Husband was kicking our cat

[bornagain2011]

46 minutes ago, BK1110 said:

You do indeed need counseling from a strong, Godly pastor. If you feel your current pastor is not up to the task, you might need to ask yourself if he is up to the task of leading a congregation. A pastor that cannot give Godly, Biblical counsel to see someone to repentance of sin...is that even a pastor at all?

He says he can do it, but he doesn't have a degree etc so he would use the bible. He doesn't have experience YET with marriage counseling. He has offered to counsel us, but my husband doesn't want to make things weird between them. Even pastor's wife said it might make coming to church weird for us. 

I talked to my husband some more before I took the kids out for a few hours. That's when he admitted that he was kicking her. He asked if I wanted to separate. I don't think so, but it hurts that he doesn't seem to care. Maybe I am over reacting, if I just let things go and overlook character flaws, things go a lot smoother and we seem happier. 

I think maybe the enemy is trying to separate us. I don't want to make a mistake and throw away my marriage if there is nothing majorly wrong. My husband doesn't seem to care much and brings up divorce and separation a lot. 

Maybe I will ask pastor if he knows anyone that could counsel us. 

[BK1110]

A referral would be a good idea. No degree is nessicary, just the Bible; if your husband hears God's word and will not obey the Lord's commands, I don't see how someone with a degree will change that.

"Husbands, love your wives, as Christ loved the church, and gave himself up for her, that he might sanctify her, having cleansed her by the washing of water with the word, so that he might present the church to himself in splendor, without spot or wrinkle or any such thing, that she might be holy and without blemish. In the same way husbands should love their wives as their own bodies. He who loves his wife loves himself. For no one ever hated his own flesh, but nourishes and cherishes it, just as Christ does the church, for we are members of his body." -- Ephesians 5:25-30

I'm in my 30s, never been a pastor, never been to seminary, never been to college. It doesn't take fancy training, just knowing and believing and applying God's word. Have your husband read that passage. You know, the preceding two verses are about wives submitting to their husbands, and that's all it is; just to submit. Then you get five long verses about husbands loving their wives to the same degree that Christ Jesus himself loves the church. That is an extremely serious and heavy burden. He's not just to love you, but to love you to the degree of sacrificing his own needs, indeed his own life if nessicary, for you, and to be your spiritual leader and guide, teaching scripture, and modeling his life after Christ. Reading that passage, that much is clear. Can your husband say he is following that order from the Lord as to how he is to lead your household? Does he even care?

This is why counseling from a strong, preferably older male Christian who is steeped in the Word of God is so critical. He must be confronted with the sins that clearly have strongholds in his life and heart. We are called to abhor and make war against our sin. Your husband's flippancy about the whole thing is very telling.

[Starise]

I don't know your husband so I would doubt I totally know everything that's going on. I can only give a generalization of some men I know who have been through similar things. Men often feel that it's a sign of weakness to ask for help. To go to a meeting and talk about weaknesses they have can be VERY difficult. Some will only go if things get very very bad first leaving all other options off the table, ESPECIALLY if going means there could be a potential breach of confidentiality. I once went to a church where the pastor talked about people he has spoken with. Things that "were not supposed to get out". My church has an appointed deacon or friend you can go to . This has to be a person you trust. 

He might feel he has a grip on this weakness only to slip up again occasionally. Since he has already seen how you respond he will be hesitant to be transparent if failure occurs again. He may be having trouble admitting to himself that he needs help so he minimizes it so he won't have to deal with it and maybe hoping he can eventually deal with it quietly and discretely. All of this internal struggle is likely tearing him apart on the inside and it occasionally comes out in outward behavior. The harder he tries to pretend everything is alright the more difficult it really is and so he might be doing things like  kicking the cat and then denying it was as bad as it really was. Some sins need much prayer and a contrite heart to get away from. If anything he really needs you more than ever through this. To distance from him will make him feel those closest to him are alienating him when he needs them the most.

It appears there is an internal struggle going on he is dealing with. If he is a child of God, and if he really desires to change, God will change his heart. I would challenge him to ask God to do whatever is necessary to change. You need to be patient here. This isn't always an overnight sort of change.

The pros- He is reading the Bible. He is in church. He seems to have a love for the Lord. You say he is pretty much a good man. There are no perfect men.

Throwing the Divorce/separation word around for effect can be very harmful. In a way this is letting him down because when you married him you promised to be with him. Most vows say for better or worse. Truly good relationships do not end when there are problems. Pornographic addiction can be a very hard thing to admit, especially if he is around men who say that having this drive aside from marriage is "normal" male sex drive. It may be common but it should not be normal for a believer to be involved in. God will convict a true believer of this. If he was involved in a compromising situation, then this was a very unwise move. We should never put ourselves in a position to easily fall. He needs to cater to better surroundings and people, especially good Christian men. It may be a blessing he was fired.

