A Process Or Now

[Sower]

9 hours ago, Rockson said:

So what do you people think here. I believe decisive action needs to take place when it comes to things like this. What say you? Appreciate your input. 

As a believer many decades I and my wife in our spiritual growing still miss God's standard (sin) every day, and based upon God's word (standard). I have, in my mind, committed murder and adultery, fornication pride, mentally  judging others etc etc. We're still working on it yet God says the heart is deceitful above all things, desperately wicked and who can know it. Reality.  Then there is God's grace.  I always think of the man king David, a man after God's own heart, and how he fell down in his walk. I am no greater nor less in mine.

There but by the grace of God go I.   Young believers need encouragement more than judgement.

I could be way wrong but it sounds like the church body may be more concerned with its reputation/rules than the spiritual health and growth of the baby believers having difficulties developing stronger spiritual legs that do take time. I remember the years it took me to grow and my friends who were patient and caring and praying for my growth and understanding.

A wise seasoned Christian woman that befriends a new member, say a just saved woman dressing inappropriately, can do more in friendship sharing dressing in modesty, than joining a gossip group pointing fingers at rule breakers.
Give em a chance to understand before the church runs them off

My wife listening to my constant concerns and worries for our kids and our grand kids in their walk and spiritual growing pains  is always reminding me   "It will work out" (and it has/does) bathed with prayers.
Today by coincidence we'll celebrate our 52nd wedding anniversary.

Through so many rocky roads, our marriage is still working out.
Ain't God good, and HIS timing, not ours,  is perfect.

If I knew you like you know you, I wouldn't listen to you.
But if you knew me like I know me, (God forbid) you wouldn't listen either....

 

 

[JimmyB]

2 hours ago, BibleStudent100 said:

The Bible places fornicators and adulterers (even if they are in "committed relationships") in the same category as homosexuals.  This understanding is repeated numerous times in the Bible, one of which is this verse:

Do you not know that the unrighteous will not inherit the kingdom of God? Do not be deceived. Neither the sexually immoral, nor idolaters, nor adulterers, nor male prostitutes, nor homosexuals, 1 nor thieves, nor covetous, nor drunkards, nor revilers, nor extortioners will inherit the kingdom of God.

1 Corinthians 6: 9,10

This quote is totally irrelevant.  As I said to Rockson, people living together does not imply intercourse. And you even stretch it to mean the sexually immoral, idolaters, adulterers, male prostitutes, homosexuals, thieves, covetors, drunkards, revilers, and extortioners!!!

There is no sin in people living together!  Jesus followers were both men and women and they traveled and lived together.  That is not a sin!  Luke 8:1-3, "After this, Jesus traveled about from one town and village to another, proclaiming the good news of the kingdom of God. The Twelve were with him, and also some women who had been cured of evil spirits and diseases: Mary (called Magdalene) from whom seven demons had come out; Joanna the wife of Chuza, the manager of Herod’s household; Susanna, and many others." 

You and Rockson need to adjust your thinking and not judge people based on your imagination instead of fact.

[Vine Abider]

51 minutes ago, JimmyB said:

This quote is totally irrelevant.  As I said to Rockson, people living together does not imply intercourse. And you even stretch it to mean the sexually immoral, idolaters, adulterers, male prostitutes, homosexuals, thieves, covetors, drunkards, revilers, and extortioners!!!

There is no sin in people living together!  Jesus followers were both men and women and they traveled and lived together.  That is not a sin!  Luke 8:1-3, "After this, Jesus traveled about from one town and village to another, proclaiming the good news of the kingdom of God. The Twelve were with him, and also some women who had been cured of evil spirits and diseases: Mary (called Magdalene) from whom seven demons had come out; Joanna the wife of Chuza, the manager of Herod’s household; Susanna, and many others." 

You and Rockson need to adjust your thinking and not judge people based on your imagination instead of fact.

No, of course just "living together" is not a sin, if that's taken strictly on face value. But "living together" usually has the connotation of being together sexually, at least that's the common meaning these days, right?

