Slave To Righteousness

[Guest Biblicist]

I know of a Pastor who became addicted to perscription drugs. Does that make him not a Christian anymore?

Addictions are very strong. Drugs are not the only things people can become addicted to.

I never read any place in the Bible that an addiction to prescription drugs is a sin. I also know of nothing in the Bible that states an addiction is a sin. As such, since the Pastor hasn't done anything that goes against God's Word, I don't know why he would cease to be a Christian?

OH, I forgot to mention that he was forging perscriptions to aquire these drugs, since the doctors took him off as a result of his addiction. So yeah, I'd say he was sinning by using his addiction, which happens with most addictions, to break the law.

[Eddie B]

I was not trying to hurt anyones feelings. But I was trying to provoke a clear answer from tsth. She sounds mature enough to handle what I said and the way I said it, but I apoligize if I came on to strong.

To put it simply, Rom 7 is a saved person who struggles to live for God by the Law through self-effort, not yet aware that it is the Holy Spirit that delivers and inables one to live for God (8:2-4) not of a unsaved person who gets saved.

The ? I was trying to get from tsth was do you believe in the doctrine of sinless perfection.

Hello Eddie,

I neither was trying to hurt anyones feelings but I was trying to provoke a clear answer from you. I think tsth is pretty plain in what she has been meaning all along even though others have said otherwise about her in this thread as I have been reading it and following it from the start and if I being a simpleton can understand what she is meaning then I'm unsure why others can't.

Now as for Romans 7 there has always been many controversial interpretations of that passage always have been always will be. I have heard so many it makes my head spin the lastest was that it was referring to sanctification.

Actually the passage is referring to apostle Paul himself in the struggle he found himself fighting with being between his flesh and spirit which are the two laws apostle Paul mentions in the chapter being the law of the flesh and the law of the spirit. Paul concluded that with his members in his body being his hands, feet, eyes all of the members of his body that he would serve the law of sin.

It was Jesus Christ that set him free from the law of sin and death the same as us and now we willingly choose to serve the Lord with the members of our bodies. We don't use our bodies for sexual sins, our tongues to gossip our hands to drink and get drunk our eyes to see and indulge in wicked things like it says in Romans 6 but instead we use the members of our body for righteous things not for sin. The word says the spirit is willing but the flesh is weak. Paul also talked about his mind in that passage as he had to yield his mind over to God as well as we are taught to have the mind of Christ in Phillippians and we are taught to renew our minds and not to have carnal minds minds that are on earthly carnal things all the time Romans 8 but things that are eternal.

You see Paul is saying and teaching us that Jesus set us free from self effort as you called it as the law couldn't make one righteous for there wasn't a law given that could do that that we could practice and do to become righteous that is why the law was not perfect and we need Jesus blood to atone for our sins as that is the only thing that makes one righteous as it set us free to be able to walk and live in the spirit doing the things of God.

So in you analogy thus far I have found myself in disagreement with you. First off here I want to say that I do not get up every morning with the thoughts in my head like what sin am I going to engage in today? Instead I get up with the Lord on my mind and often a song of praise in my heart as I am looking for how I am going to please and serve God that day. I don' think a person has to sin everyday sure we all fall short of God's glory but we all don't go and engage in willful sin every day either. As you have been set free to walk in the spirit you have a choice to engage in the sin of the flesh or walk pleasing to God everyday saying no to the sins of the world. You can live close to God or as far away as you want.

I don't agree with your assessment.

OC

Well OC I said I would put my comment in a few words.

Weather you believe Paul is talking about himself and he is, before conversion or after conversion, the result of the Law is the same it dosn't bring eternal life(justification) or spiritual life(santification).What I believe Paul is talking about is our justification cannot happen by self-effort through the law(if you believe hes talking about before his conversion) or our santification cannot be done by self-effort(by trying to obey the Law through self-effort)after his conversion.But only by dependence on the Holy Spirit can you experience the life of Christ within you.

