I have trouble with this verse

[Your closest friendnt]

On 4/1/2024 at 2:22 AM, faithfull-prophet4040 said:

The Bible says for we are saved by faith and not by our own works, and true I do believe we are saved by faith, but the Bible also says we must repent and turn from our wicked ways, then put our faith in Christ Jesus to saved. So how can it say we are not saved by works when we have to stop sinning, and we have to repent. Yes I will be the one to say it’s usually done through God putting that spark of light in our hearts, and showing us that sin is wrong not that we don’t already know that sin is wrong, but as men and women we sometimes get lost in sin and sometimes can’t see the wrong we do with a clear mind. Still we do have to do work… For example a drug addiction, it’s hard to come off of drugs, trust me I know, and that takes work, I can’t say I did it alone because without the father I never could have gotten off of drugs, but I still did, and it took work, and if I didn’t get of the drugs I would not have been saved I wouldn’t have been a repented man, and I would still be the the same drug addicted alcoholic cussing pridefull man I was then. Thankfully God put that spark in my heart and helped me through the suffering aka WORK…  I just don’t like it when people seem to think that if they accept Jesus as there lord and savior that it’s ok to sin, yes everybody sins at sometime or another, but drugs drinking smoking lust etc… are not aloud. You will not be saved just by faith without putting in the work to stop, and avoid them things

And I mean no disrespect to the Bible verse nor am I saying what it says is false, I just have a hard time agreeing with it, and was hoping some other Christian’s could shed some light on the subject.

What is the reference to the verse you want to  discuss. Can you please post the reference to that verse. Or you may say what it is in that verse as you remember it. 

Edited April 4 by Your closest friendnt

[Desopixi Seilynam]

On 4/3/2024 at 8:25 AM, Neighbor said:

Works do not matter. Yet works are accounted for as well as rewarded by our Lord and savior at no less than the Bema Judgement seat.

 

He that does not love me, does not keep my teachings.
John 14:24   [ John 14:21-23 He is speaking about anyone in the world ]

If anyone does not love the Lord Jesus Christ,
let that person be Anathema! Oh Lord Come!
1 Corinthians 16:22 [ 1 Corinthians 1:13 is the context ]

 

For what avails anything is faith that works by love.
[ Galatians 5:6-7 ]

For this is His commandment, that we love one another.
[ John 15:12, Matthew 7:12, Romans 13:10 ]

For faith without works is dead being alone.
James 2:17

For we all must appear before the judgement seat of Christ;
that every one may receive the things done in his body,
whether it be (or whether he receive) good or bad.
Knowing therefore the terror of the Lord,
we persuade men...
1 Corinthians 5:10-11

Paul is speaking about the terror of the Lord,
not an award ceremony.

For the time is come that judgement must begin at the house of God.
And if it first begin at us, what shall the end of them be
that obey not the good news of God? [ 2 Thess 1:7-10 ]
And if the righteous scarcely be saved,
where shall the ungodly and the sinner appear?
Therefore let them that suffer according to the will of God
commit the keeping of their souls to Him
in well doing, as unto a faithful Creator.

1 Peter 4:17-19

 

 

On 4/3/2024 at 8:25 AM, Neighbor said:

It is acted out through Yeshua's willing sacrifice made in obedience of His Father, and is made known through the specific call  made  by  the Holy Spirit to all that are foreknown and predestined  be saved out from destruction.

 

If you being evil know how to give good gifts to your children,
how much more shall the Father give the Holy Spirit to those that ask Him?
Luke 11:13

Received ye the Spirit by the works of the law? Or by the hearing of faith?
Galatians 3:2

Faith comes by hearing and hearing by the word of God.
Romans 10:17

 

The Holy Spirit inspired the writers of the Bible,
the Holy Spirit is the Author of the Bible,
all who read the Bible are therefore called to faith, by the Holy Spirit.
The Lord promises that before the end,
the word will be published in all the world.  Matthew 24:14
God commands all men everywhere to repent. Acts 17:30-31
All mankind will have the word of God to know and read and to thereby
be led to faith, for faith comes by hearing and hearing by the word of God.

No human is predestined to go to hell .

 

Has not the potter power over the clay
to make one lump unto honor and another to dishonor?
Romans 9:21

But in a great house there are not only vessels of gold and silver,
but also of wood and earth,
and some to honor, and some to dishonor.
If a man therefore purge himself from dishonor
he shall be a vessel of honor,
sanctified and useful for the masters use
and prepared unto every good work.
2 Timothy 2:20-21

How can a man cleanse his way?
By taking heed unto the word of God.
Psalms 119:9

 

For faith comes by hearing, and hearing by the word of God.

The Holy Spirit is a free gift one receives for just believing,
actually sourced from the death and resurrection of Christ.

No one has the Holy Spirit because of themselves,
or because they are special chosen.
The death and resurrection of Christ is the source
of the Holy Spirit after Christ, any human who sincerely
believes that Christ died and rose from the dead
is indwelt by the Holy Spirit.

