Shilohsfoal Posted September 20, 2023 Group: Royal Member Followers: 1 Topic Count: 153 Topics Per Day: 0.06 Content Count: 5,881 Content Per Day: 2.45 Reputation: 330 Days Won: 1 Joined: 10/22/2017 Status: Offline Share Posted September 20, 2023 (edited) 9 hours ago, transmogrified said: Christians are not working for the devil in his army, all whose names are not written in the Lamb's Book of Life will be following the beast...not the believers... Absolutely false...its those that loved not the truth that God gave over to strong delusion to believe the miracles and signs the anti christ does to deceive the world...the believers love the truth and will refuse his mark and will not worship him...he sets himself in the temple of God showing himself to be God, but WHO is worshiping him and the devil? Rev. 13: 4 'And THEY (all the world...not the believers) worshipped the dragon which gave power unto the beast; and THEY (all the world...not the believers) worshipped the beast saying 'who is like unto the beast and who is able to make war with him...' As he said the time will come when they will kill you thinking they do God a service...but see who is doing what...THEY (those within the beast system...not true believers) will kill YOU (the true believers, not those working within the beast system) ...so the beast that kills the two prophets are those who will kill you thinking they do God a service...the distinction is 'THEY (of the beast system) will kill YOU (the true believer) thinking they do God a service...not the beast system will kill those of the beast system thinking they do God a service... And what of the scenario you are painting? At the second coming the beast is taken and with him the false prophet and they are cast alive into the lake of fire, but you have a system where God gathers the tares, (falsely portrayed as being the two prophets) as being taken up BEFORE THE LAST TRUMP in a rapture to heaven...if all the tares are gathered BEFORE the last trump, then why would it be that the beast and false prophet were not raptured up before Jesus comes as well? Because there was no resurrection of anyone before the last trump, much less a rapture to heaven for the wicked, much less two different raptures for the wicked at two different times...absolutely false.... The wicked are not resurrected BEFORE the last day...Scripture states he will judge the living and the dead AT his appearing and kingdom, not BEFORE his appearing and kingdom...so you have a resurrection posited that CANNOT AND WILL NOT HAPPEN BEFORE HE COMES. Even the Thessalonians Paul told them about those who were persecuting them in that day...what did he say? He said it was a righteous thing with God to recompense tribulation to those who were troubling them...and what kind of tribulation was he talking about? He said he would take vengeance on them with flaming fire ( 2 Thess. 2:8) And when would this act of vengeance take place on those who were troubling them? He said: 'WHEN HE SHALL COME TO BE GLORIFIED IN HIS SAINTS...' and when would that be? Before he comes? No. Hardly...Not at all...he will be glorified in his saints at the last trump, at his appearing and kingdom...and these people who were persecuting the Thessalonians would suffer the vengeance of flaming fire WHEN HE COMES, not BEFORE HE COMES...BUT WHEN HE COMES...and he does not come before the last trump sounds. According to scripture God will take vengeance in flaming fire on the wicked dead WHEN HE COMES...NOT BEFORE HE COMES, as you have postulated...they were not already in flames of fire before he came..Paul said specifically he would take vengeance on them with flaming fire WHEN HE COMES TO BE GLORIFIED IN THE SAINTS...AND THE SAINTS DO NOT GET GLORIFIED UNTIL THE LAST TRUMP. Caiphas would have also missed the alleged rapture for the wicked as he is seen on the earth AT THE SECOND COMING and SEES Jesus returning with all the saints in the clouds.. according to the false rapture for the wicked scenario he should have been resurrected and raptured to heaven along with the two prophets before the last trump sounded to be cast into the lake of fire allegedly up in heaven. No...He was ON EARTH, not in heaven when Jesus came...you are positing that the wicked are raptured up to heaven to the alleged lake of fire BEFORE the last trump sounds...but it did not happen to Caiphas, it did not happen to the beast and the false prophet, and it will not happen to anybody because there is no rapture for the wicked, nor is the lake of fire in heaven, nor will anyone get resurrected before the last day, much less all the wicked. Seeing the wicked dead do not get judged UNTIL HIS APPEARING AND KINGDOM, it is utterly false to allege the two witnesses were resurrected and were judged before Jesus came...alas...NO ONE is resurrected before Jesus comes...alas...the premise that the two witnesses were resurrected before his appearing and kingdom is