Why not just let others believe?

[Guest]

"In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God."

"The same was in the beginning with God."

"All things were made by him; and without him was not any thing made that was made." John 1:1-3

"He was in the world, and the world was made by him, and the world knew him not."

"He came unto his own, and his own received him not."

"But as many as received him, to them gave he power to become the sons of God, even to them that believe on his name: John 1:10-12

n fact, the bible thumping is one of the things that led me away from Christianity.

Well Then Quit Thumping It

And because iniquity shall abound, the love of many shall wax cold.

Matthew 24:12

The Trouble With Bible Bashing

This Holy Bible Some Thump With Words Of Pride And Scorn

All scripture is given by inspiration of God, and is profitable for doctrine, for reproof, for correction, for instruction in righteousness:

[17] That the man of God may be perfect, throughly furnished unto all good works.

2 Timothy 3:16-17

Will Either Be Their Judge

He that rejecteth me, and receiveth not my words, hath one that judgeth him: the word that I have spoken, the same shall judge him in the last day. John 12:48

Or Their Sure Salvation

Thy words were found, and I did eat them; and thy word was unto me the joy and rejoicing of mine heart: for I am called by thy name, O LORD God of hosts.

Jeremiah 15:16

Should They Come

And the Spirit and the bride say, Come. And let him that heareth say, Come. And let him that is athirst come. And whosoever will, let him take the water of life freely.

Revelation 22:17

To Believe

For God so loved the world, that he gave his only begotten Son, that whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have everlasting life.

John 3:16

In Jesus

Now ye are clean through the word which I have spoken unto you.

John 15:3

The BIBLE

In Plan Words

The BIBLE contains the mind of God, the state of man, the way of salvation, the doom of sinners, and the happiness of believers.

Its doctrines are holy, its precepts are binding, its histories are true, and its decisions immutable.

Read it to be wise, believe it to be safe, and practice it to be holy.

It contains light to direct you, food to support you, and comfort to cheer you.

It is the traveler's map, the pilgrim's staff, the pilot's compass, the soldier's sword, and the Christian's charter.

Here Paradise is restored, Heaven opened, and the gates of hell disclosed

Christ is its subject, our good its design, and the glory of God its end.

It should fill the memory, rule the heart and guide the feet.

Read it slowly, frequently and prayerfully.

It is given to you in life, will be open in The Judgement, and be remembered forever.

It involves the highest responsibility, rewards the greatest labor, and condemns all who trifle with its holy precepts.

From the front of my Gideon BIBLE

Believe It

And Be Blessed

The LORD bless thee, and keep thee:

The LORD make his face shine upon thee, and be gracious unto thee:

The LORD lift up his countenance upon thee, and give thee peace.

And they shall put my name upon the children of Israel; and I will bless them.

Numbers 6:24-27

Love, Joe

The LORD liveth; and blessed be my rock; and exalted be the God of the rock of my salvation. 2 Samuel 22:47

[Guest Zer0]

n fact, the bible thumping is one of the things that led me away from Christianity.

Well Then Quit Thumping It

I don't and never have "thumped" it. Bible thumping is when you constantly preach or say the ideas of Christianity to have someone convert. At no time in my life have I ever done this. So, it'd be pretty hard to quit doing something I have never done in the first place, now wouldn't it?

[Guest]

n fact, the bible thumping is one of the things that led me away from Christianity.

Well Then Quit Thumping It

I don't and never have "thumped" it. Bible thumping is when you constantly preach or say the ideas of Christianity to have someone convert. At no time in my life have I ever done this. So, it'd be pretty hard to quit doing something I have never done in the first place, now wouldn't it?

Well There You Go Again

Strike The Bible?

Clearly Bible Thumping Is An Unrepentant Sinner Demanding Bible Believers Strike Their Beloved Holy Bible

And Demanding That It Must Be Stifled And Hidden Away From View Especially Within Christian Ministries

Thump

Preach the word; be instant in season, out of season; reprove, rebuke, exhort with all longsuffering and doctrine.

For the time will come when they will not endure sound doctrine; but after their own lusts shall they heap to themselves teachers, having itching ears;

And they shall turn away their ears from the truth, and shall be turned unto fables.

