Remember the sabath day

[MrSealedEternal]

Now that one has been born again, recreated in the Image of God, He has a war to wage with the flesh. There is no guarantee that he will complete the course. Each believer still has a free will to use and choose to walk either after the flesh or after the Spirit. At the new birth he is a babe in Christ. He is to grow into the full stature of Christ. This he must choose to do each day by abiding in Christ and obeying the word. All the grace is available, but it remains up to him/her whether they will indure to the end or not. There is more to Scripture than just 'by grace you are saved through faith and not of works lest any man should boast'.

You have a works gospel, because your faith is in yourself completing the course, instead of having faith that Christ already completed it. Nobody will grow to the full stature of Christ in our corrupted bodies, and if you think you have you're deluded. You're denying God's grace by trying to save yourself.

A) How many of your sins were yet future when He paid for them? Has "Christ also died for sins, ONCE for ALL ..." 1 Peter 3:18, or only certain ones?

B) Is His atonement only good until the day you trust in Him, and then you are on your own to stay saved by your own efforts?

C) Do you have to be perfect to stay saved? How bad can you be and still remain saved?

Are you perfect, or could you be? If not, what makes you think you're saved?

D) Isn't it God's grace that saves us rather than our goodness?

God in fact says it is His righteousness that saves us, not ours.

1 Peter 2:24 "... and He Himself bore our sins in His body on the cross, that we might die to sin and live to righteousness; for by His wounds we were healed."

Ephesians 2:8-9 "For by grace you have been SAVED through faith; and that not of yourselves, it is the GIFT of GOD; not as a result of works, so that no one may boast."

It is God's grace that saves us, and He paid our sin debt in full, once for all sins, past, present, and future.

1. John 10:28,29 ...and I give ETERNAL LIFE to them, and they shall NEVER PERISH; and NO ONE shall snatch them out of My hand. My Father, Who has given them to Me, is greater than all; and NO ONE is able to snatch them out of the Father's hand.

[Guest shiloh357]

Brother Shiloh,

You conveniently left out the Scripture that I quoted where Paul says that we are to labor to enter in.

First of all, the writer of Hebrews is not talking about laboring to enter into salvation. That is the point I am trying to make. Paul is warning of those who will fall short because of unbelief. One must not assume that the target audience is necessarily Christians. Hebrews is written to Jews, both believing and unbelieving. It is demonstrating to the Jewish mind the superiority of the Renewed Covenant, the "Brit Chadashah" of Hebrews chapter eight.

The warning here as Eric pointed out is falling short by virtue of unbelief.

Do you think that God has done away with all the Scriptures that talk about the war between the flesh and the Spirit? Do you You think God has done away with all the warning Scriptures that speak about completing the course, fighting the fight and claiming the prize.

1. The spirit wrestling/warring against the flesh is THE indicator that a person is saved. We are not commanded to war against the flesh in order to get saved. If a person is wrestling with the old fleshly desires, that is the result of salvation, not the means of procuring it.

2. As to your second question... Understand this: Salvation is NOT a prize. Salvation is, according to Romans 6:23 a free gift of God that comes through Christ and Christ alone. We do not "win" salvation. Salvation is a product of God's grace freely given to anyone who will trust Jesus Christ as Savior and Lord.

The fact that we are justified, forgiven, by faith born out of repentance does not negate the works of faith which are not forced upon us, but that each must choose to do. There are no works required to be forgiven, just repentance and faith, but real faith 'labors abundantly'. Faith can be renounced, it can die, it can be denied, it is up to the free will of the believer.

No one is negating any "works of faith." Works of faith are those works that demonstrate the authenticity of our profession of faith in Christ. They do produce that faith, nor do they produce our right-standing with God. For a person to get to the place where they renounce their faith, they will have to strive mightily against the Holy Spirit. While a person can apostasize from the faith, that is hardly what we are talking about. Sinning is not necessarily an indication that a person has denied the faith, or renounced Christ. You are being a bit over dramatic. Many fall into sin due to personal weaknesses, or because of bouts with discouragement, even grief. I am not so quick to judge someone who falls in a sincere attempt to serve the Lord. It is not the sin, but rather the person's ultimate response to the sin that tells me more about where they are with the Lord.

