The Purpose of the Tribulation

[Littlelambseativy]

Mizzdy, If you need some further explanation from the Jewish perspective please contact

chosenpeople.ca for further clarification on the Wife of God and the Bride of Christ.

In addition please read the following by Jack Kelly I pray that this will enlighten you about the Tribulation and the Rapture and the Jews and Gentiles.

Is There A Second Chance?

This Week’s Feature Article by Jack Kelley

If you believe as I do that the Bible teaches a rapture of the Church to occur before Daniel’s 70th Week begins then you’ve no doubt wondered what will happen to those among your friends and family who will miss it. Will they get another chance to be saved?

Those Who Are Perishing

For the secret power of lawlessness is already at work; but the one who now holds it back will continue to do so till he is taken out of the way. And then the lawless one will be revealed, whom the Lord Jesus will overthrow with the breath of his mouth and destroy by the splendor of his coming. The coming of the lawless one will be in accordance with the work of Satan displayed in all kinds of counterfeit miracles, signs and wonders, and in every sort of evil that deceives those who are perishing. They perish because they refused to love the truth and so be saved. For this reason God sends them a powerful delusion so that they will believe the lie and so that all will be condemned who have not believed the truth but have delighted in wickedness (2 Thes. 2:7-12).

Here Paul makes the case that the Church has to be gone before the anti-Christ is officially revealed. Those who are perishing will believe the lie that He’s the one God has sent to rule the world. Paul taught that God will actually help them come to this false conclusion because they will have refused to believe the truth and be saved. That’s why they’re perishing.

At first glance this passage appears to say there will be no second chance, that the time for believing the truth that saves us will have ended with the rapture. The Greek word translated refused literally means they did not accept the truth. It implies that the truth was presented to them and they rejected it.

But this doesn’t really put the question to rest. Do they have to hear the Gospel and consciously reject it to be counted among those who are perishing, or does the failure to give an affirmative response result in rejection by default? Will everyone left after the rapture be numbered among the perishing, or will there be some who are not?

Without getting into the nuances of the Greek language, let’s see if there are any other places in Scripture that can help us find more of the answer. The most logical thing to do is see if we can find any convincing evidence that Gentiles can be saved after the rapture. (I assume you know that many Jews will be saved in the 70th Week because that’s one of the main reasons for it.)

It’s true that when Daniel’s 70th Week begins God will once again be focused on Israel. From Daniel 9:24-27 it’s easy to see He has unfinished business with them. Some of the things He promised to accomplish through them in verse 24 simply have not been accomplished yet. There hasn’t been an end to Israel’s rebellion against God, everlasting righteousness hasn’t come in, there are 500 prophecies that remain unfulfilled, and the Holy Place has not been anointed. None of these things involve the world at large. They all concern Daniel’s people, the Jews, and Daniel’s Holy City, Jerusalem.

What About The Gentiles?

But in our study of Acts 15 we saw that one of the things God is going to do while restoring Israel after the rapture is to provide a way for the remnant of men, including Gentiles, to seek Him (Acts. 15:17).

Evidence that this is true can be found in Rev. 7:9 which describes a multitude of post rapture believers that no one could count, coming from every nation, tribe, people and language and arriving in Heaven. This tells us that many of these believers will be gentiles, saved out of Daniel’s 70th Week before the Great Tribulation begins.

Some say this group is the church and place the rapture here, between the 6th and 7th seal judgments, but they can’t be right. In the first place John, the disciple most closely associated with the Church, doesn’t recognize them. But more to the point, their destiny is not the same as the Church’s. They are before the Throne of God, but are not seated there with Jesus like the Church will be (Ephesians 2:6) They will serve Him day and night in His Temple, but they will not reign with him and are never called either kings or priests.

I believe this great multitude of believers will have come to faith primarily because of the rapture. They will have heard the gospel but, neither accepting or rejecting it, will have put off making a decision until it’s too late. The rapture will remove the final obstacle to their conversion, providing confirmation that you and I were right in what we tried to tell them.

This is evidence of Gentiles being saved after the Rapture. But before you get too comfortable with this, remember that in order to arrive in heaven they will have had to die on Earth. They’ll be some of the first martyrs of the 70th Week. Waiting until after the rapture to be saved will not be like waiting for the next streetcar. They’ll have to endure a lot more to receive a lot less.

People have wondered how so great a multitude could die so early in the 70th Week, before the anti-Christ gets his world wide government fully stabilized and before he becomes indwelt by Satan. The Bible doesn’t say, but I think it could be the result of a back lash against believers following the rapture.

Pagan prophecies all pointing to the same general time tell us the world intuitively knows about the coming judgments. The rapture will be incontrovertible evidence that God is about ready to come down hard on them. Retaliation against God’s people because they’re mad at Him for actually doing what He said He’ll do could be one of the motivational forces behind the mass killings.