2 Timothy 4:2-4

And Some Folk Even Claim It Was The Bible That Is Forcing Them To Scorn The Holy Blood Of The LORD Jesus Christ

Blaming The Very Bible That Believers Shamelessly Dare To Share

Thump Thump

Woe unto them that call evil good, and good evil; that put darkness for light, and light for darkness; that put bitter for sweet, and sweet for bitter!

Isaiah 5:20

But Still They March Into The House Of Worthy And Pontificate About How It Is The Bible's Fault That They Have Not Faith In The Bible

And Demand That Bible Believers Keep Their Bible Closed Lest Someone Else See The Glorious Light Of Jesus Christ And Believe And Be Saved

Thump Thump Thump

And as Moses lifted up the serpent in the wilderness, even so must the Son of man be lifted up:

That whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have eternal life.

For God so loved the world, that he gave his only begotten Son, that whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have everlasting life.

John 3:14-16

Thump Not Upon The Holy Word Of God

But Receive God's Gift Of Faith

And Live

For by grace are ye saved through faith; and that not of yourselves: it is the gift of God: Not of works, lest any man should boast Ephesians 2:8-9

Or Not

So shall my word be that goeth forth out of my mouth: it shall not return unto me void, but it shall accomplish that which I please, and it shall prosper in the thing whereto I sent it. Isaiah 55:11

And My Prayer For You Beloved Guest

See Jesus And Be Blessed

The LORD bless thee, and keep thee:

The LORD make his face shine upon thee, and be gracious unto thee:

The LORD lift up his countenance upon thee, and give thee peace.

And they shall put my name upon the children of Israel; and I will bless them.

Numbers 6:24-27

Love, Joe

I Jesus have sent mine angel to testify unto you these things in the churches. I am the root and the offspring of David, and the bright and morning star. And the Spirit and the bride say, Come. And let him that heareth say, Come. And let him that is athirst come. And whosoever will, let him take the water of life freely. Revelation 22:16-17

[Fraught]

As the title suggests, why not just let others believe? I've never been able to fully understand why someone can be so determined to make someone else believe their religion, belief or philosophy. This doesn't apply to only religion, it can apply to almost anything. Take for example a well-debated (and still in debate) subject of evolution. Is it correct? Is it wrong? Certainly there is evidence but does that make it right? My take on this is to me, it's believable. Does that make it right? No. Does it make it wrong? No. If we venture into the world of religion, we can ask the same question. Why not just let others believe? Now, before anyone comments on how I'm targetting only one group, I would like to say I'm not. This question is directed at pretty much everyone, regardless of age, gender, belief, etc... . I know many people do allow others to have different beliefs, and some don't.

Faith isn't something that can be scientifically measured. Does that mean it doesn't exist? Of course not. Other things that do exist cant be scientifically measured, such as one's affection for something or someone. You can put it on a scale but that can be meaningless as it's something that cannot be quantified.

So, whether you believe or not, it doesn't matter, why not let others believe? I have a belief of my own that everyone is intolerant of something or someone in some way. It doesn't have to be religion, it can be a food, a genre of music, a brand of shoes, a TV show, the list is endless. Asking why don't people allow others to believe Family Guy is an amazing/horrible animated cartoon may be an interesting conversation but this isn't the forum to discuss it in. As this is a religion forum (and an open-minded one at that), why not just let others believe in something you may not agree on?

We can debate about religion, evolution, whatever else and that can be fine. It is when someone becomes intolerant or wants others to believe/disbelieve. Why is that? For the most part, most of us want a world of peace, happiness, etc... (although aggressiveness is still needed in moderation), so wouldn't trying to make others believe just make this world less peaceful? If someone is already willing to believe and you're helping them, that's perfectly fine. It's if someone has their mind made up on their belief yet others want to change it. Why do we do this?

I'm not sure where this originated from, however, it's a fairly popular quote or idea: "with every light, there comes a dark". Suppose that we did make everyone believe in a certain belief. Some may say that would be great, however, I think otherwise. It'd be an off-balance. There's no opposite to it. Consider if the whole world became all Christians or became all Atheists. In either case, I think it would be a rather horrible world. You would have everyone enforcing that belief so everyone complies, restricting some freedom. Do we really want a world like this? I don't.

Of course, this is very unlikely to happen (and impossible, as a baby is born quite often, it wouldn't have a religion right there and then), however, just bear with me on this idea. Suppose all males couldn't produce sperm or all females couldn't bear children, then if this world were to exist, wouldn't it be rather horrible?

