childoftheking

I am not arguing the facts because like you said, they are facts. I am arguing that Yeshua TWICE said the ELECT will go through the Tribulation. One He mentions the days will be shortened for the Elect during Tribulation, 2nd He mentions the Elect will be gathered AFTER the Tribulation. Obviously, these ELECT that are alive during the Tribulation are not those BEHEADED!! And the 1/3 Jews do not come into play (Revelation 12) until the 2nd half of Tribulation and they ALL escape to ONE PLACE Petra. But the ELECT are gathered by the Angels from the 4 corners, meaning Believers are EVERYWHERE during the Tribulation. Before even addressing you, I wonder, do you understand that the ELECT means those who are SAVED? Because if you do, there is no mistaking what Yeshua is saying here!!

Praise the Lord!! Ain't it just a wonderful feeling knowing God's Words are True and Factual? If you want to feel free, pray over your meal when out in public. I pray at home for my meal, so praying for my meal everywhere just makes sense. But some peeps get offended by it hahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahaha Nothing better to do than to wink at someone, who see's disgust in you, for being one of them JESUS FREAKS

Greater is HE that is within me, than he that is within the world!! Fear has so many people trapped that those 14 words ^ never register. I raise llamas, longhorn cows, Icelandic horses, and breed Tibetan Mastiffs. Each animal is a literal menace to society. The llamas will attack anyone, the horses will bum rush you because they are always going to be wild to some degree, my cows have lifted 16 foot 350 pounds gates with one horn and with a shake of their head can toss it 30 feet easily, and the Tibetan Mastiffs at vet clinics are classified as only 5% domesticated (the rest is wolf since they were the very first ever dog to be bred out of wolves), and when the males get into a fight, boards, rocks, things to smack them with but not kill them, water does not remotely stop these beasts. In fact, the zoologist and breeder who began restoring the Tibetan Mastiffs, enabled them to be bigger and stronger than they were in Tibet (they claim 50,000 years ago). And 3 times he has been caught in the middle of a fight and ended up at the Emergency Room. 1 of those times, they ripped the calf of his right leg to the point he could have just carried (it was hanging by a piece of flesh) to the hospital. In my experience, (these dogs were designed because when the people of Tibet went to bed, tigers would sneak in and take the infant children for food)...(so, they were designed to fight tigers) where I live, we have roaming mountain lions. On 2 occasions, these lions climbed the 7 foot perimeter Elk fence to get to the turkeys. Neither lion ever made it back over the fence. These TM's have a thick flesh around their necks so no animal can bite them and suffocate them. But both times, when we finally were able to break the dogs free, they ripped the bottom jaw off from the lion and were dismembering it. So, I have extremely dangerous animals if in the right condition and situation. And yes, I have been attacked by the llamas that stand on their hind legs and become an easy 10 feet tall kicking their front legs like a deer at you. I have been bum rushed by the horses who get agitated quickly over their want of hay. I have been on the receiving end of the longhorn cows who are massive and strong. And I have had to break up the mastiffs who have managed to get in same vicinity and go at one another. EVERY SINGLE TIME, in all instances of me vs animals, who know they are stronger than I am... I raised my hand with 2 fingers stretched out and with a loud voice yelled, "In the Name of Yeshua." Those animals KNOW who God is!! Every single instance, the llamas backed down and moved away from me, the horses just stopped after being in a full run at me, the cows just backed away, and the Mastiffs have broken their fight up and just looked at one another like they don't understand why they stopped. Do you know how empowering that is, to put your faith in God, in a situation that have killed literally thousands of people, and see for no apparent reason these animals just stop IMMEDIATELY and back away? Brother, when the Adversary knows you have faith and apply it at all times, he avoids you, for those still trapped in their fear!! I know that I know that I know, that my God will NEVER FAIL me!! I am persuaded that God will keep His Word and Promise because He cannot change. He is the SAME yesterday, today, and every tomorrow until He returns!! God has not led me to walk through a hospital yet, to just pass by claiming, "In the Name of Yeshua!!" But I have no doubts, if He does instruct me to do as such, many doctors are going to be upset, because their business will be walking out the door completely 100% HEALED!!