Another one could be the anger many will feel when just as they think they’re rid of all the meddling Christians, clearing the way for the utopian life they’ve dreamed about, a whole new flock will show up to ruin things. Remember, with the Holy Spirit gone, the restraining influence that’s kept evil in check all these years will be gone. “Kill the infidels” could become the rallying cry of the unsaved world.

(Some New Age teachers say the world is headed for it’s final leap of evolution. It’s a spiritual one that will usher in worldwide peace and harmony. They say born again Christians and Orthodox Jews are holding this up by clinging to the outmoded notion of a single Creator God who rules over all and they will have to taken out of its way. They liken the rapture to the surgical removal of a life threatening cancer from an otherwise healthy body.)

This slaughter of believers will soon be seen as an act of God’s mercy because certainly not all the post rapture believers will immediately be put to death. Others will have years of suffering ahead of them beginning with horrific natural and supernatural events that poison the air and water and including such an agonizing attack of demonic locusts that men will long for death to release them (Rev. 9:1-6). A third of mankind will die from these judgments (Rev. 9:18).

Remember, the Great Tribulation will not have begun yet. Neither will this be the last post rapture chance for Gentiles to be saved. Rev. 14:6-7 speaks of another world wide altar call just after the Great Tribulation begins,

Then I saw another angel flying in midair, and he had the eternal gospel to proclaim to those who live on the earth—to every nation, tribe, language and people. He said in a loud voice, “Fear God and give him glory, because the hour of his judgment has come. Worship him who made the heavens, the earth, the sea and the springs of water.”

This one will come right after the mark of the beast is introduced, and will be followed by a warning that taking the mark will result in permanent separation from God and a guaranteed eternity of suffering (Rev. 14:9-11). The judgments of the Great Tribulation will be so severe that if left to run their course no one would survive. But for the sake of the elect, the Lord will put an end to them after 3 ½ years.

I’m Glad That’s Over

Only about half of the post rapture world’s population will survive until the end. During the face-to-face judgments that follow the 2nd Coming the Lord will find believers among the survivors, both Jews and Gentiles. In spite of complete exclusion from even basic levels of society and a never ending fear of capture and death, they will live to stand before Him and receive their reward.

The parables of Matt. 25 describe this and the Sheep and Goats judgment is exclusively about surviving Gentiles (Matt. 25:31-32). The ones who have demonstrated their faith by their actions will be welcomed live into the Kingdom. They’ll help repopulate the nations of Earth. Egypt and Assyria are specifically mentioned in Isaiah 19:25, but I believe there will be other Millennial nations too.

Maybe some of your currently unbelieving friends and family will find themselves among one or another of these post rapture groups. If so those who won’t be martyred early on will have endured a time you wouldn’t want your worst enemy to experience. Jesus said it will be the the most terrible time ever to befall mankind. Please don’t adopt a fatalistic attitude about them, and don’t settle for post rapture salvation on their behalf.

But if you’re beating them over the head with the Gospel, don’t do that any more either. It won’t work. Your most effective strategy will be a two-fold one. Pray for their salvation with the same intensity you would pray for their recovery from a life threatening disease. And show them the benefits of being a believer by letting your unshakeable faith be a beacon of light and a source of hope in this dark and dying world. Nothing else will be as effective. We don’t have very much time left so if you haven’t begun yet now’s the time. You can almost hear the Footsteps of the Messiah. 10-15-11

[mizzdy]

Mizzdy, If you need some further explanation from the Jewish perspective please contact

chosenpeople.ca for further clarification on the Wife of God and the Bride of Christ.

In addition please read the following by Jack Kelly I pray that this will enlighten you about the Tribulation and the Rapture and the Jews and Gentiles.

Considering I know many Jewish folk and speak to many regularly more than a few of them are rabbis, I believe I know a bit about what they think and not one Jewish person would ever agree that God has a wife and the the Messiah has a bride. Matter of fact not one would ever agree that God would ever have a wife nor that the Messiah will be bethrothed to anyone either thats just not something thought about.

You must be aware by now that God, Yeshua has only one bride, one body, one new man and to say that God has a wife and Yeshua has a bride you and all those who would say that make God out to be a polyamist. There is not two separate anything. I also do not hang on every word men like Jack Kelly write, I completely agree with scriptures that the saints are on this earth till the wrath of God comes about, the saints are sealed, the two witness come on the scene and they are killed, right after the last trumpet we are changed and raised to meet Him, the the bowl judgments come to those still alive who did recieve the mark. Also how can the angels mark the elect on earth if they are in heaven? we read that in Rev. 9 Read it for yourself, not through the lense of men.

I would like to hear in your own words, with scriptures to back it up that God is married and that His Son is engaged to another body of set apart elect. If anything God divorced the northern kingdom of Israel, gave them up to become forgotten in the nations where they were scattered and only when the Messiah came were they reached out to to bring them home, a work Paul took up by the way. You will have to prove there are two bodies of Messiah.

shalom,

Mizzdy

[Littlelambseativy]

Mizzdy, are the Jewish friends and the Rabbi's bornagain? Are they Messianic? That will make a difference in their understanding. The website that I gave you is for bornagain Jews who can explain any question that you may have. They are a wonderful organization in New York and Toronto and in Israel ( other countries also). www.chosenpeople.ca

(or .com)

Now to deal with your questions. If you start with the understanding that there is a Trinity and that the Father sits on the throne in heaven and that the Son (Jesus/Messiah) was incarnate by the Father the 'seed of a woman' in human flesh not the seed of man and sits on the right hand of the Father, you have 2 distinct persons of the Godhead.

