Questions From an Atheist

[sealdogfish]

sealdogfish,

If someone is saved and turn back and renounce God if they die then they would be in Hell.

If someone is saved, backslides for a large portion of life then returns to God then dies, then yes they are in heaven.

But it must be said that we are not guarenteed tommorrow and must live like it is our last!! Ready to see Jesus.

candi

So what about baptism? is it necessary after we have been saved? (or before)

(No longer able to reply in the other topic, had to try here)

[Candi770]

"I was simply stating that I thought that the base of the Christian doctrine is essentially "Love thy neighbor."

Says nothing about my personal beliefs.

________________

What is relevant is the truth. And the Lord Jesus Christ is the truth, and the Holy Bible is the truth. Christianity is the opposite of religion:

Religion says "behave", Christianity says "believe."

Religion says "do", Christianity says "done."

Religion says "try", Christianity says "trust."

Religion is man substituting himself for "God." Christianity is God substituting Himself for man in the person of the Lord Jesus Christ.

There are many "religions" that also "essentially" have the doctrine of "Love thy neighbor", but that does not make them "Christian", does not make them "true."

A health club, psychic hotline, dating service, "Dr. Phil", "how to books", "religion" etc., can teach "moral"/physical/spiritual precepts, and/or may/can change lives, but that does not make it Christian!

What separates Christianity from "religion", is that only one person went to "an altar", shed His blood on that altar, died on that altar, and lived to tell about it-the risen, ascended, and glorified Lord Jesus Christ. Mohammed is dead. Budha is dead. Ghandi is dead. Moses is dead. Mary is dead....=the resurrection.

Despite what you may have read, the number one attribute attributed to the LORD God of the Holy Bible is His Holiness(holy=to be separate from), not His love. And the basis for a right standing with a Holy God is grace, not love-Ephesians 2:8,9. Love is the motivation. The LORD God, cannot "love anyone into His presence." In order to restore man to a right relationship, and be justified in His sight, He had to "take care of the sin issue." And that He did, sending the Lord Jesus Christ to die in our place for our sins(1 Cor. 15:1-4, Gal. 1:4), so as to spare us from the wages of sin, which is death(Romans 6:23).

My brother is a doctor, so perhaps a medical analogy will clarify my argument that we need to be clear on the remedy for man's separation from a Holy God. If one of our loved ones were physically ill, we would not want to be deceived. We would not want to make life and death decisions based on superstition or mysticism. We would want precise answers to specific questions. We would not want general notions, opinions(one of the reasons the Lord Jesus Christ sharply rebuked the Pharisees-relying on their traditions/opinions instead of the word of God), or empty words. We would actively engage all our faculties to judge the truth. We should desire to know the right standard by which to judge these crucial matters because physical life is at stake. How much more should we value the truth and the right standards when questions concerning eternal life is at stake? Someone may claim to be physically fit and well, while they may have cancer inside beginning to eat away at their physical life. When you visit a doctor, you want the truth, the right prescription, even if does not "make you feel good."

The only "prescription", the only remedy for the sin issue has been given as a gift.

The argument that "All roads lead to the same destination", that all "religions"are equally true(Pluralism) is a self-refuting argument-it self-destructs, and here is why. The notion of "religious pluralism"=all religions are true, and the law of non-contradiction= opposite truth claims cannot both be true; no 2 propositions which contain contrary claims can both be true at the same time; if 2 statements about 1 particular issue contradict one another, then they are both false, or only one of them is true, but they cannot both be true.

If all "religions" are true, then Christianity is true. But the foundation of Christianity is its EXCLUSIVENESS, i.e., all other "religions" are false-Isaiah 43:11, Hosea 13:4,John 14:16, Acts 4:12.... Either Christianity is correct/true, and other "religions" are false/lies, or some other "religion" is true, and Christianity is false. The law of non-contradiction necessitates that if Christianity is true, all other "religions" are false. Either way, all other "religions" and Christianity cannot both be true at the same time. Thus, the Bible's claim to be the only revelation FROM God and OF God to mankind requires that all other religion's "scripture" be false.