My favorite song explains this: Here is the video and bottom the lyrics. Read those lyrics, they are factual and TRUTH!! This is Molly Skaggs, Ricky Skaggs daughter...talk about Anointed!! Ain't No Grave Oh, shame is a prison as cruel as a grave Shame is a robber and he's come to take my name Oh, love is my redeemer, lifting me up from the ground Love is the power when my freedom song is found Oh, shame is a prison as cruel as a grave Shame is a robber and he's come to take my name Oh, love is my redeemer, lifting me up from the ground Love is the power when my freedom song is found There ain't no grave Gonna hold my body down There ain't no grave Gonna hold my body down When I hear that trumpet sound I'm gonna rise up outta the ground There ain't no grave Gonna hold my body down Oh, fear is a liar with a smooth and velvet tongue Fear is a tyrant, he's always telling me to run Oh, love is a resurrection and love is a trumpet sound Love is my weapon, I'm gonna take my giants down There ain't no grave Gonna hold my body down There ain't no grave Gonna hold my body down And when I hear that trumpet sound I'm gonna rise up outta the ground There ain't no grave Gonna hold my body down Oh, there was a battle, a war between death and life And there on a tree, the Lamb of God was crucified And He went on down to hell, He took back every key He rose up as a lion and He set all captives free There ain't no grave Could hold His body down There ain't no grave Could hold His body down When He heard the trumpet sound He rose up outta the ground There ain't no grave Could hold His body down There ain't no grave Could hold His body down There ain't no grave Could hold my body down There ain't no grave Could hold my body down Oh, if You walked out of the grave, I'm walking too If You walked out of the grave, I'm walking too If You walked out of the grave, I'm walking too If You walked out of the grave, I'm walking too If You walked out of the grave, I'm walking too If You walked out of the grave, I'm walking too Gonna sing about it, yeah If You walked out of the grave, I'm walking too I'm gonna meet Jesus If You walked out of the grave, I'm walking too Oh, if You walked out of the grave, I'm walking too If You walked out of the grave, I'm walking too If You walked out of the grave, I'm walking too If You walked out of the grave, I'm walking too There ain't no grave Gonna hold my body down There ain't no grave Gonna hold my body down And when I hear that trumpet sound I'm gonna rise up outta the ground There ain't no grave Gonna hold my body down There ain't no grave Gonna hold my body down There ain't no grave Gonna hold my body down

John 3:16 is the THEME to what the Gospel is. But the actual Gospel is broken down to the Need for having Yeshua as your personal Lord and Savior. It's about how He died for you, He was buried and then Resurrected as the Lion of Judah, with the keys to the Grave and Death setting the captives FREE!! In reality, the moment you step out in faith to believe Yeshua is God, and then accept Him as a lost sinner needing Salvation, being filled with the Holy Spirit...we can go back to when Yeshua Died-Buried-Resurrected and put ourselves there. When Yeshua resurrected, so did every Believer prior to Yeshua and after Yeshua was on Earth. When Yeshua ascended to Heaven, so did every Believer prior to Yeshua and after Yeshua was on Earth. Even though I am typing this Monday, April 29, 2019...technically, I am already Resurrected from the Grave and Death and in Heaven, ALL because of what Yeshua accomplished, means I have accomplished through Him!! That is the Gospel of Christ!!

More references that WRATH = JUDGEMENT, not Tribulation: Revelation 14:10 The same shall drink of the wine of the wrath of God, which is poured out without mixture into the cup of his indignation; and he shall be tormented with fire and brimstone in the presence of the holy angels, and in the presence of the Lamb: This verse 14:10, WRATH = TORMENTED WITH FIRE AND BRIMSTONE = Lake of Fire.......this is not even remotely close to Tribulation!! This verse = Armageddon Revelation 19:15 And out of his mouth goeth a sharp sword, that with it he should smite the nations: and he shall rule them with a rod of iron: and he treadeth the winepress of the fierceness and wrath of Almighty God. When does Armageddon take place? After the Tribulation, and after the ELECT are gathered, like Yeshua claimed in Matthew 24. The WRATH of God is Armageddon that leads into the Great White Throne Judgement. Nowhere does WRATH = Tribulation!! Study to show thyself APPROVED!! You need to STUDY!! Nothing you have offered would be APPROVED by God!!

