WayneB Posted July 11, 2006 Group: Worthy Ministers Followers: 4 Topic Count: 232 Topics Per Day: 0.03 Content Count: 7,261 Content Per Day: 0.96 Reputation: 79 Days Won: 0 Joined: 08/30/2003 Status: Offline Birthday: 12/19/1959 Share Posted July 11, 2006 if we are to judge behavior that is one thing and you are correct about it..however the statement "and if he didn't...which is more likely..his mind is so gone...fried from years of drug abuse" is extremely judgemental. Not only is it a judgement about Ozzy's ability to comprehend God and find salvation, it is also a judgement on others who have spent many years abusing drugs. To further this, the judgement is also on God's ability to take the ill and heal them and turn their lives around..completely heal their minds. And yes it was a judgement on his final destiny as you put it..read it more carefully. Regardless I am saying that whenever we look at these "behaviors" and make such statments we are completely judging..it isn't partial. It is all or nothing..how can there be a loving concern about behaviors that do not exhibit the fruit of the spirit when such statements are made. Which in turn is most definitely NOT righteous judgement. Actually brother, the statement is a fact. Drugs do kill brain matter and inhibit a person's ability to make sound judgements and decisions. Regardless, read LadyRaven's statement in context to her other statements, specifically, "In that respect Ozzy is no worse than the rest of us before we were saved. It wasn't the alter call, the music, the brilliant presentation of a friend, a tract, etc... that brought us to Christ. It was the HS melting our heart of stone. The rest are vehicles." I'm not use to defending the statements of others so I'll stop here. It is better to ask LadyRaven what she means. My only point, which you have agreed with I think, is that we are called to judge behavior and distinguish between holy & righteous AND evil & destructive. Bless you, Wayne Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest jckduboise Posted July 12, 2006 Share Posted July 12, 2006 if we are to judge behavior that is one thing and you are correct about it..however the statement "and if he didn't...which is more likely..his mind is so gone...fried from years of drug abuse" is extremely judgemental. Not only is it a judgement about Ozzy's ability to comprehend God and find salvation, it is also a judgement on others who have spent many years abusing drugs. To further this, the judgement is also on God's ability to take the ill and heal them and turn their lives around..completely heal their minds. And yes it was a judgement on his final destiny as you put it..read it more carefully. Regardless I am saying that whenever we look at these "behaviors" and make such statments we are completely judging..it isn't partial. It is all or nothing..how can there be a loving concern about behaviors that do not exhibit the fruit of the spirit when such statements are made. Which in turn is most definitely NOT righteous judgement. Actually brother, the statement is a fact. Drugs do kill brain matter and inhibit a person's ability to make sound judgements and decisions. Regardless, read LadyRaven's statement in context to her other statements, specifically, "In that respect Ozzy is no worse than the rest of us before we were saved. It wasn't the alter call, the music, the brilliant presentation of a friend, a tract, etc... that brought us to Christ. It was the HS melting our heart of stone. The rest are vehicles." I'm not use to defending the statements of others so I'll stop here. It is better to ask LadyRaven what she means. My only point, which you have agreed with I think, is that we are called to judge behavior and distinguish between holy & righteous AND evil & destructive. Bless you, Wayne and after 20 years of drug abuse and addiction I can tell you that God has the ability to change that person, heal that person and give them the ability to become ripe in the fruits of the Spirit. Judge the behavior, not the soul, spirit or the person. Otherwise we are condemning the person we judge..big NO NO! bless you as well sir Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mark777 Posted July 12, 2006 Group: Advanced Member Followers: 0 Topic Count: 6 Topics Per Day: 0.00 Content Count: 416 Content Per Day: 0.06 Reputation: 12 Days Won: 0 Joined: 05/16/2006 Status: Offline Share Posted July 12, 2006 oh no - an Ozzy rant............ And another thing, Micen, is that if all the well meaning Christians in the 1970's and 80's would have put their energy into loving and witnessing to Ozzy - instead of screaming that he was a satanist, "I mean Martha, his band is called B-l-a-c-k-S-a-b-b-a-t-h!" Maybe things for him would have been different. I have read a lot of religious crap about how Black Sabbath were satanists and Ozzy sacrificed animals at concerts and stuff. You know, Ozzy knew those things were not true and probably proved to him that Christianity was made up of a bunch of liars. He was an entertainer who specialized in drama both good and bad. He wanted to sell records and he was marketing young people. Ozzy isn't a great man but he is one that influenced a generation. It would be cool if he turned it around and helped fix what he has wrought. I have a documentary called Don't Blame Me about Ozzy. He has hurt lives and caused many to feel drug use is some how glorified. He raised his kids to be completely lost. He has a lot to answer for. We should pray for all entertainers that have that power over young people. They are a message whether they know it or not. Mark Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WayneB Posted July 12, 2006 Group: Worthy Ministers Followers: 4 Topic Count: 232 Topics Per Day: 0.03 Content Count: 7,261 Content Per Day: 0.96 Reputation: 79 Days Won: 0 Joined: 08/30/2003 Status: Offline Birthday: 12/19/1959 Share Posted July 12, 2006 and after 20 years of drug abuse and addiction I can tell you that God has the ability to change that person, heal that person and give them the ability to become ripe in the fruits of the Spirit. Judge the behavior, not the soul, spirit or the person. Otherwise we are condemning the person we judge..big NO NO! bless you as well sir I do not disagree with you. No one that I can see stated otherwise. Problem is that often there are consequences to our bad behaviors and the deeper we become consumed in sin, the harder it is for us to humble ourselves and hear God knocking at the door of our heart. I speak from experience as well brother. Praise the Lord for your repentent heart, turning away from that which was destroying you. I wish there were more like you who were able to conquer their addictions. I work with inmates and my experience is that few overcome their addictions because they try to do so all on their own. Most are unwilling to let go of the world and embrace Christ. Honestly... I praise God for you. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LadyRaven Posted July 12, 2006 Group: Royal Member Followers: 2 Topic Count: 13 Topics Per Day: 0.00 Content Count: 1,981 Content Per Day: 0.30 Reputation: 3 Days Won: 0 Joined: 05/22/2006 Status: Offline Birthday: 04/20/1964 Share Posted July 12, 2006 So....... like there's this prophet right..?................. In the book of kings.....mmmmm....maybe ch 25...some one would know better than I the "location" of the tale.... But see...this "prophet" get's this other prophet to break his deal with God...and that prophet (who broke the rules) Gets killed. By this the other prophet....is confirmed...that he was indeed a prophet from God...and that his words will surely come to pass....and even as he died....some did. Well now...this prophet mourned his brothers (brother in the prophetic spirit) death.....even though he intentionally caused him to err. My point is this...............The spirit knows it's intention...and will accomplish it's task....via any available vessel or means. even a donkey in one instance mentioned in the bible.....but the point I'm making , being, that pure righteousness, and a social piety...is not necessarily the nature of a prophet. I get the chills...when I hear some of Ozzy's stuff...both new and old.....his love for humanity...aside from any "prince of darkness" (shock value titles) he's addopted.............I say he has a decent heart...and has led a hard and reckless life....but this does not make him a "bad guy"......................... but thats not even my point..........I feel a certain spirit in him...that is found lacking in most preachers....and political leaders of his time. Ozzy Will go down in history as a "great " voice of his age.................moreso than many self proclaimed prophets and teachers. I for one have been blessed to live in his time. and bless him...... It's laughable, and yet sad...that "Christians" are so closed hearted.... I say Ozzy would have walked and talked...further and longer with Jesus himself ...than all of his accusers (who don't even have sincere fodder, to argue against a man they don't even take a moment to try to know...