By His stripes we are healed of what?

[PeterR]

14 hours ago, Paul James said:

 

The same question could be asked of Jesus - why didn't He go to Jewish hospitals and heal everyone there?   Why did He heal just one lame man at the pool instead of all the sick people there?

Actually, the outworking of the gift of healing is shown in James, that it is the role of the church elder who responds to sick persons' call for them to come and pray the prayer of faith over them.

Notice that Jesus healed all who came to Him.  He didn't go around advertising His healing ministry and soliciting it.  Often when someone came to Him, He asked, "What can I do for you?"

Also, if the majority of people in hospitals have curable sicknesses, then God would give the doctors wisdom to achieve the results.

Also, the healing miracles in Acts were linked with the preaching of the Gospel, and not "healing crusades" for Christian believers.

god is not a bush button vending machine to spit out healing on demand.  He is sovereign, and decides who He will heal or not.   The reality is that not all people get healed as the result of prayer, and the promises of self-appointed "healing" ministries.

In that case, your statement that "If someone has the true gift of healing, healing will happen." Is false. With regard to physical healing, it must be conditioned to the will of God and not to the one who claims to have the gift. So the "healer" must feel at the moment that he has this power, consent? Are you saying that it is rather a permanent, everlasting gift?
I believe that God can use any of us whenever He wants to heal someone.
How do you tell the difference between true healers and false healers?

 

I don't know if there was such a thing as Jewish hospitals in those days, but Jesus had a very special "relationship" to Jews.
Jesus healed a lame man by the pond where many sick people lay. Perhaps for others it was enough to believe in healing water.

[Paul James]

8 hours ago, PeterR said:

In that case, your statement that "If someone has the true gift of healing, healing will happen." Is false. With regard to physical healing, it must be conditioned to the will of God and not to the one who claims to have the gift. So the "healer" must feel at the moment that he has this power, consent? Are you saying that it is rather a permanent, everlasting gift?
I believe that God can use any of us whenever He wants to heal someone.
How do you tell the difference between true healers and false healers?

 

I don't know if there was such a thing as Jewish hospitals in those days, but Jesus had a very special "relationship" to Jews.
Jesus healed a lame man by the pond where many sick people lay. Perhaps for others it was enough to believe in healing water.

Seeing that if the Holy Spirit gives some the gift of healing, it is obvious that it is the will of God for that person to be used on a regular basis to achieve healing miracles.   Why would the Holy Spirit bestow a gift that would be hit and miss in its use?

The reality is that the bestowal of the gift in our western churches is a rarity and that is why we don't see it being used.   While there are some who claim to have the gift, they are merely pretending and their advertising is false.

Yes, anyone can offer prayer for healing, and sometimes God heals and sometimes He doesn't.

[PeterR]

17 hours ago, Paul James said:

Why would the Holy Spirit bestow a gift that would be hit and miss in its use?

Exactly! It would make no sense for someone with this gift to manifest healings among professing Christians. Healings would be justified rather as a sign among non-believers, where they are needed. Why not in hospitals then?

[Paul James]

12 hours ago, PeterR said:

Exactly! It would make no sense for someone with this gift to manifest healings among professing Christians. Healings would be justified rather as a sign among non-believers, where they are needed. Why not in hospitals then?

What it shows is that those who claim to have a healing gift are being presumptuous because the results aren't there.

Actually, I like what I do, in offering prayer for sick people, better than you not offering similar prayers.

[PeterR]

6 hours ago, Paul James said:

What it shows is that those who claim to have a healing gift are being presumptuous because the results aren't there.

I agree. If there were noises about miraculous (true) healings, if they only wrote about it in the newspapers, it would be of benefit, but when it is loud only about counterfeiters, the effect is the opposite. If there are no such spectacular results as were, for example, when John and Peter healed a lame man and then he himself made this event known by jumping and praising God, no one believes in physical healings anymore. It would be presumptuous if John and Peter only self-testified of themselves or if they concealed the event from the people merely boasting about what God had done through them, telling it only to other believers.
As you say, where there are no signs, there are no results. All that remains is pride, building a hierarchy and prayers for show.

Act 5:16 There came also a multitude out of the cities round about unto Jerusalem, bringing sick folks, and them which were vexed with unclean spirits: and they were healed every one.

I think that today there are no miracles or signs that inspire such fear as in the times of the Apostles, because today there are no Apostles on earth. But I believe that a sincere, heartfelt confession has more healing power than asking the other person to pray for your health. Shouldn't we rather pray for one another that we may be persistent in our physical sufferings?

You have no reason to argue that someone who questions spectacular healings these days does not pray himself. It is certain, however, that such a person does not put himself in the position of an intermediary to God. After all, we do not pray like the hypocrites, but we believe that "by His stripes we are healed".