This SPECIFICALLY EXPLAINS what the WRATH of God is: Revelation 11:18 And the nations were angry, and thy wrath is come, and the time of the dead, that they should be judged, and that thou shouldest give reward unto thy servants the prophets, and to the saints, and them that fear thy name, small and great; and shouldest destroy them which destroy the earth. LOOK ^ This explains WRATH IS COME and it's time for the DEAD (SINNERS WHO DENIED GOD) will be JUDGED (LAKE of FIRE) THIS REVEALS GOD'S WRATH IS JUDGEMENT, not the Tribulation!! Wow, don't you actually read the Word of God? This is as plain as day, that the WRATH of GOD = JUDGEMENT on the SINNERS.......and has NOTHING to do with Tribulation at all!!

What is absolutely cracking me up, is that you believe TRIBULATION is God's unleashed WRATH hahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahaha The Tribulation is NOTHING compared to God's WRATH in Armageddon and the Great White Throne Judgement where His Wrath casts those who opposed Him in life into the Lake of Fire!! Whoever instructed you that the TRIBULATION is God's WRATH is dumber than a box of rocks!! The Tribulation is the Adversary's, the False Prophet, the Antichrist's time to shine. Even the TWO WITNESSES do not unleash WRATH (although some will die when trying to attack them). If Tribulation was God's WRATH, the Two Witnesses would not die!! You are so lost you need more than obvious directions to get back on track!! I suggest telling your Pastor goodbye, and go find one WITH A CLUE!!

Obviously, what everyone wrote about, WHICH PAUL DID NOT, has to coincide with what God said in Person. So obviously, If God claims we the Elect will go through the Tribulation, then no matter how much you twist what others claim, is absolutely FALSE. But, if you take what everyone else wrote and align it up with the ONLY ONE THAT MATTERS CLAIMED, they flow with Matthew 24. Since your views DO NOT ALIGN UP WITH WHAT GOD SAID, that is the clearest indicator you are WRONG!!

When I SEE ministers, evangelists, men claiming to be of God...use these scriptures ^ to build a platform for the "rapture." It reveals to me, these people are not filled with the Holy Spirit. Because anyone FILLED with the Spirit of Yahweh, has complete understanding and realizes these verses speak about JUDGEMENT, not about the Second Coming!! What these people are then proving, they have believed THE TRADITIONS OF MEN!! And the "Traditions of men," are nowhere on the "Same Page," as what God's Word literally means!!

1 Thessalonians 1:10 And to wait for his Son from heaven, whom he raised from the dead, even Jesus, which delivered us from the wrath to come. ^ This speaks we are not going to be part of the final judgement, not about the coming of Yeshua in any sense of the meaning!! This is the answer to the verse 1 Thess 1:10 1 Thessalonians 5:9 For God hath not appointed us to wrath, but to obtain salvation by our Lord Jesus Christ, I have seen UNEDUCATED, with the LACK OF KNOWLEDGE, ministers use 1 Thess 1:10 as Paul speaking of a "rapture" before. And it appears, you have listened to them and swallowed their IGNORANCE completely whole!!

The Bride comes with Him at Armageddon, not to gather the Elect, since the church/Bride is the very ELECT that is being gathered!!

Anyone that takes factual Word of God, ESPECIALLY the Words coming from God, and draws the conclusion it is a MYTH, is someone I need to REBUKE, not pay any more attention to!!

