Vine Abider Posted April 27 Group: Worthy Ministers Followers: 6 Topic Count: 201 Topics Per Day: 0.36 Content Count: 3,464 Content Per Day: 6.19 Reputation: 2,319 Days Won: 3 Joined: 10/25/2022 Status: Offline Birthday: 04/01/2024 Author Share Posted April 27 3 hours ago, WilliamL said: Sorry, but I believe that everything above, after the words "things there will reach a potentially very catastrophic level," is pure spec that will never come to pass. So I repeat what I said in my previous post: avoid such speculative interpretations of the prophecies. Thanks - your thoughts are noted. So you don't believe the man of sin will arise and do a treaty? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vine Abider Posted April 28 Group: Worthy Ministers Followers: 6 Topic Count: 201 Topics Per Day: 0.36 Content Count: 3,464 Content Per Day: 6.19 Reputation: 2,319 Days Won: 3 Joined: 10/25/2022 Status: Offline Birthday: 04/01/2024 Author Share Posted April 28 Yesterday I had the "simple middle east prophesy" discussion with my dad, who is a younger Christian, and doesn't know scripture very well. I told him my simple take on middle east prophesy was this: It's exceedingly remarkable that Israel has become a nation again after 2,000 years of dispersal and that this was divinely orchestrated and God is very focused on what happens there. And soon it will look like the whole world may get dragged into a middle east conflict, which is all prophetic. And when it looks like everything will really hit the fan, a highly charismatic and capable leader will arise, who will do what no one else has been able to do - make a treaty with Israel and her enemies. Then peace and prosperity will follow and the whole world will be convinced that this leader is the best, but then in the middle of the seven year treaty, he will break it. At that point things will dramatically spiral downward, culminating in the Lord returning to stop the advancing armies, save Jerusalem, and bring in His kingdom. Dad was receptive, and said of the leader to arise, "Every one will look to this guy as "The Savior!" (BTW - When it says the man of sin breaks the treat and causes the sacrifices to cease (Dan 9:27), I had a thought I'm chewing on . . . in the past I always thought the this one was coming out against the Jews in the middle of the final week, but what if he actually wants their worship? It says he sets himself up as God in the temple (2 Thess 2:4), so perhaps he says to the Jews, "You don't need to sacrifice to me any more . . . I'm God and have returned to save you and don't require these sacrifices from any more! Just worship me now unfettered without any pretense." Had I been looking at this all wrong before, or is this thinking totally out in left field? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WilliamL Posted April 28 Group: Royal Member Followers: 10 Topic Count: 99 Topics Per Day: 0.03 Content Count: 5,135 Content Per Day: 1.48 Reputation: 2,560 Days Won: 4 Joined: 11/06/2014 Status: Offline Birthday: 09/01/1950 Share Posted April 28 On 4/26/2024 at 7:38 PM, Vine Abider said: Thanks - your thoughts are noted. So you don't believe the man of sin will arise and do a treaty? Not the covenant of Dan. 9:27, which is history. The man of sin will be the king of the north of Dan. 11:40-45, and no covenant is mentioned or implied in that period. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NConly Posted April 28 Group: Diamond Member Followers: 5 Topic Count: 16 Topics Per Day: 0.03 Content Count: 1,335 Content Per Day: 2.76 Reputation: 614 Days Won: 0 Joined: 01/11/2023 Status: Offline Share Posted April 28 3 hours ago, Vine Abider said: Then peace and prosperity will follow and the whole world will be convinced that this leader is the best, but then in the middle of the seven year treaty, he will break it. This is just the way I read these verses . V19-22 show what happened to Israel to be scattered. V 23 imo is about Gentiles/Christians which has occurred. V24 has occurred also, 1948 Israel. V25 speaks of Israel cleansed. V26-27 Israel accepts Jesus and brought into New Covenant. V28 takes place after. One may also read Isa 28:10 and Rev 7:3-4 along with 1 Cor 15:25-28 19 And I scattered them among the heathen, and they were dispersed through the countries: according to their way and according to their doings I judged them. 20 And when they entered unto the heathen, whither they went, they profaned my holy