false..and because no one is resurrected before the last trump, then the resurrection and ascension of the two prophets into heaven happened at the last trump...making it perfectly clear that the wicked dead are on the earth at his coming and are not up in heaven, which also confirms the fact that the ONLY ones who ascend up to heaven are the Saints of the most high God.. making it also perfectly clear that the two witnesses were among those who ascended into heaven, making it also perfectly clear that they were among the dead in Christ who rose first, and will be among all the other saints of God who ascend up to heaven at the Second Coming. But the scripture shows when Jesus comes...i.e. when he is ON THE EARTH, all people are gathered before him...the sheep and the goats...according to the false rapture for the wicked scenario the goats would have already been resurrected and cast into the fire BEFORE Jesus came, but the scripture shows them all before the Lord ON THE EARTH, and then given the sentence to be cast into everlasting fire...did God remove all the people in heaven that he had just cast into the lake of fire before the last trumpet and send them back down to the earth so when he says depart from me ye cursed into everlasting fire, they would get raptured back up to heaven to be cast again into the lake of fire again...No...God does not bring people out of the lake of fire to be judged and then cast them back into the lake of fire...nor is the lake of fire in heaven, nor are there any raptures for the wicked to be caught up the heaven...nor does God bring the wicked down from heaven to be judged...nor was there another rapture after the last trump for the beast and the false prophet to be taken to heaven so they could be cast into the lake of fire along with the two prophets that had been taken there before the last trump sounded...NO NO NO...none if this is true...THERE IS NO RAPTURE FOR WICKED PEOPLE TO GO TO HEAVEN... No when Jesus comes it says every eye shall see him, even those that pierced him...all the tares are gathered first as is shown with Caiphas...HE IS NOT IN HEAVEN IN THE LAKE OF FIRE WHEN JESUS COMES, as shown in the false rapture to heaven for the wicked scenario. According to the false rapture to heaven for the wicked scenario, he should have already been resurrected and raptured to heaven and cast into the lake of fire along with the two prophets BEFORE the last trump sounded, but here he is SEEING Jesus coming in the clouds...if he were up in heaven according to the false rapture to heaven for the wicked theory he would not be seeing Jesus COMING toward him in the clouds, but rather would be seeing Jesus going AWAY from him down to the earth...but alas, he is not in heaven as the false rapture for the wicked to heaven before the last trump would presume, but rather he is ON THE EARTH, as are all the other wicked dead who are now waiting to be judged by Jesus when he comes...as it states in Psalms 96: 13 'For HE COMETH, for he COMETH to judge the earth; whereas the false rapture for the wicked to heaven doctrine would be 'For HE SENDETH, for HE SENDETH, the wicked to heaven so he can judge them...God does not rapture the wicked to heaven to judge them, rather ...he COMES DOWN TO THE EARTH because that is where all people will be gathered...according to Matthew 25 When the Son of man shall COME, in other words, he is not in heaven anymore, but rather he is ON THE EARTH...then what happens? And before him, or before Jesus (who is ON THE EARTH, NOT IN HEAVEN) shall be gathered all people...where are all the people? Are they in heaven? No...where are the goats? Are they already in the lake of fire as the false rapture to heaven for the wicked theory would propose.....NO. NO. and NO. They are on the earth...Where are the sheep? They are on the earth... NO ONE IS IN HEAVEN AT THE SECOND COMING...all the saints have descended down to the earth with Jesus and the so both sheep and goats are now being judged ON THE EARTH... Why does Jesus judge the goats WHEN HE COMES TO THE EARTH, if they had already been raptured to heaven BEFORE the last trump and cast into the lake of fire according to the false rapture for the wicked to heaven theory? Because the wicked were never raptured to heaven, nor had anyone been cast into the lake of fire BEFORE Jesus came. This is absolutely false... When is the time of the dead that they should be judged? According to the false rapture for the wicked to heaven theory, they would have already been cast into the lake of fire BEFORE THE LAST TRUMPET...But according to Rev. 11:18 AT THE LAST TRUMP is the time of the dead that they should be judged...at the same time all the saints rewarded is the same time the wicked are judged, and the righteous are not rewarded BEFORE the last trump...there is no resurrection for ANYONE BEFORE THE LAST TRUMP sounds..the theory that the wicked dead are raptured to heaven and cast into the