JohnD

Before I am misunderstood or thought of being too hard on the unbelieving Jews, first of all I am only quoting scripture. Second, anyone who turns from God turns towards the devil. There is no alternative. And about the synagogue of Satan, that is a way of saying a synagogue that has turned from God. If the people who turned from God were not Jewish they would simply be pagans and under no consideration whatsoever. Of course their temples are temples of satan who reject God and are Gentile born. You follow? Those born Jewish are the chosen people of God IN THIS LIFE. They are not the Spirit Jews / Spirit Israel who are God's chosen from above / ambassadors from heaven whose citizenship is in the Jerusalem from above... which if they do not persist in their unbelief the Jews can be grafted back into. Romans 11:16-28.

This Occult origin symbol is a six point star with six triangles or pyramids around a six sided middle. 1 John 2:18-19 (KJV) 18 Little children, it is the last time: and as ye have heard that antichrist shall come, even now are there many antichrists; whereby we know that it is the last time. 19 They went out from us, but they were not of us; for if they had been of us, they would no doubt have continued with us: but they went out, that they might be made manifest that they were not all of us. Romans 9:6 (KJV) 6 Not as though the word of God hath taken none effect. For they are not all Israel, which are of Israel: Revelation 2:9 (KJV) 9 I know thy works, and tribulation, and poverty, (but thou art rich) and I know the blasphemy of them which say they are Jews, and are not, but are the synagogue of Satan. Revelation 3:9 (KJV) 9 Behold, I will make them of the synagogue of Satan, which say they are Jews, and are not, but do lie; behold, I will make them to come and worship before thy feet, and to know that I have loved thee. John 8:43-45 (KJV) 43 Why do ye not understand my speech? even because ye cannot hear my word. 44 Ye are of your father the devil, and the lusts of your father ye will do. He was a murderer from the beginning, and abode not in the truth, because there is no truth in him. When he speaketh a lie, he speaketh of his own: for he is a liar, and the father of it. 45 And because I tell you the truth, ye believe me not. Romans 11:28 (KJV) 28 As concerning the gospel, they are enemies for your sakes: but as touching the election, they are beloved for the fathers’ sakes. They are still the chosen people of God which he loves... and their rejection of him (Jesus) breaks his heart (Luke 19:41-44) and opens them up to the deception of the false messiah who will convince them he is the true Messiah and invoke under the Occult symbol (Star of David / Seal of Solomon which is much older than they are) a Christ-less form of Judaism (which is the covenant he affirms in Daniel 9:27 and reneges on in the middle of the 70th week of Daniel). Had the accepted Messiah they would not have been vulnerable to this deception. .

Passages like the above make me wonder just how many are disciples and how many are just seeking eternal fire insurance and not taking the redemption of Christ or the wrath of God seriously enough.

Tithing was an is a good learning tool. It predates the Law of Moses as does circumcision. But most Christians do not realize Jesus is not happy settling for 10% or 30% (Jews tithed 3 times). Jesus wants it all. Luke 14:26-35 (KJV) 26 If any man come to me, and hate not his father, and mother, and wife, and children, and brethren, and sisters, yea, and his own life also, he cannot be my disciple. 27 And whosoever doth not bear his cross, and come after me, cannot be my disciple. 28 For which of you, intending to build a tower, sitteth not down first, and counteth the cost, whether he have sufficient to finish it? 29 Lest haply, after he hath laid the foundation, and is not able to finish it, all that behold it begin to mock him, 30 Saying, This man began to build, and was not able to finish. 31 Or what king, going to make war against another king, sitteth not down first, and consulteth whether he be able with ten thousand to meet him that cometh against him with twenty thousand? 32 Or else, while the other is yet a great way off, he sendeth an ambassage, and desireth conditions of peace. 33 So likewise, whosoever he be of you that forsaketh not all that he hath, he cannot be my disciple. 34 Salt is good: but if the salt have lost his savour, wherewith shall it be seasoned? 35 It is neither fit for the land, nor yet for the dunghill; but men cast it out. He that hath ears to hear, let him hear. Are ye salt or are ye to be tossed out onto the pathway or the dunghill?

I've always been partial to the name Brit Chadasha (New Covenant in Hebrew). New Testament Judaism could be another. OT = the prophetic NT = the fulfillment New Covenant Tanakh OT = Torah Moses NT = Torah Messiah

Jesus came to die as the sacrifice for human sin. What fool would execute him knowing he was the very Creator of all things?