Now that one has been born again, recreated in the Image of God, He has a war to wage with the flesh. There is no guarantee that he will complete the course. Each believer still has a free will to use and choose to walk either after the flesh or after the Spirit. At the new birth he is a babe in Christ. He is to grow into the full stature of Christ. This he must choose to do each day by abiding in Christ and obeying the word. All the grace is available, but it remains up to him/her whether they will indure to the end or not. There is more to Scripture than just 'by grace you are saved through faith and not of works lest any man should boast'.

This is where you err, and err greatly. For you salvation is a goal. You have a lot of work to do in order to secure your spot in heaven. You have a lot of "laboring" to do before you can actually be sure that you have done enough. I would hate to have to live in that mess.

You see, I have what I like to call a, "know-so" salvation. I have don't have to work to be sure that I am saved or that I stay saved. The Bible says:

He that believeth on the Son hath everlasting life: and he that believeth not the Son shall not see life; but the wrath of God abideth on him.

(John 3:36)

Verily, verily, I say unto you, He that heareth my word, and believeth on him that sent me, hath everlasting life, and shall not come into condemnation; but is passed from death unto life.

(John 5:24)

And this is the record, that God hath given to us eternal life, and this life is in his Son. He that hath the Son hath life: and he that hath not the Son of God hath not life. These things have I written unto you that believe on the name of the Son of God; that ye may know that ye have eternal life, and that ye may believe on the name of the Son of God.

(1 John 5:11-13)

These three passages tell me that I have salvation right now. I can KNOW according to these verses that because I have believed upon Christ, and because I have the SON, I have eternal life. I will never come under condemnation, I have passed from death to life. My faith is more secure because I have the assurance based upon the Word of God that I am saved right now. I am looking for eternal life, I am not "laboring" or "working" to gain salvation, it is mine today!!!

Furthermore, the Bible says:

That we should be to the praise of his glory, who first trusted in Christ. In whom ye also trusted, after that ye heard the word of truth, the gospel of your salvation: in whom also after that ye believed, ye were sealed with that Holy Spirit of promise, Which is the earnest of our inheritance until the redemption of the purchased possession, unto the praise of his glory.

(Ephesians 1:12-14)

In verse 14, it tells me that I have been sealed with the Holy Spirit, who is the earnest, the down payment of my inheritance until the redemption of the purchased possession. I am that purchased possession awaiting the final day of redemption. I am not my own but was bought with a price. I belong to Jesus, right now. Not 20 years down the road, not when I die, but today, this very minute.

Why would I want to be like you? You don't really know... You are still "laboring" to make your salvation sure. I could never live like that. There would never be any assurance. Everyday is different. One day, I live great, the next, I mess up. If my salvation were based upon my conduct, I would never really know. But God does not leave us in the dark about this. He has provided us His Word and His Spirit in us to witness that we are indeed the children of God.

I would also like to point out that 2 Corinthians has this to say:

Therefore if any man be in Christ, he is a new creature: old things are passed away; behold, all things are become new.

(2 Corinthians 5:17)

When I get born again, I can live any way I want to. How can I say that? Simple. Now that I am saved, I have a new set of "want tos." What I want now, is different than what I wanted before I was saved. I have the Holy Spirit living on the inside of me, and as a Christian, I have a new heart, and a new set of desires. People like you underestimate the transforming power of the Holy Spirit and over estimate the power of the flesh.

Your argument is not with me for I have only quoted the Scriptures and pointed out some of the things that are overlooked today.

You can lose the arrogance. Disagreeing with you is not tantamount to disagreeing with God. You are subject to the same fallibilities as the rest of us, and so is your ability to interpret Scripture. Instead of claiming that disagreeing with you is equal to arguing with God, how about using some intellectual honesty instead?

Peter said nothing that is at odds with anything I have said heretofore. Keeping the Sabbath does not ensure your place in eternity. It is silly for anyone to pretend that it does. That is what all of this boils down to. Your argument is that keeping the Sabbath is part of the "laboring" of obedience to enter into salvation, therefore, the truth be told, you believe that keeping that Sabbath is necessary for salvation. You probably don't have integrity to put in those words on this board, but that is what you have been dancing around.

You began this canard with the nonsense that those who claim to love Jesus should be obedient, and that their rejection of the Sabbath is inconsistent with their claim to love Jesus. You are nothing but legalist preaching a false gospel.