lake of fire BEFORE the last trump sounded is completely false ...everyone is resurrected on the last day...not before the last day, not after the last day, not before the last trump, not after the last trump, but AT THE LAST TRUMP, AT THE LAST DAY. You don't know what your talking about.I know for a fact that there are evangelical christians throughout the son of perditions armed forces. Fact.70 percent of the man of sins armed forces claim to be Christian with some evangelical christians who hold high offices.Brass. More recent DoD administrative data focused on active duty personnel show that as of January 2019, approximately 70 percent were recorded as Christian (about 32% no denomination, 20% Catholic, 18% Protestant, 1% Mormon), 2 percent as Atheist or Agnostic, 1 percent as affiliated with an Eastern religion, 0.4 percent ... when these evangelical christians occupy Jerusalem for those 1260 days killing and tormenting other people,you can cheer them on because you have already shown you don't know the commandments of Jesus Christ which he has commanded them. You can be their cheer leader and shout KILL,KILL,KILL PS The man of sin/son of perdition is a man.He is not the devil .The Man of sin dies when Christ comes,the devil does not. You should first learn the difference between a man and the devil before saying anything else. Edited September 20, 2023 by Shilohsfoal Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
transmogrified Posted September 20, 2023 Group: Senior Member Followers: 2 Topic Count: 4 Topics Per Day: 0.00 Content Count: 795 Content Per Day: 0.50 Reputation: 98 Days Won: 0 Joined: 01/18/2020 Status: Offline Share Posted September 20, 2023 4 hours ago, Shilohsfoal said: Fact.70 percent of the man of sins armed forces claim to be Christian with some evangelical christians who hold high offices.Brass The son of perdition has not yet arrived.. The US government, or any other government is not the son of perdition… there is no army of the son of perdition.. working in the DOD is not working for the son of perdition .. The son of perdition only rules the world for 3.5 years.. He is not ruling over all kindreds tongues and nation right now.. he has not caused anyone to take his mark for he has not yet arrived.. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shilohsfoal Posted September 20, 2023 Group: Royal Member Followers: 1 Topic Count: 153 Topics Per Day: 0.06 Content Count: 5,881 Content Per Day: 2.45 Reputation: 330 Days Won: 1 Joined: 10/22/2017 Status: Offline Share Posted September 20, 2023 (edited) 30 minutes ago, transmogrified said: The son of perdition has not yet arrived.. The US government, or any other government is not the son of perdition… there is no army of the son of perdition.. working in the DOD is not working for the son of perdition .. The son of perdition only rules the world for 3.5 years.. He is not ruling over all kindreds tongues and nation right now.. he has not caused anyone to take his mark for he has not yet arrived.. Dude There are several kings in Daniel 11 before the son of perdition places his armed forces in Jerusalem for the final 42 months in which the two witnesses occupy Jerusalem. Here is the son of perdition. 36 And the king shall do according to his will; and he shall exalt himself, and magnify himself above every god, and shall speak marvellous things against the God of gods, and shall prosper till the indignation be accomplished: for that that is determined shall be done. Here is his predecessor 20 Then shall stand up in his estate a raiser of taxes in the glory of the kingdom: but within few days he shall be destroyed, neither in anger, nor in battle. Here are other kings before his predecessor 15 So the king of the north shall come, and cast up a mount, and take the most fenced cities: and the arms of the south shall not withstand, neither his chosen people, neither shall there be any strength to withstand. 11 And the king of the south shall be moved with choler, and shall come forth and fight with him, even with the king of the north: and he shall set forth a great multitude; but the multitude shall be given into his hand. And shall also carry captives into Egypt their gods, with their princes, and with their precious vessels of silver and of gold; and he shall continue more years than the king of the north I take it,you haven't been paying attention for many decades now. As for the son of perdition,scripture does not say he rules the world. As scripture says his armed forces will occupy Jerusalem for 42 months. 31 “His armed forces will rise up to desecrate the temple fortress and will abolish the daily sacrifice. Then they will set up the abomination that causes desolation. Here are his armed forces occupying Jerusalem in revelation. 2 But the court which is without the temple leave out, and measure it not; for it is given unto the Gentiles: and the holy city shall they tread under foot forty and two months. 