Even if this hadn't come to mind, why not just allow one to have their own beliefs? (you don't need to comment on the unusual world I talked about. looking back at it before I press post new topic, I see just how silly it sounds )

funny, i was thinking about a part of your post yesterday, where you're speaking of viewpoints. every viewpoint being exclusive in some way. even those who preach tolerance of everyone are intolerant of those who aren't tolerant - !! i think it's human nature to be frustrated when others don't see things the way we do.

i enjoy diversity but must disagree that it would be bad if the whole world became christian. a whole world where everyone loved others as much as they loved themselves? where they put others' interests ahead of their own. where there was no selfishness, deceit or abuse? sounds kind of like heaven on earth to me !!

[mead]

My Father in Heaven gives His good love to anyone who seeks Him out. Not everyone who says they are Christian puts other people before themselves, though we should love and respect one another. I believe that we are our brothers and sisters keeper. Wether you are a believer or not, you should still have mutual respect for each other. It is a choice to accept Christ Jesus into your heart and be saved and know the truth, for no lie comes from it. Just like with the non believer, no Christian is perfect. Believe what you wish, we just want to share what the Lord has given us.

[Gerioke]

True Christians strive to be like Jesus. We try to learn from Jesus' words and deeds, not the words and deeds of other Christians. If you want to be prejudiced against something, then at least study what it is you are prejudiced against so you will know why you are prejudiced.

If you knew who Jesus is, then I'm sure you wouldn't be so quick to snub Him. There are plenty of "Christians" that I don't much care for, but Jesus is the Rock on which my house is built.

[OneLight]

Wow! That is just amazing! Do you REALLY think that all christians "love everyone as much as they love themselves?" Do you truly believe that only christians "put others' interests ahead of their own?" Christians corner the market on "Good" aspects of human behaviors? Wow! That's about all I can say to that - wow.

If I may. A true Christian would be one who lays their life down in order for the true Jesus to live in and through them, touching the lives of everyone around. They have no selfish ambitions, but only has a desire to live as the Holy Spirit leads them to live. They would surrender everything they believe, have, willing to be broken down and rebuilt from the very depth of their existence. These, I believe, are who Fraught was talking about.

I also believe that you are saying that there are those outside of the Christians lifestyle who live such a life. I would agree that there are those who do a lot of good. But, there is a difference when man does good and when God does good through someone. The difference is the one behind the action. The question still lies as to where will these good doers go after death? There are many beliefs that state that one would continue to be reincarnated until they get it right, then they will find Nirvana, or become a god themselves. This is what Christians find as false teaching, leading to eternal death. Jesus tells us that there is only one way to the Father, and that is through Him, Jesus Christ. Every other faith places the works of man into the equation of their personal salvation, whatever that belief's ending is.

[OneLight]

Wow! That is just amazing! Do you REALLY think that all christians "love everyone as much as they love themselves?" Do you truly believe that only christians "put others' interests ahead of their own?" Christians corner the market on "Good" aspects of human behaviors? Wow! That's about all I can say to that - wow.

If I may. A true Christian would be one who lays their life down in order for the true Jesus to live in and through them, touching the lives of everyone around. They have no selfish ambitions, but only has a desire to live as the Holy Spirit leads them to live. They would surrender everything they believe, have, willing to be broken down and rebuilt from the very depth of their existence. These, I believe, are who Fraught was talking about.

I also believe that you are saying that there are those outside of the Christians lifestyle who live such a life. I would agree that there are those who do a lot of good. But, there is a difference when man does good and when God does good through someone. The difference is the one behind the action. The question still lies as to where will these good doers go after death? There are many beliefs that state that one would continue to be reincarnated until they get it right, then they will find Nirvana, or become a god themselves. This is what Christians find as false teaching, leading to eternal death. Jesus tells us that there is only one way to the Father, and that is through Him, Jesus Christ. Every other faith places the works of man into the equation of their personal salvation, whatever that belief's ending is.

So this definition of a "true Christian" would emcompass...who? Do you know anyone that is one of these "true christians?" I sure don't. Yes, there are people who do good in our world, no matter their religion. A person who's done good for humankind will be remembered for it. That's really the only way KNOWN that people live on, anyway. Reincarnation, eternal life, whatever...is only speculation because there is no proof of it.