[Pilgrim7]

Wow!

What a landslide. Where do I start. I stated that they were works of faith which no one seemed to see. The true christian obeys the word of God by FAITH, all of it! If he fails to do this then he sins and needs to repent and be forgiven. Then get up an obey the word of God by FAITH! Yes living FAITH obeys 'every word that proceeds from the mouth of God', if not he sins and needs repentance. This would especially enclude the Holy Sabbath of God that Jesus created for Adam and his posterity. The Sabbath throughout the Scriptures:

IN THE BEGINNING:

Gen 2:1 Thus the heavens and the earth were finished, and all the host of them.

2:2 And on the seventh day God ended his work which he had made; and he rested on the seventh day from all his work which he had made.

2:3 And God blessed the seventh day, and sanctified it: because that in it he had rested from all his work which God created and made.

2:4 These [are] the generations of the heavens and of the earth when they were created, in the day that the LORD God made the earth and the heavens,

THE SABBATH BEFORE MOUNT SINAI AND THE OLD COVENANT:

Exo 16:14 And when the dew that lay was gone up, behold, upon the face of the wilderness [there lay] a small round thing, [as] small as the hoar frost on the ground.

16:15 And when the children of Israel saw [it], they said one to another, It [is] manna: for they wist not what it [was]. And Moses said unto them, This [is] the bread which the LORD hath given you to eat.

16:16 This [is] the thing which the LORD hath commanded, Gather of it every man according to his eating, an omer for every man, [according to] the number of your persons; take ye every man for [them] which [are] in his tents.

16:17 And the children of Israel did so, and gathered, some more, some less.

16:18 And when they did mete [it] with an omer, he that gathered much had nothing over, and he that gathered little had no lack; they gathered every man according to his eating.

16:19 And Moses said, Let no man leave of it till the morning.

16:20 Notwithstanding they hearkened not unto Moses; but some of them left of it until the morning, and it bred worms, and stank: and Moses was wroth with them.

16:21 And they gathered it every morning, every man according to his eating: and when the sun waxed hot, it melted.

16:22 And it came to pass, [that] on the sixth day they gathered twice as much bread, two omers for one [man]: and all the rulers of the congregation came and told Moses.

16:23 And he said unto them, This [is that] which the LORD hath said, To morrow [is] the rest of the holy sabbath unto the LORD: bake [that] which ye will bake [to day], and seethe that ye will seethe; and that which remaineth over lay up for you to be kept until the morning.

16:24 And they laid it up till the morning, as Moses bade: and it did not stink, neither was there any worm therein.

16:25 And Moses said, Eat that to day; for to day [is] a sabbath unto the LORD: to day ye shall not find it in the field.

16:26 Six days ye shall gather it; but on the seventh day, [which is] the sabbath, in it there shall be none.

16:27 And it came to pass, [that] there went out [some] of the people on the seventh day for to gather, and they found none.

16:28 And the LORD said unto Moses, How long refuse ye to keep my commandments and my laws?

16:29 See, for that the LORD hath given you the sabbath, therefore he giveth you on the sixth day the bread of two days; abide ye every man in his place, let no man go out of his place on the seventh day.

16:30 So the people rested on the seventh day.

AFTER THE CAPTIVITY IN EGYPT:

Exo 20:8 Remember the sabbath day, to keep it holy.

20:9 Six days shalt thou labour, and do all thy work:

20:10 But the seventh day [is] the sabbath of the LORD thy God: [in it] thou shalt not do any work, thou, nor thy son, nor thy daughter, thy manservant, nor thy maidservant, nor thy cattle, nor thy stranger that [is] within thy gates: (Why did God command them to keep the His Holy Sabbath?)

20:11 For [in] six days the LORD made heaven and earth, the sea, and all that in them [is], and rested the seventh day: wherefore the LORD (Jesus) blessed the sabbath day, and hallowed it. (Here we have the answer, because it identifies him, Jesus, as the creator of all and the one who made it Holy for all mankind.)

IN REVELATION:

Rev 14:6 And I saw another angel fly in the midst of heaven, having the everlasting gospel to preach unto them that dwell on the earth, and to every nation, and kindred, and tongue, and people, (Here God connects the everlasting gospel with worshipping him as creator.)