[Openly Curious]

I was not trying to hurt anyones feelings. But I was trying to provoke a clear answer from tsth. She sounds mature enough to handle what I said and the way I said it, but I apoligize if I came on to strong.

To put it simply, Rom 7 is a saved person who struggles to live for God by the Law through self-effort, not yet aware that it is the Holy Spirit that delivers and inables one to live for God (8:2-4) not of a unsaved person who gets saved.

The ? I was trying to get from tsth was do you believe in the doctrine of sinless perfection.

Hello Eddie,

I neither was trying to hurt anyones feelings but I was trying to provoke a clear answer from you. I think tsth is pretty plain in what she has been meaning all along even though others have said otherwise about her in this thread as I have been reading it and following it from the start and if I being a simpleton can understand what she is meaning then I'm unsure why others can't.

Now as for Romans 7 there has always been many controversial interpretations of that passage always have been always will be. I have heard so many it makes my head spin the lastest was that it was referring to sanctification.

Actually the passage is referring to apostle Paul himself in the struggle he found himself fighting with being between his flesh and spirit which are the two laws apostle Paul mentions in the chapter being the law of the flesh and the law of the spirit. Paul concluded that with his members in his body being his hands, feet, eyes all of the members of his body that he would serve the law of sin.

It was Jesus Christ that set him free from the law of sin and death the same as us and now we willingly choose to serve the Lord with the members of our bodies. We don't use our bodies for sexual sins, our tongues to gossip our hands to drink and get drunk our eyes to see and indulge in wicked things like it says in Romans 6 but instead we use the members of our body for righteous things not for sin. The word says the spirit is willing but the flesh is weak. Paul also talked about his mind in that passage as he had to yield his mind over to God as well as we are taught to have the mind of Christ in Phillippians and we are taught to renew our minds and not to have carnal minds minds that are on earthly carnal things all the time Romans 8 but things that are eternal.

You see Paul is saying and teaching us that Jesus set us free from self effort as you called it as the law couldn't make one righteous for there wasn't a law given that could do that that we could practice and do to become righteous that is why the law was not perfect and we need Jesus blood to atone for our sins as that is the only thing that makes one righteous as it set us free to be able to walk and live in the spirit doing the things of God.

So in you analogy thus far I have found myself in disagreement with you. First off here I want to say that I do not get up every morning with the thoughts in my head like what sin am I going to engage in today? Instead I get up with the Lord on my mind and often a song of praise in my heart as I am looking for how I am going to please and serve God that day. I don' think a person has to sin everyday sure we all fall short of God's glory but we all don't go and engage in willful sin every day either. As you have been set free to walk in the spirit you have a choice to engage in the sin of the flesh or walk pleasing to God everyday saying no to the sins of the world. You can live close to God or as far away as you want.

I don't agree with your assessment.

OC

Well OC I said I would put my comment in a few words.

Weather you believe Paul is talking about himself and he is, before conversion or after conversion, the result of the Law is the same it dosn't bring eternal life(justification) or spiritual life(santification). What I believe Paul is talking about is our justification cannot happen by self-effort through the law(if you believe hes talking about before his conversion) or our santification cannot be done by self-effort(by trying to obey the Law through self-effort)after his conversion. But only by dependence on the Holy Spirit can you experience the life of Christ within you.

Hello Eddie,

To tell you the truth you do not sound very clear in what you really believe the passage is saying. First off we are saved through faith by grace I don't feel I have to explain that one but some would argue that is you believe in living out your faith in the sight of God by doing that which is right in this life then you believe in a works salvation and that is not true. We are justified by faith in Christ Jesus as there was many things that happened when we got born again. We were justified and forgiven of our past sins as though we had never committed any. We were made a new creature in Christ Jesus no longer the same person we were before repentance, we were translated from the kingdom of darkness into the kingdom of light, we become the sons of God, made the righteousness of God, became a partaker of the divine nature and so so many other things.

