He'd pull out inane descriptions of the scientific method and then insinuate that anyone who didn't agree with his proofs was not a scientist nor rational.   If you are interested, here is the thread.  https://www.worthychristianforums.com/topic/212853-examples-of-applied-physics/   I was rather dense and it took me awhile to realize it, but I eventually realized that it was not about weighing and evaluating evidence for him, it was a conviction that scripture taught a particular thing and he was defending the Bible against me.  Nothing short of renouncing my belief in a globe-earth was acceptable.   These "proofs" that he held to so tenaciously were a part of his trust in the Bible's authority.   To cast any doubt on those proofs was to cast doubt on the Bible itself and God Himself.

 

My observation is that some Christians seem to have an all or nothing belief in the trustworthiness and authority of scripture.  It's either perfect, or should be discarded.  For those with this conviction, their faith in God to a large extent rests on this. Anything that casts doubt on this is basically an assault on their faith in Jesus Christ.  My sense is that many with YEC views have this type of conviction.  What to you is a measured weighing of evidence (with a deep conviction and confidence that God could have decided to do things however He wanted to and you're fine with that), is an out and out assault on the authority and trustworthiness of scripture to some YEC believers.  Any evidence potentially showing macro-evolution could have occurred is a direct assault on the authority of scripture to them and casts doubt on the gospel.  Such "evidence" (in their eyes) is either in error, intentional deceit, or misunderstood in some way.   For some YEC Christians, the strong conviction that the 2nd Law of Thermodynamic disproves macro-evolution is a part of their belief in the trustworthiness of scripture.  To discard this is to cast doubt on the Bible and indeed salvation through Christ and everything else it teaches. 

Thus, you and anyone else who casts doubt on scripture have to be in spiritual error of some sort because a "real" Christian would never cast doubt on scripture.  At best you are deceived.  At worst, you are an intentional false prophet and a wolf in sheeps clothing or possibly not even a Christian. ;)   For some of them, it is partially a matter of showing you the error of your ways,  and partially a matter of shutting you down and warning others away from you so that you don't destroy people's faith in God and the Bible.  

I understand your intention for this thread.  It was much my intention when I started the thread I linked to.  However as I learned, there are some Christians that are convinced that FE and YEC are an essential part of having faith in Jesus Christ.  For some of them, things such as the 2nd LoT disproving macro-evolution has become an unquestioned and important part of YEC or that the sun does not light up the moon is an essential part of the faith of FE believers.  They are going to continue to teach and preach those things.  It does not matter what evidence or arguments you bring up, they are convinced you are in error somewhere and will continue to reject most everything you try to bring up no matter how patient and reasonable you are about it.  For some, the only acceptable outcome is if you become a diehard YEC yourself.   Since then, I realize that the real battle is helping people understand that our convictions are not in an absolute trust in science but rather an unshakeable faith and confidence in God that allow us to simply trust that He is there and He is good no matter how He decides to do things.  We are free to ask questions because no matter what answer shows up, our trust and confidence in God remains.   We have full confidence in the authority and trustworthiness of scripture, just not full confidence in our or others' understanding of it.

Having said all that, I still often write for the lurkers who might be reading a post or thread and that God might simply use me as an example to those struggling with doubts that it is possible to ask hard questions, not get all the answers we want or expect, and still have a strong trust and confidence in Jesus Christ.  You never know who is reading.  I've been finding some of the stuff you bring up interesting.  

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28 minutes ago, GandalfTheWise said:

You're not in a dialog about science and evidence here.  You are in a dialog of conviction and faith that God did things a particular way.

Thanks for the reminder, thanks for reading, and thanks for taking the time to write down your thoughts. I appreciate what you have done here a great deal!

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