14:7 Saying with a loud voice, Fear God, and give glory to him; for the hour of his judgment is come: and worship him that made heaven, and earth, and the sea, and the fountains of waters. (He that also created the Sabbath day and made it Holy for holy pursuits such as worship)

IN THE NEW EARTH:

Isa 66:22 For as the new heavens and the new earth, which I will make, shall remain before me, saith the LORD, so shall your seed and your name remain.

66:23 And it shall come to pass, [that] from one new moon to another, and from one sabbath to another, shall all flesh come to worship before me, saith the LORD.

(here the Lord very clearly ties the Sabbath to worship. And since the Lord never changes, then it has always been for worship)

Here God has had the 7th day Sabbath since creation. He had it before the Old Covenant, He has it today and will have it in the 'new earth' when we have entered into eternal rest. The case has been made, I rest my case.

God Bless,

Dennis

[MrSealedEternal]

Wow!

What a landslide. Where do I start. I stated that they were works of faith which no one seemed to see. The true christian obeys the word of God by FAITH, all of it! If he fails to do this then he sins and needs to repent and be forgiven. Then get up an obey the word of God by FAITH! Yes living FAITH obeys 'every word that proceeds from the mouth of God', if not he sins and needs repentance. This would especially enclude the Holy Sabbath of God that Jesus created for Adam and his posterity.......

"Works of faith" is not a "faith" that is reckoned as righteousness.

Roman 4:5 "But to the one who does not work, but believes in Him who justifies the ungodly, his faith is reckoned as righteousness."

No flesh will be justified by "works of faith."

Galatians 2:16 nevertheless knowing that a man is not justified by the works of the Law but through faith in Christ Jesus, even we have believed in Christ Jesus, so that we may be justified by faith in Christ and not by the works of the Law; since by the works of the Law no flesh will be justified.

"Faith" means trusting God to save you, and that you can't save yourself. You are trusting in you to save yourself, and are denying what He has already done for you. If you can be snatched away, you're not in His hands.

John 10:28,29

[JesusisGod2]

I also would like to ask a question.

Is the Sabbath something that we observe, or is it something that we enter into?

Interesting that 6 days have a night and day, except the seventh day or Sabbath day which seems to be eternal. it really mentions no day or night like the other days. It also appears to be the only day that God blessed and sanctified.

So is this day something that we enter into or simply observe once a week?

Paul (Colossians 2:16-17) refers to the Sabbath as a shadow of Christ that is no longer binding since the substance (Christ) has come. To Christians every day is one of Sabbath rest because we have ceased from our spiritual labor and rest in the salvation that is found in Christ Jesus (Hebrews 4:9-11).

The apostles (who were Jews) warned the Gentiles about many kinds of sins throughout their writings, but breaking the Sabbath was never mentioned. You will never find any command in the OT or NT where Gentiles were ever commanded to keep the 4th commandment of the Decalogue.

When the Apostles met in council at Jerusalem (Acts 15), they did not impose Sabbath keeping on Gentile believers. Nowhere in the Old Testament are any Gentiles ever commanded to observe the Sabbath just as no Gentiles were condemned for failing to keep it. Nowhere in the NT, after the cross, do we see anyone commanded to observe the Sabbath. This seems very strange if Sabbath observance was meant to be an

[Guest shiloh357]

The case has been made, I rest my case.

Dennis, if you want to keep the Sabbath day, that is your choice. It is not tied to salvation. You are not more secure in your salvation because you do. That is my only point. No one is required to keep the Sabbath upon pain of losing eternal life. If you are trusting in your Sabbath-keeping to save you, you will be disappointed at the throne. If you are trusting that your Sabbath-keeping is part of securing your salvation, you are placing the responsibility for your salvation upon yourself. In doing so, you are taking the glory away from God for your salvation. Salvation is based upon what Christ did not upon what you do. God and God alone, is to get the glory for our salvation. That way no one can say, "I am saved because I do this or that." As it is, you appear to believe that you are saved because you are obedient, thus God is robbed of His glory. Your salvation becomes a work of your "righteous" conduct, instead of a work of God. God will not share that glory with you.