Israel the wife of God the Father (1st person of the Godhead)

Isaiah 54:5-8

⁵For your Maker is your husband,

The LORD of hosts is His name;

And your Redeemer is the Holy One of Israel;

He is called the God of the whole earth.

⁶ For the LORD has called you

Like a woman forsaken and grieved in spirit,

Like a youthful wife when you were refused,”

Says your God.

⁷ “ For a mere moment I have forsaken you,

But with great mercies I will gather you.

⁸ With a little wrath I hid My face from you for a moment;

But with everlasting kindness I will have mercy on you,”

Says the LORD, your Redeemer.

To show how faithless the children of Israel were to God in serving other gods dispite what God had done for them, God told Hosea to take a wife as a symbol of Israel. He referred to Israel, His wife, as a harlot, because she repeatedly followed other gods.

Hosea 1:2

² When the LORD began to speak by Hosea, the LORD said to Hosea:

“ Go, take yourself a wife of harlotry

And children of harlotry,

For the land has committed great harlotry

By departing from the LORD.”

³ So he went and took Gomer the daughter of Diblaim, and she conceived and bore him a son. ⁴ Then the LORD said to him:

“ Call his name Jezreel,

For in a little while

I will avenge the bloodshed of Jezreel on the house of Jehu,

And bring an end to the kingdom of the house of Israel.

⁵ It shall come to pass in that day

That I will break the bow of Israel in the Valley of Jezreel.”

⁶ And she conceived again and bore a daughter. Then God said to him:

“ Call her name Lo-Ruhamah,^[a]

For I will no longer have mercy on the house of Israel,

But I will utterly take them away.^[b]

⁷ Yet I will have mercy on the house of Judah,

Will save them by the LORD their God,

And will not save them by bow,

Nor by sword or battle,

By horses or horsemen.”

⁸ Now when she had weaned Lo-Ruhamah, she conceived and bore a son. ⁹ Then God said:

“ Call his name Lo-Ammi,^[c]

For you are not My people,

And I will not be your God.

Here God shows His anger with Israel and disavows them - yet in the following verses He comes back to the covenant that was made with Abraham - a covenant that God the Father will never abandon with Israel. She is His faithless wife but He loves her and will fight for her if they but turn to Him.

The Restoration of Israel

¹⁰ “ Yet the number of the children of Israel

Shall be as the sand of the sea,

Which cannot be measured or numbered.

And it shall come to pass

In the place where it was said to them,

‘ You are not My people,’^[d]

There it shall be said to them,

‘ You are sons of the living God.’

¹¹ Then the children of Judah and the children of Israel

Shall be gathered together,

And appoint for themselves one head;

And they shall come up out of the land,

For great will be the day of Jezreel!

The Bride of Jesus Christ ( the Son of God - 2nd person of the Godhead)

In Psalm 2: 7,12 God Himself says about Jesus, His Son, "Thou art my Son; this day I have begotten You." and "Kiss the Son, lest he be angry, and you perish in the way..... Blessed are all who put their trust in Him."

The words of John the Baptist in John 3:26-36 about Jesus Christ

²⁶ And they came to John and said to him, “Rabbi, He who was with you beyond the Jordan, to whom you have testified—behold, He is baptizing, and all are coming to Him!”

²⁷ John answered and said, “A man can receive nothing unless it has been given to him from heaven. ²⁸You yourselves bear me witness, that I said, ‘I am not the Christ,’ but, ‘I have been sent before Him.’ ²⁹He who has the bride is the bridegroom; but the friend of the bridegroom, who stands and hears him, rejoices greatly because of the bridegroom’s voice. Therefore this joy of mine is fulfilled. ³⁰ He must increase, but I must decrease. ³¹ He who comes from above is above all; he who is of the earth is earthly and speaks of the earth. He who comes from heaven is above all. ³² And what He has seen and heard, that He testifies; and no one receives His testimony. ³³ He who has received His testimony has certified that God is true. ³⁴ For He whom God has sent speaks the words of God, for God does not give the Spirit by measure. ³⁵ The Father loves the Son, and has given all things into His hand. ³⁶ He who believes in the Son has everlasting life; and he who does not believe the Son shall not see life, but the wrath of God abides on him.”

Now remember that just as Abraham symbolically was to sacrifice Issac and a lamb was provided in the thicket by God, so Jesus Christ the Messiah, was offered up as the sacrificial lamb for the sin of the world - the Lamb of God who takes away the sin of the world.