I said in my post that there was no law given that could make one righteous that was why the old testament law was of no effect. That is why the new covenant is based on better promises based on what Christ did for us.

I believe that when I was born again that God imputed His righteousness unto me and that he imparted to me His divine nature making me thus a new creature. I believe I experience the life of Christ because of these thing in which He did within my heart. And I experience that life as I walk and talk with Him in a relationship and He with me. It is God's work that makes this possible but no matter how one slices it you choose to live righteous before God or choose to live unrighteous before God.

You have your fruit unto death (following the sins of the flesh) or you have your fruit unto everlasting life (eternal)

This being the works of the flesh and the works of the Spirit either way one chooses they will have fruit and works.

OC

[Eddie B]

I was not trying to hurt anyones feelings. But I was trying to provoke a clear answer from tsth. She sounds mature enough to handle what I said and the way I said it, but I apoligize if I came on to strong.

To put it simply, Rom 7 is a saved person who struggles to live for God by the Law through self-effort, not yet aware that it is the Holy Spirit that delivers and inables one to live for God (8:2-4) not of a unsaved person who gets saved.

The ? I was trying to get from tsth was do you believe in the doctrine of sinless perfection.

Hello Eddie,

I neither was trying to hurt anyones feelings but I was trying to provoke a clear answer from you. I think tsth is pretty plain in what she has been meaning all along even though others have said otherwise about her in this thread as I have been reading it and following it from the start and if I being a simpleton can understand what she is meaning then I'm unsure why others can't.

Now as for Romans 7 there has always been many controversial interpretations of that passage always have been always will be. I have heard so many it makes my head spin the lastest was that it was referring to sanctification.

Actually the passage is referring to apostle Paul himself in the struggle he found himself fighting with being between his flesh and spirit which are the two laws apostle Paul mentions in the chapter being the law of the flesh and the law of the spirit. Paul concluded that with his members in his body being his hands, feet, eyes all of the members of his body that he would serve the law of sin.

It was Jesus Christ that set him free from the law of sin and death the same as us and now we willingly choose to serve the Lord with the members of our bodies. We don't use our bodies for sexual sins, our tongues to gossip our hands to drink and get drunk our eyes to see and indulge in wicked things like it says in Romans 6 but instead we use the members of our body for righteous things not for sin. The word says the spirit is willing but the flesh is weak. Paul also talked about his mind in that passage as he had to yield his mind over to God as well as we are taught to have the mind of Christ in Phillippians and we are taught to renew our minds and not to have carnal minds minds that are on earthly carnal things all the time Romans 8 but things that are eternal.

You see Paul is saying and teaching us that Jesus set us free from self effort as you called it as the law couldn't make one righteous for there wasn't a law given that could do that that we could practice and do to become righteous that is why the law was not perfect and we need Jesus blood to atone for our sins as that is the only thing that makes one righteous as it set us free to be able to walk and live in the spirit doing the things of God.

So in you analogy thus far I have found myself in disagreement with you. First off here I want to say that I do not get up every morning with the thoughts in my head like what sin am I going to engage in today? Instead I get up with the Lord on my mind and often a song of praise in my heart as I am looking for how I am going to please and serve God that day. I don' think a person has to sin everyday sure we all fall short of God's glory but we all don't go and engage in willful sin every day either. As you have been set free to walk in the spirit you have a choice to engage in the sin of the flesh or walk pleasing to God everyday saying no to the sins of the world. You can live close to God or as far away as you want.

I don't agree with your assessment.

OC

Well OC I said I would put my comment in a few words.

Weather you believe Paul is talking about himself and he is, before conversion or after conversion, the result of the Law is the same it doesn't bring eternal life(justification) or spiritual life(santification). What I believe Paul is talking about is our justification cannot happen by self-effort through the law(if you believe hes talking about before his conversion) or our santification cannot be done by self-effort(by trying to obey the Law through self-effort)after his conversion. But only by dependence on the Holy Spirit can you experience the life of Christ within you.