You see, where Sabbath observance, or ANY observance is concerned, it is not merely the observance of the commandment, but the observance of the commandment WITHOUT the stain of sin upon it, that is required. That is where we fall short. This is why our righteousnesses are like filthy rags before the Lord, as we see in Isaiah. We cannot "keep" the Sabbath or any other commandment good enough to please the Lord. Certainly not good enough to "labor" our way into salvation. Even if you kept the Sabbath in exact accordance to prescription laid out in the Word of God, your observance is of no value because of the sin into which you were born.

Even the works we do AFTER we are saved, are stained with sin. Sin has not been eradicated from us just because we are saved. This why Christ fulfills the righteousness of the Law/Torah within us. Our works, no matter how lofty, no matter "perfect" in our eyes, will never meet with God's expectations. We will never "keep" the Sabbath or any other commandment in the way demanded of us. The only One capable of keeping the Law according to prescription was Jesus, and our salvation is based upon the imputation of His righteousness to us who believe on His Name. Just as God imputed our sins upon Him at the cross, His righteousness has been imputed to us who believe. We are declared (not made) righteous by virtue of the finished work of Christ upon the cross. We will one day be made righteous in the absolute sense, but that is when we receive the fullness of our inheritance.

Again, you are of course, free in Christ to keep the Sabbath, and there is no condemnation for it. You simply err when you try to tie it to salvation.

[Pilgrim7]

Shiloh my brother,

I want you to know that I really appreciate your new tone in your replies. Praise God. I really mean that, I am not being sarcastic. Much of what you write I agree with. We can't keep any command perfectly, this is where the 'righteousness of Christ' perfects our obedience. He covers any falling short in our obedience. Yet this does not excuse us from our obedience. I cannot keep the Sabbath perfectly, Jesus, with the incense that he offers to God in the Sanctuary, adds His righteousness to my obedience and perfects it. Yet the work we do is really not our works, because we, the old man is dead, so it is really Christ working through us who is really doing the works through us. Thus my Sabbath keeping in not my work, but Jesus, who kept His Holy Sabbath which He created for me, working through me.

Believe me I have been saved by faith, but a faith that allows God to fullfill His righteousness in me and work the obedience of Christ through me. I don't depend on my works for I am dead and my life is hid with Christ in God. It is Jesus working His works through me. Praise God, for He gets all the glory, for it is Him working through me. How could I take any glory or depend on my works when I am dead.

God Bless you my brother,

Dennis

[Guest shiloh357]

Shiloh my brother,

I want you to know that I really appreciate your new tone in your replies. Praise God. I really mean that, I am not being sarcastic. Much of what you write I agree with. We can't keep any command perfectly, this is where the 'righteousness of Christ' perfects our obedience. He covers any falling short in our obedience. Yet this does not excuse us from our obedience. I cannot keep the Sabbath perfectly, Jesus, with the incense that he offers to God in the Sanctuary, adds His righteousness to my obedience and perfects it. Yet the work we do is really not our works, because we, the old man is dead, so it is really Christ working through us who is really doing the works through us. Thus my Sabbath keeping in not my work, but Jesus, who kept His Holy Sabbath which He created for me, working through me.

Believe me I have been saved by faith, but a faith that allows God to fullfill His righteousness in me and work the obedience of Christ through me. I don't depend on my works for I am dead and my life is hid with Christ in God. It is Jesus working His works through me. Praise God, for He gets all the glory, for it is Him working through me. How could I take any glory or depend on my works when I am dead.

God Bless you my brother,

Dennis

God bless you as well Shabbat Shalom!!

[Pilgrim7]

I surrender,

I am fallen from grace as was Paul:

ACTS 13:42 And when the Jews were gone out of the synagogue, the Gentiles besought that these words might be preached to them the next sabbath.

13:43 Now when the congregation was broken up, many of the Jews and religious proselytes followed Paul and Barnabas: who, speaking to them, persuaded them to continue in the grace of God. (It looks like Paul didn

[MrSealedEternal]

I surrender,

I am fallen from grace as was Paul:

ACTS 13:42 And when the Jews were gone out of the synagogue, the Gentiles besought that these words might be preached to them the next sabbath.

13:43 Now when the congregation was broken up, many of the Jews and religious proselytes followed Paul and Barnabas: who, speaking to them, persuaded them to continue in the grace of God. (It looks like Paul didn