I agree with the OP, just let everyone believe as they wish. Why do christians want people they don't know to convert to their religious views anyway? Do you get more "points" from your god for the effort?

Yes, I do know some. I also know many who are striving to be so. You may not know of any because you do not believe that there is a God who can do such in a persons life. It's not that they are not there, it's more that you have closed your eyes to the possibility that there are.

God keeps track of every idle thought and word, deeds (both good and bad), and has everything written in books. The most important one to a Christian is the Book of Life. Here, He keeps the names of all who have accepted Jesus as their Savior.

You make it sound like people are trying to convince you. I have only read where people are speaking what they believe. If this is trying to convince you, or you feel like someone is trying to convert you, then it is the Holy Spirit that is working to convict you of any sin that you have in your heart, as He does with every single person in the world. I, for one, am not trying to get you to believe in my way. Instead, I am trying to show you the truth, so you can make the decision yourself. There is nothing that anyone can do that would cause you to be a Christian. This is up to you and God. We just refuse to not share the truth, when asked.

God Bless,

OneLight

[OneLight]

Wow! That is just amazing! Do you REALLY think that all christians "love everyone as much as they love themselves?" Do you truly believe that only christians "put others' interests ahead of their own?" Christians corner the market on "Good" aspects of human behaviors? Wow! That's about all I can say to that - wow.

But that's just it, I didn't ASK you to share "the truth" with me. I only want to know WHY you believe it to BE "the truth."

Actually, you did ...

[Gerioke]

Wow! That is just amazing! Do you REALLY think that all christians "love everyone as much as they love themselves?" Do you truly believe that only christians "put others' interests ahead of their own?" Christians corner the market on "Good" aspects of human behaviors? Wow! That's about all I can say to that - wow.

If I may. A true Christian would be one who lays their life down in order for the true Jesus to live in and through them, touching the lives of everyone around. They have no selfish ambitions, but only has a desire to live as the Holy Spirit leads them to live. They would surrender everything they believe, have, willing to be broken down and rebuilt from the very depth of their existence. These, I believe, are who Fraught was talking about.

I also believe that you are saying that there are those outside of the Christians lifestyle who live such a life. I would agree that there are those who do a lot of good. But, there is a difference when man does good and when God does good through someone. The difference is the one behind the action. The question still lies as to where will these good doers go after death? There are many beliefs that state that one would continue to be reincarnated until they get it right, then they will find Nirvana, or become a god themselves. This is what Christians find as false teaching, leading to eternal death. Jesus tells us that there is only one way to the Father, and that is through Him, Jesus Christ. Every other faith places the works of man into the equation of their personal salvation, whatever that belief's ending is.

So this definition of a "true Christian" would emcompass...who? Do you know anyone that is one of these "true christians?" I sure don't. Yes, there are people who do good in our world, no matter their religion. A person who's done good for humankind will be remembered for it. That's really the only way KNOWN that people live on, anyway. Reincarnation, eternal life, whatever...is only speculation because there is no proof of it.

I agree with the OP, just let everyone believe as they wish. Why do christians want people they don't know to convert to their religious views anyway? Do you get more "points" from your god for the effort?

Yes, I do know some. I also know many who are striving to be so. You may not know of any because you do not believe that there is a God who can do such in a persons life. It's not that they are not there, it's more that you have closed your eyes to the possibility that there are.

God keeps track of every idle thought and word, deeds (both good and bad), and has everything written in books. The most important one to a Christian is the Book of Life. Here, He keeps the names of all who have accepted Jesus as their Savior.

You make it sound like people are trying to convince you. I have only read where people are speaking what they believe. If this is trying to convince you, or you feel like someone is trying to convert you, then it is the Holy Spirit that is working to convict you of any sin that you have in your heart, as He does with every single person in the world. I, for one, am not trying to get you to believe in my way. Instead, I am trying to show you the truth, so you can make the decision yourself. There is nothing that anyone can do that would cause you to be a Christian. This is up to you and God. We just refuse to not share the truth, when asked.

God Bless,

OneLight

But that's just it, I didn't ASK you to share "the truth" with me. I only want to know WHY you believe it to BE "the truth."

Do you believe man has been to the moon? If so why do you believe?