The King James Version Selected Text Strong's Greek #646 ...come, except there come a falling away first, and that man ... 646 apostasia { ap-os-tas-ee’-ah} feminine of the same as 647; TDNT - 1:513,88; n f AV - to forsake + 575 1, falling away 1; 2 GK - 686 { ἀποστασία } 1) a falling away, defection, apostasy How can the going UP to meet Christ in the clouds have anything to do with falling away?

The world does not understand such things. They see only the tragedy of the lives lost or maimed by the evil in such an one as the Son of Sam. People are going to suffer. People are going to die. That any of them died or will die not knowing Jesus is the real tragedy. But in the economy of things, God uses all things together for the good of those who love him and believe him and obey him in the Messiah. The world only scratches its head but we see the purpose in it. Consequently, we who believe must take care not to give a reverse testimony as that of Berkowitz... when we act like the world but proclaim Jesus, the world sees what we do more than what we say. Oh so you are a Christian? So Christians cheat on their taxes do they? Shoplift? Jip the servers they should tip? Show a bit too much skin? Ogle at too much flesh? So, this God you Christians claim changes everything for time and eternity... he's not worth it to you to act better than you do? That's how the world sees us.

The true success stories like these will be IMHO retold often in heaven.

Simply put... John 17:17 (NIV) 17 Sanctify them by the truth; your word is truth. John 14:6 (NIV) 6 Jesus answered, “I am the way and the truth and the life. No one comes to the Father except through me. John 1:1 (NIV) 1 In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God. John 1:14 (NIV) 14 The Word became flesh and made his dwelling among us. We have seen his glory, the glory of the One and Only, who came from the Father, full of grace and truth.

The Bible informs us in several ways that there is a plurality in the Godhead. Then it reveals that there are three who are the one God.

This is your conclusion. The scriptures you cited do not support or uphold your conclusion. Deuteronomy 4:35 (NIV) 35 You were shown these things so that you might know that the LORD is God; besides him there is no other. Deuteronomy 4:39 (NIV) 39 Acknowledge and take to heart this day that the LORD is God in heaven above and on the earth below. There is no other. Deuteronomy 6:4 (NIV) 4 Hear, O Israel: The LORD our God, the LORD is one. This is one of those imperfections in human communications I have mentioned in other threads. We are uncomfortable referring to God as "it." The way we would humanity. Humanity is an it in our vocabulary which we are quite comfortable calling an it... To use the expression in Deuteronomy 4:35b with a slight alteration: "that you might know that people are humanity and besides IT there is no other." This is not to imply that humans are it but humanity is an it. And it is certainly not declaring humanity as one being. We are agreed that the Bible teaches there is one God. But this is not saying God is one being. In Deuteronomy 6:4 hear Israel YHVH our God(s) plural form YHVH one. One name one God plurality within the one nature and one name. Echoed in: Matthew 28:19 (NIV) 19 Therefore go and make disciples of all nations, baptizing them in the name singular of the Father and of the Son and of the Holy Spirit, (tha articles are used to distinguish one person / individual from the other two). One divine nature. Three persons in unity. One name that applies to all three (like a surname). No, I can't find anything in creation where one being is three persons. The closest I can come is my thinking (Father), my speaking (Son) and my actions (Holy Spirit) are, so to speak, the one me. But they are not individual persons as in the divine Trinity. So we don't want to push that example too far. The three spatial dimensions IMHO are a good example of three distinct dimensions that are coexistent and omnipresent at the same time uniquely without being the other two.

But there are three beings in your family, and only one being in God with three persons. Do you have another example that might illustrate that? Do you have scripture to support your statement that God is only one being? The Bible says there is only one God. But does it say that the one God is only one being? To answer your question, our own personal make up (body / soul / spirit) would be an example, but it has flaws in it in that each is not a distinct person). Do you have any examples?

When the Bible uses singular pronouns (he, him, I, me, my, mine) to refer to God we must remember that each individual in the Godhead can speak as fully God, and can speak for the Godhead itself as one. Art mimics life. I sometimes use art as an example without endorsing it as "gospel truth." In Star Wars III just as the Chancellor was about to be arrested by the Jedi, he was told the Senate would determine his fate, to which he (one individual) replied "I AM THE SENATE." Furthermore, the Bible states repeatedly that there is only one God. But the Hebrew word itself for "God" is a plural word. Elohim is the plural of elohe. And some 2700 times in the Old Testament the plural "elohim" is used to refer to the one God. Further still God is quoted in scripture using plural nouns "our, us:" Genesis 1:26 (NIV) 26 Then God said, “Let US make man in OUR image, in our likeness, and let them rule over the fish of the sea and the birds of the air, over the livestock, over all the earth, and over all the creatures that move along the ground.” If God was trying to drive home the point that there is only one individual who is the one God, doesn't it seem rather odd that God would be referred to in this manner and so many times? Isaiah 6:8 (NIV) 8 Then I heard the voice of the Lord saying, “Whom shall I send? And who will go for US?” And I said, “Here am I. Send me!” Etc.

Many is the time I have heard teachers of truth worm their way out of the hassle of teaching the truth about the Trinity using such glib catch phrases like "We can only apprehend the Trinity, we cannot comprehend it." The teaching itself is rather easy. It's removing all the opinionated garbage or the misguided teachings of others that is so difficult. The actual facts about the Trinity are simple to comprehend. We just have to let go of our preconceived notions or the teachings where we've allowed others to do the thinking for us and never confirmed if they knew what they were talking about... The classic error in Trinitarian opposition is the oversight that "God" is not a being but a nature. It is the nature that the Father, the Son, and the Holy Spirit have. As man has a human nature, The Father, the Son, and the Holy Spirit have a divine nature or God nature. As we regard all of humanity as one race... we regard the three who are God as one. How many Gods are there? One. How many human races are there? One. This is the answer to the classic error that equates one person per God. Just that simple point determines whether or not one can grasp the Trinity. God is not a personal name but the name of the divine nature. To call the Father the Son or the Holy Spirit "God" would be as calling one of us "man" or "woman" or even "human." God is a compound unity (a unity of plurality) the same way a family is. This concept we grasp easily because we do not impose upon it the preconceived notions like there is one person per family. That would be nonsense since there is no such thing as a family of one. When one uses this correct math (formula) the Triunity of God is VERY comprehend-able.

Well said, Joi.

As far as being members of the Church... We are all members of one body; the body of Christ. We are all called to be priests of God. Every one of us. This may or may not mean a call to preach or be in full time ministry of one sort or another... touching on this matter and the divisions problem the Apostle Paul wrote: 1 Corinthians 12 (NIV) 1 Now about spiritual gifts, brothers, I do not want you to be ignorant. 2 You know that when you were pagans, somehow or other you were influenced and led astray to mute idols. 3 Therefore I tell you that no one who is speaking by the Spirit of God says, “Jesus be cursed,” and no one can say, “Jesus is Lord,” except by the Holy Spirit. 4 There are different kinds of gifts, but the same Spirit. 5 There are different kinds of service, but the same Lord. 6 There are different kinds of working, but the same God works all of them in all men. 7 Now to each one the manifestation of the Spirit is given for the common good. 8 To one there is given through the Spirit the message of wisdom, to another the message of knowledge by means of the same Spirit, 9 to another faith by the same Spirit, to another gifts of healing by that one Spirit, 10 to another miraculous powers, to another prophecy, to another distinguishing between spirits, to another speaking in different kinds of tongues, and to still another the interpretation of tongues. 11 All these are the work of one and the same Spirit, and he gives them to each one, just as he determines. 12 The body is a unit, though it is made up of many parts; and though all its parts are many, they form one body. So it is with Christ. 13 For we were all baptized by one Spirit into one body—whether Jews or Greeks, slave or free—and we were all given the one Spirit to drink. 14 Now the body is not made up of one part but of many. 15 If the foot should say, “Because I am not a hand, I do not belong to the body,” it would not for that reason cease to be part of the body. 16 And if the ear should say, “Because I am not an eye, I do not belong to the body,” it would not for that reason cease to be part of the body. 17 If the whole body were an eye, where would the sense of hearing be? If the whole body were an ear, where would the sense of smell be? 18 But in fact God has arranged the parts in the body, every one of them, just as he wanted them to be. 19 If they were all one part, where would the body be? 20 As it is, there are many parts, but one body. 21 The eye cannot say to the hand, “I don’t need you!” And the head cannot say to the feet, “I don’t need you!” 22 On the contrary, those parts of the body that seem to be weaker are indispensable, 23 and the parts that we think are less honorable we treat with special honor. And the parts that are unpresentable are treated with special modesty, 24 while our presentable parts need no special treatment. But God has combined the members of the body and has given greater honor to the parts that lacked it, 25 so that there should be no division in the body, but that its parts should have equal concern for each other. 26 If one part suffers, every part suffers with it; if one part is honored, every part rejoices with it. 27 Now you are the body of Christ, and each one of you is a part of it. 28 And in the church God has appointed first of all apostles, second prophets, third teachers, then workers of miracles, also those having gifts of healing, those able to help others, those with gifts of administration, and those speaking in different kinds of tongues. 29 Are all apostles? Are all prophets? Are all teachers? Do all work miracles? 30 Do all have gifts of healing? Do all speak in tongues? Do all interpret? 31 But eagerly desire the greater gifts.

Um, if I may... Jesus spoke of the Kingdom (of Israel) being off course by the infiltration of what he called weeds sown into the wheat field (Matthew 13). This was not just to slam the Jewish leadership which opposed him, but to point out that the devil who lost over the centuries whenever attempting frontal assaults learned and applied tactics like subtle infiltration to plant seeds of evil that would eventually grow into full fledged evil. Moses was asleep as the good field was sown with weed seed by the enemy. In Exodus 18 he took the advice of his father-in-law about the governing structure of Israel. On the surface it seems harmless, and actually a sound idea. But Moses did not so much as consult the Lord about this. And his beloved father-in-law was a pagan priest. What difference does that make? Jesus thought it mattered when the demons cried out that he was the Holy One of Israel and told them to be quite. To shut up. Why? Were they lying? Most the time yes. They said things like he was A way to God not THE way... but sometimes they spoke the technical truth. Jesus silenced them then too. Because it matters from where even truth comes. Truth legitimizes its source. More often than not, this is why people fall into false religions, cults, and the various denominations. One preacher preaches water baptism another preaches speaking in tongues another preaches Jesus is not God another that Jesus is God the Father the Son and the Holy Ghost all in one... some denominations believe in the methodology others in the liturgical approach... and on and on. The weed seed planted in Israel did grow into the Sanhedrin. The very body of leaders Moses agreed to have in Exodus 18 became the body of leaders that condemned the Holy One of Israel to death and turned him over to the Romans which they hornswoggled into doing their dirty work for them. Then they proceeded to teach and to preach an anti-Jesus dogma among the Jews even declaring the one thing that could take away one's Jewishness was becoming a believer in Jesus. This abdication of leadership in the Church and the persecution of the Church (first at their hands and later at the hand of the Romans) kept the Church underground until Roman Emperor Constantine saw in Christianity a cohesiveness his crumbling Empire sorely lacked. Constantine legalized Christianity and began the foundation work for it becoming the religion of State (which would morph, itself, into the Roman Catholic Empire). Some good did come out of the 4th Century CE in that the Church councils were able to compare the totality of scripture for the first time and discover such factual doctrines as the Trinity and the deity of Christ and the security of salvation. But a lot of misinterpretation and self serving doctrines were formed as well. As I said the Roman Empire collapsed and in place of its empty shell the Roman Catholic Empire hatched... a transmutation that transcended the Roman government into that which outlasts kings and kingdoms... religion. The Emperor became the Pope. The Senate became the Cardinals. The governors became the Bishops. Monsignors, Fathers, Nuns, Monks... right on down the line. And the Capitol remains in Rome (Vatican city). Enter the dark ages. Most blame the age on other things going on in the world. But it was the imprisonment of the Church. And when the Protestant Reformation came (though it was a very bloody thing to dare cross the Roman Empire Church) they did not reform nearly enough. The ideal was to get back to the roots of Christianity. Roman Catholicism had effectively expunged from the faith everything Hebrew it could in the name of riding the faith of legalism. But it threw the baby out with the bathwater like a second wife would any remnant of a first wife. And the reformers started from a Roman Catholic base rather than a Hebrew base. And from that point on it became pretty much a determination of opinions as to which "denomination" is the correct one... or the most comfortable one... or the one that "I" agree with the most...

Back to the OP: 2 Peter 1:20-21 (KJV) 20 Knowing this first, that no prophecy of the scripture is of any private interpretation. 21 For the prophecy came not in old time by the will of man: but holy men of God spake as they were moved by the Holy Ghost. So, private interpretations are wrong. John 16:13 (KJV) 13 Howbeit when he, the Spirit of truth, is come, he will guide you into all truth: for he shall not speak of himself; but whatsoever he shall hear, that shall he speak: and he will shew you things to come. The same Holy Spirit who wrote the Bible (through the prophets he inspired) will illuminate the Word of God. And how we know this illumination is actually from the Holy Spirit is by putting it to the test prescribed in scripture. 1 Thessalonians 5:21 (KJV) 21 Prove all things; hold fast that which is good. 1 John 4:1 (KJV) 1 Beloved, believe not every spirit, but try the spirits whether they are of God: because many false prophets are gone out into the world. Acts 17:11 (KJV) 11 These were more noble than those in Thessalonica, in that they received the word with all readiness of mind, and searched the scriptures daily, whether those things were so. 2 Timothy 2:15 (KJV) 15 Study to shew thyself approved unto God, a workman that needeth not to be ashamed, rightly dividing the word of truth. 2 Timothy 3:16-17 (KJV) 16 All scripture is given by inspiration of God, and is profitable for doctrine, for reproof, for correction, for instruction in righteousness: 17 That the man of God may be perfect, thoroughly furnished unto all good works. When it comes to human traditions... Mark 7:8 (NASB95) 8 “Neglecting the commandment of God, you hold to the tradition of men.” Mark 7:13 (NIV) 13 Thus you nullify the word of God by your tradition that you have handed down. And you do many things like that.” An aside about the OP title... any apparent contradiction in scripture is the product of the imperfection of human communication / understanding. A calculated risk exposing his inerrant Word to such misunderstanding and misinterpretation but one God was willing to take to save souls.

1 Corinthians 2:7 (NIV) 7 No, we speak of God’s secret wisdom, a wisdom that has been hidden and that God destined for our glory before time began. The other translations say before the eons of our glory or of this world but it states before this time line began regardless. 2 Peter 3:8 (NIV) 8 But do not forget this one thing, dear friends: With the Lord a day is like a thousand years, and a thousand years are like a day. Psalm 90:4 (NIV) 4 For a thousand years in your sight are like a day that has just gone by, or like a watch in the night. Time to God is a relevance to us.

Don't get me wrong, I love America. I served with honors in the military and would defend her even today. But I cannot think of anything that brought sulfur and ashes down on Sodom and Gomorrah more than what we've done and surpassed in the US... and yet we're not judged as they were. The only thing we have going for us that S&G didn't is that we are standing with and in support of Israel... and that support and standing is dwindling by the year and is nearly hanging by a thread. We must lobby congress. Point to the prosperity of Canada who is the lone G-8 member nation who voted against forcing Israel to return to pre-1967 borders. And Canada's dollar is worth more than the US dollar now. No coincidence! Blessing from the God who still loves the Jewish people. And if God loves them so much still it breaks his heart all the more when they perish (individually) without their Messiah Jesus! So we should double our efforts to win them (not force them) to win them with love and persistence (not intimidation) with love and persistence win them to their beloved Messiah. They are not a bad people (no worse than any of us), they are just misled by an evil sect that infiltrated their leadership and they are dogmatically doggedly beyond all odds trying to live by what they believe are the commandments of God which the evil element in leadership convinced them is that Jesus is not their Messiah. It is a blindness as the Bible says. But it is for following the leadership God told them to follow... There is a breakaway process in life (typically at the beginning and often in birth itself) when you break away from everything familiar everything you have known and you either embrace the new life or die. I recall during a shellback initiation (sailor's initiation when crossing the equator) when the final step (unbeknownst to the pollywog) was to be forcibly dunked and after hours and hours of declaring "I'm a slimy pollywog!" often defiantly they repeat the question "What are you!?" and dunk you again until you realize the breaking away and declare "I am a shellback!" then you are welcomed into the club. Would that this were only about some silly traditional initiation rather than an eternal life or eternal damnation matter. Just beware satanic antisemitism which often shows it's ugly face in Christian circles. Sadly. The Apostle Paul wrote how we owe the Jews everything having shared in their Messiah when even they would not. And still some maybe even many Christians dislike or even loathe them. Pray for the peace of Jerusalem they will prosper that love thee.

In a 2001 video, Netanyahu, reportedly unaware he was being recorded, said: "They asked me before the election if I'd honor [the Oslo accords]... I said I would, but [that] I'm going to interpret the accords in such a way that would allow me to put an end to this galloping forward to the '67 borders. How did we do it? Nobody said what defined military zones were. Defined military zones are security zones; as far as I'm concerned, the entire Jordan Valley is a defined military zone. Go argue." Netanyahu then explained how he conditioned his signing of the 1997 Hebron agreement on American consent that there be no withdrawals from "specified military locations," and insisted he be allowed to specify which areas constituted a "military location" - such as the whole of the Jordan Valley. "Why is that important? Because from that moment on I stopped the Oslo Accords," Netanyahu affirmed. However, this is consistent with Rabin's October 1995 statement to the Knesset on the ratification of the interim Oslo agreement: "B. The security border of the State of Israel will be located in the Jordan Valley, in the broadest meaning of that term." We must pray for the peace of Jerusalem and lobby hard our Congressmen and women to support Israel and get Obama and DC off of this kick to reduce Israel down to pre 1967 borders... or the last thread keeping America from being judged like Sodom and Gomorrah will be broken.

TEN MAJOR EVENTS (Relating to Israel’s Covenant Land) 1. October 30, 1991: The Perfect Storm—As President George H. W. Bush is opening the Madrid (Spain) Conference to consider “land for peace” in Israel’s Middle East role, the “perfect storm” develops in the North Atlantic, creating the largest waves ever recorded in that region. The storm travels 1000 miles from “east to west” instead of the normal “west to east” pattern and crashes into the New England Coast. Thirty-five foot waves crash into the Kennebunkport home of President Bush. 2. August 23, 1992: Hurricane Andrew—When the Madrid Conference moves to Washington DC and the peace talks resume, Hurricane Andrew, the worst natural disaster ever to hit America, comes ashore and produces an estimated $30 billion in damage and leaving 180,000 homeless in Florida. 3. January 16, 1994: Northridge Earthquake—President Bill Clinton meets with Syria's President Hafez el-Assad in Geneva. They talk about a peace agreement with Israel that includes giving up the Golan Heights. Within 24 hours, a powerful 6.9 earthquake rocks Southern California, This quake, centered in Northridge, becomes the second most destructive natural disaster to hit the United States, behind Hurricane Andrew, 4. January 21, 1998: Lewinsky Scandal—Israeli Prime Minister Benjamin Netanyahu meets with President Clinton at the White House and is coldly received. Clinton and Secretary of State Madeleine Albright refuse to have lunch with him. Shortly afterwards on that day, the Monica Lewinsky scandal breaks into the mass media and begins to occupy a major portion of Clinton's time. 5. September 28, 1998: Hurricane George—As Secretary of State Albright works on the final details of an agreement in which Israel would give up 13 percent of Yesha (Judah and Samaria), Hurricane George slams into the United States Gulf Coast with 110 mph winds and gusts up to 175 mph. The hurricane hits the coast and stalled. On September 28, Clinton meets with Yasser Arafat and Netanyahu at the White House to finalize this land deal. Later, Arafat addresses the United Nations about declaring an independent Palestinian state by May 1999, as Hurricane George pounds the Gulf Coast, causing $1 billion in damage. At the exact time that Arafat departs the country, the storm begins to dissipate. 6. October 15-22, 1998: Texas Flooded—On October 15, 1998, Arafat and Netanyahu meet at the Wye River Plantation in Maryland. The talks are scheduled to last five days with the focus on Israel giving up 13 percent of Yesha. The talks are extended and conclude on October 23. On October 17, awesome rains and tornadoes hit southern Texas. The San Antonio area is deluged with rain. The rain and flooding in Texas continue until October 22 and then subside. The floods ravage 25 percent of Texas and leave over one billion dollars in damage. On October 21, Clinton declares this section of Texas a major disaster area. 7. November 30, 1998: Market Capitalization Evaporates—Arafat comes to Washington again to meet with President Clinton to raise money for a Palestinian state with Jerusalem as the capital. A total of 42 other nations were represented in Washington. All the nations agreed to give Arafat $3 billion in aid. Clinton promised $400 million, and the European nations $1.7 billion. On the same day, the Dow Jones average drops 216 points, and on December 1, the European Market had its third worst day in history. Hundreds of billions of market capitalization were wiped out in the U.S. and Europe. 8. December 12, 1998: Clinton is Impeached—As Clinton lands in the Palestinian-controlled section of Israel to discuss the “land for peace” process, the House of Representatives votes four articles of impeachment against him. 9. May 3, 1999: The Powerful Super Tornado—On the day that Yasser Arafat is scheduled to declare a Palestinian state with Jerusalem as the capital, the most powerful tornado storm system ever to hit the United States sweeps across Oklahoma and Kansas. The winds are clocked at 316 mph the fastest wind speed ever recorded. The declaration is postponed to December 1999 at the request of President Clinton, whose letter to Arafat encourages him in his "aspirations for his own land." He also writes that the Palestinians have a right to "determine their own future on their own land" and that they deserve to "live free, today, tomorrow and forever." 10. Week of October 11: Hurricane, Earthquake and Dow Collapse—As Jewish settlers in 15 West Bank (Israel) settlements are evicted from the covenant land in Israel, the Dow-Jones financial averages lose 5.7 percent in the worst week since October 1989. On October 15 the Dow lost 266 points, and a hurricane slams into North Carolina. On the next morning, October 16, a magnitude 7.1 earthquake rocks the southwest in the fifth most powerful earthquake in 20th Century. The earthquake was centered in the California desert and did little damage but was felt in three states.

The late Dr. J.R. Church did an audio series back in the 1980's which was an in depth study on the topic written by Eustace Mullins in his book "The Secrets of the Federal Reserve." I had an audio cassette produced by the Southwest Radio Church. This series of recorded broadcasts gave the background for our modern financial system which dates back to the the late 1700's through what became the Federal Reserve and the Bank of England, predating the American Revolution. This is all documented research. Such interesting tidbits as the surrender of England in the Revolutionary War was not over American spirit or determination as it was the Crown granting America sovereignty if Washington agreed to charter America's financial system through the Bank of England. Guiding principle of one of the controllers of the Bank of England:Amsel (Amschel) Bauer Mayer Rothschild: "Let me issue and control a Nation's money and I care not who makes its laws"Every time America did not renew that charter there was trouble. The war of 1812 for example. Then there were various depressions through the 19th and early 20 Centuries... all triggered by the Federal Reserve / Bank of England. When Abraham Lincoln refused to pay the interest B of E demanded to fund the Civil War effort, he funded the effort with the green backs he minted. Lincoln met an untimely death. In 1913 when the Federal Reserve act was ushered in (along with the declared ratified 16th ammendment to levy tax on the American people) the B of E was in full swing essentially establishing a New York branch and getting America to pay the taxes that the Revolutionary war was fought over. Incidentally, the taxation without representation was over a 1% tax. John Kennedy was a man of conviction. When his son died an infant death and his wife was not going to be dissuaded from leaving him that last time he had gone off on an adulterous tryst ... the man had a truly repented spirit and won the love of his wife back. This was a dangerous thing to have in the white house as far as the Federal Reserve and the Bank of England were concerned. Kennedy not only drafted an executive order to withdraw all American troops from Southeast Asia, he began the severing of the ties with the Fed by printing the Kennedy two dollar bills. You will notice the Kennedy two dollar bills say "United States Note" on the top of the face rather than the "Federal Reserve Note" all other American paper money says. JFK met with an untimely death. This is pretty much where Church and Mullins leave off. They go into the Chairmen of the Fed up to the mid 1980's and refer to the Jekyll Island Club / Skull and Bones Society and then Church ventures a prophecy about rainbow money being printed in the 1990's. Not to detract from his excellent work in research and reporting what he'd found... folks, especially preachers, just can't resist prophesying their beliefs or opinions... and when they are found wrong it tends to discredit all their good hard work... I think of Dr. Chuck Missler and his big faux pas investing his reputation in the Y2K Bug frap... too bad because his very in depth Bible teaching is second to very few people in history. Enter Richard Milhous Nixon. Politics are dirty as h-e-double hockey sticks.Tricky Dick was no worse and no better than most. Because Christians abandoned politics not wanting to soil their skirts... the real shysters and baser forms of human life set up a gauntlet for would be governmental leaders to go through to get anywhere near public office. So, those who run on the platform of purity and the media grants them a pass BEWARE! When Tricky Dick got elected and established his power base in DC as all who get elected must (read Chuck Colson's Kingdoms in Conflict), he believed he was empowered and insulated enough to overcome the feeding frenzy the media had whipped the American public into for little other purpose than for the media to flex its muscle and show DC how easily it could break ANYBODY. Nixon as we know resigned in disgrace. But before he left, he signed an executive order taking the American currency off of the gold standard (which was masked as an order to lift the embargo on gold in America which was put in place by FDR) and put the currency on "petrodollars." Oil was abundant and extremely cheap by today's standards. This precipitated the oil embargo of the 1970's when the cartel (OPEC) essentially flexed its muscle. Ford came and went, swine flu vaccinations being his legacy... the Warren Commission cover up and falling down the stairs of Airforce 1. Carter got elected and however he did it, he ticked off the Fed / B of E. From that point on everything in his administration was reactionary or damage control to save his historic legacy. He twisted the Shah of Iran's arm to give into the protests and give up his power and come to America in exile. The Iranian people whom Carter hoped would love America and use their oil resources to supply the US with oil (making Jimmy the hero) backfired with the return of the Ayatollah Khomeini and the overrunning of the US embassy and the hostage crisis. There were several failed attempts to negotiate and even a covert action to insert commandos to free the hostages that utterly failed. And the Fed / B of E were fed up with Carter and raised interest rates to some 22% (not credit card interest but car loan and home loan and business loans). The Fed was insuring that Carter would not be reelected. To try to save what was left of his administration and history's tendency to condemn people who were more or less brutalized by the opinion makers of the world, Carter twisted the arm of Menachem Bagan to get Israel to give back land for a treaty with Egypt (the Sinai peninsula) from the land Egypt lost in the 6 Day war when it attacked Israel. Doing this deed against Israel and giving up a world gate (the Suez canal) was not enough. Carter also signed the act to return the Panama canal to a government that was created to build the canal in the first place insuring the canal would be in American hands forthwith. That's two world gates given away. I don't doubt Mr Carter did what he thought was good, but ... Enter Ronald Reagan. Now I realize he was second Moses to most, and I am stepping on some very deluded toes, but he wasn't the brilliant president the greedy rich made him out to be. He was instrumental in bringing the cold war to a pause... and only a pause... for people to think otherwise is what the USSR counts on. Russia is only in hibernation. And many experts say she is nearly reawakened today. But we in the US have been disarming our arsenal or expending it in police actions / wars 1 and 2 in the Gulf as if there will never be a cold war again. WHich their might no be if America is so bankrupt or so out of bullets and war materials that we can only surrender... GHW Bush when running against Reagan for the GOP nomination declared the economic plan of Reagan "voodoo economics." And he was right. It was a system of basing the America currency on... debt and indebtedness. That so long as people were spending themselves silly going beyond living paycheck to paycheck and living beyond their means... and as long as banks / corporation / and eventually nations (once the debt was big enough) were willing to buy the debt... well... uh... everything was prosperous... Reagan was the consummate pitch man the fighting Irish coach that kept America giving one more for the Gipper... he was not an economics genius. Remember that the next time some loving devotee to him tells you how much or a Reagan republican they are... Larry Burkett Christian financial expert all through the 1990's warned of "the Coming Financial Meltdown." He warned how the deficit was not being addressed or faced and how politicians used dishonest methods to make it seem as though they paid it down or even off (using an "off budget" category to simply set aside trillions of dollars' debt and act as if it did not exist). It was a house of cards from the start. And because it was so artificially stimulated and trillions of dollars of debt was hidden, it was prolonged at least a decade longer. 2008 was the fulfillment of what Burkett warned. And we still did not face the music as we bailed out the very people responsible for the collapse. And we couldn't even get them to stop giving extremely lavish bonuses to their head henchmen (CEO's). And now that the Middle Class has been eliminated (by the industry / jobs outsourcing and the collapse) the wealthy have no one to pass along the American tax burden to. So NOW they are concerned about Government spending... at a time when historically Government spending stimulated the economy when the wealthy would not. The CCC for example. We are in a precarious predicament. When we had jobs and industry and tariffs and taxes protecting our borders we could stand up to these greedy types and out votes mattered. We cannot now duplicate the war effort of the 1940's to defend ourselves if need be because almost none of those industries (steel and other manufacturing industries) exist within our borders. We have to buy bullets from other nations to fight in Afghanistan now. God's judgment has been progressively unleashed on this nation founded on Christian principles because we turned our back on him and those principles and opened our arms to humanism, atheism, cults and world religions all the while systematically outlawing Christianity and step by step turning our back on Israel. With God's protective hedge none of these people or situations would have worked or prospered. Naked of his hedge we are totally vulnerable to all the evil forces of men and angels and systems of hell. America needs not to "man up" as the title OP suggest it need to kneel down, prostrate itself, tear it's robes in grief and put dust and ashes on her head... for we have sinned.