3 And I will give power unto my two witnesses, and they shall prophesy a thousand two hundred and threescore days, clothed in sackcloth. And here 11 And I beheld another beast coming up out of the earth; and he had two horns like a lamb, and he spake as a dragon. 12 And he exerciseth all the power of the first beast before him, and causeth the earth and them which dwell therein to worship the first beast, whose deadly wound was healed. 13 And he doeth great wonders, so that he maketh fire come down from heaven on the earth in the sight of men, You see,his armed forces work like this,the two horns command fire come down from heaven and the armed forces obey.Fire proceeds from the mouths of those two horns . Edited September 20, 2023 by Shilohsfoal Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
transmogrified Posted September 20, 2023 Group: Senior Member Followers: 2 Topic Count: 4 Topics Per Day: 0.00 Content Count: 795 Content Per Day: 0.50 Reputation: 98 Days Won: 0 Joined: 01/18/2020 Status: Offline Share Posted September 20, 2023 The son of perdition has not yet arrived - No one is working in his army- He is not here Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
transmogrified Posted September 20, 2023 Group: Senior Member Followers: 2 Topic Count: 4 Topics Per Day: 0.00 Content Count: 795 Content Per Day: 0.50 Reputation: 98 Days Won: 0 Joined: 01/18/2020 Status: Offline Share Posted September 20, 2023 4 hours ago, Shilohsfoal said: Here is his predecessor 20 Then shall stand up in his estate a raiser of taxes in the glory of the kingdom: but within few days he shall be destroyed, neither in anger, nor in battle Yes he appears in verse 21 .. this man is the same man who comes to his end in 11:45 meaning that is when Jesus comes and he is taken and cast into the lake of fire.. and none shall help him.. This is when the resurrection of both the bad and the good take place.. This is the day the two prophets ascend to heaven .. this is the day the last trumpet sounds…This is when all the dead in Christ will rise up to heaven in glorified bodies.. this is the day all the saints will return with Jesus to set up his kingdom.. this is the day of judgement when the tares and the goats are cast into the fire, this is the day when the good and bad fish are separated… this is that great and terrible day of the Lord The beast is only given power over all nations kindreds and tongues for 3.5 years.. he is not ruling now.. he will come in the future.. Jesus said when you see the AOD standing in the temple THEN know that day is near.. what does that mean? It means for the past some 2000 years there was no man of sin standing in the temple… what does that mean? It means there has been no mark of the beast for the past some 2000 years. What that means is there is no present army serving under the son of perdition until he appears on the scene.. What does that mean? It means the DOD or any other agency for the past some 2000 years have not been armies of the son of perdition.. meaning quoting statistics from the DOD has nothing to do with armies working under the son of perdition any more than quoting how many Christians allegedly fought in any other war at any other time. THESE ARE NOT ARMIES WORKING UNDER THE SON OF PERDITION Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shilohsfoal Posted September 20, 2023 Group: Royal Member Followers: 1 Topic Count: 153 Topics Per Day: 0.06 Content Count: 5,881 Content Per Day: 2.45 Reputation: 330 Days Won: 1 Joined: 10/22/2017 Status: Offline Share Posted September 20, 2023 (edited) 51 minutes ago, transmogrified said: Yes he appears in verse 21 .. this man is the same man who comes to his end in 11:45 meaning that is when Jesus comes and he is taken and cast into the lake of fire.. and none shall help him.. This is when the resurrection of both the bad and the good take place.. This is the day the two prophets ascend to heaven .. this is the day the last trumpet sounds…This is when all the dead in Christ will rise up to heaven in glorified bodies.. this is the day all the saints will return with Jesus to set up his kingdom.. this is the day of judgement when the tares and the goats are cast into the fire, this is the day when the good and bad fish are separated… this is that great and terrible day of the Lord The beast is only given power over all nations kindreds and tongues for 3.5 years.. he is not ruling now.. he will come in the future.. Jesus said when you see the AOD standing in the temple THEN know that day is near.. what does that mean? It means for the past some 2000 years there was no man of sin standing in the temple… what does that mean? It means there has been no mark of the beast for the past some 2000 years. What that means is there is no present army serving under the son of perdition until he appears on the scene.. What does that mean? It means the DOD or any other agency for the past