The bride of Christ is raptured and in Revelation 21:9 we read -

⁹ Then one of the seven angels who had the seven bowls filled with the seven last plagues came to me^[a] and talked with me, saying, “Come, I will show you the bride, the Lamb’s wife.”

During the millennial reign of Jesus Christ, we read in Revelation 22 a picture of the Temple in Jerusalem

¹ And he showed me a pure^[a] river of water of life, clear as crystal, proceeding from the throne of God and of the Lamb. ² In the middle of its street, and on either side of the river, was the tree of life, which bore twelve fruits, each tree yielding its fruit every month. The leaves of the tree were for the healing of the nations. ³ And there shall be no more curse, but the throne of God and of the Lamb shall be in it, and His servants shall serve Him. ⁴ They shall see His face, and His name shall be on their foreheads. ⁵ There shall be no night there: They need no lamp nor light of the sun, for the Lord God gives them light. And they shall reign forever and ever.

¹² “And behold, I am coming quickly, and My reward is with Me, to give to every one according to his work. ¹³ I am the Alpha and the Omega,the Beginning and the End, the First and the Last.”^[f]

¹⁴ Blessed are those who do His commandments,^[g] that they may have the right to the tree of life, and may enter through the gates into the city. ¹⁵ But^[h] outside are dogs and sorcerers and sexually immoral and murderers and idolaters, and whoever loves and practices a lie.

¹⁶“I, Jesus, have sent My angel to testify to you these things in the churches. I am the Root and the Offspring of David, the Bright and Morning Star.”

¹⁷ And the Spirit and the bride say, “Come!” And let him who hears say, “Come!” And let him who thirsts come. Whoever desires, let him take the water of life freely.

[Massorite]

but both

Massorite, look at Noah - he and his family were the only ones save from the flood. Why do you think that Jesus says 'As it was in the days of Noah so shall it be before the Son of man cometh'? Noah was spared the destruction because he believed in what God told him and though others laughed at him and his building the ark, he non the less trusted in the Lord and was spared.

Read the Old Testament carefully.

God gave over to themselves Israel, though He loves them - they are His wife - He calls them a harlot because they turned from Him to other gods and would not follow Him. That is why He turned to the gentiles to make them jealous. This is now the time of the gentiles and after the Rapture, Israel in their jealousy will turn to Him who they rejected.

JohnDB is right! It has nothing to do with God's ability to protect the church and Israel. It all has to do with Israel.

You said "Massorite, look at Noah - he and his family were the only ones save from the flood". Yes I agree but we should look at how God protected Noah and his family from the Flood. "He instructed Noah to build a boat that would protect his family from the flood "Without ever leaving the earth to do it" God did not Rapture nor did he need to Rapture Noah and family out of this world to protect them. We also should look at how it was in the days of Noah and frankly there is only one way to discribe it. Wickedness covered the whole earth and once again wickedness is beginning to cover the whole earth today.

So now lets take a look at what God has done for Isreal in just the past 70 years. First of all He has brought them back together as a nation which was recignized as a nation by the whole world in 1948. Prophecy Fulfilled. The 6 day war in 1967. The Isrealites were out gunned and out manned by the forces of 4 or 5 that were much better equiped then Isreal was and they fought for 6 days and rested on the seventh day. BAM a modern day miracle done by God for his chosen people. Today as we are speaking the enemies out number the Isrealites by more then 35 to 1 yet Isreal at this point in time is protected from a full scale attack from all of her enemies because God is holding them back. They could defeat Isreal simply by running them over with nothing more then humans carrying rifles and hand guns. You wrote "That is the only reason for the Tribulation. For as long as the Church is here on earth God cannot turn His attention to Israel. {You did right this didn't you?} God is more then capable of protecting Isreal and his Bride at the same time".

Today in Isreal there is the beginnings of a movement to turn to Christ already. Now I don't know about the jealousy of Isreal but you are correct on the sequence of events.

JohnDB wrote "There is no other purpose the tribulation and the great tribulation serve than to open the eyes of the Jewish people and then you wrote "That is the only reason for the Tribulation'.

I disagree whole heartedly. I do agree that one purpose of the Great tribulation is to wake up the Jewish people to thier Messiah but there is also another greater purpose for the great Tribulation. It is for the purpose of purifing the Bride of Christ in order to make them ready to be recieved by the Bride groom so that they are pure enough to be presented to the Father as an acceptable gift to the Father in the Fathers house which is in heaven. There are those that you sit next to every time you go to the house of worship who would turn on you in a heart beat to save their own hide, because you are a believer. There are those who commit unrepented sins that only the Lord can see who sit in church and act like a true lover of Christ just like those who are truly lovers of Christ nut are instead wolves in sheeps clothing.