God the Father has all knowledge. Past, present, future, plus all the variables along the way from the limited sovereignty he gave men and angels to make choices. Jesus did not know when he would return the Father knows (Mark 13:32). The Spirit searches the mind of the Father (1 Corinthians 2:10) Acts 1:1-7 (NIV) 1 In my former book, Theophilus, I wrote about all that Jesus began to do and to teach 2 until the day he was taken up to heaven, after giving instructions through the Holy Spirit to the apostles he had chosen. 3 After his suffering, he showed himself to these men and gave many convincing proofs that he was alive. He appeared to them over a period of forty days and spoke about the kingdom of God. 4 On one occasion, while he was eating with them, he gave them this command: “Do not leave Jerusalem, but wait for the gift my Father promised, which you have heard me speak about. 5 For John baptized with water, but in a few days you will be baptized with the Holy Spirit.” 6 So when they met together, they asked him, “Lord, are you at this time going to restore the kingdom to Israel?” 7 He said to them: “It is not for you to know the times or dates the Father has set by his own authority. Personal opinion time (warning take this with grain of salt and if it does not line up with scripture disregard): I have contemplated (not to the point of belief yet) that the three who are the one God were all on a higher plain of existence and function. Then person #2 and person #3 lowered themselves to be able to deal with lower beings like angels and then man on a temporal basis. Person #1 remained in that higher state and is the one who has all knowledge and does not relate to the progression that is temporal existence. This is how God (person #2) seemed not to know things in the Old Testament (Genesis 22:13b) and even in a few places in the New Testament. Jesus did said in the crowd (Mark 13:32) "who touched me?" Not, "YOU touched me!" See?