name, when they said to them, These are the people of the LORD, and are gone forth out of his land. 21 But I had pity for mine holy name, which the house of Israel had profaned among the heathen, whither they went. 22 Therefore say unto the house of Israel, Thus saith the Lord GOD; I do not this for your sakes, O house of Israel, but for mine holy name's sake, which ye have profaned among the heathen, whither ye went. 23 And I will sanctify my great name, which was profaned among the heathen, which ye have profaned in the midst of them; and the heathen shall know that I am the LORD, saith the Lord GOD, when I shall be sanctified in you before their eyes. 24 For I will take you from among the heathen, and gather you out of all countries, and will bring you into your own land. 25 Then will I sprinkle clean water upon you, and ye shall be clean: from all your filthiness, and from all your idols, will I cleanse you. 26 A new heart also will I give you, and a new spirit will I put within you: and I will take away the stony heart out of your flesh, and I will give you an heart of flesh. 27 And I will put my spirit within you, and cause you to walk in my statutes, and ye shall keep my judgments, and do them. 28 And ye shall dwell in the land that I gave to your fathers; and ye shall be my people, and I will be your God. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
farouk Posted Friday at 03:03 AM Group: Royal Member Followers: 8 Topic Count: 26 Topics Per Day: 0.05 Content Count: 6,526 Content Per Day: 12.18 Reputation: 3,328 Days Won: 31 Joined: 11/18/2022 Status: Online Share Posted Friday at 03:03 AM On 4/28/2024 at 4:18 PM, NConly said: This is just the way I read these verses . V19-22 show what happened to Israel to be scattered. V 23 imo is about Gentiles/Christians which has occurred. V24 has occurred also, 1948 Israel. V25 speaks of Israel cleansed. V26-27 Israel accepts Jesus and brought into New Covenant. V28 takes place after. One may also read Isa 28:10 and Rev 7:3-4 along with 1 Cor 15:25-28 19 And I scattered them among the heathen, and they were dispersed through the countries: according to their way and according to their doings I judged them. 20 And when they entered unto the heathen, whither they went, they profaned my holy name, when they said to them, These are the people of the LORD, and are gone forth out of his land. 21 But I had pity for mine holy name, which the house of Israel had profaned among the heathen, whither they went. 22 Therefore say unto the house of Israel, Thus saith the Lord GOD; I do not this for your sakes, O house of Israel, but for mine holy name's sake, which ye have profaned among the heathen, whither ye went. 23 And I will sanctify my great name, which was profaned among the heathen, which ye have profaned in the midst of them; and the heathen shall know that I am the LORD, saith the Lord GOD, when I shall be sanctified in you before their eyes. 24 For I will take you from among the heathen, and gather you out of all countries, and will bring you into your own land. 25 Then will I sprinkle clean water upon you, and ye shall be clean: from all your filthiness, and from all your idols, will I cleanse you. 26 A new heart also will I give you, and a new spirit will I put within you: and I will take away the stony heart out of your flesh, and I will give you an heart of flesh. 27 And I will put my spirit within you, and cause you to walk in my statutes, and ye shall keep my judgments, and do them. 28 And ye shall dwell in the land that I gave to your fathers; and ye shall be my people, and I will be your God. Hi @NConly Interesting passage, indeed. I think it can be helpful always to distinguish between Israel and the church in Scripture (1 Cor. 10.32). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NConly Posted Friday at 03:18 AM Group: Diamond Member Followers: 5 Topic Count: 16 Topics Per Day: 0.03 Content Count: 1,335 Content Per Day: 2.76 Reputation: 614 Days Won: 0 Joined: 01/11/2023 Status: Offline Share Posted Friday at 03:18 AM 11 minutes ago, farouk said: Hi @NConly Interesting passage, indeed. I think it can be helpful always to distinguish between Israel and the church in Scripture (1 Cor. 10.32). It is just one of the things that have to happen before Jesus returns. I posted because the op did not say 10 things only for the church. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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