Phil.b Posted March 14, 2012 Group: Members Followers: 1 Topic Count: 30 Topics Per Day: 0.01 Content Count: 39 Content Per Day: 0.01 Reputation: 1 Days Won: 0 Joined: 09/19/2009 Status: Offline Birthday: 03/03/1954 Share Posted March 14, 2012 I need help along this line of thought. Please send in your comments and other biblical references to edit into this writing. An agreement or disagreement is ok -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Be ye not unequally yoked together with unbelievers: for what fellowship has righteousness with unrighteousness? and what communion has light with darkness? 2 Cor 6:14 We may have read or heard this verse as related to engagement to a future spouse or contemplating a business partner. My question however is how do we parallel this verse to every day life? I find myself sometimes not being able to say “Praise the Lord.” or an “Amen” to something I may agree upon to a person who may not be a Christian. I also believe judging if they be a Christian or not is not my business, but the bible does says “Wherefore by their fruits ye shall know them.”Matt 7:20 It is evident a boundary is implemented and endorsed in this verse. It is evident there is a total unequal fellowship between the believer and those that proclaim they haven’t received Him as Lord and Saviour. I may be corrected here but it says “AND” “What communion has light with darkness?” I believe this is a second boundary. How is this to be? Paul teaches there is no communion between light and darkness. Light penetrates darkness. If I were to go into a very dark room and after being there for thirty seconds and turn a torch through the darkness, the torch light is not the same as the darkness. 14“Ye are the light of the world. A city that is set on an hill cannot be hid .15Neither do men light a candle, and put it under a bushel, but on a candlestick; and it giveth light unto all that are in the house.16Let your light so shine before men, that they may see your good works, and glorify your Father which is in heaven.” Matt 5:14-16. Yes, we should let our light shine for the Gospels sake, because to have fellowship there cannot be a meeting of light and darkness. It is either light or dark. And the light shines in darkness; and the darkness overcame it not. John1:5 “we say that we have fellowship with Him and yet walk in the darkness , we lie and do not practice the truth ;” 1John 1:6. We need to practice the truth.If we do not have worship in truth then a boundary is not a boundary but rather a wall in our lives which cannot be penetrated because there is a wall to obscure the darkness of which it wants to penetrate. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AnotherSinner Posted March 14, 2012 Group: Senior Member Followers: 1 Topic Count: 47 Topics Per Day: 0.01 Content Count: 628 Content Per Day: 0.14 Reputation: 94 Days Won: 5 Joined: 03/13/2012 Status: Offline Birthday: 08/14/1984 Share Posted March 14, 2012 I need help along this line of thought. Please send in your comments and other biblical references to edit into this writing. An agreement or disagreement is ok -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Be ye not unequally yoked together with unbelievers: for what fellowship has righteousness with unrighteousness? and what communion has light with darkness? 2 Cor 6:14 We may have read or heard this verse as related to engagement to a future spouse or contemplating a business partner. My question however is how do we parallel this verse to every day life? I find myself sometimes not being able to say “Praise the Lord.” or an “Amen” to something I may agree upon to a person who may not be a Christian. I also believe judging if they be a Christian or not is not my business, but the bible does says “Wherefore by their fruits ye shall know them.”Matt 7:20 It is evident a boundary is implemented and endorsed in this verse. It is evident there is a total unequal fellowship between the believer and those that proclaim they haven’t received Him as Lord and Saviour. I may be corrected here but it says “AND” “What communion has light with darkness?” I believe this is a second boundary. How is this to be? Paul teaches there is no communion between light and darkness. Light penetrates darkness. If I were to go into a very dark room and after being there for thirty seconds and turn a torch through the darkness, the torch light is not the same as the darkness. 