The sad thing is that today if a woman wants a divorce and seeks support for her decision she will often find it if she listens to those voices the devil puts in her path. Satan would like nothing better than to split your marriage and have your children caught in the middle of it. You will pay for a bad decision for many many years to come. It doesn't magically go away when you sign divorce papers. In many ways it creates more problems that never go away. Trust me on that one.

I would pray for him continually that the Lord will show him what he needs to do and that the Lord will do whatever is necessary to get him away from it. Just a fair warning. It might not be pretty but God knows what He is doing.

 

Edited March 17, 2021 by Starise

[Riverwalker]

1 hour ago, bornagain2011 said:

no, I had to show him what he did, and he admitted he kicked her, it wasn't hard (which I guess is how he defines kicking), but he kicked her. He likes to act like he doesn't know what things mean sometimes. Like "flirting", he has double standards about things. 

Okay Understood.  There are not that many choices here. You just have to seek God as to which is the right one

 

[bornagain2011]

35 minutes ago, BK1110 said:

A referral would be a good idea. No degree is nessicary, just the Bible; if your husband hears God's word and will not obey the Lord's commands, I don't see how someone with a degree will change that.

"Husbands, love your wives, as Christ loved the church, and gave himself up for her, that he might sanctify her, having cleansed her by the washing of water with the word, so that he might present the church to himself in splendor, without spot or wrinkle or any such thing, that she might be holy and without blemish. In the same way husbands should love their wives as their own bodies. He who loves his wife loves himself. For no one ever hated his own flesh, but nourishes and cherishes it, just as Christ does the church, for we are members of his body." -- Ephesians 5:25-30

I'm in my 30s, never been a pastor, never been to seminary, never been to college. It doesn't take fancy training, just knowing and believing and applying God's word. Have your husband read that passage. You know, the preceding two verses are about wives submitting to their husbands, and that's all it is; just to submit. Then you get five long verses about husbands loving their wives to the same degree that Christ Jesus himself loves the church. That is an extremely serious and heavy burden. He's not just to love you, but to love you to the degree of sacrificing his own needs, indeed his own life if nessicary, for you, and to be your spiritual leader and guide, teaching scripture, and modeling his life after Christ. Reading that passage, that much is clear. Can your husband say he is following that order from the Lord as to how he is to lead your household? Does he even care?

This is why counseling from a strong, preferably older male Christian who is steeped in the Word of God is so critical. He must be confronted with the sins that clearly have strongholds in his life and heart. We are called to abhor and make war against our sin. Your husband's flippancy about the whole thing is very telling.

Thank you for your advice. My husband is in his 40's and I am in my 30's, like our Pastor who is actually a few years younger. I think it would be a good idea to get counseling from an older person. I need to also ask God to soften my heart as well because I am fairly bitter and resentful about a lot of things from the past. I need help with forgiveness and moving on.

[bornagain2011]

23 minutes ago, Starise said:

I don't know your husband so I would doubt I totally know everything that's going on. I can only give a generalization of some men I know who have been through similar things. Men often feel that it's a sign of weakness to ask for help. To go to a meeting and talk about weaknesses they have can be VERY difficult. Some will only go if things get very very bad first leaving all other options off the table, ESPECIALLY if going means there could be a potential breach of confidentiality. I once went to a church where the pastor talked about people he has spoken with. Things that "were not supposed to get out". My church has an appointed deacon or friend you can go to . This has to be a person you trust. 

He might feel he has a grip on this weakness only to slip up again occasionally. Since he has already seen how you respond he will be hesitant to be transparent if failure occurs again. He may be having trouble admitting to himself that he needs help so he minimizes it so he won't have to deal with it and maybe hoping he can eventually deal with it quietly and discretely. All of this internal struggle is likely tearing him apart on the inside and it occasionally comes out in how outward behavior because the harder to pretend everything is alright such as kicking the cat and then denying it was as bad as it really was. Some sins need much prayer and a contrite heart to get away from. If anything he really needs you more than ever through this. To distance from him will make him feel those closest to him are alienating him when he needs them the most.

It appears there is an internal struggle going on he is dealing with. If he is a child of God, and if he really desires to change, God will change his heart. I would challenge him to ask God to do whatever is necessary to change. You need to be patient here. This isn't always an overnight sort of change.