The bible uses Silver as an example of a pruifying process in the word of God on many occasions and here is the reason why. Silver in the raw is of course full of impurities and in order to purify that silver it needs to be heated up to the boiling point so that the impurities will raise to the top of the crusible and then they are scraped off. This is done 7 times to make silver as pure as it can be made and the number 7 represents the perfection of GOD. This is what is going to happen to the Bride of Christ during the period of Great Tribulation. When that period of tribulation has come to an end and the wrath of God comes to the earth all that will be left of the Bride of Christ will be those who are totally sold out to God. They will have no blemmish or spot and those Isrealites who have accepted Christ into them and ENDURED TO THE END will be among those who are the true Bride of Christ. In all of the history of the Bible God has never taken anyone out or off of this earth in order to protect them. He has always protected them where they stood here on earth. Are we apointed to suffer the wrath of God? No we are not and we will not be here when the wrath of God come to earth.

I agree with JohnDB that it is all about Isreal but which Isreal is the bible speaking about? The chosen people of God which is Isreal a nation of Isrealites or is it Mystery Isreal, a nation of both ture Isrealites and adopted Isrealites? The answer is both. End time prophecy is about both nations of Isreal with the chosen people being left here on the earth when the wrath of God comes to the earth but will be protected from that wrath.

Is there such a thing as seven years of tribulation? No way Hosa The words "seven years of tribulation" can not be found anywhere in the bible. There will be a period of seven years in which a period of tribulation will take place and then another period in which the wrath of God will take place but both events will take place within that seven year period.

[~candice~]

Massorite, look at Noah - he and his family were the only ones save from the flood. Why do you think that Jesus says 'As it was in the days of Noah so shall it be before the Son of man cometh'? Noah was spared the destruction because he believed in what God told him and though others laughed at him and his building the ark, he non the less trusted in the Lord and was spared.

Read the Old Testament carefully.

God gave over to themselves Israel, though He loves them - they are His wife - He calls them a harlot because they turned from Him to other gods and would not follow Him. That is why He turned to the gentiles to make them jealous. This is now the time of the gentiles and after the Rapture, Israel in their jealousy will turn to Him who they rejected.

JohnDB is right! It has nothing to do with God's ability to protect the church and Israel. It all has to do with Israel.

You said "Massorite, look at Noah - he and his family were the only ones save from the flood". Yes I agree but we should look at how God protected Noah and his family from the Flood. "He instructed Noah to build a boat that would protect his family from the flood "Without ever leaving the earth to do it" God did not Rapture nor did he need to Rapture Noah and family out of this world to protect them. We also should look at how it was in the days of Noah and frankly there is only one way to discribe it. Wickedness covered the whole earth and once again wickedness is beginning to cover the whole earth today.

Indeed!

I think Noah and his family would have felt the boat rock, felt the rain beat down, felt the waves... they were not removed from the situation, they were simply safe in the ark (the covenant).

[Massorite]

Something bothers me about this thread. Do we all think the same thing when we see the word tribulation.

Exactly what is the "Tribulation"

The word "Tribulation" in any bible, concordance or bible dictionary means or is speaking of a trial as in affliction IE the testing of ones resalve or commitment.

The word Wrath in any bible, concordance or bible dictionary means and is speaking of the "Punishment of God".

Let us take a look at what the bible says about the wrath of God which is to come. The bible says that men shall seek death and death shall flee away from them, That men will say to the mountains "fall on us". effort to get away from the torment of the wrath of God. Men will be stuck in the day of wrath. Thier suffering such torment that they would rather die then to continue to suffer the wrath of God but the will not be about to die because God will not let them die. Forcing them to suffer with no escape from the torment. All of the water on the face of the earth will turn to a putrid, toxic mess of some kind of blood and I could go on.

Folks like littlelamb believe that when the bible speaks about being hanged, tortured, haveing the head cut off, being put in jail and beaten, etc is all the wrath of God and that we as Christians are not appointed to suffer these kinds of torments because it is the wrath of God. But I can tell you with confidance that they are very wrong. Go to the web sites of www.persecution.org, The Voice of the martyrs and so on. We hear or read in the news things like a pastor and his two sons get burned alive while sleeping in there van by hindus in India. A group of Christian teen girls are attacked by Muslims while they were on their way to a Christian school. Four had their heads cut of and one servived. Or a Christian woman who was simply walking down a street when a Muslim man threw Acid into here face and the list goes on and on. Christians around the world are being persecuted and around 200,000 are murdered and many more are put into jail and tortured, held over an open flame so that the fire licks their belly in an effort to get them to reject Christ as their Lord and saveour and to be forcabily converted to Islam every single year. This is true persecution of the saints and it is only just beginning. What makes any of us think that we are so good that God is going to remove us from this kind of tribulation in this world? We are not better then those brothers and sisters who die daily for the name of Christ. If anything they are better then we are because they have been tried and have been washed clean and pure and have come out of great tribulation shining.

We in America have no idea what it is like to be a Christian in most of the rest of the worldbut we are going to find out because that kind of tribulation is coming to America one day and then God will know just exactly which side we are on.

If God can allow Christians around the world to suffer Great Tribulation as we speak he can allow it in America as well.