A born again person is one actually led by the Holy Spirit.
As Paul says in Romans 8:14.

Because as many as are led by the Spirit of God,
they are the children of God.

 

 

 

[Neighbor]

Hi, I suggest that a read of Romans 8 and 9 will refute that presentation.

[Desopixi Seilynam]

4 minutes ago, Neighbor said:

Romans 8 and 9 will refute that presentation.

 

Part of the "presentation" includes Romans 8 and 9.

He that does not love me, does not keep my teachings.
John 14:24

Is Christ divided? Was Paul crucified for you
or were you baptized in the name of Paul?
1 Corinthians 1:13

If anyone does not love the Lord Jesus Christ,
let that person be Anathema! Oh Lord Come!
1 Corinthians 16:22

 

For as many as are led by the Spirit of God,
they are the children of God.
Romans 8:14

 

1 hour ago, Desopixi Seilynam said:

Has not the potter power over the clay
to make one lump unto honor and another to dishonor?
Romans 9:21

But in a great house there are not only vessels of gold and silver,
but also of wood and earth,
and some to honor, and some to dishonor.
If a man therefore purge himself from dishonor
he shall be a vessel of honor,
sanctified and useful for the masters use
and prepared unto every good work.
2 Timothy 2:20-21

 

How can a man cleanse his way?
By taking heed unto the word of God.
Psalm 119:9

For faith comes by hearing and hearing by the word of God.
Romans 10:17

 

 

 

 

 

[farouk]

On 4/2/2024 at 3:21 PM, Tristen said:

Hey fp,

This question can be addressed from several angles.

- The term “repentance” simply refers to a change of direction. In the case of salvation, we turn towards serving God (in righteousness), and away from serving ourselves and the corrupted desires of our flesh. In confessing Christ as Lord, we make an active decision to enter into His process of sanctification – allowing the Holy Spirit to separate us (our behaviors) from the corrupted world. That is, even though we stumble, we always turn back to God (repent). That is the direction we have chosen to travel.

- Central to the concept of Christian repentance is the recognition that sin is bad – not just in some ethereal, abstract, theological sense, but literally bad for us. Sin destroys us. Sin is the lie that we are missing out on something if we behave with righteous self-control. Sin is corruption, and deceit, and bondage, and death. Sin is not good nor to be desired, but rather something we need to be saved from.

- By contrast, righteousness is health, and freedom, and peace, and joy. Righteousness means we are in control of our actions – rather than being dictated to by our flesh. Righteousness is the power to live the all-conquering life God prepared for us.

- The reason we need a Savior is that we are corrupted beyond the capacity to be righteous enough to save ourselves. Perfect righteousness is the standard. We have all fallen well short. There is therefore no super-moral act that could add righteousness to our account. Nothing we do can ever earn God’s favor. Our salvation comes entirely by trusting in the grace offered through the Gospel of Christ. Therefore, Christ alone is exclusively deserving of all glory - we cannot take any credit for our own salvation. Nothing we ever did, nor can do, can ever make us deserving.

- To receive that salvation, one must sincerely surrender ownership of their life to the lordship of Christ as a faith response to His Gospel. That decision infers that we are no longer our own masters, but He is our Master/Owner/Lord. In choosing to make Jesus our Lord, we are choosing to surrender our behaviors to Him – i.e. to do those things that are in our eternal best interest – i.e. to live the free, overcoming, all-conquering life He created for us to enjoy – i.e. to have dominion over our flesh, rather than be enslaved to its desires.

- Because He loved us and saved us, we love Him and desire to do the things that are pleasing to Him. Good behavior is a natural response to comprehending His salvation – and the love expressed through His sacrifice for us.

 

@Tristen The 'metanoia' in the Greek refers to a turning, in the NT context, a turning from sin and a turning to God in faith. Paul has a treatise on repentance in Romans 2.

[farouk]

@Tristen The word for repentance - metanoia - indeed basically means turning: from sin and to God in faith.

[BibleStudent100]

On 3/31/2024 at 11:22 PM, faithfull-prophet4040 said:

So how can it say we are not saved by works when we have to stop sinning, and we have to repent.

We render sacred service to the living God by combating the works of the flesh and resisting the world’s immorality, and avoiding its snares. It says: “Fight the fine fight of the faith,” put off “the sin that easily entangles us,” and “run with endurance the race that is set before us, as we look intently at the Chief Agent and Perfecter of our faith, Jesus.” And the Bible urges us not to ‘get tired and give out in our souls.’—1 Timothy 6:12; Hebrews 12:1-3; Galatians 5:19-21.

We do not earn salvation by doing these things, for no human could ever do enough to merit such an astounding blessing. We are not worthy of this magnificent gift, though, if we fail to demonstrate our love and obedience by doing the things that the Bible says God and Christ want us to do. Without works to demonstrate our faith, our claim to follow Jesus would fall far short, for the Bible clearly states: “Faith, if it does not have works, is dead in itself.”—James 2:17.