Hello Eddie,

To tell you the truth you do not sound very clear in what you really believe the passage is saying. First off we are saved through faith by grace I don't feel I have to explain that one but some would argue that is you believe in living out your faith in the sight of God by doing that which is right in this life then you believe in a works salvation and that is not true. We are justified by faith in Christ Jesus as there was many things that happened when we got born again. We were justified and forgiven of our past sins as though we had never committed any. We were made a new creature in Christ Jesus no longer the same person we were before repentance, we were translated from the kingdom of darkness into the kingdom of light, we become the sons of God, made the righteousness of God, became a partaker of the divine nature and so so many other things.

I said in my post that there was no law given that could make one righteous that was why the old testament law was of no effect. That is why the new covenant is based on better promises based on what Christ did for us.

I believe that when I was born again that God imputed His righteousness unto me and that he imparted to me His divine nature making me thus a new creature. I believe I experience the life of Christ because of these thing in which He did within my heart. And I experience that life as I walk and talk with Him in a relationship and He with me. It is God's work that makes this possible but no matter how one slices it you choose to live righteous before God or choose to live unrighteous before God.

You have your fruit unto death (following the sins of the flesh) or you have your fruit unto everlasting life (eternal)

This being the works of the flesh and the works of the Spirit either way one chooses they will have fruit and works.

OC

Hello again OC,

All I can say is that what i said in my first and second post in a few words was exactly what you said in more detail, so i don't know what your disagreeing about.If i didn't make myself clear enough about justification being by grace through faith was because i took it for granted you could see that by what i didn't say.

[Openly Curious]

Hi tsth,

In my last post you choose not to anwser in your own words, or not to anwser at all since you answered in scripture i don't know if that was to my post or somebody elses.But it seems to me that when you don't have a clear answer in your own mind, you try to answer by scripture.And by your scripture answers it seems you have a incorrect interpretation of Rom 7 which leads you to believe you can live a sinless life.

Love in Christ

Dear Eddie,

I have clarified SEVERAL times what I am talking about. I don't know why you keep asking me the same question over and over again.

I don't intend to keep repeating myself. You're welcome to go back and read my postings on this thread OR the Naming the Name of Christ thread.

In His Love,

Suzanne

Hi tsth,

I went to your thread Naming the name of Christ pg. 4 as well as to the beginning of this thread and I still stand by what I said in this post you avoid the ?. But I do thank you for answering me in your own words this time.

I understand what you are saying. Thats why I asked the ?.

Let me say it this way your interpertation of Rom 7 is WRONG!

Thats what you are avoiding to answer.

Love in Christ

Hello Eddie,

I just want to say that your interpretation of being wrong is only that your interpretation. But I noticed that you gave no clarification to what was wrong or no interpretation from your side of the coin why is that? It would help me as a reader to know your side. It's easy to knock the step ladder out from under someone with words but with scripture it's another story.

You should straighten us out if you are sure you are correct.

OC

[Guest Biblicist]

I tell you a story to try to bring out what I'm trying to say. I had a person walk up to our vehicle once and he ask me to borrow $3.oo and then he said I am going to be honest I want the money to buy me a beer I ain't gonna lie to you. Well next thing you know I saying to this guy I am not going to give you $3.oo dollars so you can buy you a beer with it. What you need to do is repent of your wrongdoing and ask Jesus into your heart and life and the man shook his head yes as he hung it to the ground and walk off jump over this half brick wall and I didn't know where he got to. I proceeded to pull off and my eye caught sight of the man who was sitting down on the sidewalk with his head down in his arms over his knees. You know I don't know if that man ever got his heart right with God or not but I've often prayed for that man down through the years and have prayed God would raise him up to be a preacher.