[mizzdy]

Mizzdy, are the Jewish friends and the Rabbi's bornagain? Are they Messianic? That will make a difference in their understanding. The website that I gave you is for bornagain Jews who can explain any question that you may have. They are a wonderful organization in New York and Toronto and in Israel ( other countries also). www.chosenpeople.ca

(or .com)

Now to deal with your questions. If you start with the understanding that there is a Trinity and that the Father sits on the throne in heaven and that the Son (Jesus/Messiah) was incarnate by the Father the 'seed of a woman' in human flesh not the seed of man and sits on the right hand of the Father, you have 2 distinct persons of the Godhead.

Israel the wife of God the Father (1st person of the Godhead)

Isaiah 54:5-8

⁵For your Maker is your husband,

The LORD of hosts is His name;

And your Redeemer is the Holy One of Israel;

He is called the God of the whole earth.

⁶ For the LORD has called you

Like a woman forsaken and grieved in spirit,

Like a youthful wife when you were refused,”

Says your God.

⁷ “ For a mere moment I have forsaken you,

But with great mercies I will gather you.

⁸ With a little wrath I hid My face from you for a moment;

But with everlasting kindness I will have mercy on you,”

Says the LORD, your Redeemer.

To show how faithless the children of Israel were to God in serving other gods dispite what God had done for them, God told Hosea to take a wife as a symbol of Israel. He referred to Israel, His wife, as a harlot, because she repeatedly followed other gods.

Hosea 1:2

² When the LORD began to speak by Hosea, the LORD said to Hosea:

“ Go, take yourself a wife of harlotry

And children of harlotry,

For the land has committed great harlotry

By departing from the LORD.”

³ So he went and took Gomer the daughter of Diblaim, and she conceived and bore him a son. ⁴ Then the LORD said to him:

“ Call his name Jezreel,

For in a little while

I will avenge the bloodshed of Jezreel on the house of Jehu,

And bring an end to the kingdom of the house of Israel.

⁵ It shall come to pass in that day

That I will break the bow of Israel in the Valley of Jezreel.”

⁶ And she conceived again and bore a daughter. Then God said to him:

“ Call her name Lo-Ruhamah,^[a]

For I will no longer have mercy on the house of Israel,

But I will utterly take them away.^[b]

⁷ Yet I will have mercy on the house of Judah,

Will save them by the LORD their God,

And will not save them by bow,

Nor by sword or battle,

By horses or horsemen.”

⁸ Now when she had weaned Lo-Ruhamah, she conceived and bore a son. ⁹ Then God said:

“ Call his name Lo-Ammi,^[c]

For you are not My people,

And I will not be your God.

Here God shows His anger with Israel and disavows them - yet in the following verses He comes back to the covenant that was made with Abraham - a covenant that God the Father will never abandon with Israel. She is His faithless wife but He loves her and will fight for her if they but turn to Him.

The Restoration of Israel

¹⁰ “ Yet the number of the children of Israel

Shall be as the sand of the sea,

Which cannot be measured or numbered.

And it shall come to pass

In the place where it was said to them,

‘ You are not My people,’^[d]

There it shall be said to them,

‘ You are sons of the living God.’

¹¹ Then the children of Judah and the children of Israel

Shall be gathered together,

And appoint for themselves one head;

And they shall come up out of the land,

For great will be the day of Jezreel!

The Bride of Jesus Christ ( the Son of God - 2nd person of the Godhead)

In Psalm 2: 7,12 God Himself says about Jesus, His Son, "Thou art my Son; this day I have begotten You." and "Kiss the Son, lest he be angry, and you perish in the way..... Blessed are all who put their trust in Him."

The words of John the Baptist in John 3:26-36 about Jesus Christ

²⁶ And they came to John and said to him, “Rabbi, He who was with you beyond the Jordan, to whom you have testified—behold, He is baptizing, and all are coming to Him!”

²⁷ John answered and said, “A man can receive nothing unless it has been given to him from heaven. ²⁸You yourselves bear me witness, that I said, ‘I am not the Christ,’ but, ‘I have been sent before Him.’ ²⁹He who has the bride is the bridegroom; but the friend of the bridegroom, who stands and hears him, rejoices greatly because of the bridegroom’s voice. Therefore this joy of mine is fulfilled. ³⁰ He must increase, but I must decrease. ³¹ He who comes from above is above all; he who is of the earth is earthly and speaks of the earth. He who comes from heaven is above all. ³² And what He has seen and heard, that He testifies; and no one receives His testimony. ³³ He who has received His testimony has certified that God is true. ³⁴ For He whom God has sent speaks the words of God, for God does not give the Spirit by measure. ³⁵ The Father loves the Son, and has given all things into His hand. ³⁶ He who believes in the Son has everlasting life; and he who does not believe the Son shall not see life, but the wrath of God abides on him.”

Now remember that just as Abraham symbolically was to sacrifice Issac and a lamb was provided in the thicket by God, so Jesus Christ the Messiah, was offered up as the sacrificial lamb for the sin of the world - the Lamb of God who takes away the sin of the world.