-save only that which he willingly volounteered to you- with his reckless abandon and theatricly "shocking" ways) I usually get up and leave too...when someone with no spiritual girth...""witnesses" to me......... Wittness .....what a farce......(a crock even) Personally, I *like* Ozzy. I feel very badly that his drug abuse has rendered his mind to the condition it is in. I also feel bad that he has mental problems...I can't remember what the actual diagnosis was but I remember Sharon talking about it years ago. He was under the impression sharon was going to kill him and tried to kill her instead. He is creative and I believe, like Alice Cooper, that a good bit of that "evil" persona he puts forth on stage is vaudville type hype. Some of his music is very deep, asks alot of questions. As far as the episode with the wittnessing individual I did not see that. I saw the one where he wanted to have a romantic evening with sharon and went through an awful lot to build a bonfire in the backyard only to have the tide come in, the one where he got a car you had to speak commands to (and the computer could not understand his use of the f word), one where he decided to get take out but didn't know what anyone wanted so ordered stuff from just about every delivery place in town and a few other ones with the kids home fighting. Most likely the person best able to wittness to him, if indeed he has not been saved, is probably Alice Cooper. They had been friends for years, if they are not still friends. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jamie Posted July 12, 2006 Group: Diamond Member Followers: 0 Topic Count: 104 Topics Per Day: 0.01 Content Count: 1,026 Content Per Day: 0.14 Reputation: 11 Days Won: 0 Joined: 10/13/2003 Status: Offline Share Posted July 12, 2006 micen2, I like the 'realness' in your personality. But do a study on the holiness of God. Ozzie's not there brother, not at all. Holiness is something we know so little about these days. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest jckduboise Posted July 12, 2006 Share Posted July 12, 2006 and after 20 years of drug abuse and addiction I can tell you that God has the ability to change that person, heal that person and give them the ability to become ripe in the fruits of the Spirit. Judge the behavior, not the soul, spirit or the person. Otherwise we are condemning the person we judge..big NO NO! bless you as well sir I do not disagree with you. No one that I can see stated otherwise. Problem is that often there are consequences to our bad behaviors and the deeper we become consumed in sin, the harder it is for us to humble ourselves and hear God knocking at the door of our heart. I speak from experience as well brother. Praise the Lord for your repentent heart, turning away from that which was destroying you. I wish there were more like you who were able to conquer their addictions. I work with inmates and my experience is that few overcome their addictions because they try to do so all on their own. Most are unwilling to let go of the world and embrace Christ. Honestly... I praise God for you. Thank you Wayne..God has been very good to me..praise God for you also..just for the record and tenderly spoken..I am a sister..smiles Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ColleenLovesMischief Posted July 12, 2006 Group: Royal Member Followers: 2 Topic Count: 100 Topics Per Day: 0.01 Content Count: 2,791 Content Per Day: 0.37 Reputation: 21 Days Won: 0 Joined: 10/21/2003 Status: Offline Birthday: 06/13/1977 Share Posted July 12, 2006 Actually Ozzy is a believer in Christ. He rededicated his life right after 9/11 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gerioke Posted July 12, 2006 Group: Royal Member Followers: 3 Topic Count: 97 Topics Per Day: 0.01 Content Count: 5,850 Content Per Day: 0.84 Reputation: 128 Days Won: 0 Joined: 03/19/2005 Status: Offline Birthday: 08/11/1911 Share Posted July 12, 2006 Actually Ozzy is a believer in Christ. He rededicated his life right after 9/11 He's going through changes? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ColleenLovesMischief Posted July 12, 2006 Group: Royal Member Followers: 2 Topic Count: 100 Topics Per Day: 0.01 Content Count: 2,791 Content Per Day: 0.37 Reputation: 21 Days Won: 0 Joined: 10/21/2003 Status: Offline Birthday: 06/13/1977 Share Posted July 12, 2006 Actually Ozzy is a believer in Christ. He rededicated his life right after 9/11 He's going through changes? LOL yeah I guess you would call it that. Think about it some are saved and just don't let it show. I was that way for a looooooooooooooong time! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts