The Hope of Eternal Life

[Mr. M]

2 minutes ago, FreeGrace said:

The operative word IS assurance, as that is what 'elpis' means in the Koine Greek of 2,000 years ago.

Or, confident expectation.  Which is assurance.

I was addressing the Greek word translated as "hope", which means confident expectation.  Which is assurance of salvation.

I am fully aware that no Arminian can say they are assured of salvation.  The idea seems anathema to them.  Even though it is taught throughout the Scriptures.

Luke 6:46-49 But why do you call Me ‘Lord, Lord,’ and not do the things which I say? Whoever comes to Me, and hears My sayings and does them, I will show you whom he is like: He is like a man building a house, who dug deep and laid the foundation on the rock. And when the flood arose, the stream beat vehemently against that house, and could not shake it, for it was founded on the rock. But he who heard and did nothing is like a man who built a house on the earth without a foundation, against which the stream beat vehemently; and immediately it fell. And the ruin of that house was great.”

I am aware that once born again, you cannot be unborn. What you seem oblivious to is that there is also a "quality of life issue". Why do you think Peter made this statement?

2 Peter 2:21 For it would have been better for them not to have known the way of righteousness, than having known it, to turn from the holy commandment delivered to them.

You would do well to read the entire second chapter of Peter's second letter. Then go and learn the meaning of this: "weeping and gnashing of teeth".

Revelation 21:22 But I saw no temple in it, for the Lord God Almighty and the Lamb are its temple. 23 The city had no need of the sun or of the moon to shine in it, for the glory of God illuminated it. The Lamb is its light. 24 And the nations of those who are saved shall walk in its light, and the kings of the earth bring their glory and honor into it. 25 Its gates shall not be shut at all by day (there shall be no night there). 26 And they shall bring the glory and the honor of the nations into it. 27 But there shall by no means enter it anything that defiles, or causes an abomination or a lie, but only those who are written in the Lamb’s Book of Life.

Revelation 22:14 Blessed are those who do His commandments, that they may have the right to the tree of life, and may enter through the gates into the city. 15 But outside are dogs and sorcerers and sexually immoral and murderers and idolaters, and whoever loves and practices a lie.

The eternal Law remains: you will reap what you sow!

[Mr. M]

8 minutes ago, FreeGrace said:

The promise of eternal reward is what disobedient children of God won't be receiving.

Which Is? Access to the tree of life maybe?

Edited October 4, 2023 by Mr. M

[FreeGrace]

2 hours ago, Mr. M said:

Luke 6:46-49 But why do you call Me ‘Lord, Lord,’ and not do the things which I say? Whoever comes to Me, and hears My sayings and does them, I will show you whom he is like: He is like a man building a house, who dug deep and laid the foundation on the rock. And when the flood arose, the stream beat vehemently against that house, and could not shake it, for it was founded on the rock. But he who heard and did nothing is like a man who built a house on the earth without a foundation, against which the stream beat vehemently; and immediately it fell. And the ruin of that house was great.”

I am aware that once born again, you cannot be unborn. What you seem oblivious to is that there is also a "quality of life issue".

I am not oblivious to spiritual growth, which is commanded of every believer.  But eternal security is a different subject.

2 hours ago, Mr. M said:

Why do you think Peter made this statement?

He was speaking of quality of life issues, obviously.

2 hours ago, Mr. M said:

2 Peter 2:21 For it would have been better for them not to have known the way of righteousness, than having known it, to turn from the holy commandment delivered to them.

You would do well to read the entire second chapter of Peter's second letter. Then go and learn the meaning of this: "weeping and gnashing of teeth".

Your judgment of my knowledge is baseless.  Some think that passage teaches loss of salvation, which it doesn't.

2 hours ago, Mr. M said:

Revelation 21:22 But I saw no temple in it, for the Lord God Almighty and the Lamb are its temple. 23 The city had no need of the sun or of the moon to shine in it, for the glory of God illuminated it. The Lamb is its light. 24 And the nations of those who are saved shall walk in its light, and the kings of the earth bring their glory and honor into it. 25 Its gates shall not be shut at all by day (there shall be no night there). 26 And they shall bring the glory and the honor of the nations into it. 27 But there shall by no means enter it anything that defiles, or causes an abomination or a lie, but only those who are written in the Lamb’s Book of Life.