The bride of Christ is raptured and in Revelation 21:9 we read -

⁹ Then one of the seven angels who had the seven bowls filled with the seven last plagues came to me^[a] and talked with me, saying, “Come, I will show you the bride, the Lamb’s wife.”

During the millennial reign of Jesus Christ, we read in Revelation 22 a picture of the Temple in Jerusalem

¹ And he showed me a pure^[a] river of water of life, clear as crystal, proceeding from the throne of God and of the Lamb. ² In the middle of its street, and on either side of the river, was the tree of life, which bore twelve fruits, each tree yielding its fruit every month. The leaves of the tree were for the healing of the nations. ³ And there shall be no more curse, but the throne of God and of the Lamb shall be in it, and His servants shall serve Him. ⁴ They shall see His face, and His name shall be on their foreheads. ⁵ There shall be no night there: They need no lamp nor light of the sun, for the Lord God gives them light. And they shall reign forever and ever.

¹² “And behold, I am coming quickly, and My reward is with Me, to give to every one according to his work. ¹³ I am the Alpha and the Omega,the Beginning and the End, the First and the Last.”^[f]

¹⁴ Blessed are those who do His commandments,^[g] that they may have the right to the tree of life, and may enter through the gates into the city. ¹⁵ But^[h] outside are dogs and sorcerers and sexually immoral and murderers and idolaters, and whoever loves and practices a lie.

¹⁶“I, Jesus, have sent My angel to testify to you these things in the churches. I am the Root and the Offspring of David, the Bright and Morning Star.”

¹⁷ And the Spirit and the bride say, “Come!” And let him who hears say, “Come!” And let him who thirsts come. Whoever desires, let him take the water of life freely.

As to my Jewish brethren they are both, Messianic and those within Judaism and none of them will tell you that they are going to be whisked off to heaven while the rest are being punished and if any of your Jewish friends or organizations believe that then they do not know what scriptures said. Not one of my Jewish brother would endorse an org. that tells anyone God has a wife and Yeshua a bride, all my Messianic friends will tell you that you are grafted into an already existing body, to a body already brought forth at Sinai and it is by faith alone that we are in this body. None of them would endorse the website you mentioned since most believe its just a place to get Jews to convert to christianity.

The idea that Hosea is about God having a wife and Yeshua a bride is frankly absurd, Hosea shows God sending Israel out because of idolatry and then bringing them back to Him when they come back to the understanding of who they are in Him. Hosea is about all who come back to Him in faith, after all it is about a restoration, a reconcillation to Him and not a brand new nothing. Posting walls of scriptures do not change Gods simple message, Israel is His, we are grafted into Israel when we come to Him in faith and confess His name. Theres no gentile church with a convenant, but as we are told in Jer. 31 and Heb. 8 that Judah and Israel and their companions are in the covenant.

As far as the tribulation you are stuck in a man made thinking, the tribulation will be for all of us, the wrath is not. There is no whisking away of anyone till the last trumpet is sounded after the plagues and before the wrath or bowl judgment. You even know that Noah was not taken off this earth for safety, so why would God not do the same for us during the bowl judgments, and hmm thats exactly what He will do take us to a place of safety while He pours His wrath upon those men and woman, nations and wicked after the tribulation. If you wish to think that you will be taken somewhere at the start of the tribulation I pray hard that you do not lose your faith when the tribulation comes upon us all. I rarely ever get involved with topics like this because most every single person has their mind made up for them by their pastors, by the prophecy teachers who are ranking in the money on all these theories, which are not provided for in the scriptures. A complete reading of the feasts of God, along with a straightforward reading of all the prophecies are clear, the saints/elect are here during the great tribulation, and then the angel comes to gather the elect before the bowl judgments, sorry you cannot see this.

shalom,

Mizzdy

[mizzdy]

Something bothers me about this thread. Do we all think the same thing when we see the word tribulation.

Exactly what is the "Tribulation"

The word "Tribulation" in any bible, concordance or bible dictionary means or is speaking of a trial as in affliction IE the testing of ones resalve or commitment.

The word Wrath in any bible, concordance or bible dictionary means and is speaking of the "Punishment of God".

The word for tribulation is thlipsis it means tribulation, affliction, trouble, anguish, persecution, pressing together and pressure, Messiah spoke of the megathlipsis that will come upon us all at the end of the age. Wrath is orge/orgay and the word thumos is used also, it means wrath, fierceness, vengeance, indignation, anger exhibited in punishment or used in punishment. Thumos is wrath, fierceness, indignation, passion, anger, anger forthwith boiling up and soon subsiding....

They are different in meanings and usages. The tribulation is different than the wrath and we are not appointed to Gods wrath. I can come up with at least a dozen or so off the top of my head that most use for wrath thats only meant for tribulation but for the pretribbers nothing will do to take away their sense of comfort to think they are going to be whisked away so God can punish the Jews, which is what most pretribbers tell me anyhow that it is the Jews who are left behind so they can be punished. Sorry if that offends anyone out there just writing what I have been told over the dozen or so years people have been trying to convince me of a pretrib rapture and that theres two separate bodies and now the really silly theory that God has a wife and Messiah has a bride.

shalom,

Mizz

[Massorite]

Something bothers me about this thread. Do we all think the same thing when we see the word tribulation.