I guess I can just say. . . Thank you for so completely illustrating my point.

[Openly Curious]

I was not trying to hurt anyones feelings. But I was trying to provoke a clear answer from tsth. She sounds mature enough to handle what I said and the way I said it, but I apoligize if I came on to strong.

To put it simply, Rom 7 is a saved person who struggles to live for God by the Law through self-effort, not yet aware that it is the Holy Spirit that delivers and inables one to live for God (8:2-4) not of a unsaved person who gets saved.

The ? I was trying to get from tsth was do you believe in the doctrine of sinless perfection.

Hello Eddie,

I neither was trying to hurt anyones feelings but I was trying to provoke a clear answer from you. I think tsth is pretty plain in what she has been meaning all along even though others have said otherwise about her in this thread as I have been reading it and following it from the start and if I being a simpleton can understand what she is meaning then I'm unsure why others can't.

Now as for Romans 7 there has always been many controversial interpretations of that passage always have been always will be. I have heard so many it makes my head spin the lastest was that it was referring to sanctification.

Actually the passage is referring to apostle Paul himself in the struggle he found himself fighting with being between his flesh and spirit which are the two laws apostle Paul mentions in the chapter being the law of the flesh and the law of the spirit. Paul concluded that with his members in his body being his hands, feet, eyes all of the members of his body that he would serve the law of sin.

It was Jesus Christ that set him free from the law of sin and death the same as us and now we willingly choose to serve the Lord with the members of our bodies. We don't use our bodies for sexual sins, our tongues to gossip our hands to drink and get drunk our eyes to see and indulge in wicked things like it says in Romans 6 but instead we use the members of our body for righteous things not for sin. The word says the spirit is willing but the flesh is weak. Paul also talked about his mind in that passage as he had to yield his mind over to God as well as we are taught to have the mind of Christ in Phillippians and we are taught to renew our minds and not to have carnal minds minds that are on earthly carnal things all the time Romans 8 but things that are eternal.

You see Paul is saying and teaching us that Jesus set us free from self effort as you called it as the law couldn't make one righteous for there wasn't a law given that could do that that we could practice and do to become righteous that is why the law was not perfect and we need Jesus blood to atone for our sins as that is the only thing that makes one righteous as it set us free to be able to walk and live in the spirit doing the things of God.

So in you analogy thus far I have found myself in disagreement with you. First off here I want to say that I do not get up every morning with the thoughts in my head like what sin am I going to engage in today? Instead I get up with the Lord on my mind and often a song of praise in my heart as I am looking for how I am going to please and serve God that day. I don' think a person has to sin everyday sure we all fall short of God's glory but we all don't go and engage in willful sin every day either. As you have been set free to walk in the spirit you have a choice to engage in the sin of the flesh or walk pleasing to God everyday saying no to the sins of the world. You can live close to God or as far away as you want.

I don't agree with your assessment.

OC

Well OC I said I would put my comment in a few words.

Weather you believe Paul is talking about himself and he is, before conversion or after conversion, the result of the Law is the same it doesn't bring eternal life(justification) or spiritual life(santification). What I believe Paul is talking about is our justification cannot happen by self-effort through the law(if you believe hes talking about before his conversion) or our santification cannot be done by self-effort(by trying to obey the Law through self-effort)after his conversion. But only by dependence on the Holy Spirit can you experience the life of Christ within you.

Hello Eddie,

To tell you the truth you do not sound very clear in what you really believe the passage is saying. First off we are saved through faith by grace I don't feel I have to explain that one but some would argue that is you believe in living out your faith in the sight of God by doing that which is right in this life then you believe in a works salvation and that is not true. We are justified by faith in Christ Jesus as there was many things that happened when we got born again. We were justified and forgiven of our past sins as though we had never committed any. We were made a new creature in Christ Jesus no longer the same person we were before repentance, we were translated from the kingdom of darkness into the kingdom of light, we become the sons of God, made the righteousness of God, became a partaker of the divine nature and so so many other things.