The pros- He is reading the Bible. He is in church. He seems to have a love for the Lord. You say he is pretty much a good man. There are no perfect men.

Throwing the Divorce/separation word around for effect can be very harmful. In a way this is letting him down because when you married him you promised to be with him. Most vows say for better or worse. Truly good relationships do not end when there are problems. Pornographic addiction can be a very hard thing to admit, especially if he is around men who say that having this drive aside from marriage is "normal" male sex drive. It may be common but it should not be normal for a believer to be involved in. God will convict a true believer of this. If he was involved in a compromising situation, then this was a very unwise move. We should never put ourselves in a position to easily fall. He needs to cater to better surroundings and people, especially good Christian men. It may be a blessing he was fired.

The sad thing is that today if a woman wants a divorce and seeks support for her decision she will often find it if she listens to those voices the devil puts in her path. Satan would like nothing better than to split your marriage and have your children caught in the middle of it. You will pay for a bad decision for many many years to come. It doesn't magically go away when you sign divorce papers. In many ways it creates more problems that never go away. Trust me on that one.

I would pray for him continually that the Lord will show him what he needs to do and that the Lord will do whatever is necessary to get him away from it. Just a fair warning. It might not be pretty but God knows what He is doing.

 

Well, I was hoping that when he would see how absolutely crushed I was each time I found out he would feel awful and never do it again, he would SEEM to feel awful, but it would happen again. The last time it happened I told him I would leave him if it happened again, and when I found out this last time and reminded him of what I said he said "I forgot you had said that" how convenient. Him flirting with women and watching porn makes me feel like they are what he really wants and he just has to be with me because we are married, but I am not what he REALLY wants. 

When I found out the last time it was because his phone kept getting spam, and he kept changing his story over and over again and doing the whole "trickle truth" so I don't even know now what the truth is. I just sat there, not screaming or crying, just so over it. And then I found out some other stuff that night, like a female co worker had tried to entice him to go to the bathroom with him, and he had been talking to her, and somehow knows where she lives. This was about 5 months ago. I almost separated from him that night, but my friend convinced me to stay with him and join a marriage group (which was a flop) and do a mentoring program. 

I don't know how I could stick with him emotionally and not alienate him when he is being unfaithful. I would feel like I was rewarding bad behavior. And I feel like I can't keep submitting and touching that hot stove to keep getting burnt over and over again. 

We apologized a little while ago. Not like we will ever resolve the issue because he still doesn't think he did anything wrong even though he said he DID kick her, but he won't admit it was wrong. Yet I must forgive him. 

So you think I should be closer to him and loving etc? But what happens if he either drops his guard and confesses MORE stuff, or he sees me being so nice and decides to take advantage of that and sneak around because he gets the best of both worlds?

Him and I both know that we married for the wrong reasons. I was feeling very convicted about being intimate without being married, and I knew we couldn't stay away from each other, and I didn't want anyone else to have him, and also I loved how he made me feel. He married me I guess because he loved me? He thought marriage would be fun and it should be pretty easy. Yes, he told me these things. And he likes things easy with the least amount of effort possible. Projects get half done around the house, and left for a long time before I mention things and he does them in a big huff. So that's the kind of energy he puts in to working on our marriage as well. He doesn't want to talk about hard stuff. That's why he would talk to other women at work and flirt with them because they were fun etc. This is what he told me. I just feel like I am not good enough, never good enough.

If God convicts true believers, then how come I always have to PRY the truth out of my husband??! He will take his lies to his grave, he doesn't act convicted AT ALL. He acts completely normal while he is caught up in sin. It's so scary. Yet, when I talk too long to pastor, or comment on a guy's fb post I feel awful and tell my husband all about it. I tell him everything. Maybe too much. But I hate feeling convicted, it eats me up inside. When I have sinned in the past by being emotionally entangled with a man at our old church, I would feel so so convicted about every single text, even though they were seldom and usually always about ministry, I would have to tell my husband right away because I felt awful. I couldn't eat or sleep, it affected my mood. But my husband... acts the same.

This is why we need counseling. Now I feel like it is all my fault again, like I am crazy and over reacting. I don't think I could divorce, I have been through a previous divorce and it affected my 2 girls even though they were young, so I couldn't do that to our little boy. But sometimes I daydream about being free, free of fighting and arguments, free of worry and paranoia. I just want to be happy. I want to either be alone and happy, or with someone who loves me enough to be truthful with me and loyal to me. One thing I know for certain though, if something were to happen and I ended up alone again I will stay that way. Marriage is too much work and too much pain. I envy single people sometimes because they don't have to deal with an unfaithful spouse, or all the disagreements all the time. 