Exactly what is the "Tribulation"

The word "Tribulation" in any bible, concordance or bible dictionary means or is speaking of a trial as in affliction IE the testing of ones resalve or commitment.

The word Wrath in any bible, concordance or bible dictionary means and is speaking of the "Punishment of God".

The word for tribulation is thlipsis it means tribulation, affliction, trouble, anguish, persecution, pressing together and pressure, Messiah spoke of the megathlipsis that will come upon us all at the end of the age. Wrath is orge/orgay and the word thumos is used also, it means wrath, fierceness, vengeance, indignation, anger exhibited in punishment or used in punishment. Thumos is wrath, fierceness, indignation, passion, anger, anger forthwith boiling up and soon subsiding....

They are different in meanings and usages. The tribulation is different than the wrath and we are not appointed to Gods wrath. I can come up with at least a dozen or so off the top of my head that most use for wrath thats only meant for tribulation but for the pretribbers nothing will do to take away their sense of comfort to think they are going to be whisked away so God can punish the Jews, which is what most pretribbers tell me anyhow that it is the Jews who are left behind so they can be punished. Sorry if that offends anyone out there just writing what I have been told over the dozen or so years people have been trying to convince me of a pretrib rapture and that theres two separate bodies and now the really silly theory that God has a wife and Messiah has a bride.

shalom,

Mizz

You go girl. LOL Pretribbers believe in what I call "Escape Theoligy". By the way where did you get that info about the words tribulation and wrath?

[Guest Nathan21]

Here's something else pertinent;

Re 7:14

And I said unto him, Sir, you know. And he said to me, These are they who came out of the great tribulation, and have washed their robes, and made them white in the blood of the Lamb.

If it were Gods Wrath they would have escaped because we are not appointed unto Wrath;

1Th 5:9

For God has not appointed us to wrath, but to obtain salvation by our Lord Jesus Christ,

In passing through the Great Tribulation these Saints appear to have obtained their Salvation by our Lord Jesus Christ. They washed their robes of Rightesouness in His atoning Blood. Hallelujah!

Here's something more;

Php 2:5

Let this mind be in you, which was also in Christ Jesus:

Php 2:6

Who, being in the form of God, thought it not a thing to be grasped to be equal with God:

Php 2:7

But made himself of no reputation, and took upon him the form of a servant, and was made in the likeness of men:

Php 2:8

And being found in fashion as a man, he humbled himself, and became obedient unto death, even the death of the cross.

Php 2:9

Therefore God also has highly exalted him, and given him a name which is above every name:

Why do we wish to escape the pattern? We want to fly away and watch Israel be punished? Nonsense.

Beautiful are the feet;

Isa 52:7

How beautiful upon the mountains are the feet of him that bringeth good tidings, that publisheth peace; that bringeth good tidings of good, that publisheth salvation; that saith unto Zion, Thy God reigneth!

Yes I agree, Israel has been punished since they were invaded by the assyrians and babylonians. When they killed Jesus they added to their punishment and extended their time. If they didn't kill Jesus then he would be ruling now, but it wasn't ment to be...

EZEKIEL 22:4 "You have brought your days to a close, and the end of your years has come. Therefore I will make you an object of scorn to the nations and a laughingstock to all the countries. Those who are near and those who are far away will mock you, O infamous city, full of turmoil."

EZEKIEL 22:15 I will disperse you among the nations and scatter you through the countries; and I will put an end to your uncleanness. When you have been defiled in the eyes of the nations, you will know that I am the Lord.'"

The Tribulation is a punishment to the whole world including Israel, we believers will be in it too, as it says in revelations, 6:11. The Jewish people have been restored to Israel, so their punishment is partly completed, they will not be defeated again until the last anti-christ comes. The Tribulations is an "out with the old in with the new situation" Jesus is cleaning the world up. But with Jesus he will only rule for 1000 years then he will destory the world and everyone in it, except the believers will be taken to a new earth and heaven.

People have been making fun of Jews for a long time but after the tribulation, Jesus will show the world that the Jews are his holy people and it has always been that way. We Gentiles have just been blessed by Jesus, through the Jews. In the end it does not matter if your a Jew or Gentile what matters is were your heart is with Jesus Christ.

By the way the tribulation is coming very soon. America, England, Canada, Europe, believe it or not, will be where most of the Christians will be murdered for their faith. They will be called terrorists. Iran and China is very evil but the West is the mastermind behind the new world order/ the one world government that will be created very soon. Eco taxes will fund the new world order but we know it wont last long because of Jesus. Times are coming for his return... Read revelations, there will be asteriods that will wipe out all green grass on the earth and a 3rd of the trees. If the Lord wills it we will all be alive when this happens... it is crazy... It is coming soon!