I said in my post that there was no law given that could make one righteous that was why the old testament law was of no effect. That is why the new covenant is based on better promises based on what Christ did for us.

I believe that when I was born again that God imputed His righteousness unto me and that he imparted to me His divine nature making me thus a new creature. I believe I experience the life of Christ because of these thing in which He did within my heart. And I experience that life as I walk and talk with Him in a relationship and He with me. It is God's work that makes this possible but no matter how one slices it you choose to live righteous before God or choose to live unrighteous before God.

You have your fruit unto death (following the sins of the flesh) or you have your fruit unto everlasting life (eternal)

This being the works of the flesh and the works of the Spirit either way one chooses they will have fruit and works.

OC

Hello again OC,

All I can say is that what i said in my first and second post in a few words was exactly what you said in more detail, so i don't know what your disagreeing about.If i didn't make myself clear enough about justification being by grace through faith was because i took it for granted you could see that by what i didn't say.

This is actually amusing to me Eddie. If you would read closer I pointed out the areas of disagreement I had in the things you said and you can't recognize them (?). Then if you believe we are saying the same things now then you should be in perfect agreement with tsth also but the fact is you are not or so you have thus stated in this thread that she is wrong on Romans 7 but you gave us no answers just a few choice words that told us nothing of why we was wrong. I don't buy into the short or long posts bit I know why I believe like I do and can tell you why and why not? If you agree with me then you should have nothing else to say in the thread as tsth has acknowledged the things that I have said as being her own beliefs.

OC

[Openly Curious]

I tell you a story to try to bring out what I'm trying to say. I had a person walk up to our vehicle once and he ask me to borrow $3.oo and then he said I am going to be honest I want the money to buy me a beer I ain't gonna lie to you. Well next thing you know I saying to this guy I am not going to give you $3.oo dollars so you can buy you a beer with it. What you need to do is repent of your wrongdoing and ask Jesus into your heart and life and the man shook his head yes as he hung it to the ground and walk off jump over this half brick wall and I didn't know where he got to. I proceeded to pull off and my eye caught sight of the man who was sitting down on the sidewalk with his head down in his arms over his knees. You know I don't know if that man ever got his heart right with God or not but I've often prayed for that man down through the years and have prayed God would raise him up to be a preacher.

I guess I can just say. . . Thank you for so completely illustrating my point.

I don't think I am illustrating your point Biblicist because my point was not about judging nor was it being so close to a person that I had to know their motives in making the choices that they do for I don't have to be close to someone to know if they are making wrong choices in life I can make that distinction by having good judgment of what is right and wrong from God's word that teaches us those things. I can be a compassionate and caring person and help someone out not being close to them. You see I wasn't in agreement with you but had an opposite view which got kind of left out in the other half of this post that wasn't included here. No offense but I didn't illustrate your point but mine.

OC

[Openly Curious]

Quite right.

We can not judge someones relationship with God by their outward behaviour. It's something that is only learned if one becomes friends with such a person.

Hello Biblicist,

I know you response it to tsth but could you eloborate on your answer for me as the passage is not referring to judging a person outward behaviour so I'm a little confused on what your trying to get across and say. Also what is the something that is only learned by becoming friends with such a person. No disrespect intended I just do not get what your answer is saying it just doesn't make sense to me.

OC

It's OK, I can understand why that sentence would confuse some. This whole thread and others like it started because of a thread started about having "christian" friends who are gay.

A person can only understand another's relationship with the Lord and their choices in life by being a friend. Not a casual aquantience, a friend. Someone who prays with them, cries with them and is there for them on a daily basis. Casual observers should never judge what is going on on the inside of a person.

There is a process that the Lord takes us each through, some might go throug it faster than others, but it is a process all the same.