The true LORD God, as revealed in the Holy Bible, can only be accessed/justified through His only begotten Son, the Lord Jesus Christ, who is "...the power of God, and the wisdom of God"(1 Cor. 1:24), by His authority, through the power of the Holy Spirit:

"Neither is there salvation in any other: for there is none other name under heaven given among men, whereby we must be saved." Acts 4:12

"Jesus saith unto him, I am the way, the truth and the life; no man cometh unto the Father but by me." John 14:6

"I said therefore unto you, that ye shall die in your sins: for if ye believe not that I am he, ye shall die in your sins." John 8:24

"Then said they unto him, Where is thy Father? Jesus answered, Ye neither know me, nor my Father: if ye had known me, ye should have known my Father also." John 8:19

"If ye had known me, ye should have known my Father also: and from henceforth ye know him, and have seen him." John 14:7

"And this is life eternal, that they might know thee the only true God, and Jesus Christ, whom thou hast sent." John 17:3

"...neither knoweth any man the Father, save the Son, and he to whomsoever the Son will reveal him." Mt. 11:27

"But now in Christ Jesus....For through him we both have access by one Spirit unto the Father." Ephesians 2:13, 18

"Therefore being justified by faith, we have peace with God through our Lord Jesus Christ: By whom also we have access by faith into this grace wherein we stand, and rejoice in hope of the glory of God." Romans 5:1,2

"And whatsoever ye do in word or deed, do all in the name of the Lord Jesus, giving thanks to God and the Father by him" Colossians 3:17(see also Ephesians 5: 20, Romans 1:8)

This Christ-rejecting world, "religion", shuns mentioning the name of the Lord Jesus Christ. As such, God the Father does not, and will not, honour any "access" requests, except through the Lord Jesus Christ, and any worship of any "god" that is not revealed by/accessed through the Lord Jesus Christ, and revealed exclusively through the Holy Bible, is not honored, as it is written:

"That all men should honour the Son, even as they honour the Father. He that honoureth not the Son honoureth not the Father which hath sent him." John 5:23

But one day soon, every one, both saved and lost, will honor the Lord Jesus Christ, all to the glory of God the Father, as it is written:

"Wherefore God also hath highly exalted him, and given him a name which is above every name: That at the name of Jesus every knee should bow, of things in heaven, and things in earth, and things under the earth; And that every tongue should confess that Jesus Christ is Lord, to the glory of God the Father." Philippians 2:9-11

I "...know not any..."(Is. 44:8) God apart from the God that is revealed in the Holy Bible, and in and through the Lord Jesus Christ. And notice Israel's history is a documentation of their failure in witnessing to this true God of the Holy Bible, despite the LORD God's charge to them:

"Ye are my witnesses, saith the LORD, and my servant whom I have chosen: that ye may know and believe me, and understand that I am he: before me there was no God formed, neither shall there be after me(emphasis mine). I, even I, am the LORD; and beside me there is no saviour." Is. 43:10-11

Simarlily, those in Christ are called to witness to the only LORD God of the Holy Bible, and the only Saviour, the Lord Jesus Christ. Anything less, and we are guilty of the same charge made against Israel-spiritual adultery. The LORD God in the OT refers to this as idolatry, and Paul makes the same charge in 1 Cor. 8:4-6.

To all Muslims, Jews, Hindus...........: The only time the truth hurts is if you do not reveal it. And Christians are called to proclaim the only God as revealed in the Holy Bible. Praying to some false "THE UNKNOWN GOD" is ignorant worship(Acts 17:23), whether it is Allah, whether it is Buddha........, and is idolatry, and deceit, and only gives "...comfort in vain..."(Zechariah 10:2).

As Christians, we have our orders. Let us carry them out without reservation, without excuse, without apology, without fear, without compromise, and with "boldness"(Acts 9:27, 29, 18:26, 19:8; Romans 15:15 2 Cor. 7:4; Eph. 3:12, 6:19,20; Philippians 1:20), so that we "...may please him who hath chosen him to be a soldier"(2 Tim. 2:4), so as "...to walk and to please God...."(1 Thes. 4:1), not men, as "...the servant of Christ...."(Galatians 1:10), for we "...serve the Lord Christ...."(Col. 3:24). We should have no interest in pleasing man, but in pleasing God.

In Christ,

John M. Whalen

[Candi770]

sealdogfish,

In touch ministries had a good reference to baptism, I wasn't able to link to it for what ever reason, oh well.

Yes it is only for the believer only. And it is visual picture of an inner decision. And you can do this after accepting the

Lord.

here is a link to look at another

Baptism

If you want to PM me, I'd be glad respond.

blessings

candi

[Candi770]

sealdogfish,

If someone is saved and turn back and renounce God if they die then they would be in Hell.

If someone is saved, backslides for a large portion of life then returns to God then dies, then yes they are in heaven.

But it must be said that we are not guarenteed tommorrow and must live like it is our last!! Ready to see Jesus.

candi

So what about baptism? is it necessary after we have been saved? (or before)

(No longer able to reply in the other topic, had to try here)

Baptism: Not a Requirement for Salvation- Baptism, Jesus Christ

blessings

candi

[sealdogfish]

sealdogfish,

If someone is saved and turn back and renounce God if they die then they would be in Hell.

If someone is saved, backslides for a large portion of life then returns to God then dies, then yes they are in heaven.

But it must be said that we are not guarenteed tommorrow and must live like it is our last!! Ready to see Jesus.

candi

So what about baptism? is it necessary after we have been saved? (or before)

(No longer able to reply in the other topic, had to try here)

Baptism: Not a Requirement for Salvation- Baptism, Jesus Christ

blessings

candi

Then what is meant by the verse:

John 3:5 Jesus answered, Verily, verily, I say unto thee, Except a man be born of water and of the Spirit, he cannot enter into the kingdom of God.

[Candi770]

sealdogfish,

If someone is saved and turn back and renounce God if they die then they would be in Hell.

If someone is saved, backslides for a large portion of life then returns to God then dies, then yes they are in heaven.

But it must be said that we are not guarenteed tommorrow and must live like it is our last!! Ready to see Jesus.

candi

So what about baptism? is it necessary after we have been saved? (or before)

(No longer able to reply in the other topic, had to try here)

Baptism: Not a Requirement for Salvation- Baptism, Jesus Christ

blessings

candi

Then what is meant by the verse:

John 3:5 Jesus answered, Verily, verily, I say unto thee, Except a man be born of water and of the Spirit, he cannot enter into the kingdom of God.

Read the full context of the above scripture.

John 3:

1. Now there was a man of the Pharisees, named Nicodemus, a ruler of the Jews;

2. this man came to Jesus by night and said to Him, "Rabbi, we know that you have come from God as a teacher; for no one can do these signs that You do unless God is with him."

3. Jesus answered and said to him, "Truly, truly, I say to you, unless one is born again he cannot see the kingdom of God."

4. Nicodemus said to Him, "How can a man be born when he is old? He cannot enter a second time into his mother's womb and be born, can he?"

5. Jesus answered, "Truly, truly, I say to you, unless one is born of water and the Spirit he cannot enter into the kingdom of God.

6. That which is born of flesh is flesh, and that which is born of the Spirit is Spirit.

In understanding what was said, Nicodemus was confused, but Jesus said you must be born into this world (we all come by way of our mothers water-born of flesh) and when we are born again we are born of the Spirit.

I hope that helps.

blessings

candi

[Joshua-777]

Why? Because Christianity is not a religion. Satan comes as an angel of the Light, cheating many though philosiphy, and fear. Now early catholism started cause the king wanted every one he ruled over to be christian, cause christians where concidered good people, they killed thousands all in the name of God, which they where blind. Neo nazi's all the same, violence is a product of man made tradition. Christianity is not a religion, it is a personal relationship. Now as far as accepting others, well Jesus accepted prostitutes, tax collecters, sinners, yet they new they had sin. Homosexuality has been just as attacking on Christianity as Christianity on homosexuals if not more attacking, for the fact. Homosexuality is a sin, Love the sinners hate the sin, but in a carnal mind, they hate the one who calls it a sin. Sin only makes us what we are in the world. There is corouption everwhere. THrough the blood of Jesus we are free. Now me, I am an x drug addict, and also a former sex adict, Now would It be wise for me to hang out with temptation? Those oposing my beliefs, seek to destroy beliefs, I do have friends that are aithiest, that are gay, that are drug addicts. I am friends, but I do not have fellowship with them, around what they do, or doing what they do, for I am a child of the Light. Yes love them, but make known the truth. Christianity set apart from Christ is alot of reason why we have violence. My Lord says love thy enemys. Which I do, Its not my place to condem them, it is my place to make known the word. If someone cannot accept me saying that is a sin, where the bible directly says it is a sin, then what friendship is there? Yes I do accept others not what they do. I am the worst of the worst sinners, yet the Lord has shown his grace on me, and his blood covers me. There are alot of wolves in sheeps clothing, those that seek to devour, My place to to make known, not devour. My war isnt with flesh and blood. Those who call themselves christians, yet act contrary to their beliefs and claim it's from God are false. If a Christian is trying to justify somthing that God has said is wrong, then they are false. Anyone can claim a name, or a title, but that is why christianity is set apart from religion. Now christianity viewed as a religion, and a belief, is a dangerious thing, I am A christian yes, not a set man made form of beliefs but I am a christian through the revelation of Christ, and the Holy Spirit working in my life. It is a living relationship, not a man made tradition, I know Jesus personally. There are so many who's love is cold in Christ, they are bitter, and angery, acting contrary to what Jesus Preaches. IT has been said "You will know Christians by their love" True christians, Believe in Christ, Love in Christ, and live in Christ. If we claim to be His children, yet our lives and hearts contradict, then we are not his. Christ can be seen in our lives, and through our love. In word and in action we confess Christ.