[Rockson]

4 hours ago, Neighbor said:

My "opinion" God can fix it.

One of my most fond memories in that area of concern occurred when my pastor addressed a couple during Sunday's worship services saying, This couple (He called them by name) and myself were talking this morning about their not getting married before God. They said that after seven years they are  indeed ready. So I ask of them are you ready? If so we can get it fixed right now.

They looked at him and declared yes! We went right into their  wedding ceremony before God amongst the congregation. 

God can fix it indeed.

Interesting account. 

[Rockson]

2 hours ago, JimmyB said:

This quote is totally irrelevant.  As I said to Rockson, people living together does not imply intercourse. And you even stretch it to mean the sexually immoral, idolaters, adulterers, male prostitutes, homosexuals, thieves, covetors, drunkards, revilers, and extortioners!!!

There is no sin in people living together!  Jesus followers were both men and women and they traveled and lived together.  That is not a sin!  Luke 8:1-3, "After this, Jesus traveled about from one town and village to another, proclaiming the good news of the kingdom of God. The Twelve were with him, and also some women who had been cured of evil spirits and diseases: Mary (called Magdalene) from whom seven demons had come out; Joanna the wife of Chuza, the manager of Herod’s household; Susanna, and many others." 

You and Rockson need to adjust your thinking and not judge people based on your imagination instead of fact.

I do thank you for your input. Even though I have some reservations in regard to what you've said I did ask for opinions and am willing to consider them. Actually i would say it DOES imply having a physicals relationship and I think most everyone knows that. Is it possible that's not taking place? Yes possible but highly doubtful as people have put themselves in a place of great temptation. I think most know that too. 

I think your usage of Lk 8 is pretty weak in this regard. So if they had tents are you saying female A would be laying in a closed area with a male that it wouldn't open them up to great temptation? Are you suggesting Jesus would approve of that? Doesn't make sense to me. And if they were in one big room as a massive group, and maybe this is what took place on the day of Pentecost 40 days in the upper room....tarrying.....I have an impossible time envisioning an unmarried couple would be in a room by themselves. 

And back to your post....it does not imply intercourse. And what if the individuals I'm talking about don't deny at all that they're engaging in such? So are you saying you would be against this if you knew it meant that for these people? 

 

 

[Rockson]

4 hours ago, Sower said:

As a believer many decades I and my wife in our spiritual growing still miss God's standard (sin) every day, and based upon God's word (standard). I have, in my mind, committed murder and adultery, fornication pride, mentally  judging others etc etc. We're still working on it yet God says the heart is deceitful above all things, desperately wicked and who can know it. Reality.  Then there is God's grace.  I always think of the man king David, a man after God's own heart, and how he fell down in his walk. I am no greater nor less in mine.

There but by the grace of God go I.   Young believers need encouragement more than judgement.

There are various things you've said which is right and true....I agree, HOWEVER what are we to do with I call it God's instructions through the Apostle Paul which states the following, I'll condense it and put it in my own words but by all means look at the passage,  1 Cor 5 (the whole chapter) 

It states for the sexually immoral they should be removed from  fellowship from the ones so doing. He states but they were proud...meaning what? That they wanted to have a reputation for being loving people by allowing things they shouldn't but really it wasn't true love at all? That is was just the reputation they wanted to have pride about being a certain way. But Paul stated, Know you not that a little leaven spoils the whole lump in other words if you close one's eye to it OTHERS would be or could be affected. Other can look at that and state well look it's really not all the bad for look at so and so they're doing it so why can't I?  Wouldn't that be called allowing as leaders corrupting influences? Does it not then make the other persons sin become their  sin as a leader for the Sheppard is to PROTECT the sheep? 

 6Your boasting is not good. Do you not know that a little leaven works through the whole batch of dough? 

 

4 hours ago, Sower said:

I could be way wrong but it sounds like the church body may be more concerned with its reputation/rules than the spiritual health and growth of the baby believers having difficulties developing stronger spiritual legs that do take time.