some 2000 years have not been armies of the son of perdition.. meaning quoting statistics from the DOD has nothing to do with armies working under the son of perdition any more than quoting how many Christians allegedly fought in any other war at any other time. THESE ARE NOT ARMIES WORKING UNDER THE SON OF PERDITION You still don't get it.Must I post everything I have said again? You have been sleeping a great dark sleep and have not been watching.The former kings of the north have already arrived and done what Daniel wrote of them and you ignored them. You ignore the 20 verses before verse 21 and have not watched.I have relatives who served in those wars.I have related who invaded the south . Edited September 20, 2023 by Shilohsfoal Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
transmogrified Posted September 20, 2023 Group: Senior Member Followers: 2 Topic Count: 4 Topics Per Day: 0.00 Content Count: 795 Content Per Day: 0.50 Reputation: 98 Days Won: 0 Joined: 01/18/2020 Status: Offline Share Posted September 20, 2023 5 minutes ago, Shilohsfoal said: You ignore the 20 verses before verse 21 and have not watched.I have relatives who served in those wars. You have no relatives that have served under the son of perdition. The son of perdition has not yet arrived. Nobody is serving under him now, or in the past. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shilohsfoal Posted September 21, 2023 Group: Royal Member Followers: 1 Topic Count: 153 Topics Per Day: 0.06 Content Count: 5,881 Content Per Day: 2.45 Reputation: 330 Days Won: 1 Joined: 10/22/2017 Status: Offline Share Posted September 21, 2023 22 minutes ago, transmogrified said: You have no relatives that have served under the son of perdition. The son of perdition has not yet arrived. Nobody is serving under him now, or in the past. So you say. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
transmogrified Posted September 21, 2023 Group: Senior Member Followers: 2 Topic Count: 4 Topics Per Day: 0.00 Content Count: 795 Content Per Day: 0.50 Reputation: 98 Days Won: 0 Joined: 01/18/2020 Status: Offline Share Posted September 21, 2023 23 minutes ago, Shilohsfoal said: The former kings of the north have already arrived and done what Daniel wrote of them and you ignored them. The kings before verse 21 have came and gone...the one starting in verse 21 is describing ONE MAN and what he will do UNTIL he is destroyed by Jesus...He persecutes the saints...he exalts himself above all that is called God...he sits in the temple of God showing himself to be God..the whole world is deceived by the signs and wonders whose names are not written in the book of Life...ALL of these things must occur and they must occur with ONE MAN and ONE MAN only...there is no beast RIGHT NOW commanding everyone to receive a mark to buy or sell...there is not ONE MAN ruling over all kingdoms, nations and tongues RIGHT NOW. There is no temple in Jerusalem where he is sitting and ruling the world RIGHT NOW..The Jews have not received him as their Messiah RIGHT NOW...There is no temple with offerings being made for him to stop RIGHT NOW... THESE ARE ALL FUTURE EVENTS...NO ONE IN HISTORY HAS FULFILLED THESE THINGS...THERE IS NO ONE SERVING UNDER A MAN WHO DOES NOT EXIST Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shilohsfoal Posted September 21, 2023 Group: Royal Member Followers: 1 Topic Count: 153 Topics Per Day: 0.06 Content Count: 5,881 Content Per Day: 2.45 Reputation: 330 Days Won: 1 Joined: 10/22/2017 Status: Offline Share Posted September 21, 2023 19 minutes ago, transmogrified said: The kings before verse 21 have came and gone...the one starting in verse 21 is describing ONE MAN and what he will do UNTIL he is destroyed by Jesus...He persecutes the saints...he exalts himself above all that is called God...he sits in the temple of God showing himself to be God..the whole world is deceived by the signs and wonders whose names are not written in the book of Life...ALL of these things must occur and they must occur with ONE MAN and ONE MAN only...there is no beast RIGHT NOW commanding everyone to receive a mark to buy or sell...there is not ONE MAN ruling over all kingdoms, nations and tongues RIGHT NOW. There is no temple in Jerusalem where he is sitting and ruling the world RIGHT NOW..The Jews have not received him as their Messiah RIGHT NOW...There is no temple with offerings being made for him to stop RIGHT NOW... THESE ARE ALL FUTURE EVENTS...NO ONE IN HISTORY HAS FULFILLED THESE THINGS...THERE IS NO ONE SERVING UNDER A MAN WHO DOES NOT EXIST A good portion of what you just said is false. The man of sin doesn't rule the world.He doesn't claim to be the Messiah.The first beast has already come and is in Jerusalem today.The armed forces of the man of sin isn't the first beast .It's the second to appear in Jerusalem. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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