evetsegap Posted March 5, 2010 Group: Members Followers: 1 Topic Count: 2 Topics Per Day: 0.00 Content Count: 49 Content Per Day: 0.01 Reputation: 0 Days Won: 0 Joined: 09/26/2007 Status: Offline Birthday: 12/29/1956 Share Posted March 5, 2010 Grace to you, Evetsegap. We all know that Jesus is just and righteous. If a person has no opportunity to be baptized then He knows their hearts, don't you think? But, you do bring up a good point, "person who accepts Christ as their personal savior but doesn't decide to get baptized until 2 months later is not saved." Only Jesus can know if that person was like the foolish virgins or not. (Matthew 25) How then can we believe God when He say's believe on the name of Jesus and you will be saved? Ro Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
evetsegap Posted March 5, 2010 Group: Members Followers: 1 Topic Count: 2 Topics Per Day: 0.00 Content Count: 49 Content Per Day: 0.01 Reputation: 0 Days Won: 0 Joined: 09/26/2007 Status: Offline Birthday: 12/29/1956 Share Posted March 5, 2010 I'm just trying to understand why you feel that there are two different standards throughout the Dispensations when they were all Justified by Faith. Justified by faith in what or who Dave, and please provide me a scripture reference. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Matthitjah Posted March 5, 2010 Group: Royal Member Followers: 4 Topic Count: 1,285 Topics Per Day: 0.16 Content Count: 17,917 Content Per Day: 2.27 Reputation: 355 Days Won: 19 Joined: 10/01/2002 Status: Offline Share Posted March 5, 2010 Grace to you, Evetsegap. We all know that Jesus is just and righteous. If a person has no opportunity to be baptized then He knows their hearts, don't you think? But, you do bring up a good point, "person who accepts Christ as their personal savior but doesn't decide to get baptized until 2 months later is not saved." Only Jesus can know if that person was like the foolish virgins or not. (Matthew 25) How then can we believe God when He say's believe on the name of Jesus and you will be saved? Ro Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Matthitjah Posted March 5, 2010 Group: Royal Member Followers: 4 Topic Count: 1,285 Topics Per Day: 0.16 Content Count: 17,917 Content Per Day: 2.27 Reputation: 355 Days Won: 19 Joined: 10/01/2002 Status: Offline Share Posted March 5, 2010 I'm just trying to understand why you feel that there are two different standards throughout the Dispensations when they were all Justified by Faith. Justified by faith in what or who Dave, and please provide me a scripture reference. Grace to you, Faith in God's Word and we have already spoken of that Faith speaking to Abraham of God's Son, the Messiah. Joh Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
evetsegap Posted March 6, 2010 Group: Members Followers: 1 Topic Count: 2 Topics Per Day: 0.00 Content Count: 49 Content Per Day: 0.01 Reputation: 0 Days Won: 0 Joined: 09/26/2007 Status: Offline Birthday: 12/29/1956 Share Posted March 6, 2010 Grace to you, Amen, but you still haven't answered the question. You are saved by Faith alone and that Faith is not even yours. It belongs to God and so too the works that follow. The Old Testament Saint's of God were Saved by that same Faith. The works that followed spoke of Christ and as such they were a Kingdom of Priests. Preaching this Gospel to the world as a peculiar people just like you and I through the Sanctification of their Religious actions. Yet the Faith they had was not in the actions themselves but in the Word of God commanding them to follow those actions, lest they be found not of Faith at all. Peace, Dave OK. Who said the faith was in the actions? Not I. As I have over and over and over if you love Him obey Him. Loving Him and obeying Him is how we live out our faith. "You are saved by Faith alone" is an incomplete statement. Don't we need to repent? See the problem with you just saying "You are saved by Faith alone" is that you have not defined true Biblical faith that causes men to build arks, and allow themselves to be thrown into a furnace. It's a simplistic statement, that is made by many, that does not lead men and women to become fully devoted Christ followers bent on living holy and righteous lives. It is the cause of apathy in the church. Instead of spending hours arguing about whether or not Baptism is necessary you need to understand the enormity of what our faith requires of us and once you have that understanding, you will understand that yes we have to be baptized, if humanly possible, or we will not be saved. Why? Because it is disobedience and disobedience is damning evidence of faith that does not save. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
evetsegap Posted March 6, 2010 Group: Members Followers: 1 Topic Count: 2 Topics Per Day: 0.00 Content Count: 49 Content Per Day: 0.01 Reputation: 0 Days Won: 0 Joined: 09/26/2007 Status: Offline Birthday: 12/29/1956 Share Posted March 6, 2010 I'm just trying to understand why you feel that there are two different standards throughout the Dispensations when they were all Justified by Faith. Justified by faith in what or who Dave, and please provide me a scripture reference. Grace to you, Faith in God's Word and we have already spoken of that Faith speaking to Abraham of God's Son, the Messiah. Joh Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Littlelambseativy Posted March 6, 2010 Group: Royal Member Followers: 6 Topic Count: 230 Topics Per Day: 0.04 Content Count: 4,941 Content Per Day: 0.95 Reputation: 2,003 Days Won: 14 Joined: 02/08/2010 Status: Offline Share Posted March 6, 2010 Christ said to His disciples to go to all nations baptizing in the name of the Father, Son, and Holy Spirit. But at that time Jesus was still alive. After His death and resurrection when He returned to heaven He said that He would send the Holy Spirit, the Comforter, and the Holy Spirit would baptize with fire. So are we immersed in water or are we baptized by the Holy Spirit when we accept Christ as our personal Saviour? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Matthitjah Posted March 6, 2010 Group: Royal Member Followers: 4 Topic Count: 1,285 Topics Per Day: 0.16 Content Count: 17,917 Content Per Day: 2.27 Reputation: 355 Days Won: 19 Joined: 10/01/2002 Status: Offline Share Posted March 6, 2010 I'm just trying to understand why you feel that there are two different standards throughout the Dispensations when they were all Justified by Faith. Justified by faith in what or who Dave, and please provide me a scripture reference. Grace to you, Faith in God's Word and we have already spoken of that Faith speaking to Abraham of God's Son, the Messiah. Joh Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
evetsegap Posted March 6, 2010 Group: Members Followers: 1 Topic Count: 2 Topics Per Day: 0.00 Content Count: 49 Content Per Day: 0.01 Reputation: 0 Days Won: 0 Joined: 09/26/2007 Status: Offline Birthday: 12/29/1956 Share Posted March 6, 2010 (edited) Grace to you, So then those men of old, those Patriarchs were then Saved by faith in Christ. Not Faith in Christ and Baptism. Their outward show of Faith, their circumcision or practice as a peculiar people, was an act of Obedience then born of Love. We can be Obedient by Faith and we can even have a command to follow certain rites as a show of our peculiarity, but it is Faith in Christ's completed work alone that does in fact Save. Therefore we ought not condemn those whom the Lord Himself has not condemned. Rather we should Live in Liberty and grow in the knowledge of our Lords Grace. Peace, Dave No person has said that anyone is saved by faith in baptism. I do not believe that is an honest appraisal of what has been said, nor do I believe that any reasonable person could come to that conclusion based what has been written. I have stated over and over that being baptized is being obedient. Edited March 6, 2010 by evetsegap Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Blien Posted March 6, 2010 Group: Royal Member Followers: 1 Topic Count: 346 Topics Per Day: 0.06 Content Count: 3,050 Content Per Day: 0.50 Reputation: 46 Days Won: 3 Joined: 10/02/2007 Status: Offline Birthday: 08/26/1982 Share Posted March 6, 2010 God is the same the covenant is not. The thief on the cross died under the old covenant, and it does not matter if it was only three days before the start of the old covenant. Peter introduced the new covenant with the words "God has raised this Jesus to life" and "repent and be baptized." Jesus said those who believe and are Baptized will be saved. Jesus told the Apostles to baptize and every convert in the NT was Baptized. So no matter what we want to theorize about a guy who died before the resurrection, Jesus told us to be Baptized as did the apostles who knew Him best. Baptism does not save us, faith does. But, not being Baptized is disobedience that shows we don't love Jesus and only those who love Jesus are saved. Are you calling Jesus a liar??? Luke 23:42-43 42Then he said, "Jesus, remember me when you come into your kingdom." 43 Jesus answered him, "I tell you the truth, today you will be with me in paradise." There is no room for different interpretations. Jesus said, He will be with HIM... why is this not clear to you? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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