14“Ye are the light of the world. A city that is set on an hill cannot be hid .15Neither do men light a candle, and put it under a bushel, but on a candlestick; and it giveth light unto all that are in the house.16Let your light so shine before men, that they may see your good works, and glorify your Father which is in heaven.” Matt 5:14-16. Yes, we should let our light shine for the Gospels sake, because to have fellowship there cannot be a meeting of light and darkness. It is either light or dark. And the light shines in darkness; and the darkness overcame it not. John1:5 “we say that we have fellowship with Him and yet walk in the darkness , we lie and do not practice the truth ;” 1John 1:6. We need to practice the truth.If we do not have worship in truth then a boundary is not a boundary but rather a wall in our lives which cannot be penetrated because there is a wall to obscure the darkness of which it wants to penetrate When this subject is mentioned...my first thought is often of Solomon. While he was a man who sought God's wisdom and tried to be like his father, King David, it was this very same thing that put a wedge between him and God. Does this mean we cannot have a relationship with non-believers? Not necessarily. For when we look at Jesus, who was it he sat with and spent most of His time with? The very same souls whom were the most possible to lead him astray. My understanding or comprehension of the message in this scripture could be wrong, so I ask forgiveness and will pray for guidance on it. But....I have always felt that God does NOT WANT US TO BE INFLUENCED by these such individuals in our lives. Should we choose to love, care, and befriend them....we need to always strive to set a loving but Godly, or Christlike example for them. So should we speak to, help, or spend time with such individuals we do so without necessarily falling into the very practices we hope to get them out of. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OneLight Posted March 14, 2012 Group: Royal Member Followers: 22 Topic Count: 1,294 Topics Per Day: 0.21 Content Count: 31,762 Content Per Day: 5.23 Reputation: 9,762 Days Won: 115 Joined: 09/14/2007 Status: Offline Share Posted March 14, 2012 You ask "how do we parallel this verse to every day life?" where the verse is 2 Cor 6:14 "Be ye not unequally yoked together with unbelievers: for what fellowship has righteousness with unrighteousness? and what communion has light with darkness?" To me, the key word is "yoke" when it is applied to a relationship of any kind. Though 2 Cor 6:11-18 is speaking of a marriage relationship, you are bringing this outside of it's intent, where it should also be applied. When we find ourselves in a group, we should always be ourselves. To be anything else would be a lie. We should be humble in our actions and not a zealot. Allow His Spirit to guide our words and actions, giving us His words to reply to statements and questions, and we will remain the light He asks us to be. We can only allow Him to live in and through us to those who will listen. Proverbs 3:5-6 instructs us to "Trust in the Lord with all your heart, and lean not on your own understanding; in all your ways acknowledge Him, and He shall direct your paths." When we follow this instruction, He will strengthen us in our weakness, bring boldness to our timidness and humility to our pride. This does not mean we are going to make friends that call each other, making long term plans, and confide in those who are lost. We should never take council with them, for they cannot lead us in Gods way, nor can they give us a word from Him. That strength of relationship is only between brothers and sisters. Yet, we cannot ignore the lost either. Who does the light shine for? The lost, for they are in darkness and need to be guided out of the darkness with love that only His guidance can give. It is our place in Him to love them as He loves them, to show them we care, to offer a helping hand, to give them a word from God in their lives. We can be a friend in many ways, but because of the great gulf that separates us, there can be no yoke of brotherhood. A yoke between brothers and sisters can never be the same as a friendship created with the lost. They are two different relationships all together. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Phil.b Posted March 14, 2012 Group: Members Followers: 1 Topic Count: 30 Topics Per Day: 0.01 Content Count: 39 Content Per Day: 0.01 Reputation: 1 Days Won: 0 Joined: 09/19/2009 Status: Offline Birthday: 03/03/1954 Author Share Posted March 14, 2012 1. I think I may need to change my opening sentence or question in this discussion. The verse maybe talking about relationship but I was considering this part of the verse as I think it is a general statement for what fellowship has righteousness with unrighteousness? and what communion has light with darkness?" I took this as a general statement even though the verse was talking about being unequally yoked. 2. Then we have these verses that talk about light and darkness. And the light shines in darkness; and the darkness overcame it not. John1:5 “we say that we have fellowship with Him and yet walk in the darkness , we lie and do not practice the truth ;” 1John 1:6. I believe in 1 John is for the Christian. So even the Christian can have the light obscured and can't see that something which is of a serious nature when truth is being told to another brother or sister. I know it is sin to put up a wall even for a Christian. But how can we penetrate that sin when one is'nt seeing the light? Is there a verse to show that there is consequences of particular sin activity especially that of abuse or one losing their temper. A typical example is when they use their own surname and say it is "....... trait or fault." I like spacific verses or typical bible reality in either testament but preferably one of Jesus examples or of Pauls examples or teaching. I know sin is sin but sometimes a direct passage can have more impact than saying it's sin to do this or that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gdemoss Posted March 15, 2012 Group: Royal Member Followers: 8 Topic Count: 59 Topics Per Day: 0.01 Content Count: 4,402 Content Per Day: 0.99 Reputation: 2,154 Days Won: 28 Joined: 02/10/2012 Status: Offline Birthday: 04/26/1971 Share Posted March 15, 2012 2 Corinthians 6 & 7 are essential scriptures that teach about the qualifications for the indwelling of Gods Holy Spirit in its fullness. The term 'yoke' being used is to be understood as an influencing weight. When you yoke two oxen together the stronger one trains up the younger one. Jesus told us to take his yoke upon us and learn from him. We really need to keep the verse within its context. 6:1 1We then, as workers together with him, beseech you also that ye receive not the grace of God in vain. 'workers together' = 'yoked together' We are instructed not to receive the grace of God in vain as that is possible. 2(For he saith, I have heard thee in a time accepted, and in the day of salvation have I succoured thee: behold, now is the accepted time; behold, now is the day of salvation.) Receiving the grace of God in vain means no salvation. Verses 3-10 cover aspects of the ministry and things that can be expected. Verses 11-12 turn the focus upon the Corinthian believers preparing to explain to them what is at stake. Verses 14-18 Explain what is necessary for God to receive us as children and walk in us through his spirit. Verse 17 is wholly conditional 'wherefore' as we must come out of them and not be unequally yoked together with unbelievers. We cannot preform the work of the ministry along side those who walk in darkness. Chapter 7 begins the instruction to believers and is combined with real life examples of both Paul and his fellow laborers along with the example of the Corinthian believers seen in 1 Corinthians and the results of their godly behavior. Does this pertain to marriage? Marriage is better covered in 1 Corinthians 7 where Paul addresses it expressly. We know that it is not good to go out and marry outside the faith, but we also know that it is perfectly acceptable to remain married to someone who never became a believer when you did. When it comes to our wives we are heirs together of the grace of life and they are supposed to be our support network that take care of our homes while we are busy working in the gospel. When it comes to those who are plowing together with us for the kingdom of righteousness we are oxen treading out the corn and taking the yoke of an unbeliever upon us if we be the weaker is a recipe for disaster. In Jesus Name, Gary Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Phil.b Posted March 15, 2012 Group: Members Followers: 1 Topic Count: 30 Topics Per Day: 0.01 Content Count: 39 Content Per Day: 0.01 Reputation: 1 Days Won: 0 Joined: 09/19/2009 Status: Offline Birthday: 03/03/1954 Author Share Posted March 15, 2012 1. I think I may need to change my opening sentence or question in this discussion. The verse maybe talking about relationship but I was considering this part of the verse as I think it is a general statement for what fellowship has righteousness with unrighteousness? and what communion has light with darkness?" I took this as a general statement even though the verse was talking about being unequally yoked. 2. Then we have these verses that talk about light and darkness. And the light shines in darkness; and the darkness overcame it not. John1:5 “we say that we have fellowship with Him and yet walk in the darkness , we lie and do not practice the truth ;” 1John 1:6. I believe in 1 John is for the Christian. So even the Christian can have the light obscured and can't see that something which is of a serious nature when truth is being told to another brother or sister. I know it is sin to put up a wall even for a Christian. But how can we penetrate that sin when one is'nt seeing the light? Is there a verse to show that there is consequences of particular sin activity especially that of abuse or one losing their temper. A typical example is when they use their own surname and say it is "....... trait or fault." I like spacific verses or typical bible reality in either testament but preferably one of Jesus examples or of Pauls examples or teaching. I know sin is sin but sometimes a direct passage can have more impact than saying it's sin to do this or that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Phil.b Posted March 15, 2012 Group: Members Followers: 1 Topic Count: 30 Topics Per Day: 0.01 Content Count: 39 Content Per Day: 0.01 Reputation: 1 Days Won: 0 Joined: 09/19/2009 Status: Offline Birthday: 03/03/1954 Author Share Posted March 15, 2012 I need help along this line of thought. Please send in your comments and other biblical references to edit into this writing. An agreement or disagreement is ok -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Be ye not unequally yoked together with unbelievers: for what fellowship has righteousness with unrighteousness? and what communion has light with darkness? 2 Cor 6:14 We may have read or heard this verse as related to engagement to a future spouse or contemplating a business partner. My question however is how do we parallel this verse to every day life? I find myself sometimes not being able to say “Praise the Lord.” or an “Amen” to something I may agree upon to a person who may not be a Christian. I also believe judging if they be a Christian or not is not my business, but the bible does says “Wherefore by their fruits ye shall know them.”Matt 7:20 It is evident a boundary is implemented and endorsed in this verse. It is evident there is a total unequal fellowship between the believer and those that proclaim they haven’t received Him as Lord and Saviour. I may be corrected here but it says “AND” “What communion has light with darkness?” I believe this is a second boundary. How is this to be? Paul teaches there is no communion between light and darkness. Light penetrates darkness. If I were to go into a very dark room and after being there for thirty seconds and turn a torch through the darkness, the torch light is not the same as the darkness. 14“Ye are the light of the world. A city that is set on an hill cannot be hid .15Neither do men light a candle, and put it under a bushel, but on a candlestick; and it giveth light unto all that are in the house.16Let your light so shine before men, that they may see your good works, and glorify your Father which is in heaven.” Matt 5:14-16. Yes, we should let our light shine for the Gospels sake, because to have fellowship there cannot be a meeting of light and darkness. It is either light or dark. And the light shines in darkness; and the darkness overcame it not. John1:5 “we say that we have fellowship with Him and yet walk in the darkness , we lie and do not practice the truth ;” 1John 1:6. We need to practice the truth.If we do not have worship in truth then a boundary is not a boundary but rather a wall in our lives which cannot be penetrated because there is a wall to obscure the darkness of which it wants to penetrate When this subject is mentioned...my first thought is often of Solomon. While he was a man who sought God's wisdom and tried to be like his father, King David, it was this very same thing that put a wedge between him and God. Does this mean we cannot have a relationship with non-believers? Not necessarily. For when we look at Jesus, who was it he sat with and spent most of His time with? The very same souls whom were the most possible to lead him astray. My understanding or comprehension of the message in this scripture could be wrong, so I ask forgiveness and will pray for guidance on it. But....I have always felt that God does NOT WANT US TO BE INFLUENCED by these such individuals in our lives. Should we choose to love, care, and befriend them....we need to always strive to set a loving but Godly, or Christlike example for them. So should we speak to, help, or spend time with such individuals we do so without necessarily falling into the very practices we hope to get them out of. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Phil.b Posted March 15, 2012 Group: Members Followers: 1 Topic Count: 30 Topics Per Day: 0.01 Content Count: 39 Content Per Day: 0.01 Reputation: 1 Days Won: 0 Joined: 09/19/2009 Status: Offline Birthday: 03/03/1954 Author Share Posted March 15, 2012 Light and Darkness in believers. I believe we can lose fellowship and have split in friends and family because something of truth Spiritually of which should have been learned a long time ago. That is they lie to one side of the family to keep in good with them and then tell another side of the family a different version. I am looking for a spacific verse of Jesus example or something in Paul's writings. I seem to have used the wrong verse talking about being unequally yoked. But rather I was focusing on the other part of the verse " for what fellowship has light with darkness" paraphrased. To me if I may use an example of this... "that blue shirt doesn't go with that green paints for what don't you know that blue never goes with green." Just like blue doesn't go with green statement, it is a general statement. I believe although it is talking about being "Unequally yoked" there is a general phrase here that "light doesn't go with darkness." They just don't meet. Because of this sometimes we can't get the light through of a biblical truth even to those who do believe. But I as I said I need a verse that shows this in true form through the scriptures. This would be easier and much more effective than to say a broad statement that not seeing a particular truth is sin. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gdemoss Posted March 16, 2012 Group: Royal Member Followers: 8 Topic Count: 59 Topics Per Day: 0.01 Content Count: 4,402 Content Per Day: 0.99 Reputation: 2,154 Days Won: 28 Joined: 02/10/2012 Status: Offline Birthday: 04/26/1971 Share Posted March 16, 2012 Light and Darkness in believers. I believe we can lose fellowship and have split in friends and family because something of truth Spiritually of which should have been learned a long time ago. That is they lie to one side of the family to keep in good with them and then tell another side of the family a different version. I am looking for a spacific verse of Jesus example or something in Paul's writings. I seem to have used the wrong verse talking about being unequally yoked. But rather I was focusing on the other part of the verse " for what fellowship has light with darkness" paraphrased. To me if I may use an example of this... "that blue shirt doesn't go with that green paints for what don't you know that blue never goes with green." Just like blue doesn't go with green statement, it is a general statement. I believe although it is talking about being "Unequally yoked" there is a general phrase here that "light doesn't go with darkness." They just don't meet. Because of this sometimes we can't get the light through of a biblical truth even to those who do believe. But I as I said I need a verse that shows this in true form through the scriptures. This would be easier and much more effective than to say a broad statement that not seeing a particular truth is sin. Hi Phil, I think your on the right track, but I think what you need is to do a read through the New Testament with this thought in mind allowing the Holy Spirit to speak to you about light and darkness as you go. I loved your example of the pants and shirt but what we find when we get into scripture is that many believers are color blind. They can't tell the 'green' scriptures from the 'blue' ones and mix and match as they see fit. John 3:19 covers the contrast between light and darkness best as it speaks openly that those who live in darkness are condemned. Period. While 1 John tells us that those who hate their brother are in darkness till now. Darkness is associated with those who live in sin that despise good. They don't understand that which is light. When they see someone who follows Christ do something selfless, they instantly believe there is a selfish motive behind what they do. It is there foolish darkened heart. Just because one believes in Jesus does not automatically mean that they will come to the light, walk in that light and become the light. Many who believe never make it to the light although they believe. When I want to do a word study to better understand a biblical concept, I like to take a word and view it at Blue Letter Bible dot com. I find that I get a better understanding of the use of the word and the depth of its meaning, provided it is used more than once. Here is an example for darkness from BLB: σκότος Transliteration skotos Pronunciation sko'-tos (Key) Outline of Biblical Usage 1) darknessa) of night darknessb) of darkened eyesight or blindness2) metaph.a) of ignorance respecting divine things and human duties, and the accompanying ungodliness and immorality, together with their consequent misery in hellb) persons in whom darkness becomes visible and holds sway Authorized Version (KJV) Translation Count — Total: 32 AV — darkness 32 Thayer's Lexicon (Help) Strong's Number G4655 matches the Greek σκότος (skotos), which occurs 32 times in 31 verses in the Greek concordance of the KJV Page 1 / 2 (Mat 4:16 - 1Th 5:4) (More Info) [*]Mat 4:16 The people which sat in darkness4655 saw great light; and to them which sat in the region and shadow of death light is sprung up . [*]Mat 6:23 But if thine eye be evil, thy whole body shall be full of darkness. If therefore the light that is in thee be darkness4655, how great [is] that darkness4655! [*]Mat 8:12 But the children of the kingdom shall be cast out into outer darkness4655: there shall be weeping and gnashing of teeth. [*]Mat 22:13 Then said the king to the servants, Bind him hand and foot, and take him away , and cast [him] into outer darkness4655; there shall be weeping and gnashing of teeth. [*]Mat 25:30 And cast ye the unprofitable servant into outer darkness4655: there shall be weeping and gnashing of teeth. [*]Mat 27:45 Now from the sixth hour there was darkness4655 over all the land unto the ninth hour. [*]Mar 15:33 And when the sixth hour was come , there was darkness4655 over the whole land until the ninth hour. [*]Luk 1:79 To give light to them that sit in darkness4655 and [in] the shadow of death, to guide our feet into the way of peace. [*]Luk 11:35 Take heed therefore that the light which is in thee be not darkness4655. [*]Luk 22:53 When I was daily with you in the temple, ye stretched forth no hands against me: but this is your hour, and the power of darkness4655. [*]Luk 23:44 And it was about the sixth hour, and there was a darkness4655 over all the earth until the ninth hour. [*]Jhn 3:19 And this is the condemnation, that light is come into the world, and men loved darkness4655 rather than light, because their deeds were evil. [*]Act 2:20 The sun shall be turned into darkness4655, and the moon into blood, before that great and notable day of the Lord come : [*]Act 13:11 And now, behold , the hand of the Lord [is] upon thee, and thou shalt be blind, not seeing the sun for a season. And immediately there fell on him a mist and a darkness4655; and he went about seeking some to lead him by the hand. [*]Act 26:18 To open their eyes, [and] to turn [them] from darkness4655 to light, and [from] the power of Satan unto God, that they may receive forgiveness of sins, and inheritance among them which are sanctified by faith that is in me. [*]Rom 2:19 And art confident that thou thyself art a guide of the blind, a light of them which are in darkness4655, [*]Rom 13:12 The night is far spent , the day is at hand : let us therefore cast off the works of darkness4655, and let us put on the armour of light. [*]1Cr 4:5 Therefore judge nothing before the time, until the Lord come , who both will bring to light the hidden things of darkness4655, and will make manifest the counsels of the hearts: and then shall every man have praise of God. [*]2Cr 4:6 For God, who commanded the light to shine out of darkness4655, hath shined in our hearts, to [give] the light of the knowledge of the glory of God in the face of Jesus Christ. [*]2Cr 6:14 Be ye not unequally yoked together with unbelievers: for what fellowship hath righteousness with unrighteousness? and what communion hath light with darkness4655? [*]Eph 5:8 For ye were sometimes darkness4655, but now [are ye] light in the Lord: walk as children of light: [*]Eph 5:11 And have no fellowship with the unfruitful works of darkness4655, but rather reprove [them]. [*]Eph 6:12 For we wrestle not against flesh and blood, but against principalities, against powers, against the rulers of the darkness4655 of this world, against spiritual wickedness in high [places]. [*]Col 1:13 Who hath delivered us from the power of darkness4655, and hath translated [us] into the kingdom of his dear Son: [*]1Th 5:4 But ye, brethren, are not in darkness4655, that that day should overtake you as a thief. [*]1Th 5:5 Ye are all the children of light, and the children of the day: we are not of the night, nor of darkness4655. [*]Hbr 12:18 For ye are not come unto the mount that might be touched , and that burned with fire, nor unto blackness, and darkness4655, and tempest, [*]1Pe 2:9 But ye [are] a chosen generation, a royal priesthood, an holy nation, a peculiar people; that ye should shew forth the praises of him who hath called you out of darkness4655 into his marvellous light: [*]2Pe 2:17 These are wells without water, clouds that are carried with a tempest; to whom the mist of darkness4655 is reserved for ever. [*]1Jo 1:6 If we say that we have fellowship with him, and walk in darkness4655, we lie , and do not the truth: [*]Jud 1:13 Raging waves of the sea, foaming out their own shame; wandering stars, to whom is reserved the blackness of darkness4655 for ever. After reading through the verses, I have a better feel for the word than when I began. But most importantly, I like to read one of the gospels plus the whole New Testament with the concept in mind so that I get a full understanding of it. light/darkness righteous/unrighteous truth/error good/evil Opposites are prevalent in scripture that depict two opposing sides. Your topic says Let us Believer Practice the Truth. One of the hardest lessons of being a follower of Jesus is that not all who believe practice or are going to make it. There will be those who betray others such as Judas did or a couple of the fellows Paul spoke about in his epistles. Gary Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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