You have no idea of what my intentions were by quoting Galileo in my original post within this thread. You cannot properly deduct by any form of reasoning I was manipulating God to a set of numbers. This thread is about how can we Tell God exists through Mathematics, not describe God via Mathematics. And by looking at this from the very viewpoint of God, and Him claiming, he used Mathematics and Science (that is what measuring and stretching a line consists of) in His Creation is far from defining God at all. In fact, to say that is defining God has no logic to it at all!! We are Created in His Likeness. When you know that God used Mathematics and Science, that is a big REVEAL that there will be humans who achieve in both Mathematics and Science because that is a part of WHO GOD is!! Whoever taught you in whatever church Denomination you grew up in, was not very bright, if you conclude that God and Mathematics cannot co-exist. And if this is your own understanding, you need to take some serious in depth Seminary classes. I could suggest a few Biblical Universities to you, but you have to go in thinking I can learn something, not how you are thinking like you have a clue. Because your assumption of what I was doing, has been off the mark the entire time. I quoted Galileo and specified his work in "Patterns," because God's Holy Word reveals that God used Mathematics/Science in His Creation and the Book of Hebrews specifies He did it in "Patterns." We see this by the variety of dogs from the wolf, coyote, to the various species of domesticated dogs. But they are ALL DOGS and they are ALL "Patterned" in like fashion. The same can be said with trees, grass, mammals, amphibians, fish, humans, and the list of Creation goes on and on and they are all in "Patterns." So, to offer scripture trying to discredited me, which is a very BIG RED FLAG that you do not even understand anything I have posted. Alerts me, that your understanding is still in the stages of milk. The meat is when you have the knowledge of specifics about God. Your answers, just provide a general and very broad spectrum that is so far off this topic, it makes me wonder why you are even posting on this topic!!

Golden Candlestick in Revelations represents the 7 Spirits of God. 7 is the number of God, just like man's number is 6:

Here is my upbringing. This video pinpoints the view of Bishop G.T. Haywood, who wrote in the old hymnal song books, "The Crimson Stream of Blood, that Flows from Calvary." I have this video designated to begin at the 1:14 mark because the picture of the founding fathers of the Assemblies of the Lord Jesus Christ can be fully viewed. The man shortest man among all of them on the furthest LEFT, is my Jewish Grandfather, who was well versed in the Torah (as was his son, my dad, and as well as myself) and studying to become a Rabbi. But he was driving and saw this huge tent in the middle of nowhere, with cars filling the nearby fields. This got his attention to what was going on. He stopped and made his way to the tent, and eventually to a seat near the back row. G.T. Haywood was evangelizing, this obvious was many years before these 2 men eventually helped to found the Assemblies of the Lord Jesus Christ. My Grandfather said a power overcame him and he felt the desire to get up and run to the alter. But in his attempt to being dignified, he said he stopped walking because he could not move. He just felt this urge alerting him again and again to get to the man preaching and with this man's help to surrender his life properly to Yeshua. But he could not move in the form of walking, but he discovered he could crawl. So, he crawled on the dirt ground to the pulpit area, told G.T. about this power that was overwhelming him, and how he could not walk but was able to crawl. Long story short, he accepted Yeshua and was filled with the Holy Spirit. He left studying to be a Rabbi and followed G.T. in his tent ministry for several years being his understudy. Ultimately, my Grandfather taught in Bible Universities from Texas, Oklahoma, to Florida. He finally settled in the Midwest and due to his biblical knowledge as a scholar, teacher, evangelist, pastor, he was given the role of presbyter overseeing several churches. Those familiar with him, maybe have one of his books or their family member was a student of his still talk my ears off. My father eventually stepped in and filled his role. Basically, the first 20 years of my life was in Bible studies, dissecting my Grandfather's work, and even my father's work. I had the best education anyone could ever desire from learning the Torah, the KJV, and every topic in between concerning our God (Yahweh). So nothing you wrote is even remotely close to as what you think. I purposely did not share that I had knowledge nor was the student of 2 of the greatest biblical minds + including G.T. Haywood. I figured you were going to dig a hole deep enough to look up and still see bottom. I just knew helping you would not be as fun as to the damage you could do to yourself. Here is the video:

ἐκλεκτοὺ Translations of elect Verb Frequency ἐκλεκτοὺ = elect

ΚΑΤΑ ΜΑΤΘΑΙΟΝ 24:31 Greek NT: Nestle 1904 καὶ ἀποστελεῖ τοὺς ἀγγέλους αὐτοῦ μετὰ σάλπιγγος μεγάλης, καὶ ἐπισυνάξουσιν τοὺς ἐκλεκτοὺς αὐτοῦ ἐκ τῶν τεσσάρων ἀνέμων ἀπ’ ἄκρων οὐρανῶν ἕως ἄκρων αὐτῶν. ΚΑΤΑ ΜΑΤΘΑΙΟΝ 24:31 Greek NT: Westcott and Hort 1881 καὶ ἀποστελεῖ τοὺς ἀγγέλους αὐτοῦ μετὰ σάλπιγγος μεγάλης, καὶ ἐπισυνάξουσιν τοὺς ἐκλεκτοὺς αὐτοῦ ἐκ τῶν τεσσάρων ἀνέμων ἀπ' ἄκρων οὐρανῶν ἕως τῶν ἄκρων αὐτῶν. ΚΑΤΑ ΜΑΤΘΑΙΟΝ 24:31 Greek NT: Westcott and Hort / [NA27 and UBS4 variants] καὶ ἀποστελεῖ τοὺς ἀγγέλους αὐτοῦ μετὰ σάλπιγγος μεγάλης, καὶ ἐπισυνάξουσιν τοὺς ἐκλεκτοὺς αὐτοῦ ἐκ τῶν τεσσάρων ἀνέμων ἀπ' ἄκρων οὐρανῶν ἕως τῶν ἄκρων αὐτῶν. ΚΑΤΑ ΜΑΤΘΑΙΟΝ 24:31 Greek NT: RP Byzantine Majority Text 2005 Καὶ ἀποστελεῖ τοὺς ἀγγέλους αὐτοῦ μετὰ σάλπιγγος φωνῆς μεγάλης, καὶ ἐπισυνάξουσιν τοὺς ἐκλεκτοὺς αὐτοῦ ἐκ τῶν τεσσάρων ἀνέμων, ἀπ’ ἄκρων οὐρανῶν ἕως ἄκρων αὐτῶν. ΚΑΤΑ ΜΑΤΘΑΙΟΝ 24:31 Greek NT: Greek Orthodox Church καὶ ἀποστελεῖ τοὺς ἀγγέλους αὐτοῦ μετὰ σάλπιγγος φωνῆς μεγάλης, καὶ ἐπισυνάξουσι τοὺς ἐκλεκτοὺς αὐτοῦ ἐκ τῶν τεσσάρων ἀνέμων ἀπ’ ἄκρων οὐρανῶν ἕως ἄκρων αὐτῶν. ΚΑΤΑ ΜΑΤΘΑΙΟΝ 24:31 Greek NT: Tischendorf 8th Edition καὶ ἀποστελεῖ τοὺς ἀγγέλους αὐτοῦ μετὰ σάλπιγγος μεγάλης, καὶ ἐπισυνάξουσιν τοὺς ἐκλεκτοὺς αὐτοῦ ἐκ τῶν τεσσάρων ἀνέμων ἀπ’ ἄκρων οὐρανῶν ἕως ἄκρων αὐτῶν. ΚΑΤΑ ΜΑΤΘΑΙΟΝ 24:31 Greek NT: Scrivener's Textus Receptus 1894 καὶ ἀποστελεῖ τοὺς ἀγγέλους αὐτοῦ μετὰ σάλπιγγος φωνῆς μεγάλης, καὶ ἐπισυνάξουσι τοὺς ἐκλεκτοὺς αὐτοῦ ἐκ τῶν τεσσάρων ἀνέμων, ἀπ’ ἄκρων οὐρανῶν ἕως ἄκρων αὐτῶν. ΚΑΤΑ ΜΑΤΘΑΙΟΝ 24:31 Greek NT: Stephanus Textus Receptus 1550 καὶ ἀποστελεῖ τοὺς ἀγγέλους αὐτοῦ μετὰ σάλπιγγος φωνῆς μεγάλης καὶ ἐπισυνάξουσιν τοὺς ἐκλεκτοὺς αὐτοῦ ἐκ τῶν τεσσάρων ἀνέμων ἀπ' ἄκρων οὐρανῶν ἕως ἄκρων αὐτῶν All Greek transcripts from 1550 till now specify the Elect means US, not just the Jews!!

31And he shall send his angels with a great sound of a trumpet, and they shall gather together his elect from the four winds, from one end of heaven to the other. Verse 31 shows us the ELECT is not the Jews who get saved during the Trib because they will all be at Petra. And verse 31 says the Angels will GATHER THE ELECT from the 4 CORNERS..all over the Earth!! This means Christians!! 30And then shall appear the sign of the Son of man in heaven: and then shall all the tribes of the earth mourn, and they shall see the Son of man coming in the clouds of heaven with power and great glory. And verse 30 specifies ALL TRIBES, not just Jews will be watching Yeshua return.

Matthew 24: 21For then shall be great tribulation, such as was not since the beginning of the world to this time, no, nor ever shall be. 22And except those days should be shortened, there should no flesh be saved: but for the elect's sake those days shall be shortened. 27For as the lightning cometh out of the east, and shineth even unto the west; so shall also the coming of the Son of man be. 29Immediately after the tribulation of those days shall the sun be darkened, and the moon shall not give her light, and the stars shall fall from heaven, and the powers of the heavens shall be shaken: 30And then shall appear the sign of the Son of man in heaven: and then shall all the tribes of the earth mourn, and they shall see the Son of man coming in the clouds of heaven with power and great glory. 31And he shall send his angels with a great sound of a trumpet, and they shall gather together his elect from the four winds, from one end of heaven to the other. This shows the specified events and how it will happen. (1) God begins with Great Trib begins (2) Because the ELECT will be in that Trib, God will shorten the days (3) Trib ends (4) sun darkens (5) moon to blood (6) YESHUA RETURNS!! (7) Angels gather the ELECT!! Can't believe you would take Paul's word over God!!

That is all well and good, but Paul never did specify the Gathering of the Elect was before, during, or after Tribulation. But the good thing is, YESHUA (BETTER KNOWN AS GOD AND MESSIAH) did specify these things in Matthew 24. Mark and Luke reiterate them and so does the Book of Acts!!

Am I actually doing as you suggest by observing His Creation? A tree, is something everyone of age can look at immediately and say, that is a tree. It can be an Oak, Birch, Redwood, Walnut, Elm, Sycamore, Weeping Willow, does not matter, we all know they are trees because the "PATTERN GOD MADE FOR A TREE" can be seen in EVERY SPECIES of trees. A fish is the same. Whether a small pond fish, big lake fish, or an ocean fish from a tiny blue gill to a great white shark, they are all fish and we know they are all fish by their "PATTERN." Humans, we come in all shapes and sizes including different shades of brown. But if anyone looks and see's whether someone is African, English, Middle Eastern, what they positively do see is a resemblance of a human being, because of the "PATTERN." Galileo was specifying this with the stars. And what we have learned by powerful telescopes, there are literally millions of galaxies (that look just like our Milky Way) all over space. We know they are Galaxies by the "PATTERN." God specifically used a "PATTERN" for EVERYTHING He spoke into existence. From a house cat to a tiger, you know that "PATTERN" is a feline "PATTERN," whenever you see it. As a Mathematician, a believer in God, I study "PATTERNS" in my line of work. Typically off of a GD&T (blueprint). I definitely relate to what Galileo was claiming here because it is an absolute fact!! Even Einstein mentioned patterns. His Theory on Relativity using Quantum Mechanics, has many portions of it relating to "Patterns." Look at this scripture here: This is Yahweh speaking to Job about using Mathematics and a tape measure: Job 38: 1Then the LORD answered Job out of the whirlwind, and said, 4Where wast thou when I laid the foundations of the earth? declare, if thou hast understanding. 5Who hath laid the measures thereof, if thou knowest? or who hath stretched the line upon it? ^This is God explaining how He acted like what an Engineer would do using measurements and a tape measure!! From Hebrews: Hebrews 9:23 It was therefore necessary that the patterns of things in the heavens should be purified with these; but the heavenly things themselves with better sacrifices than these. This specifically tells us that the things in the heavens (space, stars, Galaxies, planets, etc) are in "PATTERNS," like both Galileo and Einstein mention. ***By the way, thank you for the warning since you have proven you lack the understanding and knowledge within scripture that God claimed He used Mathematics Himself in His Creation*** I don't see how it is even remotely possible to limit and define God, when you are basically QUOTING HIS VERY WORDS THAT HE USED!!

