ENOCH2010

The number of gay people in the usa is said to be around 3%, why do the politicians care about such a small number of votes? The republican party will lose a lot more Christian votes than that, when they adopt the sin of gay sex into their platform.

Sounds about right brother Joe

True floating ax, I got carried away debunking lamads theory and made a mistake. I went back to edit that

Lamad my Bible don't have a left behind book in it. Like I said before, the pre - trib doctrine is a man made doctrine. My Bible don't say anything about different "waves" of the first resurrection, my Bible don't even say anything about going to some mystical place called heaven, my Bible says the first resurrection happens at the second coming. My Bible says the holy city is coming down here after the 1000 year reign. The preconceived glasses are on the pre-trib believers and their left behind series.

floating ax # 10 should be a clue for you that the pre-trib rapture doctrine is a man made doctrine. No pre-trib resurrection, ergo no pre-trib rapture. For the Lord will descend from heaven with a shout and the dead in Christ will rise first they we which are alive and remain will be called up to join them in the air. Sounds like a resurrection to me, and it happens at the second coming.

Lamad my Bible says only 2 resurrections of a massive group remain, the first resurrection ( at the second coming), and the resurrection for the great white thrown(after the 1000 year reign). There is no mention of a resurrection for a pre-trib rapture. That is one big nail in the coffin for the pre-trib doctrine.

Lamad maybe you can tell me which resurrection the church will be raptured with.

The born again believers, the Christians, the Saints of the old and new testament , the heroes of faith in the Old Testament, all the believers through out history and the future.

Other one, On that we agree 100%

other one, that wont work for the pre-tribbers

That's a new one even for the pre-tribbers, to say that the 144,000 are demon worshipers. All I can say is wow !!!

AMEN and AMEN brother rjp

Amen !!! Matt36 I've been wanting to say that for a long time.

Marv you might ought to take another look at the hall of fame of faith in the book of Hebrews

Christians are being killed daily in the muslim countries as we speak. Enoch 2021 are you saying they aren't being overcome by satan. They are included in that number under the alter are they not. I don't get you, when someone points out a hole in your doctrine, you just brush it aside and keep going as though they never said anything.

Yes please don't think we are the same.

Enoch 2021 The only barrier to truth is thinking you already have it

Marilyn c, Enoch 2021 is the only one that gets to say what scripture goes together, and if it don't, he'll write you a whole page of scripture that has nothing to do with the subject at hand hoping people will forget what the subject was, while they read his page.

There isn't a graph in my Bible. When do you say the wrath of God starts?

Spock the kings, the great men, the rich men, the mighty men, the bondman and the free men say that the wrath of the Lamb has come, that is their opinion of what is happening, but the Bible says the vials contain the wrath of God. They remind me of the pre-tribbers in this thread, they think the wrath of God starts with the opening of the first seal.

The Bible says the wrath of God is poured out of the vials, right after the 7th trumpet. That's when Gods wrath starts, but I'm sure the pre-tribbers want agree with what the Bible says.

Marv, take your blinders off and look at the whole picture, the pre-trib doctrine adds a secret resurrection and a secret return of the Lord. The post-trib view doesn't.

Matt since you have came this far away from the pre-trib doctrine, just skip over the pre-wrath doctrine and settle in the camp of the post-tribbers, where the truth still resides. Neither the pre-trib doctrine or the pre-wrath doctrine were ever taught before the 1800's when a lady named Margaret M. had a dream about a secret return of the Lord. Darby picked up the dream and ran with it until Scofield printed it in his bible. People see Scofields comments at the bottom of the pages in his bible and think they are included in "thus sayeth the Lord" when in fact they are just an opinion like everybody else has. Then came the left behind series of books and movies, now this doctrine is so ingrained into the minds of some,there is no way to convince them other wise. The post trib return of the Lord was the doctrine taught from the beginning of the church, and it is still being taught today. The Bible says the second coming of the Lord is to happen at the first resurrection, the dead in Christ will rise first then we which are alive and remain will join them in the air. From there we will stay with the Lord while He cleans up Bozrah and then we go to the Mount of Olives to rescue his people. The post -trib view is the only view that was taught in the beginning, and it is the only view that doesn't have to add a secret resurrection and a secret return of the Lord. I think we need to believe what the Bible says, not some lady named Margaret.

It keeps you away from the second death.

The last couple posts sound pleasing to the ears, but the truth of the of the (he) in those verses is, they are guessing at the identity of the he. No where in the Bible is(he) identified, and to say otherwise is a lie. That's the problem with the pre-trib doctrine, the pre-tribbes don't seem to care if they add their words to the scriptures, or take a few words out, and claim them as gospel. I have witnessed pre-tribbes in this thread, when shown in scripture an error in their doctrine, they just ignore it and add something else to try and cover it up, or say that's not what those verses really mean. One thing is for sure, at the second coming they will be the first group proven wrong or right.