Anyway, I gotta go to work. Talk to you later.

Thanks for the clarification on your part. But still do not see the connection concerning judging going with the passage given by tsth as it doesn't fit. But in light of your train of thought towards the other threads it may. And I don't know if I fully agree with your assessment concerning not being able to understand another's relationship with the Lord and their choices in life if we are not a close friend of that person. Again no disrespect but I can't see that as being true that is like almost judging my heart to say I can't understand another's relationship with God and understand the choices they make in life because I don't really know that person closely.

I tell you a story to try to bring out what I'm trying to say. I had a person walk up to our vehicle once and he ask me to borrow $3.oo and then he said I am going to be honest I want the money to buy me a beer I ain't gonna lie to you. Well next thing you know I saying to this guy I am not going to give you $3.oo dollars so you can buy you a beer with it. What you need to do is repent of your wrongdoing and ask Jesus into your heart and life and the man shook his head yes as he hung it to the ground and walk off jump over this half brick wall and I didn't know where he got to. I proceeded to pull off and my eye caught sight of the man who was sitting down on the sidewalk with his head down in his arms over his knees. You know I don't know if that man ever got his heart right with God or not but I've often prayed for that man down through the years and have prayed God would raise him up to be a preacher.

No Biblicist I didn't know that man as a close friend I don't know why he was drinking but I know what it is to be in the bondage of sin and I know without Christ that man will continue to choose sin and I can say that without knowing the man closely. For we were all once yet sinners but Christ died for the ungodly. And lots of times what is going on on the outside is revealing making known what is on the inside of a person got nothing to do with judging.

Hope you have a good night at work

OC

[Guest Biblicist]

I tell you a story to try to bring out what I'm trying to say. I had a person walk up to our vehicle once and he ask me to borrow $3.oo and then he said I am going to be honest I want the money to buy me a beer I ain't gonna lie to you. Well next thing you know I saying to this guy I am not going to give you $3.oo dollars so you can buy you a beer with it. What you need to do is repent of your wrongdoing and ask Jesus into your heart and life and the man shook his head yes as he hung it to the ground and walk off jump over this half brick wall and I didn't know where he got to. I proceeded to pull off and my eye caught sight of the man who was sitting down on the sidewalk with his head down in his arms over his knees. You know I don't know if that man ever got his heart right with God or not but I've often prayed for that man down through the years and have prayed God would raise him up to be a preacher.

I guess I can just say. . . Thank you for so completely illustrating my point.

I don't think I am illustrating your point Biblicist because my point was not about judging nor was it being so close to a person that I had to know their motives in making the choices that they do for I don't have to be close to someone to know if they are making wrong choices in life I can make that distinction by having good judgment of what is right and wrong from God's word that teaches us those things. I can be a compassionate and caring person and help someone out not being close to them. You see I wasn't in agreement with you but had an opposite view which got kind of left out in the other half of this post that wasn't included here. No offense but I didn't illustrate your point but mine.

OC

What did that man do that made you judge him by his actions? Did you ask him anything? Did you try to find out why on earth he didn't even have $3.00?

You judged his heart simply by the way he looked and by the things he said to you. That's exactly what I am talking about.

Matthew 25:35 For I was hungry and you gave me something to eat, I was thirsty and you gave me something to drink, I was a stranger and you invited me in, 36 I needed clothes and you clothed me, I was sick and you looked after me, I was in prison and you came to visit me.'

How could you possibly know his heart need just because he asked you for money to buy beer. Last I checked, neither of those actions are sinful. Were you absolutly certin that the man was in bondage to alcoholism? $3.00 for one beer is not alcoholism, it's thirst. How could you know unless you asked?

Why was your reaction to the fact that the man didn't even have $3.00 automatically to assume that he needed to repent of some sin? Are people poor because of their sin?

Your exchange with that man is exactly my point. I think it's called, Drive By Witnessing. I don't see that it is Biblical.