The original Hebrew makes it clear that Genesis (Bereishit) 1:1 means at this point, the Earth, the Universe, Creation, life itself has all happened and is in a state of existence (much like we are in now). Then of course, you get to Genesis (Bereishit) 1:2 and the Earth is empty, there is complete chaos, complete darkness, and life no longer exists as the face of the Earth is covered in water. So that naturally leads to the thought and question, what happened here? That then leads to the "Gap Theory," the "Lucerian Flood theory" (which ironically Lucifer being cast to Earth would create a catastrophic condition and destroy all life) (some would insert the "Ice Age" here). But nonetheless, By the meaning of the original Hebrew, it shows a Creation before Adam (which Adam is the lineage to which Yeshua comes from and gives light to why Adam's Creation is vitally important). So, if Genesis (Bereishit) 1:1 represents a Creation before Adam, where do we find it in scripture to reveal these details? The Book of Jeremiah, in my opinion, sheds some interesting light. Jeremiah 4: 22For my people is foolish, they have not known me; they are sottish children, and they have none understanding: they are wise to do evil, but to do good they have no knowledge. 23I beheld the earth, and, lo, it was without form, and void; and the heavens, and they had no light. 24I beheld the mountains, and, lo, they trembled, and all the hills moved lightly. 25I beheld, and, lo, there was no man, and all the birds of the heavens were fled. 26I beheld, and, lo, the fruitful place was a wilderness, and all the cities thereof were broken down at the presence of the LORD, and by his fierce anger. 27For thus hath the LORD said, The whole land shall be desolate; yet will I not make a full end. 28For this shall the earth mourn, and the heavens above be black: because I have spoken it, I have purposed it, and will not repent, neither will I turn back from it. (1) Verse 23 specifically resembles the condition we see in Genesis 1:2. (2) The other verses describe the desolation, darkness, and chaos we also find in Genesis 1:2 (Noah's Flood was only for a year or just longer, which means, the water was not upon Earth long enough to destroy the Earth, it's life and vegetation like we see the effect upon the Earth from Jeremiah). (3) God admits He has destroyed the people and the Earth. (4) But God also goes onto say in verse 27 that He is not ending everything at this moment in time (this lead to Adam's creation). ***And we know from Psalms, Isaiah, Ezekiel, and Jeremiah about Lucifer used to be God's rep to His Creation, that the Angels honored him, and eventually it all led to the Adversary exalting himself equal to God. This obvious led to being booted from Heaven (in the words of Yeshua, I saw the Adversary falling like it was as lightning). So he was forced from Heaven to Earth in a violently matter that when he made contact with the Earth would lead to the conditions we find in Genesis 1:2*** If the original Hebrew is correct, in its assessment, that Genesis 1:1 meant EVERYTHING WAS FINISHED at this moment in time and life existed in every form. And we know the information concerning the "Adversary," (the Devil)...And we see what Jeremiah 4 goes into great detail leading us to the condition of Genesis 1:2, this means the Creation before Adam could lead to those fossils being aged far beyond what typical "Young Earth" advocates believe. And for the Earth to be as chaotic as we find it in verse Genesis 1:2, explains the water had to be there a very long time. And this could put the "Ice Age" into play, plus water damage could even skew the age of those hominid fossils. I'm guesstimating not a million years old, but definitely around the range of 300,000 to 500,000 years old!!

Amen, and I believe since Yeshua was in human form as the Angel of God whom Jacob wrestled and ended up with a real injury to his hip over a dream, we see Yeshua as Melchizedek as Abraham's High Priest, Yeshua as the Angel who instructed Ishmael to return back to Abraham, Yeshua as the rep of God with Abraham before sending His 2 Angels to destroy Sodom and Ghomorrow, Yeshua as the Leader of God's military before Joshua, Yeshua as the 4th man in the fiery furnace with Shadrach, Meshach, and Abednego, and on and on represent the physical Adam in the Likeness of God. Then to the spirit side: I believe what Yeshua said in John, He was embodied by the Father and Holy Spirit = Anointed = Messiah When we accept Yeshua as our Personal Lord and Savior and receive the Holy Spirit, we are able to do as such since we ourselves also have a spirit body. And this spirit body also reflects the Likeness of God's Spirit Body!!

Indeed, I do like that!!