[BK1110]

36 minutes ago, bornagain2011 said:

Thank you for your advice. My husband is in his 40's and I am in my 30's, like our Pastor who is actually a few years younger. I think it would be a good idea to get counseling from an older person. I need to also ask God to soften my heart as well because I am fairly bitter and resentful about a lot of things from the past. I need help with forgiveness and moving on.

I will be praying for you, sister!

[Starise]

32 minutes ago, bornagain2011 said:

Well, I was hoping that when he would see how absolutely crushed I was each time I found out he would feel awful and never do it again, he would SEEM to feel awful, but it would happen again. The last time it happened I told him I would leave him if it happened again, and when I found out this last time and reminded him of what I said he said "I forgot you had said that" how convenient. Him flirting with women and watching porn makes me feel like they are what he really wants and he just has to be with me because we are married, but I am not what he REALLY wants. 

When I found out the last time it was because his phone kept getting spam, and he kept changing his story over and over again and doing the whole "trickle truth" so I don't even know now what the truth is. I just sat there, not screaming or crying, just so over it. And then I found out some other stuff that night, like a female co worker had tried to entice him to go to the bathroom with him, and he had been talking to her, and somehow knows where she lives. This was about 5 months ago. I almost separated from him that night, but my friend convinced me to stay with him and join a marriage group (which was a flop) and do a mentoring program. 

I don't know how I could stick with him emotionally and not alienate him when he is being unfaithful. I would feel like I was rewarding bad behavior. And I feel like I can't keep submitting and touching that hot stove to keep getting burnt over and over again. 

We apologized a little while ago. Not like we will ever resolve the issue because he still doesn't think he did anything wrong even though he said he DID kick her, but he won't admit it was wrong. Yet I must forgive him. 

So you think I should be closer to him and loving etc? But what happens if he either drops his guard and confesses MORE stuff, or he sees me being so nice and decides to take advantage of that and sneak around because he gets the best of both worlds?

Him and I both know that we married for the wrong reasons. I was feeling very convicted about being intimate without being married, and I knew we couldn't stay away from each other, and I didn't want anyone else to have him, and also I loved how he made me feel. He married me I guess because he loved me? He thought marriage would be fun and it should be pretty easy. Yes, he told me these things. And he likes things easy with the least amount of effort possible. Projects get half done around the house, and left for a long time before I mention things and he does them in a big huff. So that's the kind of energy he puts in to working on our marriage as well. He doesn't want to talk about hard stuff. That's why he would talk to other women at work and flirt with them because they were fun etc. This is what he told me. I just feel like I am not good enough, never good enough.

If God convicts true believers, then how come I always have to PRY the truth out of my husband??! He will take his lies to his grave, he doesn't act convicted AT ALL. He acts completely normal while he is caught up in sin. It's so scary. Yet, when I talk too long to pastor, or comment on a guy's fb post I feel awful and tell my husband all about it. I tell him everything. Maybe too much. But I hate feeling convicted, it eats me up inside. When I have sinned in the past by being emotionally entangled with a man at our old church, I would feel so so convicted about every single text, even though they were seldom and usually always about ministry, I would have to tell my husband right away because I felt awful. I couldn't eat or sleep, it affected my mood. But my husband... acts the same.

This is why we need counseling. Now I feel like it is all my fault again, like I am crazy and over reacting. I don't think I could divorce, I have been through a previous divorce and it affected my 2 girls even though they were young, so I couldn't do that to our little boy. But sometimes I daydream about being free, free of fighting and arguments, free of worry and paranoia. I just want to be happy. I want to either be alone and happy, or with someone who loves me enough to be truthful with me and loyal to me. One thing I know for certain though, if something were to happen and I ended up alone again I will stay that way. Marriage is too much work and too much pain. I envy single people sometimes because they don't have to deal with an unfaithful spouse, or all the disagreements all the time. 

I was afraid my response would sound one sided to you as the woman who has to put up with these things. This was not my intention. I am in no way excusing his behavior. The man I described is a man who wants to do the right thing, is a true believer and wants to change for good.

I came from a household where my mother was a Christian and my dad was not. My mom was in church while my dad was out at the bars. My dad didn't seem to have a conscience. He just did what he wanted to do and looked at my mom like she was nuts, even ran her down to friends. So I LIVED in that and I seen it first hand. Not only that, HIS dad had no interest in God at all so it seems to have ran in that side of the family. In pursuit of women and drink  I seen my dad destroy both our family and his life. Yet there was one foundation in our family- My mother. Her life eventually led to him changing, however this took a very long time to happen. The Lord took her at a fairly young age which in looking back I think was a blessing.