Revelation 22:14 Blessed are those who do His commandments, that they may have the right to the tree of life, and may enter through the gates into the city. 15 But outside are dogs and sorcerers and sexually immoral and murderers and idolaters, and whoever loves and practices a lie.

The eternal Law remains: you will reap what you sow!

Of course everyone will reap what they sow.  For all unbelievers, the judgment according to the "books" will be an evaluation of how "tolerable" it will be for them in eternity in the LOF.  Jesus taught that clearly in Matt 10:15 and 11:22, 24.

For all believers, the Bema will evaluate their lives and they will either reap eternal reward or not.

[FreeGrace]

2 hours ago, Mr. M said:

FreeGrace said: 

The promise of eternal reward is what disobedient children of God won't be receiving.

Which Is? Access to the tree of life maybe?

Yes, that clearly.  And all the things that Jesus mentioned to the 7 churches of Rev 2-3.

[Buzzard3]

12 hours ago, Mr. M said:

OSAS does seem to be a dodge to the requirement

OSAS says a believer can live a life filled with the worst kinds of sin and evil and God will reward him with eternal life ... an absurd and dangerous and obviously false doctrine.  

[Buzzard3]

9 hours ago, Mr. M said:

Revelation 22:14 Blessed are those who do His commandments, that they may have the right to the tree of life

"To him who conquers I will grant to eat of the tree of life, which is in the paradise of God" - Rev 2:7

[Buzzard3]

9 hours ago, Mr. M said:

Which Is? Access to the tree of life maybe?

FreeGrace doesn't accept that "the tree of life" refers to eternal life; rather, it's merely a "reward".  An orange or apple tree, maybe, installed in one's Heavenly backyard.  Or a money tree?

[Mr. M]

On 9/11/2023 at 8:32 AM, Mr. M said:

7 that having been justified by His grace we should become heirs

according to the hope of eternal life.

Colossians 3:

23 And whatever you do, do it heartily, as to the Lord and not to men, 

24 knowing that from the Lord you will receive the reward of the inheritance; 

for you serve the Lord Christ.

25 But he who does wrong will be repaid for what he has done,

and there is no partiality.

Looking at this passage in the study on inheritance currently being discussed.

I would consider assurance of salvation without reward is eternal life

without access to the City of God. Here is "outer darkness", a place far

from the source of All Life.

From this perspective to my understanding, "weeping and gnashing of teeth"

is not a statement of "conscious torment", or physical punishment, but an

anguish of mind to know what you fell short of by being banished from 

the Presence of God.

Revelation 22:

14 Blessed are those who do His commandments, that they may have the right 

to the tree of life, and may enter through the gates into the city. 

15 But outside are dogs and sorcerers and sexually immoral and murderers

and idolaters, and whoever loves and practices a lie.

[Mr. M]

On 10/4/2023 at 10:10 AM, FreeGrace said:

The command to be obedient is never attached to salvation

Hebrews 5:

8 Though he were a Son, yet learned he obedience

by the things which he suffered;

9 And being made perfect, he became the author of

eternal salvation unto all them that obey him.

[FreeGrace]

On 10/4/2023 at 10:36 PM, Buzzard3 said:

OSAS says a believer can live a life filled with the worst kinds of sin and evil and God will reward him with eternal life ... an absurd and dangerous and obviously false doctrine.  

Wrong.  OSAS ONLY says a believer will never perish.  Never.  Do you disagree with Jesus??

Also, eternal life isn't a reward.  It's a gift for believing.  Read John 5:24; "whoever believes (present tense) HAS (possesses- present tense) eternal life.  That is a promise from Jesus.  Better believe what He says.

Reward is for faithful and obedient service to the King.  Many believers will lose ALL reward, because of their lifestyles.

1 Cor 3:14 - If the work that anyone has built on the foundation survives, he will receive a reward.

15 - If anyone's work is burned up, he will suffer loss, though he himself will be saved, but only as through fire.

Couldn't be more clear.

The Bema:  2 Cor 5:10 - For we must all appear before the judgment seat of Christ, so that each of us may receive what is due us for the things done while in the body, whether good or bad.