 

Well actually I'd say that's true but in reverse in the way that you're assessing it. Paul in 1 Cor 5 stated they were in PRIDE because they would NOT deal in a decisive manner with the issue, that is when it came to fornication.  . It was people that didn't deal with it in the name of wanting to appear like loving that he said they were wrongly esteeming a type of reputation God didn't want them to have. Yes God told people to judge not and yet 1 Cor 5 says we are to judge. Not a contradiction but context needs to be considered. 

Edited August 14, 2023 by Rockson

[Rockson]

7 hours ago, Neighbor said:

Marriage is made rather complicated by government, more so than by God. Government rulings laws and decisions that come about because of  government rules pertaining to marriage get very complicated. SO I personally understand why many do not get married before government authority, as contrasted with being married in the sight of God.

So what are you saying constitutes marriage in the sight of God. A religious spiritual ceremony or none at all? 

7 hours ago, Neighbor said:

 Sometimes you have to walk a mile in another person's shoes in order to gain valid understanding of the effect of your own demands and opinions about what the other person must do.

Or could it be there are times when the messenger is condemned that it's their demands when all the time it is God's? 

7 hours ago, Neighbor said:

 

 

Edited August 14, 2023 by Rockson

[Neighbor]

3 minutes ago, Rockson said:

So what are you saying constitutes marriage in the sight of God. A religious spiritual ceremony or none at all? 

Or could it be there are times when the messenger is condemned that it's their demands when all the time it is God's? 

 

Hi, As far as I am concerned my yes is yes and my no is no before God and man; but I am also not so dumb as to think the USA SS administration is going to pay monthly widow's retirement benefits to my widow if there is no legal State approved documentation of our marriage. 

I searched it all out for myself in lengthy exasperating and expensive detail some 8 years ago now. I was amazed, emotionally drained, and financially challenged in facing the details of a second marriage in one's lifetime.

The primary reason  I actually married, a  ceremony recognized by government, was for the legal benefits my  bride would be entitled to should I predecease her.  Now there is romance eh?

My bride was my wife for life the moment I met her, actually the moment I asked her to meet in person, having known of her only through our common association on a Christian message board. I did not need official stamps, documents, ceremonies, but I went through the process of getting them anyway.

The pre nup process was absolutely terrible, going through  the very same process that is a divorce procedure. 

[Rockson]

7 hours ago, Neighbor said:

Want to kill the romance of being a couple intending to spend life together, go through a pre nup agreement process so that  all the government rules are covered should the marriage end ( And it will one way or another). It (The pre  nup) is actually a divorce settlement combined with a last will and testament package written up and agreed to  before marriage.

Interesting. Of course this is a different topic but is a pre nup really that horrible? My wife and I don't have one....been married 45 years.....but you do see some older couples get married.....each one might have adult offspring and what a sad thing to see a whole inheritance go off to some new person and the kids get nothing. I've seen that happen. 

7 hours ago, Neighbor said:

 

 

[Rockson]

6 minutes ago, Neighbor said:

Hi, As far as I am concerned my yes is yes and my no is no before God and man; but I am also not so dumb as to think the USA SS administration is going to pay monthly widow's retirement benefits to my widow if there is no legal State approved documentation of our marriage. 

I searched it all out for myself in lengthy exasperating and expensive detail some 8 years ago now. I was amazed, emotionally drained, and financially challenged in facing the details of a second marriage in one's lifetime.

The primary reason  I actually married, a  ceremony recognized by government, was for the legal benefits my  bride would be entitled to should I predecease her.  Now there is romance eh?

My bride was my wife for life the moment I met her, actually the moment I asked her to meet in person, having known of her only through our common association on a Christian message board. I did not need official stamps, documents, ceremonies, but I went through the process of getting them anyway.

The pre nup process was absolutely terrible, going through  the very same process that is a divorce procedure. 

Interesting post.