I sincerely hope God gets a choke hold on your husband before things get too bad. My dad had to loose everything to eventually wake up and smell the coffee. Only God can change a heart. Much prayer is needed. Counselling might help to some extent, but really it's a lot like a diet. A person can go on as many diets as they want to but if they don't stick to it and really want to loose weight they will remain overweight. Some people will attend counselling because it looks good on the outside, then they can argue they tried "counselling' and it didn't work. If he gets dragged into counselling complaining about it I would doubt his sincerity.

He might need some tough love to get the point across. Not everyone is the same. People often tend to get complacent in relationships and often take each other for granted. He seems to need a wakeup call from the Lord.

Edited March 17, 2021 by Starise

[bornagain2011]

31 minutes ago, Starise said:

I was afraid my response would sound one sided to you as the woman who has to put up with these things. This was not my intention. I am in no way excusing his behavior. The man I described is a man who wants to do the right thing, is a true believer and wants to change for good.

I came from a household where my mother was a Christian and my dad was not. My mom was in church while my dad was out at the bars. My dad didn't seem to have a conscience. He just did what he wanted to do and looked at my mom like she was nuts, even ran her down to friends. So I LIVED in that and I seen it first hand. Not only that, HIS dad had no interest in God at all so it seems to have ran in that side of the family. In pursuit of women and drink  I seen my dad destroy both our family and his life. Yet there was one foundation in our family- My mother. Her life eventually led to him changing, however this took a very long time to happen. The Lord took her at a fairly young age which in looking back I think was a blessing.

I sincerely hope God gets a choke hold on your husband before things get too bad. My dad had to loose everything to eventually wake up and smell the coffee. Only God can change a heart. Much prayer is needed. Counselling might help to some extent, but really it's a lot like a diet. A person can go on as many diets as they want to but if they don't stick to it and really want to loose weight they will remain overweight. Some people will attend counselling because it looks good on the outside, then they can argue they tried "counselling' and it didn't work. If he gets dragged into counselling complaining about it I would doubt his sincerity.

He might need some tough love to get the point across. Not everyone is the same. People often tend to get complcent in relationships and often take each other for granted. He seems to need a wakeup call from the Lord.

Thank you for your response. I was not offended at all

My husband told me today that he is trying to change, he doesn't talk to any women at work at all, and doesn't feel tempted to watch anything online. I hope that it's the Lord changing him and not him trying to change himself.

I like that analogy about dieting, it is really helpful because I can relate to that. It's not a sprint, it's a marathon. You have to "earn" permanent weight loss by BECOMING a different person inside, you can't just crash diet your way to slim and expect to stay that way because you didn't really change.

I guess I can't expect my marriage to be perfect, it's going to take work because we aren't perfect. It takes work and consistency, like weight loss. 

I am really sorry you grew up in that kind of environment. I can't imagine going through that. My parents had problems too, I guess my dad was a drinker, and did drugs etc, but my parents always argued behind closed doors. My mom was not a christian, but she drug us to catholic church while my dad stayed home to watch Nascar.

If I were to be honest, I would say I need a wake up call as well, God needs to soften my heart as well. I want to want to try, if that makes sense.

 

Edited March 17, 2021 by bornagain2011

[AnOrangeCat]

I've found that the use of scripture in personal arguments can come off as very much a blunt force thing, but sometimes it's needed. So far as the cat goes there's Proverbs 12:10, which says that the righteous regard the lives of their animals. Unless the cats have a history of violently fighting with each other or the younger one has some special conditions it's probably best to let them figure out the pecking order and their boundaries on their own. I say this as someone who's had cats for about 20 years.

Regarding his reluctance to see the pastor for counseling, Galatians 6:2 tells us to "bear one another's burdens and so fulfill the law of Christ". Sharing our problems with other Christians is what allows us to do that. That really applies to sharing with your friend, too. The very least any fellow Christian can do is to lend an ear to you. Another thing to keep in mind is that the Bible also encourages a certain amount of social pressuring when it comes to dealing with sin as outlined in Matthew 18:15-17. There's also what Jesus said in Matthew 5:29: If an eye causes us to stumble, pluck it out. Don't push for a literal interpretation there. It's probably less about the eye and more about ease of access. The porn is an addiction so it should be treated as such. Part of breaking addictions is making them difficult to access.

I have to agree with DDisconnect that you should draw a hard line. Aside from the counseling part of that should involve letting you set up and control the necessary filters to block pornography on the computer. It's a long way from being perfect or foolproof, but every hurdle you put between an addict and their addiction helps.