[Paul James]

11 hours ago, PeterR said:

I agree. If there were noises about miraculous (true) healings, if they only wrote about it in the newspapers, it would be of benefit, but when it is loud only about counterfeiters, the effect is the opposite. If there are no such spectacular results as were, for example, when John and Peter healed a lame man and then he himself made this event known by jumping and praising God, no one believes in physical healings anymore. It would be presumptuous if John and Peter only self-testified of themselves or if they concealed the event from the people merely boasting about what God had done through them, telling it only to other believers.
As you say, where there are no signs, there are no results. All that remains is pride, building a hierarchy and prayers for show.

Act 5:16 There came also a multitude out of the cities round about unto Jerusalem, bringing sick folks, and them which were vexed with unclean spirits: and they were healed every one.

I think that today there are no miracles or signs that inspire such fear as in the times of the Apostles, because today there are no Apostles on earth. But I believe that a sincere, heartfelt confession has more healing power than asking the other person to pray for your health. Shouldn't we rather pray for one another that we may be persistent in our physical sufferings?

You have no reason to argue that someone who questions spectacular healings these days does not pray himself. It is certain, however, that such a person does not put himself in the position of an intermediary to God. After all, we do not pray like the hypocrites, but we believe that "by His stripes we are healed".

Most genuine healing is not spectacular and don't get to Youtube.  Most healing happens in normal church services, and people's homes, and never get into the public domain.  There is a great difference between a compassionate pastor/elder, and a "healing evangelist" having mass meetings in order to advertise himself.   Jesus doesn't share His glory with others.

[Joulre2abba]

On 2/19/2021 at 5:05 PM, Whyme said:

This topic isn't about a spiritual gift but a certain scripture. The reason I post it here is because folks who believe in gifts use this scripture often. Its my belief that this scripture is misunderstood and I would like a friendly discussion on it. I believe Isaiah 53 isn't about physical healing but spiritual instead. Think about it, if sinners were physicaly sick we would all be phicically sick with disease but this isn't the case. We are all spiritually sick however. This Isaiah sripture is for us all too. We are all spiritually sick without Jesus to heal our spiritual man. Jesus said a sick man needs a doctor, and he was referring to spiritual sickness not physical and so is Isaiah (Mark 2:17)

There is Mat.8:17 (quoting the Isa.53 text) that clearly indicates that the Bible is speaking of physical healing of physical sickness.

Mark 2:1-16 is the context for verse 17. Verses 1-12 is a physical healing. In Isa.53 the verses address sins and also peace for the soul and then the physical for health. God is concerned with our entire being made whole.

[Whyme]

4 hours ago, Joulre2abba said:

There is Mat.8:17 (quoting the Isa.53 text) that clearly indicates that the Bible is speaking of physical healing of physical sickness.

Mark 2:1-16 is the context for verse 17. Verses 1-12 is a physical healing. In Isa.53 the verses address sins and also peace for the soul and then the physical for health. God is concerned with our entire being made whole.

But God doesnt make everyone whole physically. How do you explain this?

[Marathoner]

God does as He pleases. The Lord is the giver of gifts, not man. Whatsoever the Almighty accomplishes on this earth, it's done according to His will and purpose. Whatever we ask for in accordance with His will and purpose, we receive; but it's not our place to abjure the power of the Lord. Who are we to question God? To expect or demand that He do this or that?

How are we to know the will and purpose of the Lord unless He is pleased to reveal this to us? And how are we to know Him unless we are in Him, and He dwells with us? If we belong to Him and the Lord God calls us friend then we hear His voice; we hear His voice, and He is pleased to reveal His will and purpose to His friends, the bondservants of Jesus Christ. 

Decades ago a precious brother in Christ spoke a simple prayer to the Lord, in accordance with the will of God revealed by His Spirit. My brother said of me, "Lord, heal and restore him as it pleases You." He uttered this prayer after we parted ways. 

Was our brother privy to the whole counsel of the Lord? No. No one was; he had no way of knowing that I was afflicted so that the power of Christ might be displayed in me. My old friend only knew that I was afflicted and he wept and prayed for my sake. The prayer was prophetic. 

Many years later, disease ravaged this body and I was close to death. The Spirit of the Lord came and it pleased Him to reverse the course of the illness so I might live; I was healed. Two years later, it pleased the Lord to baptize me in His Spirit and so I was restored. 

A simple petition made in accordance with the will and purpose of Almighty God accomplishes much. Not our will, but His will be done. That it pleases the Lord to reveal what will come to pass to His bondservants is wonderful beyond words.   

[Whyme]

Timothy had illness but he was a student of a real apostle. I dont demand nor expect healing. All i ask of God is that He save me. Sure i pray for healing, but i'm much more interested in the new man who is incorruptible and will not decay. I want to see the place where God wipes away every tear. Thats my focus. I asked the Lord to show me the end of my days so i would know my life is just a vapor, here today and gone tomorrow. Who is to say my illness isnt really a blessing?

Edited June 2, 2021 by Whyme